I don't know what this chap done wrong something about sending stuff to Iran.
Maybe its me but I felt sorry for him sending a sixty five year old man to a American prison.
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We should have told the yanks to sod off. All he did was sold some batteries, generally commercially available, and was caught in an FBI sting
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I agree Zero what's going on here a law for one and not for another.He looked a decent bloke to me.
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That's why Great Britain is called 51st state. Federal laws prevail.
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There doesn't seem to be a great deal of info about his exact case. Although all the courts he has been to say that he can be send off to the US. Anyone know anywhere with a bit more detail beyond the bbc reports ?
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The USA likes prison. It is a profit driven system with many private goals.
Some 2.4m are incarcerated - approximately 0.8% of the population and more than the population of Latvia (142nd in the world).
By comparison, the UK prison population is c93k - about 0.15% of the population.
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Latest BBC info reveals that he may well be in USA (at whose expense?) for 2 years before he gets a hearing. In a restrained and dignified interview the gentleman pointed out that he was being bundled out of the country at the same time as Abu Qatada could NOT be deported.
Last edited by: Meldrew on Fri 24 Feb 12 at 18:28
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I don't want Iran getting things they shouldn't and they are a very dangerous outfit at the moment, a real danger to world peace...but...
I do have misgivings about the US decreeing what is acceptable to the rest of the world and then legally kidnapping someone else's citizens to put that person through their legal system...one that has its flaws..........doesn't sit right.
Particularly as the US is very self centred.
I'm generally a fan of the US, have had many holidays there and will have many more (if their truly awful immigration officials let me that is), but something here isn't right.
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>> I don't want Iran getting things they shouldn't and they are a very dangerous outfit
>> at the moment, a real danger to world peace...but...
'The Now Show' tonight discussed the potential Republican candidates for the US president. There's Romney, an elder in the Mormon church and Santorum, a profound Catholic who'd be at home in the Spanish Inquisition.
Both would go to war in Iran 'cos religious fundamentalists cannot be trusted with Nukes.
Yeah Right......
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The Israelis will have rubbed them out long before the next US Election. Everyone will condemn it but breathe a sigh of relief. The Americans won't say anything much.
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>> The Israelis will have rubbed them out long before the next US Election.
>>Everyone will condemn it but breathe a sigh of relief.
>>The Americans won't say anything much.
>>
www.nytimes.com/2012/02/20/world/middleeast/iran-raid-seen-as-complex-task-for-israeli-military.html?_r=1
" Should Israel decide to launch a strike on Iran, its pilots would have to fly more than 1,000 miles across unfriendly airspace, refuel in the air en route, fight off Iran’s air defenses, attack multiple underground sites simultaneously — and use at least 100 planes. "
Lots more detail in the article.
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The Israelis were practicing this last year in the eastern Med. Putting the wind up the Greeks and the Turks. They sort of rubbed out Iraq's Nuclear programme in the 80s.
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"Israel would have to use airborne refueling planes, called tankers"
This is from the NYTimes article - dumbed down to almost British standards of "journalism"
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>> The Israelis will have rubbed them out long before the next US Election. Everyone will
>> condemn it but breathe a sigh of relief. The Americans won't say anything much.
>>
I think you are absolutely right.
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>>he was being bundled out of the country at the same time as Abu Qatada could NOT be deported.
>>
AQ could not be deported because of witness statements for his trial were obtained by torture.
No such situation in the US.( mainland)
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It will probably turn out that the "evidence" against our man, when/if it is produced is a result of corrupt practices and illegal actions. Regrettably he has to wait in USA while this is thrashed out. Any country that can manipulate what passes as law, think Guantanamo Bay, can mess us up when they put their minds to it. Bliar was USA's lap dog and Cameron and May and our laughable judiucial system are on the same track. It may well be that law has been applied but it is clearly flawed.
Last edited by: Meldrew on Fri 24 Feb 12 at 20:02
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>The USA likes prison. It is a profit driven system with many private goals.
What a spiffing idea, maybe we should adopt that model here?
We could get Travelodge to do it. £39 pppn?
>Some 2.4m are incarcerated - approximately 0.8% of the population..
>By comparison, the UK prison population is c93k - about 0.15% of the population.
Are we right or are they?
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>>Are we right or are they?
I like to think that it is us - but it is probably neither.
There seems to a revenge aspect to US punishment. I am not sure that it right.
I also cannot agree with the disenfranchisement of ex-convicts in some states. I you are told that you do not belong to a society why should you obey its rules?
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March 15 likely bombing date.
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>> March 15 likely bombing date.
>>
Why?
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Last payday before the new financial year probably.
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The Ides of March (though I can't see what relevance that might have, unless your name is J. Caesar).
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>>It is a profit driven system with many private goals.
>>
>>
And gaols
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>> I don't know what this chap done wrong >>
How about this woman's case then?
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-17124014
"The High Court ruled Eileen Clark, who moved to Britain with her three children in 1998, should be returned to the US."
>> I'm generally a fan of the US, have had many holidays there and will have many more (if their truly awful immigration officials let me that is), but something here isn't right. >>
be careful, very careful
www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16810312
"Holidaymakers have been warned to watch their words after two friends were refused entry to the US on security grounds after a tweet."
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>> >> I'm generally a fan of the US, have had many holidays there and will
>> have many more (if their truly awful immigration officials let me that is), but something
>> here isn't right. >>
>>
>> be careful, very careful
They once refused to let me in because I didn't know where I was staying...a mate was waiting to pick me up at the airport and I was staying at his flat. I had the address recorded at home in the UK and his phone number in my dual band mobile phone that didn't work in the US.
I left that queue, then went and joined another one after i'd called him from a public phone.....and through I went, now armed with his address.
When I met up with him...he said, "Oh sorry about that, I usually tell my visitors to say 'the Holiday Inn', they'll let you through then".
How mad is that.
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>> "Oh sorry about that, I usually tell my visitors to say 'the Holiday Inn', they'll let you through then". >>
Two years ago, I was travelling from Calgary to Vegas. At Calgary airport, there is a "US border preclearance" point where US immigration officers check your papers. There was only one other passenger waiting behind me to be seen for the next flight to the US. I had put in "Hilton, Las Vegas" as my address. The conversation went something like this:
Him: Which Hilton is that?
Me: Are there more than one in LV? I only know of one.
Him: Do you know the address?
Me: Let me find my booking and I'll show it to you.
Him: OK, there is no hurry, take your time.
Me: (Fumbles in bag, hands over reservation printout).
Him: That is the San Fran Hilton.
Me: Sorry. Explain that I shall be going on to SF from LV. (more fumbling through bag to find the LV booking).
Him: All OK. Welcome to the USA. Enjoy your stay. (Entry Visa stamped.)
p.s. since January 2012, the LV Hilton is no more.
Last edited by: John H on Sat 25 Feb 12 at 23:52
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When I used to go to the USA on business my employers would only let me take a blank workbook.
A bear bones windows installation was allowed only - no software, no files.
Even the password generator dongle had to be posted separately.
This was because if they picked your laptop at customs they could go through all the files which are strictly confidential.
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Slight drift! I see that Abu Qatada is now "costing" us £100,000 a week to monitor while he is his house 22 hnours a day and out and about for 2 lots of 1 hour. I don't quite know how this figure is arrived at as whoever is doing the watching would be drawing a salary whatever they were doing.
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Thought provoking comment comment from a Queen's Counsel
Should we fear that to speak freely on any topic of sensitivity or controversy risks being interpreted as a challenge to US Homeland Security
Sir, The shameful surrender of Chris Tappin to an almost inevitable US prison sentence, based upon a grand jury’s proceedings of which he knew nothing and in which he could not participate, is just one stark example of the deplorable willingness of British governments to coerce Parliament into agreeing that British subjects be surrendered to foreign governments without any proof of misdoing.
This is not restricted to US requests. The European Arrest Warrant covers a great many countries which can obtain the surrender of British subjects, who are then likely to be kept in shocking conditions until trial, without producing a shred of evidence.
Robert Rhodes, QC
London WC2
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If the Americans are that sensitive I wouldn't go.But to make comments on the net about blowing anything up is silly.Even in jest you are looking for trouble.
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No credit to me zippy - I only found it but I do agree with the content
Last edited by: Meldrew on Mon 27 Feb 12 at 19:40
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Businessman send to Amerika. - Zero
