tinyurl.com/5tenuts
Im not sure I quite know how a man should treat a woman so as not to offend, if this study is right.
Im to understand that I should let doors slam in a womans face now? I hold the door for anyone, men or women so am I offending both?
I see though that this study reckons that women are called girls but men not called boys - well ive known groups of men to be called boys, infact dont they often refer to football teams as boys?
I may get in trouble for ddriving my wife around, because I do. Not because I have an alpha male thing going on, its because she tells me im driving, she doesnt want to, I know this is true, she hates driving.
Is there a handbook for all this stuff. I do tend to tell me wife to do something herself and refuse to help, but even today she asked me to undo her bottle of coke because she couldnt. Did I undermine her by my brute strength and would it have been better for women if I had told her tough luck, drink something else?
Crikey life is confusing.
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That report is absolute poppycock Stu, you carry on doing what you've always done and we'll carry on appreciating it.
Pat
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Well feminism has some traction these days with PC being all the rage, I was left wondering quite how a man should react with the women and doors situation, if one is to meet the needs of the apparent problem.
I thought about and there arent alot of options.
Do I hold the door, do I knowlingly let the door swing back behind me or in some circumstances, do I make a point of shutting the door so the woman can do it herself?
Theres alot of info on what these 'experts' want but seemingly little on what men should actually do.
My wife said its a load of old rubbish by bra burning cat ladies, but then thats her, no nonsense :-)
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...Did I undermine her by my brute strength and would it have been better for women if I had told her tough luck, drink something else?...
Were you a diplomat, you would have said: 'Those bottles are very tight, dear, I will need our handy JML bottle opening tool to undo it for you.'
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Whenever I can't undo something and have to ask Mr pda he makes big show of telling me how tight it was, and how he nearly couldn't do it either.
That's called tact and diplomacy!
Pat
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The point is, women are physically weaker than men. Men and women are not physically the same.
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>> Men and women are not physically the same.
YES THEY ARE! (only kidding)
Women with rare exceptions can't lift such heavy weights as men or run quite as fast etc., all other things being equal in our immensely varied species.
But in terms of resistance to disease and mortality all through life including lifespan itself within the same society, women have the advantage. They are more stoical and practical than men in adversity too, as concentration camp survivors' stories tend to indicate.
Women are the biological centre of the species, the mainstream, men buzzing round the outside. Patriarchal ideology is misleading, although we are used to it.
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"Whenever I can't undo something and have to ask Mr pda he makes big show of telling me how tight it was, and how he nearly couldn't do it either."
Pat, my mind is boggling, but then that's me and he is a gent and you are a lady (I hope!)
;-)
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"Men who carry shopping bags for women are apparently being sexist - because they're implying that women can't carry them themselves."
Wait till I tell that to my 84 year old near neighbour ... she can buy her own milk from now on and carry it home - all 2 miles. (At present I buy hers , and deliver it to her door)
Written by muppets for muppets...
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I think that was written by the "all men are rapists" faction.
Mind they should have made men childbearers, we would have found a painless way to do it by now.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 15 Jun 11 at 17:30
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I'm not afraid of being a man and I respect a woman who knows how to to that ( be a woman that is ) well too. It's not a competition despite some sociological evidence to the contrary. I'm happy to celebrate and make the most of the differences.
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Wed 15 Jun 11 at 17:36
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Men are sexist by nature, women less so as their biological role as mothers imposes a certain objectivity and impartiality on them (between children of different sexes). But they are perfectly capable of acquiring a sort of cultural sexism, and even male chauvinism, so in our society many do.
Feminists and gays have made us think again in recent years and try to rein ourselves in, although their theories and demands, now widely diffused, quite often (in my male opinion) go somewhat further than they should and are responsible for a certain amount of nonsense. Nevertheless many of us try to be polite in these ways and only occasionally ruin it with some irresistibly gross sexist joke.
My wife often assures me that I have psychopathic tendencies and suffer from Asperger's and Tourette's syndromes in addition to being irredeemably male chauvinist and sexist. I suspect women quite enjoy some of these defects though. They try not to giggle but often can't quite hide it.
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Damn that pink thing!
I tried to add that when, years ago now, Ms Coussine was a member of a feminist group consisting of rather classy, mainly Oxbridge intellectuals and artists, I got a lot of guilty giggles by calling them the "Ladies' Liberation Front".
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Women are always complaining that there aren't enough hours in the day to get all their work done. If they got up earlier it would be much easier...:-)
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I take exception to that remark Stuartli, since I'm always up before some of you go to bed on these forums:)
Pat
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I am often still up when Pat gets up in the morning.
I often toy with the idea of saying good morning to you actually Pat, as I scoff my delicious bedtime Statin pill and low-dose aspirin. But at that time of the morning it seems like showing off.
:o}
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You should do AC, I'm a morning person and have all my best ideas over that first ciggy:)
Pat
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I can never understand why women get upset about four letter words.
What's wrong with iron, dust, wash and cook...?
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Feminism gives itself a bad name, its case not helped by its high profile proponents.
The incredible stupidity that this woman spouts can't do the cause/belief/religion's case any good.
www.heraldsun.com.au/ipad/greer-attacked-on-soldier-rapes/story-fn6s850w-1226073690626
Edit. She is clearly not a stupid person which makes her comments even more unbelievable.
Last edited by: Pugugly on Wed 15 Jun 11 at 18:40
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Yeah PU, she's often a bit hasty. And the tabloids pounce whenever she leaves herself open to it.
I am sure though that she could be brought to admit that she doesn't really think 'all soldiers' will rape under the right circumstances, and that what she really meant was that 'all armies' will contain some men capable of it. No one I hope will disagree with that.
It's difficult for people like her. I often think when I see one of these remarks reported: She's really lost it this time'. Then quite often I realise what she probably meant.
She's a very bright woman really, and quite a sympathetic figure in many ways. Likes to get up everyone's nose. A sound instinct surely?
Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Wed 15 Jun 11 at 18:50
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Probably - She used to be passionate, now she just churns out the words (see her Guardian columns) - bit like a female Clarkson these days (that would annoy her). People like them were at their best when they were hungry. Both now are too well fed.
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>> Probably - She used to be passionate, now she just churns out the words (see
>> her Guardian columns) - bit like a female Clarkson these days (that would annoy her).
>> People like them were at their best when they were hungry. Both now are too
>> well fed.
Because, like clarkson, they have nothing new or radical to say. Time moves on and leaves them and their position redundant or irrelevant.
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As I've said before, Clarkson was at his best when writing for Performance Cars - slick, intelligent, informative - and I forgive him a lot for those days when I used to devour every word he wrote.
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He does still write at a much higher level than he broadcasts. But I enjoy both for different reasons.
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>> As I've said before, Clarkson was at his best when writing for Performance Cars
Nah, his apogee was Fast Lane magazine. Thems were the days.
:-)
Last edited by: Alanović on Thu 16 Jun 11 at 11:33
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Is holding the door open for an old person ageist?
re Pat's point about pretending that the tight bottle top was nearly at the man's limit too, surely that just makes him seem even more like a sexist gorilla?
I always make it look really easy, but explain that it's just a knack, nothing to do with inate strength.
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No Cliff, he knows fine well that I'm remembering when I could happily sling 22 tonnes of 22 Kilo bags of potatoes on a lorry, along with the lads I worked with.
Better to laugh about Arthritis than keep looking back feeling sad at what you can no longer do.
He knows how ashamed I feel at having to ask....
Pat
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I completely ignore all these 'isms'. The self appointed moral minority who keep raising these isms which apparently are so damaging to our society, somehow feel the need to be offended on behalf of the vast majority of the normal population, most of whom couldn't care less, and don't have a problem in the first place.
For example, most of my non-white friends view the anti-racism lobby as a achieving nothing more than setting back race relations by decades, simply by creating issues where there are none, and forcing people to bear race in mind while dealing with people of a different skin colour. This in itself is racist, and creates tension and resentment.
The key is surely to treat people with the same respect and courtesy one would like to be shown one's-self. Who cares what's between their legs, what colour their skin is, how old they are etc etc.
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You might just as well say men are trying to compensate for feeling inadequate, as say they are condescending to women.
I know Mrs Dugong is infinitely more emotionally intelligent, stoical, dogged and adaptable and, when required, patient than I.
I happen to be better at earning money, lifting stuff, fixing taps and holding doors open which I am happy to do to make up in some small way for my other deficiencies.
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www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b010twf6/Sarah_Millicans_Support_Group_Series_2_Episode_1/
I listened to this last night. Classic satire on all the isms....find out what women control when men have the remote in their hands.
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Yeah I heard an episode of that the other morning,
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I've plenty of time for being careful over 'isms'. Thinking of discrimination as a food chain white hetero males who'd pass as CofE are pretty short of 'predators'.
But I'd hold a door for anybody irrespective of their genitalia.
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>find out what women control when men have the remote in their hands.
I'm not allowed to touch the remote.
"That's what bad boys do!."
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Can men ever avoid being sexist now? - Pat
