news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/edinburgh_and_east/8600833.stm
Horrendous incident I can't imagine what caused it though.
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...I can't imagine what caused it though...
Me neither.
Would I have thought to let the bulging tyre down before putting it on my lap?
Probably not.
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would I have had a dirty filthy tyre in my lap?
probably not.
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It's either that or leave it at the roadside if the boot has luggage in.
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Possibly, but I mean, are you really goona travel with a tyres that just come off a car in your lap? Apart from it being filthy, what happens if you have a crash?
And where did the good tyre that was on the car come from?
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>> And where did the good tyre that was on the car come from?
Probably a spacesaver.
And on the issue if the wheel beign dirty, I seem to recall that there's a big plastic bag in the wheel change kit, for putting the wheel into.
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>> It's either that or leave it at the roadside if the boot has luggage in.
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What about putting the wheel in the boot and the luggage inside? Where was the other wheel before thay changed it?
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>> What about putting the wheel in the boot and the luggage inside? Where was the
>> other wheel before thay changed it?
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In the boot.
Cliff, have you seen the size of some spacesavers?
some have collapsed sidewalls, and need to be inflated before use, with those there is no way you can get a fullsized wheel in the boot!
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>> would I have had a dirty filthy tyre in my lap?
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>> probably not.
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with spacesavers, you dont have a lot of choice, in their defence some manufactures supply a bag in which you put the dirty wheel.
that of course doesnt save you if the tyre explodes.
Very sad story.
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What sort of pressure would you need in a tyre to cause a fatal injury?
I believe large, commercial vehicle tyres are initially inflated in a cage, but I understood that was because of the extreme pressures involved and the danger of a locking ring flying off.
I think there may be more to this story.
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I cannot imagine what might cause it either unless something other than the tyre helped it explode.
If we were to take a similar tyre and even over inflate it... would it explode? What would happen if you pierced the tyre?
Could the bulge in the tyre have been because of something else which was intended to create a blowout? These were two US army personnel after all. I am sure the details will come out in the end.
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Could it have been that the bulge was purely a tyre defect, and that as the cold tyre (what was the outside temperature?) warmed up (maybe the heating was on and blowing on the tyre?) the damaged cords gave way?
I should think the explosion wouldn't need to be massive to cause quite severe injury give that the wheel was close to, or touching the poor girls body?
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>> What sort of pressure would you need in a tyre to cause a fatal injury?
>>
Idling away my time watching one of those old Police! Camera! Action! programmes recently they showed a VW camper van on fire at the side of a motorway. When the front mounted spare exploded I would not like to have been holding it, there was a hell of a bang and bits of tyre flying off at a fair old lick.
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Quite frightening. This was a BMW Z3 like mine, and the handbook says that you can't fit the deferctive tyre into the spare weheel holder (because it's a space-saver) but gives you no hints as to where to put it, apart from saying that there's a plastic bag included in the kit.
It wouldn't fit even in an empty boot, so the only possibility is the front passenger seat (with or without a front passenger) - or a tow from a motoring organisation.
No time now - going to conduct a concert in church - but will look on a BMW forum later and see if there are any comments.
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If the Z3 has a space saver spare and nowhere for the faulty wheel in the boot at all - then it should just come with a can of sealant or have run flats. Poor design.
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>> It wouldn't fit even in an empty boot so the only possibility is the front
>> passenger seat (with or without a front passenger) - or a tow from a motoring
>> organisation.
I would never question your posts Avant, but thats just incredible.
If you let the tyre down fully could you compress it enough to shove it in the boot?
Stupid question i know but a more stupid design i'm trying to imagine.
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The odds of this accident occuring must be very long.
Ferrying a replacement wheel /tyre especially a BMW (our rims do not split unless abused sir) could also be risky with or without a passenger.
Another warning to be added to the user manuals?
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I'm almost questioning my own post GB - it does seem incredible. I feel a little ashamed that I hadn't spotted it before - but I hardly ever drive it with anything in the boot!
The boot on a Z3 is not bad for a sports car, but the wheels and tyres are big ones (225/16). You could get it in with the lid partly open, but only if the boot is empty. This tragic accident happened with the boot full of luggage.
Thinking about it, I suppose this issue hasn't come up before as a tyre is normally punctured when changed, and the passenger having to hold it is inconvenient but not dangerous. This couple had changed the wheel because they spotted a bulge in the tyre, so unusually it was inflated when inside the car.
Anyone know if there are other 2-seaters with space-savers and therefore nowhere to put a punctured full-size tyre and wheel?
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>> Anyone know if there are other 2-seaters with space-savers and therefore nowhere to put a punctured full-size tyre and wheel?
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I would say its quicker to name 2-seaters that can house a full sized wheel in the boot.....
Last edited by: swiss tony on Fri 2 Apr 10 at 21:35
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The fact that they spotted, or more likely felt, the bulge must mean that it was quite a size.
It's not commonly realized just how much energy is contained in a tyre - and blast has strange and incongruous effects; someone right next to a bomb can be materially unharmed, while someone 200yds away can be dead.
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Compressed air can take your breath away.
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>> >>
>> >>
>> I would say its quicker to name 2-seaters that can house a full sized wheel
>> in the boot.....
>>
OK, 1947 Triumph Roadster. Enormous 16 inch tyre mounted under the hinged dickey lid, still space inside for a cavernous boot.
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My TR7 in the 80's had a reasonable sized boot
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"1947 Triumph Roadster...."
Good point Cliff. Happy days - before anyone ever thought of the space-saver. But of course tyres were narrower in those days.
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I've posted on the BMW Car Club forum and the one suggestion so far is that a punctured tyre could possibly fit behind the front passenger seat if (s)he sat well forward. No - I'm not going to change a wheel and find out, unless I have to....
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Duty of care? Lack of?
Well if anyone finds out it will be the Americans.
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As SL says above, the potential energy in an inflated tyre is quite large.
The very "springiness" of the air means the energy is large, and this is the reason why pressure vessels (even those destined to hold gases) are usually proof tested hydraulically.
In terms of the combination of pressure and enclosed volume (i.e. the potential energy), tyres would normally be covered by pressure vessel legislation, but, vehicle tyres are given a specific exemption.
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I suppose that there is a lesson here that you actually physically deflate the wheel before carrying it in the car - mind you this would be a horrendous risk if the car was in a collision subsequently.
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...I suppose that there is a lesson here that you actually physically deflate the wheel before carrying it in the car...
That's right, but I don't reckon I would have deflated it, even if it crossed my mind.
I'd be thinking don't let the dodgy tyre down because then I'll not be able to put it back on if the spacesaver gives up, or if I get another puncture.
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Nor me - the MX5 that will be in the family tomorrow has an electric pump and nawt else. At least it gives usable boot space.
Moved the MX5 chat into Florida thread in Non-motoring - seemed out of place here
Last edited by: Pugugly on Fri 2 Apr 10 at 23:50
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Just a thought........
This is a news story and we all know the first rule of journalism is to never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
What if the car was involved in some sort of incident that caused an air bag to go off while the passenger was holding the wheel?
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...we all know the first rule of journalism is to never let the facts get in the way of a good story...
Cliched claptrap of the worst sort.
This type of story is an information gathering exercise - if any journalist had evidence an airbag had gone off, it would go in.
There's no reason not to put it in.
Even if your crassly stupid remark is in any way accurate, an airbag going off doesn't kill the story, you might say it adds to it.
The police statement seems to confirm the exploding tyre, and they may have already spoken to the driver on that point and carried out an initial examination of the car - the incident happened more than a week ago.
Other things may emerge, but in today's information hungry age, waiting for an official report in a year's time is not an option, you have to go with what you have.
It may not suit the likes of Bathtub who choose cheap ridicule, but a journalist in this case will take professional pride in putting together a story quickly that's also right.
As I mentioned in another thread - speed and accuracy.
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The military press release from her base seems to support the story as reported...
www.mildenhall.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123198119
I have a distant connection with the USAF personal over here and feel very much at home in Scotland on our hols each year..... a tragic holiday accident for them indeed.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Sat 3 Apr 10 at 10:36
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>> Cliched claptrap of the worst sort.
>>
>> It may not suit the likes of Bathtub who choose cheap ridicule but a journalist
>> in this case will take professional pride in putting together a story quickly that's also
>> right.
Are you honestly saying that all Journalism is done with factual accuracy as the main priority? That there aren't some outfits out there with an angle? That some don't concentrate on one part of the story, to make the piece more saleable, despite the fact the full facts would make a less impressive story?
Like everything in life there'll be some good, some indifferent and some bad and even if the majority tried to get it right, there's still quite a few willing to sensationalise the story, it's what sells in't it...how else would all the red tops survive.
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>>crassly stupid
'The lady doth protest too much'
Tautology dear iih. ;>)
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I rate tabloid journalists one rung below Lawyers in the evolutionary scale.
At least lawyers lie for financial gain.
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Predictable response, but a point or two raised by Westpig is worthy of a reply.
A good, hard news story such as the exploding tyre will be done, by and large, pretty straight.
Showbiz and sport are better examples of stories that are messed around with.
Say Clogger Figgis wants to leave United, so his agent phones a pal on one of the nationals and plants a story.
Clogger's manager gets the hump - or wants rid - he phones his pal on another paper and a story appears suiting the manager's aim.
I know of one celeb who was caught bang-to-rights doing drugs.
He was desperate to break America, so he played for a series of other stories and in return the drugs sting never saw the light of day.
So murky deals do go on - one party uses the other and both benefit.
But all this is a long way from the way in which a story such as the exploding tyre is approached.
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A bizzare and tragic accident.... - Iffy
