|
Sold my wife's learner 125 to a guy who runs a motorcycle training company, the price was right, but to meet up with him involved riding around 6 miles on a Motorway - the bike still displayed her "L" plates which I decided to leave on for the journey (Breach of Highway Code which I take on the chin) - I was told off by the buyer, who helpfully pointed out that it's a "three pointer" for a qualified rider to ride on L Plates. Quite clearly as dumb as he looked. God help the ones he teaches.
|
I used to know quite a few motorcycle instructors when I was an ADI, and while most were very good the job did seem to attract people with strange ideas. "It's illegal to circle a roundabout more than three times", and "It is illegal to have a race number on a road bike" were two common bits of mis-information I heard.
And don't get me started on the ones who "teach" counter steering.
|
|
Well I even doubted myself he was so convincing - he had a strange "hippy" handshake as well.
|
Did you slap him? Please tell us you did ! You will have completed your emancipation from suitland...
:-)
|
'HELLS ANGEL' LAWYER JAILED FOR ASSAULT
Alleged 'strange handshake' led to loss of control
'Jock told me to give him a slap so I ******* did', leather-jacketed motorcyclist tells judge
|
|
I was actually in a leather jacket - My BMW T****r suit would have been somehwat out of place
Last edited by: R.P. on Mon 25 Jul 11 at 21:43
|
I drove for a transport manager once who couldn't grasp a fairly fundamental but rather boring part of drivers' hours legislation regarding statutory breaks*. The half-a-dozen drivers explained it to him many times, but we ended up doing it his way just for a quiet life as he wouldn't be told.
*He mistakenly believed that taking a 45-minute break would forfeit a whole 4.5 hour block of potential driving time, whether or not it had been used for driving. So if we took a break whilst waiting to be unloaded round the corner at 8.30am, he would accuse us of breaking the law by driving after 1pm.
Last edited by: Dave_TDCi on Mon 25 Jul 11 at 21:43
|
Even driving examiners can display a startling lack of knowledge when it comes to motoring. One used to tell me that I wasn't teaching pupils to use the gears properly because they used to stay in third in a 30 limit. No matter how often I told him my car was barely ticking over in third at that speed he wouldn't have it and used to drone on about how he used fifth on his motorcycle at 30 (twit).
In the end I used to tell pupils that if they got the idiot with bushy eyebrows to forget what I told them and stick it in fourth.
|
|
Those who can, do......those who think they can, teach.
|
|
My wife was commenting on how professional her trainers were, they sounded pretty good to me as well (in defence of trainers)
|
>> Those who can, do......those who think they can, teach.
And those that can't teach, teach teachers. ;>)
|
>>And don't get me started on the ones who "teach" counter steering.
I understand the only way a two-wheeled vehicle will turn is if the steering's turned in the opposite direction to the intended direction of turn first.
|
>> >>And don't get me started on the ones who "teach" counter steering.
>>
>> I understand the only way a two-wheeled vehicle will turn is if the steering's turned
>> in the opposite direction to the intended direction of turn first.
>>
That's my understanding also.
In fact, people I have explained (taught?) the concept to, have told me they find cornering easier.
In fact, to prove counter steering is real, just look at still photos of a bike in a fast corner.....
|
Counter steering is something all riders do naturally, whether they are aware of it or not. You cannot teach someone to counter steer, but what you can do is make them aware of it, and therefore enable them to use it in situations where it otherwise might not apply. If you need to change direction quickly to avoid a hazard for example, it could save your life. A shove on the "inside" bar makes the bike change direction almost instantly.
Of all the things I learned between passing my test, and now, I can honestly say conscious counter steering made the biggest difference to my riding. I didn't learn to do it, just became aware that I was doing it naturally, and was able to consciously apply it in certain situations.
|
You steer with your eyes.
Look where you want to go and you will go where you're looking, the counter steering will take care of itself because the bike can't turn without it.
|
>> You steer with your eyes.
>>
>> Look where you want to go and you will go where you're looking, the counter
>> steering will take care of itself because the bike can't turn without it.
>>
That's not strictly accurate... whilst you do look at where you want to be, rather than purely 'aiming' at it like in a car, there's a lot more to it (subconsciously)
IMHO looking at where you're wanting to be is not the be all and end all - if it was we would all fall off when doing a 'life-saver'!
I think Rob has summed it up perfectly...
''steering at any sort of speed is almost instinctive, it's effortless - you imagine or picture the line the bike takes on a series of bends for instance and your body shifts weight in the appropriate direction''
ie you subconsciously ride though the next 100 yards or so BEFORE you get there!
Decent cornering on a bike takes loads of skill, and handling a bike is a sum of many parts.....
|
e you subconsciously ride though the next 100 yards or so BEFORE you get there!
Bang on the money that one....the bike is moved in minute planes of adjustment for the next position on the road...
|
>>in minute planes of adjustment for the next position on the road...
As in subtly squeezing your cheeks together micro-moments before your harris hits the deck?
:-)
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Tue 26 Jul 11 at 20:59
|
>> As in subtly squeezing your cheeks together micro-moments before your harris hits the deck?
Strangest thing there Humph....those micro-moments seem to last an hour.....
'Oh Sugar! This is going to hurt!'
|
|
You're right DP - I had to think a lot about my riding technique when I read this thread....the thought that occurred to me is that steering at any sort of speed is almost instinctive, it's effortless - you imagine or picture the line the bike takes on a series of bends for instance and your body shifts weight in the appropriate direction, that's the best I can come up with in short order ! I have become far more conscious of road positioning since my Bikesafe courses. I'll try and upload some helmet-camera footage to try and portray what I'm trying to say.
|
>>I understand the only way a two-wheeled vehicle will turn is if the steering's turned in the opposite direction to the intended direction of turn first.
I'm claiming no expertise here, I gave up motorcycling when I decided it gave me too little control over my life expectancy, but if it is always necessary to counter steer, how is it possible to ride with no hands as any 14 year old can??
|
I once read somewhere that some say fast efficient motorcycling requires a much higher degree of driving skill. I read somewhere else that all it really requires is a distinct lack of imagination...
:-)
|
|
A good imagination is what keeps you apart from half asleep, myopic 4 wheel drivers (literally).
|
|
Of course. My tongue was ever so slightly in my cheek. I like to think anyway, that I'm reasonably "bike aware" when driving. You sort of have to be on rural roads or conversely in London traffic. They're rarely if ever a problem if you give them space to do what they do. Some car drivers seem to take a perverse pleasure in deliberately baulking them. Never been sure why. Jealousy perhaps or just some primeval mistrust of those from a different tribe maybe.
|
|
I know Humph :-). A rider learns to respect particular cars and trucks (pat) - you almost read the body language of a car occasionally, it either reinforces a decision or makes you back away, you're far more aware of everything on a bike, quite simply your life depends on it....you learn to kepe clear of phone users, smokers, eaters, talkers....long list.
|
The theory that you will steer where your eyes are looking is true. A problem arises when you take your eyes away from where you want to be and fix somewhere between. For example you approach a bend a bit too fast. You start to fix on where your bike will go if you come off he road and you will. Its called 'target fixation'.
All things beinq equal, a bit more lean or countersteer and you should get round.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zt1hnkj6RSA
www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjdMqYM8XKo&feature=related
|
>>For example you approach a bend a bit too fast. You start to fix on where your bike will go if you come off he road
I had precisely that problem the first (and only) time I drove a single seater. I couldn't believe the brakes would scrub off enough speed before the corner and that I'd have enough grip to get round. I never did reach the limits of either.
|
>> The theory that you will steer where your eyes are looking is true. A problem
>> arises when you take your eyes away from where you want to be and fix
>> somewhere between.
The important word is 'fix'
Yes, when cornering you do fix on the exit, but your still looking around at other things... at least I do!
I suppose the 'fix' is always in my minds eye - but of course the faster your going, the more you do have to concentrate on the exit point.
|
Dumb Professionals.... - Robin O'Reliant
