Motoring Discussion > Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france	Miscellaneous
Thread Author: apm	Replies: 253

Sat 4 Jun 11 16:46   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - apm

Hi all, We are taking the car to France in a week or so, for a holiday. I think most avenues are covered, but I am wondering if anyone has advice re: 1) Headlamp converters- are there good ones, or just cheapies will do? Anyone know if the 211 E class has an automatic setting to point the lights the other way? 2) Bulb set. Seems to be recommended rather than compulsory. Doesn't look like any of the lights is easy to change... 3) The villa we've hired is near Limoges. The satnav seems to be suggesting we go around the Paris peripherique. Is that suicide, or ok? Many thanks in advance, Alex. That's about it. Any specific advice Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 17:09   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Jacks

This is a good website which will give alternative routes avoiding Paris. about-france.com/travel.htm click on "Avoiding Paris" It all depends on the time you are travelling, if you are travelling through the night the Peripherique can be ok but at busy times there can be long delays. I go to SW France quite often crossing via Dover-Calais and I always head towards Boulogne then Abbeville-Rouen-Evreux-Dreux-Chartres-Orleans and onto A20 free motorway south. I'm going to Beaulieu-sur-Dordogne in early July and will use this route as usual. The route is explained on the website, there's less to pay in tolls as well and very little in it mileage wise <10 miles IIRC I thought bulbs were compulsary along with a warning triangle and Hi-Viz jacket(s). If you plan to do night driving then headlamp converters are also required although I never bother as I rarely drive at night in France, if I have to I just adjust the headlamp levels down a notch or 2. Interestingly I have never seen a French/Dutch etc car driving in the UK with anything stuck on their headlamps. Maybe I just haven't noticed! J Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 17:13   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - swiss tony

bulbs ARE compulsory along with a warning triangle and Hi-Viz jacket(s). I heard that in some countries (inc France IIRC) require that the Hi Viz is kept in the car, so you can get out wearing it. Also a good idea to have it visible from outside the car, to help prevent a 'tug' from the local rozzers..... Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 17:11   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

>> 1) Headlamp converters- are there good ones, or just cheapies will do? Anyone know if >> the 211 E class has an automatic setting to point the lights the other way? If it doesn't have the built in shutters, then don't bother to do anything. No-one does these days, just turn the leveller control down. I haven't changed or masked headlight for euro use for the last 7 years, >> 2) Bulb set. Seems to be recommended rather than compulsory. Doesn't look like any of >> the lights is easy to change... I always carry one, they cost peanuts and are just as useful at home, its money well spent. >> 3) The villa we've hired is near Limoges. The satnav seems to be suggesting we >> go around the Paris peripherique. Is that suicide, or ok? I assume then you are heading from Dover. Yes paris is in the way, what day/time will you hit it? Last time I did the peripherique it was on a wintery december friday evening. I survived ok, I would have chosen the Portsmouth / Caenn route for that destination tho. >> >> >> That's about it. Any specific advice Dont forget your Hi Vis for each passenger. >> Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 17:19   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Jacks

>> I assume then you are heading from Dover. Yes paris is in the way, what >> day/time will you hit it? >> Last time I did the peripherique it was on a wintery december friday evening. I >> survived ok, >> But the OP said 1 week holiday in June suggesting a Saturday to Saturday schedule Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 17:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

Assuming an eastern Channel crossing I'd go for the Rouen - Chartres route. Paris like London is a traffic lottery. Thye avoiding route may look slower in routing software but it ain't really. Off to Le Mont Dore in July and I'll be going that way. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 23:42   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

Another vote for the Rouen, Evreaux, Chartres route. If you want a reasonable hotel the Kyriad at Chartres is OK. Only a year or two old and handily placed on the on the ring road. If you want a nice stop an after a couple of hours driving stop at the Baie de la Somme service area (aire) on the A6 to see what a motorway service area can be like. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 08:31   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Mike H

>> If it doesn't have the built in shutters, then don't bother to do anything. No-one >> does these days, just turn the leveller control down. I haven't changed or masked >> headlight for euro use for the last 7 years, Nothing to be proud of Zero! There's nothing worse than encountering a car with unmasked assymetric lights on the wrong side. It's bad manners not to adjust the lights properly, and is the work of minutes with the Eurolites adaptors. I've always adapted mine in the past, and since moving to Austria and fitting LHD lamps I always adapt mine back when I return to the UK, as a simple courtesy to other road users. And, in poor conditions, particularly in winter, you can see a hell of a lot more if they're not wound right down ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 10:08   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

>> >> If it doesn't have the built in shutters, then don't bother to do anything. >> No-one >> >> does these days, just turn the leveller control down. I haven't changed or masked >> >> >> headlight for euro use for the last 7 years, >> >> Nothing to be proud of Zero! There's nothing worse than encountering a car with unmasked >> assymetric lights on the wrong side. You have completely dismissed the "turn the leveller down" - It makes a good job of avoiding glare, and I never get flashed. Oh, and how many of he dutch, french and germans who come over here make their headlamps? Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 21:45   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Mike H

>> You have completely dismissed the "turn the leveller down" - It makes a good job >> of avoiding glare, and I never get flashed. >> >> Oh, and how many of he dutch, french and germans who come over here make >> their headlamps? >> I've not dismissed it at all, it doesn't alter the fact that the asymmetric section is flicking the wrong way! Perhaps not such an issue with xenons given the sharp cutoff, but certainly was with "normal" lights. I agree that damn furriners don't do it, but two wrongs don't make a right. Don't get me started! Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 4 Jun 11 22:08   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - ....

Have you thought about breakdown cover should the unthinkable happen ? Obviously, you wouldn't consider taking the car if you thought it wouldn't make it however there's always the other road users you may come into contact with. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 05:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Meldrew

This may help find breakdown cover at a good price www.comparethemarket.com/continental-breakdown-cover/ Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 10:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - lancara

Have you checked whether your insurance cover is comprehensive whilst abroad as opposed to reverting to third party only (Direct Line/Aviva)? www.moneysupermarket.com/c/news/is-your-car-insured-abroad/0004953/ Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 10:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Iffy

Nothing to do with the car, but is it worth informing your bank/credit card company to expect some transactions from over the channel? I only ask because Tesco blocked my card for what I thought was a very modest spike in my modest spending pattern. To be fair, they lifted the phone to ask what the crack was, and I felt reassured they were keeping an eye on things. But I reckon if I popped up in Paris without telling them the card would soon be stopped. Last edited by: Iffy on Sun 5 Jun 11 at 10:30 Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 10:52   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - mikeyb

Few years back HSBC just stopped my card - I had just fillef up the hire care in spain on the way back to the airport - luckily had just enough Euros left to cover the fuel. I was not amused, so always gie the card provider a quick bell just to clairify Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 10:58   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

Sometimes I do, sometimes I dont. Depends on your spending history. I never inform my card providers for mainland Europe, and have never had a problem, as my cards get used in Europe a fair bit. I do inform them when we went to the States or Aus as that is far less common, and I certainly would for the Mid East, Far East and Africa. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 11:11   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

I spoke to my bank about this and was told that whether I told them or not it would make no difference to their security settings and that in fact they have no mechanism for changing them. I have had automated phone calls several times from the bank checking what seemed to be unusual spending patterns or transactions, each time they were for UK transactions. Always best to carry at least a couple of cards. Worth taking out a credit card just for travel and choose one with the best terms for currency transactions. Post Office card is a good one. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 14:07   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Meldrew

Halifax Clarity card is also good; fee free abroad and you don't have to be a Halifax account holder to get one. Post Office card lets one buy foreign curreny, from the PO, fee free and thus at least 4 weeks before one has to pay for it, if cash flow is a problem. Also, Martyn Lewis's www.travelmoneymax.com will actually find you the best rate. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 22:25   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - henry k

>>Always best to carry at least a couple of cards. >> I carry both VISA and Mastercard as I have been caught out by one of the local systems being down so I reverted to the other cards. I advise my card companies re the country / planned duration of my trip and reaffirm my mobile number (s) prior to departure. I always have key information re card phone nos, passport details etc available in several locations not just in wallet. Having hit problems in the past, prior to departure I now call the number to ensure it is what I need. Consider storing such info in an email (suitably protected) to yourself that you can retrieve locally. Amend some of your stored numbers in your mobile to +44. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 11:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - PeterS

I have to say I've never bothered calling the bank to let them know where I'm going. I wonder whether their systems are even set up to allow a 'note' to be made? Despite that I've only had a problem twice, one in Malaysia and once in Japan. On both occasions it wasn't he fact that I was abroad per se, but that it appeared the card was being used in two countries at the same time. I'd gone on holiday but an on-line retailer in the UK charged my card for purchases a few days after I'd ordered them, by which time I was on holiday. Both time I was called by the banks (HSBC and AMEX), and the card unblocked straight away. On the car front, it might be worth checking what kind of breakdown cover MB offer. I seem to recall that, as long as it has dealer service history, Mercs of theat era came with something called Mobilo Life which included lifetime breakdown cover Peter Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 5 Jun 11 15:28   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Injection Doc

Via Rouen is the best way and the tolls are cheaper as more stretches are free. That route is so much quieter. Watch out for some of the 24/7 fuel stops that UK cards dont work in ! they are improving. Enjoy and dont get caught speeding, penalties are very high now ! When in Rouen the signs are confusing for the auto route ! Last edited by: Injection Doc on Sun 5 Jun 11 at 15:29 Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Jun 11 18:17   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Boxsterboy

>> Watch out for some of the 24/7 fuel stops that UK cards dont work in >> ! they are improving. >> I used one last week, no problem, and much cheaper than 'normal' filling stations. As I was filling up, I noticed a sign saying that UK cards were not accepted! I normally avoid any outside cash point/CC machine. The cashiers at my local Barclays never use the outside cash point at their own branch, as apparently almost every week it gets tampered with. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Jun 11 07:26   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

I have to say I've never bothered calling the bank to let them know where I'm going. I wonder whether their systems are even set up to allow a 'note' to be made. They are - at least that's what my bank and CC provider tell me when I call them before a trip. I find it matters more with the bank - my debit card has failed to produce cash for me in France and Singapore when I've neglected to warn them. As for Rouen, we had this discussion years ago in another place. My advice? As the young people have, thankfully, stopped saying, don't go there. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Jun 11 19:23   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

What's the problem with Rouen? Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Jun 11 20:44   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

OK, I lifted back from elsewhere what I wrote on 23 April 2007. I stand by every word. Going through Rouen to avoid Caen is a bit like - oh, I don't know...something very silly indeed. Just don't do it. You will get lost. You will think you've worked out where you are. You will get lost again. You will wish you'd stayed at home. You will think your navigator is holding the map upside down because you keep coming back to the same junction where you have to make a near-suicidal left turn into heavy traffic on a steep hill. Your navigator will offer to drive if you think you can do any better. You will accept but you will do just as badly; you will get lost yet again and now it'll be getting dark. You will eventually find your hotel or way out by accident and have no idea how you got there. Then you will try again the next year, thinking you must have made an elementary mistake and it can't possibly be as bad this time. And it will be WORSE! Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 6 Jun 11 20:51   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

Should have bought a satnav :-) Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 7 Jun 11 05:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

Sounds like Cardiff. The town all lorry drivers hate. The Castle with so many sides that you always come back to and it's never the same side. The roundabout where you can pick which road sign you want from the middle of it. ...and when you do get your bearings there's a dreaded low bridge that you can't get under and it all starts over again. Pat Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 7 Jun 11 09:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Injection Doc

Been through Rouen load of times, 20ish + never had that much of a problem whilst towing caravan. Got caught out once , The first time ,after having driven through and looking for the autoroute and ignoring the autoroute sign posted Paris and i had decided that would be the wrong way so led to a few inetresting U turns but no problem. the logic of following the signs for Paris when i actually wanted to keep away from there didnt seem right untill i got on the auto route then discovered it split so problem over, Sat Nav has always worked brilliantly in France with the exception of a couple of Mountainous bits in the Ardech ! Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 7 Jun 11 09:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Jacks

>> Been through Rouen load of times, 20ish + never had that much of a problem >> whilst towing caravan. >> Got caught out once , The first time ,after having driven through and looking for >> the autoroute and ignoring the autoroute sign posted Paris and i had decided that would >> be the wrong way so led to a few inetresting U turns but no problem. >> the logic of following the signs for Paris when i actually wanted to keep away >> from there didnt seem right untill i got on the auto route then discovered it >> split so problem over, >> If the OP is still following this..... This is correct, specifically - you stay on the A13 dir. Paris (for about 10Km) and then look out for the exit (junction 19) onto the A154 dir. Evreux, Dreux. J Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 7 Jun 11 13:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Robbie34

I always go through Chartres rather than going round the interminable roundabouts on the ring road. It saves a lot of hassle and I have never found it to be busy. Watch out for the sign to Chartres on the left as you approach the ring road. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 7 Jun 11 14:12   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Jacks

>> I always go through Chartres rather than going round the interminable roundabouts on the ring >> road. It saves a lot of hassle and I have never found it to be >> busy. Watch out for the sign to Chartres on the left as you approach the >> ring road. >> Robbie Would you still recommend going through Chartres at lunchtime on a Saturday in early July? I've been into the centre a couple of times when overnighting at the Ibis near the Cathedral and had some trouble finding my route the first time but this was due mainly due to poor directions on the hotel website (yes really!) . I may try the through route if the answer is positve, as you say the ring road is quite a detour. thanks J Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 7 Jun 11 14:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

I have tried both and I think the ring road is better. Interminable sets of lights and some tricky junctions going through the middle. Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 08:49   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - apm

Dear all, Many thanks for your invaluable advice! Having looked at the 'about france' website and the maps, I think we will head down through Rouen and Chartres. Looks sensible and importantly avoids Paris! The car is well looked after and I trust it to complete the journey. We have breakdown cover (as has been pointed out) via MB. Insurance is covered, but I will double-check that it is equivalent cover to what we have in the UK. I have purchased some spare bulbs, headlamp converters and will bring the fluorescent tabard I used to wear on the bike. We're taking some cash to avoid using cashpoints and in case petrol stations are awkward. We depart on saturday, so it's all getting a bit exciting now!! It even looks like the weather will be nice (fingers crossed). BW, Alex. Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 09:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

>> I have purchased some spare bulbs, headlamp converters and will bring the fluorescent tabard I >> used to wear on the bike. You need to be able to produce one HiVis per occupant. So for the two of you you will need to have two in the car. Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 09:33   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Really? One was enough (for four of us) in 2008, when we had our one tug - at a routine vehicle check - from les flics. We weren't asked to produce our vest, but it was visibly protruding from a seat pocket, which was evidently enough for him. On the other hand, he didn't ask to see our spare bulbs or warning triangle, which were out of sight in the boot, so perhaps we just looked honest enough for him. Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 09:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

Zero is actually wrong. Although not a bad idea to have a couple of these things the law only specifies the requirement for the driver. "Article R416-19 du code de la route Modifié par Décret n°2008-754 du 30 juillet 2008 - art. 19 I. - Lorsqu'un véhicule immobilisé sur la chaussée constitue un danger pour la circulation, notamment à proximité des intersections de routes, des virages, des sommets de côtes, des passages à niveau et en cas de visibilité insuffisante, ou lorsque tout ou partie de son chargement tombe sur la chaussée sans pouvoir être immédiatement relevé, le conducteur doit assurer la présignalisation de l'obstacle en faisant usage de ses feux de détresse et d'un triangle de présignalisation. En circulation, le conducteur doit disposer de ce triangle. II. - Le conducteur doit revêtir un gilet de haute visibilité conforme à la réglementation lorsqu'il est amené à sortir d'un véhicule immobilisé sur la chaussée ou ses abords à la suite d'un arrêt d'urgence. En circulation, le conducteur doit disposer de ce gilet à portée de main. III. - Les dispositions des I et II du présent article ne s'appliquent pas aux conducteurs de véhicules à deux ou trois roues et quadricycles à moteur non carrossés. Les dispositions du I ne s'appliquent pas aux conducteurs de véhicules d'intérêt général prioritaires faisant usage de leurs avertisseurs spéciaux. Les dispositions du II ne s'appliquent pas aux conducteurs de véhicules agricoles, ni aux conducteurs des véhicules d'intérêt général prioritaires, dès lors que les conducteurs de ces derniers disposent d'une tenue de haute visibilité conforme aux dispositions du code du travail relatives aux équipements de protection individuelle. IV. - Un arrêté du ministre chargé des transports fixe les caractéristiques de ces dispositifs et les conditions d'application des I et II du présent article. V. - Le fait, pour tout conducteur, de contrevenir à une ou plusieurs des dispositions du présent article ou à celles prises pour son application est puni de l'amende prévue pour les contraventions de la 4e classe. Article R431-1-1 du code de la route Créé par Décret n°2008-754 du 30 juillet 2008 - art. 20 Lorsqu'ils circulent la nuit, ou le jour lorsque la visibilité est insuffisante, tout conducteur et passager d'un cycle doivent porter hors agglomération un gilet de haute visibilité conforme à la réglementation et dont les caractéristiques sont prévues par un arrêté du ministre chargé des transports. Le fait pour tout conducteur ou passager d'un cycle de contrevenir aux dispositions du présent article est puni de l'amende prévue pour les contraventions de la 2e classe. Définition du cycle suivant article R311-1 du code de la route : - cycle : véhicule ayant au moins deux roues et propulsé exclusivement par l'énergie musculaire des personnes se trouvant sur ce véhicule, notamment à l'aide de pédales ou de manivelles" Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 09:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Iffy

Or to translate: Vous needez only un haute-viz veste per voiture. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 11 Jun 11 08:49   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Mike H

>> Or to translate: >> >> Vous needez only un haute-viz veste per voiture. >> ...but that's only in France - I do realise that what's what we're talking here, but I just thought it was worth pointing out that different countries have different requirements. Here in Austria for example, you have to carry one for each occupant, and they must be able to be put on before you get out of the car. Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 09:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

Thats really useful CGN, Reply to this message | Report message

Thu 9 Jun 11 18:45   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - apm

Merci bien, toute le monde. Je suis sure que j'ai toutes les choses dont j'ai besoin pour nos voyage en France. For info, I checked with Admiral that our comprehensive cover is valid in France, and it is. I WILL be phoning Barclays before we leave to tell them not to stop my card working as they always do. Sometimes they stop it even if I have told them. I'm glad they are vigilant, but it does go a bit far! Bonne chance! M. Alex. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 10 Jun 11 10:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Robbie34

>> >> >> Robbie >> Would you still recommend going through Chartres at lunchtime on a Saturday in early July? >> >> I've been into the centre a couple of times when overnighting at the Ibis near >> the Cathedral and had some trouble finding my route the first time but this was >> due mainly due to poor directions on the hotel website (yes really!) . >> >> I may try the through route if the answer is positve, as you say the >> ring road is quite a detour. >> >> thanks I have always found roads to be fairly quiet at lunchtime. France seems to close down for two hours whilst they stop for lunch. Apart from the big supermarkets, and boulangerie, shops close for two hours or so. I have always found it easy to traverse Chartes and never had a hold up. A few years ago there was a lot of work taking place in the town centre and there were horrendous hold ups, however, this has finished. The route to the N154 is well signposted in Chartres. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 10 Jun 11 10:58   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Mike Hannon

The law re hivis jackets is indeed as quoted above but for the sake of a couple of quid I would carry one for each occupant. In my - albeit limited - experience the gendarmes expect anyone who gets out of a broken-down vehicle beside the road to be wearing a hivis jacket, or otherwise to stay in the vehicle. Seems to me it's a basic safety issue rather than a matter of exact interpretation of the law. Nip out and get another! And bon voyage... Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 10:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Lerees

Update for anyone looking to drive to Europe with their Mercedes. We have an E Class Estate 2015 plate. Have just spoken to the dealership service guys who advised on how to switch lights over. Xenon Headlights (The very bright white ones, not yellow) On the steering wheel use the controls to access the menu on the small screen beside the speedometer. Flick through left or right to get to "Vehicle Settings", then scroll down to "Lighting" in here if you have the option to change from left hand drive to right hand drive, then you can change them. If you do not have this option but have Xenon headlights, then you don't have to do anything to them. The beam is low enough to drive safely anywhere. Happy driving :-) Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 10:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Hi Lerees, welcome to the forum ! There's a handful of us here with E class estates, you'll find that they often get referred to here as "LECs" ( Large Estate Cars ) for reasons we've all but forgotten. The other thing you can do in the menu is change the digital read out of your speed to KPH which is handy. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 10:38   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

>> >> If you do not have this option but have Xenon headlights, then you don't have >> to do anything to them. The beam is low enough to drive safely anywhere. Ah would not lahke to argue zees wiz ze Gendarme next to ze autoroute, mon ami. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 11:13   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

But the advice refers to the 2010-16 W212 (strictly S212 for the estate.) The S211 has a switch on each lamp unit. The advice is not to venture in there unless you know what you're doing because the capacitors store enough to deliver a shock even with the system switched off. An MB dealer will do it FOC anyway, while you drink their very nice coffee. Five years ago, when this thread was current, I didn't even have an LEC. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 18:59   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - PeterS

Bringing this back on track :p. In 2004 Wr had an E270 S211. It was an 'avantgarde' and had xenons, but as WDB says the dealer was happy to change the lights for continental driving for free. Not sure if MB dealers are still as accommodating? I loved that car - we drove to Lake Annecy one year and managed 800 miles on a tank of diesel driving south. Driving north back to the ferry used rather more fuel as I recall...plus, you can get a lot of cases of wine in the back of one :) Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 21:30   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

The way it carries wine is a thing of beauty and wonder. Four cases fit perfectly across the space behind the back seat, with no space wasted. The floor is so flat and solid that you can create a perfectly tessellated base layer of wine, then load your luggage on top and still have more room than a lesser estate car would offer. And all the time, the self-levelling is keeping the tail up, the nose down and the xenons out of the eyes of les flics. I hope Volvo has been paying attention and the new V90 will measure up where the V70 came up short. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:04   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

I've not bothered to do anything to lights when driving abroad for about 10 years now. I just wind the load leveller in the cabin down. Never had a moments trouble. Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 12:50 Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:08   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Xenon lights don't have a leveller, Z. Not a manual one anyway. (Two kinds of auto-levelling in the LEC.) Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

>> Xenon lights don't have a leveller, Z. Not a manual one anyway. (Two kinds of >> auto-levelling in the LEC.) No they have the "flash in the other drivers eyes" feature Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:21   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

...says the man with his lights set to point straight at ze uzzer driverrz. I presume you keep the boot and back seat empty to keep the mid-set beams low enough. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:09   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

But monsewer must ave ze patches on ze lahts. Sree undred yuro, maintenant, or we do ze frog marsh to ze bonk. Good moaning. (I'm not taking that risk for the sake of a couple of quid.) Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 12:50 Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:25   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

Ah, monsewer can predict ze fyutyur based on wot as appened in ze past. Vary good. Ah luk forword to zat sree undred yuro vary soon. I've been stopped by frog plod before and was glad of aving ze patchez, spare bulbs, triangle, ai-vizzes, breath test thing, the lot. Yes, they look for everysing, monsewer. You ave, yes? NO? Oh dear. Good luck, Tommy. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 12:51 Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 12:35   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

>> The future is ALWAYS someone else's past. Bof, zis is a bit, ow you say, existensielle for a seemple Gendarme comme moi. Crazy RO58EEF! Last edited by: Alanović on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 12:35 Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:00   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

Aye aye, ze Gestapo az arrived, monsewer Zed! Ah don wanna tok to you no more, your mother waz a amster, your father smelled of elderberries! Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:06   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

WHAT? why has that been deleted? OI DAVE WTF are you up to? I seriously an explanation and it better be good. Last edited by: Zero on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 13:08 Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:10   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

No-one expects the Spanish Inquisition! Looks like the old crystal ball needs a spot of Windolene, Z. ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:12   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

>> No-one expects the Spanish Inquisition! >> >> Looks like the old crystal ball needs a spot of Windolene, Z. >> >> ;-) I know whats coming next, It aint gonna be pretty. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> OI DAVE WTF are you up to? I seriously an explanation and it better be good. Like I said, STOP the excessive quoting, or I'll simply delete your posts. Far easier to delete than edit. I've previously mentioned about you excessively quoting, but you carry on regardless. I've politely emailed you about it, but looks like you've ignored that too. For someone who's been around computers for years, you don't have come across as an amateur sometimes. Surely even you've heard the phrase "netiquette" before. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:28   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Zero

Well i tell you what - quote this - Keep this on here or not I dont give sheet Frankly I have had enough. If the the web site was any bucking good i wouldnt need to quote it, You can stuff your useless bucking wbesite up your fat ar-se you jumped up power crazy tw-at I'm outa here. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:30   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

Oh la la. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:34   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Plus ça change... Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:33   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> I'm outa here. Bye. Don't let the door hit your backside on the way out. and I'll now go and disable your account for the abuse you've gone and posted, which is against forum policy. Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 13:34 Reply to this message | Report message       3

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:40   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

Zumwun az failed ze attitude test, most unwise. I'm sure he'll be OK though. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:02   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> most unwise. Just to clarify, this has been an on-going issue with Zero for several months (if not longer). But in his usual way of wanting to wind people up, he carried on as normal, regardless of the polite (and occasional sarcastic) requests not to do so. It was his decision to flounce. Not mine. It's also not my fault if he can't carry out a request (or several requests on the same topic) from a moderator and wants to throw his toys out of his pram. Vx. Reply to this message | Report message       8

Fri 15 Apr 16 16:19   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>> >> most unwise. >> >> Just to clarify, this has been an on-going issue with Zero for several months (if >> not longer). >> >> But in his usual way of wanting to wind people up, he carried on as >> normal, regardless of the polite (and occasional sarcastic) requests not to do so. >> >> It was his decision to flounce. Not mine. >> >> It's also not my fault if he can't carry out a request (or several requests >> on the same topic) from a moderator and wants to throw his toys out of >> his pram. >> >> Vx. >> Why is it a problem? Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 16:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> Why is it a problem? Ho ho. How original. You're so funny. Do you also wear the underpants as him too? Reply to this message | Report message       3

Fri 15 Apr 16 18:58   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

Can't you put it into words, do you just not know? Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 20:28   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

I just can't be bothered playing with your small carrot. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 20:56   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - R.P.

Leave it out for goodness sake. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sat 16 Apr 16 21:05   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

I'd prefer it if he'd put it away ;) Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 13:59   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - tyrednemotional

>> and I'll now go and disable your account........ ...you couldn't do the same for fluffy, while you're at it..........? Reply to this message | Report message       2

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:00   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

William Shakespeare walks in to a pub. Barman says: "You're barred". Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:05   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Two horses go into a bar, barman says "what's with the long faces lads?" Just then, a Labrador comes in and orders a pint, first horse says to his mate, "blimey, did you see that, a talking dog?!" Then a red paving slab comes in and sits at the bar, the dog turns to the horses and says "don't talk to him, he's a bit of a cycle path" I could go on...but I'm sure you've had enough already... ;-) Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:11   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - tyrednemotional

...White horse walks into a bar and ask for a pint of bitter. "Wouldn't you rather have a whisky?", says the barman. "Why would I prefer a whisky?" says the horse. "Because there's one named after you", says the barman. ..........."What, Eric!?" Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:13   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Just then a pie comes in and asks for a lager, barman asks him to leave. When the pie asks why the barman says "we don't serve food here"... Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:20   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - tyrednemotional

...Vincent van Gogh was sat in a bar, when a few of his mates drifted in. Over comes the shout, "do you want a pint, Vince?". To which comes back the reply "No thanks, I've got one 'ere" Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:21   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Bought it with his own Monet presumably? Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:33   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Manatee

>> Bought it with his own Monet presumably? That's the Impression I get. He'd probably been there for a while, and just been out for a Pis-sarro. So Cezanne, the barmaid. Last edited by: Manatee on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 14:34 Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Focusless

>> So Cezanne, the barmaid. www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCYNrklb3kc Last edited by: Focusless on Fri 15 Apr 16 at 14:48 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 14:54   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - tyrednemotional

...he'd probably had too Manet pints already...... Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 15:01   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

They had to get rid of Lisa, always moaning and wouldn't smile. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 15:17   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

A polar bear walks into a bar and says; "I'll have a gin and............ .......... .......... tonic please " The barman looked at him and said "Why the big pause?" Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 15:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>> and I'll now go and disable your account for the abuse you've gone and posted, Don't be such an a***. You allow idiots like fluffy to post endless tripe but you can't cope with Zero's post format. And now you'll disable his account. Is it because he flouts your authority? Reply to this message | Report message       3

Fri 15 Apr 16 15:17   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

Uh ho. Someone else is taking the attitude test.................... Reply to this message | Report message       8

Fri 15 Apr 16 15:22   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> Is it because he flouts your authority? Wind your neck in trunky. How I moderate the forum is up to me, not you. Reply to this message | Report message       5

Fri 15 Apr 16 16:18   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>> >> Is it because he flouts your authority? >> >> Wind your neck in trunky. How I moderate the forum is up to me, not >> you. >> Ah, that'd be a "yes" then. Reply to this message | Report message       2

Fri 15 Apr 16 16:25   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Manatee

More likely that he did not appreciate the abusive treatment. If it's your job to moderate, you moderate. The long quotes don't bother me but that clearly wasn't the reason for any ban (which Zero clearly was deliberately planning and took care to pre-empt.) He has in effect banned himself, so it's no good blaming Vx. Most people don't need moderating. Reply to this message | Report message       4

Fri 15 Apr 16 16:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

Can I just say that it's a thankless job being a moderator...I know, I do it our forums and over the years we've had our share of problem posters. Whatever you do will be wrong for someone. Now, bear in mind we do this voluntarily, in our own free time, there are always times when you say 'enough is enough' and make a decision. I don't know what's right or wrong in this case because I have deliberately not been around too much lately because I haven't liked the way some forum members have reacted to Fluffy, so I made the decision not to visit so often. One option for those who don't agree with the moderation though, is to do what I did and find a forum where it doesn't happen. Pat Reply to this message | Report message       4

Fri 15 Apr 16 16:42   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> Ah, that'd be a "yes" then. If I were to question some of your moderator decisions from years ago, we'd be here all night. Now move along and put the carrot away. Reply to this message | Report message       5

Fri 15 Apr 16 17:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

He will be back. He's flounced before. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 17:46   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Clk Sec

>> He will be back. I sincerely hope so. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 17:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

He's probably fluffy. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 19:53   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - sooty123

Isn't he the second one this week to leave? Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 20:26   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

Who else left? Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 20:31   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - sooty123

CGN done one. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Fri 15 Apr 16 20:30   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Yes, I think CG Norwich has punctuated himself. I've a feeling it might be my fault, and if it is, I'm sorry about that. I felt ( feel ) very strongly about the house purchase transaction laws in England and he got caught in the crossfire of my ire about that. I didn't really intend to target him, he was only following the rules as they stand, as was his right, but I'm so incensed at the existence of that law as it stands that it in hindsight it would quite easily have been seen as a personal attack which from my side is regrettable and was not my intention. If he feels that an apology is appropriate then I offer that unreservedly. I've enjoyed his contributions and I hope he decides to come back sometime. I still, however, feel very strongly that the law we were discussing is preposterous in its current form. That I assure you, is my very last word on the subject for now though. I will not enter into further discussion on it. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 20:30   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> I think CG Norwich has punctuated himself. I've a feeling it might be my fault. Makes a change from me getting the blame. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 19:00   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

You didn't understand them then, I see no reason to suppose you would understand them now. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 19:31   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dutchie

The route I have taken a few times is Rouen Chartres.I don't bother with the Paris route. High Viz jackets and the breathalyser thingy.Never been stopped by the French police for a check.I suppose they would be more interested if you are involved in a accident. I have very rarely seen a Dutch driver in the UK with headlamp converters.Police here are very relaxed regarding checking all these items. Reply to this message | Report message

Fri 15 Apr 16 19:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dutchie

What is it with you lot about fluffy? He hasn't upset or swore at anybody.Ok his post can be a bit different and off the beat but so what. Reply to this message | Report message       6

Fri 15 Apr 16 22:06   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

>>What is it with you lot about fluffy? Because he/she is probably another member of the forum trying to wind us up. Moderators will have a better idea - Zero in the past had more than one logon he used for example in the HonestJohn forums. He'd use his own and the 'fake' ID to have conversations with himself. Reply to this message | Report message       2

Sat 16 Apr 16 03:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

>>Because he/she is probably another member of the forum trying to wind us up. << So for those who think that, why not just totally ignore him then? Or could it just be that Fluffy is different? Different is like change, and typically, we neither very well. I'm sorry CGN has gone, and Zero, and I would be very sorry if Fluffy was offended and disappeared too. Surely we can welcome and accommodate people from all walks of life with different opinions and enjoy the life that would bring to the forum? ....or do all newcomers have to arrive wearing worn brogues, the classic cords and clutching their bus pass for inspection first. Pat Reply to this message | Report message       9

Sat 16 Apr 16 09:10   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - bathtub tom

>>arrive wearing worn brogues, the classic cords and clutching their bus pass You been spying on me? Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 12:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

I bet flouncers still read these forums though. It's been a while since we had a drama Queen type exit. Never mind, a turnover of people is a good thing, it helps to keep discussions fresh when new members join. Oh. Reply to this message | Report message       2

Sat 16 Apr 16 13:08   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

>>He'd use his own and the 'fake' ID to have conversations with himself. Sometimes in our house it's the only way of getting intelligent conversation. Last edited by: The Melting Snowman on Sat 16 Apr 16 at 13:08 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sat 16 Apr 16 14:21   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

If or when I ever decide to go, for whatever reason, I'll just go really. No need for a Miss Piggy impression. I do give it a break sometimes anyway, especially in the summer when there's more real life to attend to or be distracted by. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 19:16   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

>> If or when I ever decide to go, for whatever reason, I'll just go really. I couldn't agree more. I don't understand how anyone can get so worked up about something written on a blog. I mean, how do these people deal with real confrontation in life? And what's the point of changing one's forum id? We had it before with gordonbennet / GB who became hyphenated. Absolutely bizarre. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 15:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

"Zero in the past had more than one logon he used for example in the Honest John forums. He'd use his own and the 'fake' ID to have conversations with himself." Interesting thought. I don't think we've had anyone on the HJ forum 'talking to themselves' since I've been moderator, although I suppose I can't guarantee I'd notice! Zero (formerly 'Renault Family') I thought was a highly qualified IT specialist who retired early but had plenty of better things to do with his life than that. He'd be welcome to revisit us on HJ: I'm not entirely sure what the 'long quotes' issue is but I don't think it would worry me. Apart from deleting spam and unfair naming and shaming, the only things that I censor are rudeness and unhelpfulness. Last edited by: Avant on Sat 16 Apr 16 at 15:49 Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:12   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - John Boy

I would have said the "long quotes" issue is about making the forum easy to read, with the minimum of scrolling. If you can't be bothered to edit the quotes and take out those irritating right arrows, you can't expect anyone to bother to read what you're writing. That's how it works for me anyway. Reply to this message | Report message       8

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:17   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

I prefer not to use the quote option anyway, sometimes it seems appropriate but there's a little arrow at the side of each post that shows you who it's replying to. Selective quotation can also be ( sometimes deliberately? ) misleading too... Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:22   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Armel Coussine

I don't understand what's supposed to be problematic about quotes. A short quote - not someone's three-paragraph post, just an identifying sentence, clause or phrase - will make it clear what the post is replying or reacting to. I've been doing it since I was Lud on HJ. Easy-peasy. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

Agreed, AC - I often do that to make it clear that I'm picking up on a point that someone has made. In fairness, I don't think that's what the moderators on here are objecting to. A long quote wouldn't worry me enough to spend time deleting it, but I'd agree that if you want people to read your post, prefacing it with a large chunk of someone else's isn't a great start. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:25   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - John Boy

>> Selective quotation can also be deliberately misleading too... >> Too true! :-) Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:28   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Armel Coussine

>> Selective quotation can also be deliberately misleading too... Why would anyone want to be misleading except in jest? I don't understand this. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:30   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

>> I don't understand See what I mean? ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 18:53   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

>> I would have said the "long quotes" issue is about making the forum easy to >> read, with the minimum of scrolling. If you can't be bothered to edit the quotes >> and take out those irritating right arrows, you can't expect anyone to bother to read >> what you're writing. That's how it works for me anyway. >> Fair enough. Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Clk Sec

>> He'd use his own and the 'fake' ID to have conversations with >> himself." That's really funny, but I very much doubt whether Z was the guilty party. However, I believe someone else was playing that game quite regularly. Seemed quite obvious to me at the time, but I could have been mistaken. You poaching, Avant? ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

Not at all - we're not in competition! Anyone is welcome to post on both, as I do. Reply to this message | Report message       5

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:45   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Clk Sec

>>Not at all I must say you come across as a very likeable chap. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

He is, and what's more he's an expert on big organs. ;-) Last edited by: Runfer D'Hills on Sat 16 Apr 16 at 16:52 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sat 16 Apr 16 16:57   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Sorry I never got to hear him play the one at Sonning. If I was passing that way on a Sunday morning I used to open the car windows just in case. (20 limit past the church anyway, so the odds were reasonable.) Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 13:06   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - devonite

Now your sounding like BBD! ;) Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 20:32   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> the only things that I censor are rudeness and unhelpfulness. Crikey! If we started doing that here, there would be nothing left at all ;) Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 16 Apr 16 at 20:40 Reply to this message | Report message       2

Sat 16 Apr 16 21:32   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Focal Point

Only just discovered this hoo-hah. Surprised about Z, who can be abrasive but not, I thought, deliberately nasty. Others have filled that role from time to time and seem to have got away with it. I've never worked out what the moderation policy is anyway. I guess the "long quote" tendency was not the real reason, but more his other interactions with the mod(s), or a bout of self-destruction, or both. Can't say I'm much bothered - except that Z had an exceptionally wide range of interests and knowledge. The forum will stagger on as it's done for ages now. It mostly consists of people who know each other too well and, like a crowd at a bar, sometimes someone loses control and fires off a punch. The flounce is a surprise, though. How undignified! If you're so brassed off you don't want to post any more, just slink away. Drama queens don't get a lot of sympathy and just look a bit silly. And about Fluffy - I don't understand why people are getting worked up, though it can be quite amusing. If he's a fake, so what? Reply to him or ignore him. He hasn't been nasty to anyone. Reply to this message | Report message       4

Sun 17 Apr 16 00:08   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>> seem to have got away with it. With this software if someone really wants to put their mind to having a go, its pretty much impossible to do something stop them. There are no sanctions that can work really. So nagging and whining until you pass them off and they leave of their own accord is about the only way to get rid of someone. Last edited by: No FM2R on Sun 17 Apr 16 at 00:08 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sat 16 Apr 16 22:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Kevin

>He'd use his own and the 'fake' ID to have conversations with himself. What led you to that conclusion? httpd logs? Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 23:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

I can't say I'm afraid. Moderators secrets and all that. But he did do this. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 00:53   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

As a contributor, I'd rather Zero/RF was here and VxFan was not. It's a forum after all. Just saying I'll miss Z more than Dave that's all. No offence intended towards Dave/VxFan. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Sun 17 Apr 16 04:49   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

No offence taken. Reply to this message | Report message       2

Sun 17 Apr 16 05:36   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - sooty123

>> I can't say I'm afraid. Moderators secrets and all that. But he did do this. How very OSA ;) Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sun 17 Apr 16 10:59   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

There are various ways of checking for duplicate members (if one can be bothered). Is it a problem if someone wants to talk to themselves? Quite funny really. Last edited by: The Melting Snowman on Sun 17 Apr 16 at 11:00 Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 13:18   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

Sometimes it's been known that a person responds to their own questions as the wrong alter ego. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 18:05   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Kevin

>There are various ways of checking for duplicate members.. And there are lots of ways to get around leaving a trail, many of which Zero will know about. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 18:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - The Melting Snowman

Indeed, which makes it all the more the surprising he was 'caught' so to speak. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 22:46   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

>> Indeed, which makes it all the more the surprising he was 'caught' so to speak. He wasn't caught as such because nobody told him. He probably knew he would be discovered. He wasn't the only one with multiple IDs. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 22:55   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>He wasn't the only one with multiple IDs. Amazing. And did these people generally use them for fake conversations with themselves? And for any noticeable purpose? Or was it for maintaining completely different personas or stances in discussions? I'm genuinely interested, so any comment welcome. Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 23:15   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - BobbyG

I have two accounts here - one with and without a G ! Two separate email accounts, usually only use one, buts sometimes cookies on a lesser used machine have the wrong sign on. FWIW I actually like the quotes - unless you view this forum with all the different threads or hover above the arrow to see what the contributor is responding to, it doesnt make sense. Zero is zero, its the way he has always been but I would guess that one of the reasons for the quotes is he is probably one of the higher contributors on here and doesnt mind giving detailed answers and explanations. So if someone has posted a 3 paragraph reply I can understand why he would quote it all with his response below each pertinent point. And anyway, how do we know that there arent multiple people here with multiple accounts that they have just nurtured the "personality " of that account over the years. I mean, I might be a socialist Glaswegian... but I might also be a shoe loving ex-pat that favours big estates........ How many of us have actually met another contributor? Reply to this message | Report message

Sun 17 Apr 16 23:28   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

" I mean, I might be a socialist Glaswegian... but I might also be a shoe loving ex-pat that favours big estates........" (Short quote....) But you'd never EVER admit to coming from Edinburgh as Runfer does. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Sun 17 Apr 16 23:38   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - R.P.

Humph thought he met me once at a petrol station. After a lot of winking etc. he realized it wasn't. I have met me andI know that Zero exists... Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 00:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

I very much doubt its very much to do with quoting or not. Its simply that Dave asked / told / whatever him to do something different and Zero ignored the authority. Now, as someone said earlier, its all pride and willies. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Mon 18 Apr 16 01:00   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

I just don't get why Dave thinks he has to have this forum how he wants it looking. ACD springs to mind. If the rest of us had problems with excessive quoting then we'd say something. Other forum software lets you embed images... and then people quote and the images are repeated. Zero can be a pain at times but he offered a lot of sound advice. I think he'll be missed. I wonder how many on here came from the HJ site when invited and then how many are new? I suspect 90% are from the original 'referrals' from the old HJ site. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Mon 18 Apr 16 01:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>I just don't get why Dave thinks he has to have this forum how he wants it looking. Never been told how to drive by a car park attendant? Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 01:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> If the rest of us had problems with excessive quoting then we'd say something. Just because it doesn't get mentioned here, it does get mentioned by email occasionally. As someone else has mentioned further up this thread, it's about making the forum easier to read, and those who access the forum on their phone have also said about the very long threads are difficult to read on their screen because of the amount of scrolling they have to do. It was a request made to Zero. He ignored it and then started doing it even more to wind me up. Like I've previously said, he was the one who threw his toys out the pram over it. He was the reason I had to add the html tag command BIG to the swear filter because he went overboard with it, showing off how clever he was by repeating it over and over and making words bigger and bigger. In short he just doesn't know when to stop acting the fool. Now, I'm quite happy for him to return if he apologises for his outburst. That's up to him. His account is still active despite me saying I would disable it in the heat of the moment. All I ask for is for a bit of consideration from him to snip and summarise when he replies to someone and also not to continue winding me (and others) up. oh, and not be quite so abrasive to people (as has been mentioned in this thread and/or elsewhere). It's his call. On the whole he's a knowledgeable and clever bloke. There is no denying that. He can be helpful towards other forum members. It's just a pity the other side of Zero lets him down. That said, if we were all the same then life would be predicable and boring. Reply to this message | Report message       8

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>On the whole he's a knowledgeable and clever bloke. There is no denying that. He can be helpful towards other forum members. It's just a pity the other side of Zero lets him down That "other side" is the bit that means he doesn't format his posts the way that you have ordained shall be so. To the point where you simply deleted his stuff because you didn't like it. i.e. We lose the "knowledgeable and clever bloke" who is "helpful towards other forum members" because you've got your tutu in a twist about the way he quotes stuff. Way to have the priorities in a FORUM. Last edited by: No FM2R on Mon 18 Apr 16 at 18:44 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:51   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Westpig

>> That "other side" is the bit that means he doesn't format his posts the way >> that you have ordained shall be so. I'm a guest here. If someone asks me to do something and it is reasonable, why wouldn't I comply? Why do some people have to challenge everything, why can't they just do as they are told? Reply to this message | Report message       11

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:58   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

The operative bit being " reasonable " surely? Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 19:54   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Westpig

>> The operative bit being " reasonable " surely? >> Yes. But is it unreasonable to comply with a request to not re-post everything someone else has posted... every time? Reply to this message | Report message       9

Mon 18 Apr 16 20:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Crankcase

Can't say I was bothered by the excessive quoting, but then I don't really read on a phone. Perhaps it annoyed others. But I do think it's a real shame that we have lost zero, who, for all his manifest peccadilloes, was a useful, amusing and valued contributor. However, look forward, not back. Others here are also tick those boxes, and the place is not entirely moribund yet. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 23:22   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

Not particularly, but to take it to that extent is. Consider speed limits. What happens when you put the limit too low? Everybody starts breaking it and it quickly loses all credibility. Who would you rather have around? Zero who could be abrasive and annoying and over quoted stuff, or these idiots with their thumbs and frownies who contribute precisely nothing? Losing a contributor seems a shame. Losing the gutless would seem irrelevant, albeit that they show no sign of declining. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 21:32   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> The operative bit being " reasonable " surely? And of course you were never unreasonable on HJ toward anyone that didn't do as they were told by you. People in glass houses and all that. Reply to this message | Report message       5

Mon 18 Apr 16 23:19   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>And of course you were never unreasonable on HJ toward anyone that didn't do as they were told by you. You have referred to my moderating on HJ a few times and I've let it slide. Keep bringing it up and we'll get down to brass tacks about who did what. Simply remember that the moderating on HJ took the Backroom from not actually existing at all to a major part of a major site. What have you achieved here? In fact, what did you achieve towards the end of your time at HJ? >>People in glass houses and all that. Absolutely. Want to start throwing rocks? Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 01:01   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> You have referred to my moderating on HJ a few times and I've let it slide. Like I've said before, stop questioning how I moderate the site then, and I won't keep referring to your moderating style on HJ. Take it up with SL if you've got an issue with how I moderate here. After all said and done, he was the one who appointed me the position. You're just a visitor, so what concern is it of yours anyway? Zero is quite able to speak up for himself, without you puffing your chest out and interfering. Referring back to HJ days, you would have either banned anyone who questioned your moderator decisions over and over again, and/or told them to take it to email where you could then tell them to "shut up you silly little man" and the like. >> Simply remember that the moderating on HJ took the Backroom from not actually existing at all to a major part of a major site. Is this the same Backroom that a certain moderator almost managed to get it closed down because of his ongoing argument with someone? Hmmm! >> what did you achieve? Oh, so that's what it's about is it. Willy waving. I couldn't give two hoots what I achieve or don't achieve. I just do the job to the best of my ability, and that was good enough for HJ, and subsequently SL. >> Absolutely. Want to start throwing rocks? Like I said before, I'm quite happy to call a cease fire, but only if you stop dictating to me how to moderate the forum. Put the carrot away again before someone grabs it and snaps it in half. Now move on please and we can put all of this behind us. Reply to this message | Report message       4

Tue 19 Apr 16 01:16   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>. I couldn't give two hoots what I achieve or don't achieve Quite obviously. And i don't dictate how you should do it, i just think that the way you do it is crap. Still, at least all the threads will show nice neat quoting. You must be so proud. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 01:18   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

As for threatening to snap my carrot, what are you on about? I don't even know what that means. Do you? Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 11:33   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Focal Point

"As for threatening to snap my carrot, what are you on about? I don't even know what that means." Allow me. Dave made an earlier reference to your offering a carrot, meaning (I believe) an enticement to fall into some kind of trap. You know, carrots/horses/donkeys. A leading question. Of course it has also become loaded with phallic imagery. Actually, I find it hard to believe you didn't get that, intelligent as you undoubtedly are. Reply to this message | Report message       6

Tue 19 Apr 16 11:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Come off it, FP! A carrot isn't bait for a trap, it's a straightforward incentive. Only a fresh, young carrot will snap; one left in a trap will go soft and bendy. So, no trap. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 12:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

Uncle Monty: "Do you like vegetables? I've always been fond of root crops but I only started to grow last summer. I happen to think the cauliflower more beautiful than the rose. Do you grow?" Withnail: "Geraniums." Uncle Monty: "Oh, you little traitors. I think the carrot infinitely more fascinating than the geranium. The carrot has mystery. Flowers are essentially tarts. Prostitutes for the bees. There is, you'll agree, a certain 'je ne sais quoi' oh so very special about a firm, young carrot." Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 12:13   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Focusless

>> "There is, >> you'll agree, a certain 'je ne sais quoi' oh so very special about a firm, >> young carrot." www.naharnet.com/stories/en/79086 Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 12:16   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Flowers are essentially plants' genitals. In one of the many possible universes, plants are the dominant living things and offer bunches of animal bits as tributes and ornaments. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 12:20   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

>> Flowers are essentially plants' genitals. In one of the many possible universes, plants are the >> dominant living things and offer bunches of animal bits as tributes and ornaments. >> But enough about UKIP. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 13:27   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>> Actually, I find it hard to believe you didn't get that, intelligent as you undoubtedly >> are. Oh. Well thank you for the compliment but i quite genuinely didn't. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 14:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Focal Point

Sorry to have implied otherwise. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 01:39   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> i just think that the way you do it is crap. It's all down to the poor teacher I had on HJ. Each of us is entitled to our opinion though. I think you're an arrogant bully with too much time on his hands who gets his jollies by being a troll. >> You must be so proud. Whatever. Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 19 Apr 16 at 01:43 Reply to this message | Report message       7

Tue 19 Apr 16 01:54   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

I think VxFan has overstepped the mark and should take some time out and chill. Leave Smokie and RP to moderate for a bit. This is a bit over the top as a response. And follows on from the Zero issue. This site needs little moderation. And when those of us that moved over from the old HonestJohn site in early 2010, the low level of moderation was something Dave et al made a point of. The implications were the HJ site needed moderation and this needed little. I hope all is okay at home Dave. The last few days is not like you. I've not seen any private exchanged emails with Mark or Zero/RF. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Tue 19 Apr 16 02:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

>> I think VxFan has overstepped the mark and should take some time out and chill. >> Leave Smokie and RP to moderate for a bit. This is a bit over the >> top as a response. And follows on from the Zero issue. Are you all forgetting that when you push the 'Quote original message' button there is a pop up asking you not to forget to limit the message to as little as possible? Surely that means it isn't just VX being picky but something which has been thought about and embedded in the original forum software by the Owner. IMHO, it's a Mods job to see that is adhered to. >> >> I hope all is okay at home Dave. The last few days is not like >> you. This is just two blokes throwing teddies out of the pram, and two other blokes getting offended on their behalf because they think it makes them look big......idiots, more like. I've not seen any private exchanged emails with Mark or Zero/RF. >> .....and why would you? Pat Reply to this message | Report message       10

Tue 19 Apr 16 02:54   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

>> ....and why would you? I wouldn't. And this has more to do with this than we will know. I think Dave/VxFan is part of the problem. Especially as this forum in 2010 was meant to have low levels of moderation. I think Dave's forgotten that. It is two blokes throwing toys out of a pram. And I'd rather it resulted in Zero/RF here and Dave was no longer a mod. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Tue 19 Apr 16 08:01   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Westpig

>> and Dave was no longer a mod. >> ... and I disagree. I am quite happy for him to remain, particularly as he does it in his free time for the benefit of the rest of us. It isn't difficult to comply with his and the other mods requests. Reply to this message | Report message       13

Tue 19 Apr 16 11:54   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - NortonES2

It's hardly an onerous request. But he and his acolyte want to mark their territory. Except it isn't. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 08:18   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> I think Dave/VxFan is part of the problem. Especially as this forum in 2010 was >> meant to have low levels of moderation. I think Dave's forgotten that. Regretfully, I have agree with the above. For a Mod to get in a personal spat with one contributor is unfortunate. Getting in spats with two looks like carelessness (or worse). If it was the practice of deleting Z's posts rather than, probably unnecessarily, editing them that lead to subsequent posts being lost then that's even worse. The one of mine I'm aware of, on the M25 thread, said little more than 'I'd forgotten that point'. If it was something I'd given thought and research time to I'd be really miffed. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 08:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

Now I think it's time a few on this thread took a step back and had a good look at themselves, specially those who were involved with the running of the HJ forums and also those who never fail to recall, and infer, what 'used' to happen on the HJ forums. You were either mods or admin or long term members there. As far as I know the HJ forums are still there. This, car4play, is a free platform provided for those of us who want to use it. The owner makes the rules and the moderators kindly volunteer to take the flak for looking after them 24 hours a day. In effect the owner is welcoming you in providing you play by the rules and what do you do....complain. It's not right. It's not fair. He shouldn't have done this or that. There are a great many free forums on the web, there are even more free platforms where you can start forums of your own and make your own rules....even do your own moderating if you think you're up to it. If that doesn't appeal then, who know......HJ might just be for you if you think your face still fits. For my part, I'm utterly sick of the world and it's wife thinking they have a right to criticise something provided for their enjoyment free of charge. Get a grip, if you don't like it no-one is forcing you to stay. Pat Reply to this message | Report message       13

Tue 19 Apr 16 09:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> The owner makes the rules and the moderators kindly volunteer to take the flak for >> looking after them 24 hours a day. That in way is my point too, at least the first bit. If a Moderator is going beyond his remit and getting in a private battle with a poster then that's a legitimate basis for complaint and discussion. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 12:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

>>then that's a legitimate basis for complaint and discussion. << I agree, via email with the owner of the forum and all three Mods. I assume we have got three? They seem noticeable by their absence these days certainly when things start to get a bit heated. It would be nice to see all four to present a united front as they should do and consequently take a bit of weight of one persons shoulders. Sadly it seems to be the way with some volunteers, they have the attitude that they will chose to do the good bits and leave the bad bits to someone else. Those bad bits might not happen so often if ALL involved clamped down a bit on the personal insults, bullying and rudeness. ..........and we wonder why no newcomers stick around and post? Not hard to see why, is it? Pat Reply to this message | Report message       3

Tue 19 Apr 16 12:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

How does: "I'm utterly sick of the world and it's wife thinking they have a right to criticise something provided for their enjoyment free of charge." = "They seem noticeable by their absence these days certainly when things start to get a bit heated. It would be nice to see all four to present a united front as they should do and consequently take a bit of weight of one persons shoulders. Sadly it seems to be the way with some volunteers, they have the attitude that they will chose to do the good bits and leave the bad bits to someone else" Genuine question. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 15:09   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

The first is a forum, of which we've seen constant criticism about the way it works, doesn't work and many ideas put forward of what should and shouldn't be done. The second isn't a criticism at all, it's a possible explanation of why one person who does all the work, and takes all the flak (mentioned in the first) may possibly become worn down by it all. Once a bully detects that, he, or she isn't going to let up and it shows. I'm not sure what you were asking Alanovic really but I hope that goes some way to answering it. If not, I'll have another go:) Pat Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 10:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> I think Dave/VxFan is part of the problem. No, part of the problem is certain people see this place as their playground. On the whole, we turn a blind eye to a lot of things that goes on here. I think that is also part of the problem. Some people then take advantage of that fact and then think they can get away with murder. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Tue 19 Apr 16 10:32   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> I think VxFan has overstepped the mark So then Rob, would you sit on your hands, take it and not say anything in return? I think not. In fact I know you wouldn't. ps, everything is fine at home, btw. Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 19 Apr 16 at 10:32 Reply to this message | Report message       6

Tue 19 Apr 16 07:29   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

>>I think you're an arrogant bully with too much time on his hands who gets his jollies by being a troll. I formed that opinion some time ago when he threatened to rip my throat out in a private email. I see him as a sad bald-headed drunk who, if he ever had the misfortune to actually meet me, might well regret threatening an old aged pensioner (almost!) from sowf lunden. ;} Reply to this message | Report message       13

Tue 19 Apr 16 13:31   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>> I formed that opinion some time ago when he threatened to rip my throat out >> in a private email. Care to forward me a copy of that email? Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 17:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

>>Care to forward me a copy of that email? Getting on for two years ago. I'd been AWOL for about a year due to flouncing after Pugley deleted a post of mine which was perceived as being racist when I stated my Sister up in Lewisham can often be the only white face on the bus. Pat disclosed the fact that I used to occasionally have a nose around the forum to see what was cooking, after I'd emailed her to comment on something a forum member had posted. You made a comment at the time on this forum saying I should come back and stand by what I had said, so I emailed you before starting to post again on this forum after asking Dave for my log in details, being I'd been away so long. That's when you said you would "rip my throat out" if I made certain comments on this forum again. I can't recall the full context of the email you sent me, but I shall never forget "those words" as long as I live. Reply to this message | Report message       7

Tue 19 Apr 16 18:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

>>Pat disclosed the fact that I used to occasionally have a nose around the forum to see what was cooking, after I'd emailed her to comment on something a forum member had posted. << I remember that, it was a comment MD made and I replied that you should come back and make it yourself! I don't like being anyone's puppet:) Pat Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 19:40   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

>>I don't like being anyone's puppet:) I wonder if one day that you'll say that you care. If you say you luv me madly I'll gladly be there. >>I remember that, it was a comment MD made and I replied that you should come back and make it yourself! Can you remember roughly when that was? .. Time goes by so quickly I loose (as Zero would say) track of who said what, when, howl, and to whom. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 20:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> Can you remember roughly when that was? This thread I think: www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?t=19260&v=f Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 20:33   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>I can't recall the full context of the email you sent me, but I shall never forget "those words" as long as I live. You Sir, are a t*** of the very first degree.... Here's a little bit of context of an email chain, that even continued past those words which had such a terrible impact upon you. >>if he ever had the misfortune to actually meet me, might well regret threatening an old aged pensioner (almost!) from sowf lunden. Not quite the threatening email out of the blue you try to pretend, is it. Hang your head in shame you little slime ball, and if we're ever in the same area I shall do my best to give you the opportunity you crave. If I can bend down that far. From: virgil [7virgil7@gmail.com] Sent: 05 March 2015 17:14 To: no_fm2r@outlook.com Subject: Is it safe to come back? Hello Martin, Just to let you know that I do indeed check out what's hot and what's not on car4play most weeks. I did ask 'that woman' to give a thumbs up or frownie on some post a while back about something or other for the simple reason I've forgotten my log-in details, being I've changed ISP's a couple of times in the last 9 months. The thing that I don't think anyone really got was is the fact that I'm quite a jokey wind-up kinda guy really, and although I tend to over-concern myself sometimes with events in the Middle East, and the fact that blacks have taken over in the area where I used to live, I'm far removed from what goes on 'up country' these days. In fact I haven't even visited London for 14 years, and don't intend to any time soon. Best regards, Ray ========================================================== Hey Roy, Here’s the thing; If you’d said; “idiots have taken over” “people who don’t speak English have taken over” “Criminals have taken over” Etc. etc. I would have had understanding and sympathy. But you didn’t, you said “Blacks” have taken over. Why do you care what colour your neighbour is? If he’s rude, or criminal, or deviant, then that would bother me too. But if he’s decent what does it matter if he’s black. What does it matter if they’re all black? Nobody chooses their colour. You didn’t choose to be white. You don’t get any credit for being white, It’s an accident of birth. I’m explaining this only because I enjoy your company and I like reading your stuff, but this comment about “blacks” really, really bothers me – to the point that I find it offensive. I’m also trying to explain it politely because other than this, I have time for your views. I find it ridiculously stupid and in my opinion you , as a knowledgeable and intelligent man, should be ashamed of such a view. You can get your login details changed to anything you want by emailing the moderators. They can simply set your password and email address to anything you want it to be. I’d like to see you back, but I’ll do my best to rip your throat out if you start this racist s***. Good luck, Mark. ========================================================= Thanks for giving Dutchie that message, Mark. I did obviously go to school with black (I prefer the word brown) people in the 1960's. I even had many brown customers when I used to be a mobile car tuner covering most of South London, and a large part of East London too. I even had a brown customer who became more of a friend, I would say. I got to know his family too, his son used to call me 'The Man' because I used to sort out his V8 Rover for him. I do have a problem though, with the sheer amount of brown people living in, as I say, areas which I remember from my younger days. My sister in Lewisham, London, can often be the only white face on the bus at times. My other sister who lives in E. Dulwich refers to Peckham in London, as Africa, but, not in a derogatory way - she has 'brown' neighbours, mixes with them, and knows them on a personal level. So, that's the state of play with me guvnor. To be, or not to be, a racist. I dunno If you see me as a racist, well, that's your opinion and, I'm okay with that. Best regards, Ray. Last edited by: No FM2R on Tue 19 Apr 16 at 20:38 Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 20:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

I've forwarded the emails to 7virgil7@gmail.com as well, just in case you forget them again. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 21:18   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> Here's a little bit of context of an email chain, that even continued past those >> words which had such a terrible impact upon you. Thanks 'Martin'. They say context is everything and that little chain rather proves the point. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Wed 20 Apr 16 09:13   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Manatee

>> Thanks 'Martin'. They say context is everything and that little chain rather proves the point. Proves nothing to me either way, except that Dog said he said it, Mark confirmed it, evidence admitted. What about the context of the context? Do you think you have seen all the emails? It's not an unequal battle, so enjoy the show while it lasts. I noticed Dog's first 'throat' post had some sort of advanced smiley attached, a hint of mischief I thought:) It's only a game. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Wed 20 Apr 16 09:59   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

>>I noticed Dog's first 'throat' post had some sort of advanced smiley attached, a hint of mischief I thought:) >>It's only a game. That's me in a nutshell. Same as referring to that woman as "that woman" which is nothing at all really compared to what I call my wife *in jest* but, we celebrate our 47th wedding anniversary this year, so I can't be all bad ;) Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 11:18   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

I had to laugh to myself just a moment ago while brewing a cup of freshly-ground coffee. I have been called a bigot, a homophobe, a racist, and a liar at various times by people on this forum over the years. Maybe I am indeed all of those, or none of the above (I prefer the latter) Infamy, infamy, they've all got it in for me. :o} Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 22:27   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

What you conveniently fail to see though fella, is the reason my earlier post was thumbed 11 times, isn't about you saying you would rip my throat out, it's due to the fact that others, like me, see you as an obnoxious trouble making so-and-so and, it's a pity, in my not-so humble opinion, that you wasn't flushed away from this forum, instead of Zero. Reply to this message | Report message       7

Tue 19 Apr 16 22:56   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

Mark and Zero over the years have offered some good advice on the forum (for free) based on their knowledge and experience. I hope Mark stays and Zero comes back. I also think Dog's recollection of past emails shows Dog in a bad light. I'll put that down to forgetting rather than manipulating facts. Mark clearly had the old emails which put his comment into context. Sadly you've made him post old emails which shows that you are probably racist. We didn't need to know that did we. A mistake on your part? This Zero leaving has brought a lot out I guess. Fluffy and others will probably be fleeing. And Car4Play Limited are unlikely to afford another dividend of over £30k this past tax year. Last edited by: rtj70 on Tue 19 Apr 16 at 22:57 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Wed 20 Apr 16 02:58   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

>>Sadly you've made him post old emails << Nope, he's an adult and as such, made the choice to do that himself which says a lot. Pat Reply to this message | Report message       1

Wed 20 Apr 16 08:15   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> Nope, he's an adult and as such, made the choice to do that himself which >> says a lot. If there was any confidentiality then Dog had already breached it. While Mark had other options as well as the nuclear one of publishing the whole chain doing so immediately rather than a series of 'ping pong' messages was the right thing to do. Makes me wonder how many other real or attempted cliques attempt to influence the thumbing/scowly nonsense. And while I'm surprised this site apparently makes a profit I'm delighted it does. Stephen and his colleagues are running a business after all. Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 08:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Dog

>>I also think Dog's recollection of past emails shows Dog in a bad light. I'll put that down to forgetting rather than manipulating facts. I didn't forget the throat ripping out threat though - and never will. >>Sadly you've made him post old emails which shows that you are probably racist. That's your opinion of course, and you're welcome to it. My opinion is that you are wrong on that account. Reply to this message | Report message       6

Wed 20 Apr 16 09:11   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Focal Point

Interesting analysis. "Mark and Zero over the years have offered some good advice on the forum (for free) based on their knowledge and experience." I agree. But I'm not sure that Z's plus side entirely cancels out his abrasiveness. And I'm even less convinced that Mark's good advice compensates for the nastiness he's dished out when the red mist descends. "I hope Mark stays and Zero comes back." I'm not bothered. I don't understand why people are getting so wound up about it - it's an internet forum, for goodness' sake. Don't people have more important things to do? "I also think Dog's recollection of past emails shows Dog in a bad light. I'll put that down to forgetting rather than manipulating facts. Mark clearly had the old emails which put his comment into context." If that means "Dog is a racist and Mark can be excused for saying what he did" then I absolutely do NOT agree. However you interpret Dog's remarks, there's no excuse for what Mark put. "This Zero leaving has brought a lot out..." I has indeed. It has been on the whole an unedifying spectacle of bitching and recrimination, of inflated egos, of raking over the murky past, of washing dirty linen in public, of petty squabbling and vindictiveness, in which one moderator at least has joined in, instead of keeping himself aloof, and has thereby lost any moral authority. Many who have joined in emerge with little credit. The exceptions would be Pat and a few others. Last edited by: Focal Point on Wed 20 Apr 16 at 09:13 Reply to this message | Report message       8

Wed 20 Apr 16 00:42   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>an obnoxious trouble making so-and-so Perhaps. Whereas you, as proven by your own words, are both a liar and a racist. All of a sudden "obnoxious trouble making so-and-so" doesn't sound so bad. And you may well have 11 thumbs, you can have 111 for all I care. It hardly improves your morality, integrity or character. It simply reflects on theirs. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Wed 20 Apr 16 02:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Pat

I know exactly what date it was, I still have the email but I would never, ever make public a private email. It does confirm that I was right in not wanting to get involved with it then and I don't want to get involved with it now either. 'That woman' does have some principles. Pat Last edited by: Pat on Wed 20 Apr 16 at 02:38 Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 09:49   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

>> I think you're an arrogant bully >> with too much time on his hands who gets his jollies by being a troll. Vx, with that comment (and others) aren't you straying a little towards copying the abuse you took so unkindly to from Zero? Perhaps rtj is right and you might consider taking a short break, for the sake of your own sanity and perspective. Just to say though that I appreciate your, and all the Mods efforts, I wouldn't want to do it. Thanks. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 13:46   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

I appreciate the time VxFan and the other mods give to this site. But I think VxFan has let some wind him up and he could do with some timeout. I don't get the problem with excessive quoting (We don't need to read all the posts after all if we don't want). If we can let some threads run to 1000 posts then what's a few extra lines. I know VxFan wants things to look neat and tidy and Zero will have been annoying him by repeatedly quoting text he didn't have to. And this wound VxFan up. Can't be doing any good for your health when all considered this is just a forum. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 15:40   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Manatee

>> I appreciate the time VxFan and the other mods give to this site. Seconded. >> I don't get the problem with excessive quoting (We don't need to read all the >> posts after all if we don't want). If we can let some threads run to >> 1000 posts then what's a few extra lines. I disagree. We've all seen forums where nearly every post quotes all the prior posts, nested together. I don't bother to read them, it's too much like hard work. Two questions - What possible excuse is there for winding up a moderator? What do we expect a moderator to do when he or she asks for cooperation and is repeatedly given a two fingered response? And one observation. Zero has removed himself. He is certainly intelligent enough to have known where that was likely to end, with one or the other walking, so it must have been what he wanted. He has not martyred himself for a worthy cause, and he will not be going to paradise on the strength of it. My guess is he was a bit bored and made a performance out of giving the forum a rest for bit. Reply to this message | Report message       8

Tue 19 Apr 16 21:47   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> Can't be doing any good for your health when all considered this is just a >> forum. Something about your repeated mentions of Vx's health is disturbing my dog; maybe she's hearing a whistling noise? Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 23:03   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - BobbyG

Can I suggest Mark, Dave, Zero and Dog all jump in a big Merc E Class and take a wee trip to France?? But don't quote me on that :) Last edited by: BobbyG on Tue 19 Apr 16 at 23:03 Reply to this message | Report message       3

Tue 19 Apr 16 23:05   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

BoobyG's back tonight then :-) Which of the four should drive I wonder? Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 23:36   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bobby

Ah that's it, BobbyG is the cookies from Chrome on the laptop! Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 00:44   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>Can I suggest Mark, Dave, Zero and Dog all jump in a big Merc E Class and take a wee trip to France?? I'd have no issue with Zero. I disagree with Dave on many many things, I doubt we like each other very much, but I don't think either has ever accused or suspected the other of dishonesty, so we'd get by. Dog on the other hand, would you travel with him? I mean, really? Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 21:28   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> Way to have the priorities in a FORUM. Whatever. Reply to this message | Report message       3

Sun 17 Apr 16 23:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> I'm genuinely interested, so any comment welcome. Suspect I've seen two, or possibly three, scenarios. First would be somebody who is trolling and wants to 'stimulate' debate by being controversial from contradictory points of view Subset is somebody putting their alter-ego's POV - who was 'Another John H'? - the only person before Z to be banned. Third is the fictional character, created for amusement by somebody who has a gift for writing. The character with 94 as year of birth in his username who progressed from felling a barn find to fettling his 'ladyfriend' is a case in point. A bit of me suspects Fluffy (unless a bot augmented by human intervention) is in this category. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 13:46   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - devonite

I rather like Fluffy, mainly for his Child-like bulletproof resistance to insult. If I had been in his shoes I'd have thought "Sod 'em" and left, but Fluffs got staying power and you've to at least admire him for that! Now, I have great admiration for most of Z's posts and I've learnt a lot from him! - I hope he was just having a bad day, and returns soon. Then again, Do you think Fluffy could be MS trying out their new AI ? ;) Reply to this message | Report message       1

Mon 18 Apr 16 01:06   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> And did these people generally use them for fake conversations with themselves? I've been racking my brain all evening (in case you wondered what the burning smell was) of the same person often having a conversation with himself on HJ that you wagged your finger at. I finally "remembered" it was Ho Chi Minh and Tobyn. Memory of an elephant me, as well as being the size of one ;) >> And for any noticeable purpose? Now that I cannot remember (you could always forum search HJ if you're really that interested). Probably though to show some kind of superiority by asking a question that no one else could answer, then along comes their alias, answers it and scores the brownie points. Or maybe to bump their question/post back up the pecking order. Who knows what goes on in their head? I'm sure there were others, but only the above names spring to mind. Well apart from this other one I've just remembered. Aprilia, 5 or 6 different aliases IIRC, which was a big surprise. But as he was very helpful in Tech Matters, a blind eye was turned. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 01:15   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - No FM2R

>>I finally "remembered" it was Ho Chi Minh and Tobyn There must have been two then, because that's not the one I remember. John someone or other, I thought. I may be wrong. And that one was to praise his own opinion and offer confirmation of its veracity. Aprilia? I don't recall him ever using different personalities. I must have been asleep. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 01:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

There was one member with at least three aliases why almost identical emails. That's the ones I remember (but Z did have an alias at one point). The HJ member I'm thinking of had three emails that were almost identical. And they used at least two of their user name to backup what they were saying. A long time ago. But I think Dave appeared in part of their name on HJ. I probably remember their surname too but won't post that. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 02:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - rtj70

It was Dave. He had an Audi A6. I remember more than I'm posting since it was a long time ago and a different forum. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:22   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - VxFan

>> I think Dave appeared in part of their name on HJ. He had an Audi A6. Dave Andrews, IIRC. That was one of his many names, along with AudiA6dti or something like that. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 09:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bobby

Aprilia - used to give loads of great information and then disappeared off the face of the earth - or certainly under that title anyway. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 09:35   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> Aprilia - used to give loads of great information and then disappeared off the face >> of the earth - or certainly under that title anyway. Aprilia was very helpful when my Xantia threw its cambelt and the dealer was talking rubbish. IIRC he was one of two or three who flounced simultaneously over an issue I cannot now remember. One of the others was a knowledgeable techy type too. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:34   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Has Aprilia ever been a contributor here? I put the name into Forum Search and, while he gets 27 mentions, none of them are as author. I understand a bit of reminiscing about the old days, but this is reminiscing about reminiscing! Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Alanovich

>> Has Aprilia ever been a contributor here? Didn't someone say that he passed away? Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Now that's a proper flounce. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:48   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Bromptonaut

>> Has Aprilia ever been a contributor here? He dissapeared from HJ in around 2007/8 and I don't remember him resurfacing here with others. His posts gave impression he was involved in some sort of technical consultancy and travelled the world on business. If Al is right and he's passed away then that would account!! Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Mon 18 Apr 16 at 10:48 Reply to this message | Report message

Sat 16 Apr 16 22:49   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

Sorry to have missed you, WdB. I used to give it a bit of welly at Sonning Church to encourage hymn-singing, so no doubt it was audible outside! Having semi-retired to rural north Dorset, I'm now organist at Cucklington, only 2 miles from home but actually in Somerset. It's mainly evening services at this church which means that I can deputise in other churches in the mornings. Runfer - having come a long way from genteel Edinburgh (Morningside, was it?) - would doubtless call that 'playing around'..... Reply to this message | Report message       2

Mon 18 Apr 16 00:38   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Stuartli

As I've pointed out before, including to said forum member, every website has at least one such individual who either knows it all or just wants to wind people up......:-) Reply to this message | Report message       9

Mon 18 Apr 16 08:44   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - MD

This site will be a lesser place without Zed's knowledge and input. Some mods can be very inconsistent. For example I used to get ollockings for making up swear words using different signs etc. I see it goes on all of the time now seemingly without censure. Explain or not!! Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 09:25   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

I'm running out of alternative spellings for 'b°lløx', MD. };---) What's all the fuss? Z had a but of a tantrum and flounced, then VF had another one and disabled his account. Z will be looking in every hour (from a cookie-free computer, presumably) to see what we're saying about him. Narcissism is a powerful driver. Last edited by: WillDeBeest on Mon 18 Apr 16 at 09:27 Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:33   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Of course I'm not able to check, but I strongly suspect that a certain party was prone to occasionally green thumbing his own losing arguments from an alternate identity here. Couldn't really care less what people do to be honest but it did seem potentially quite obvious if you were looking for it. Hey ho, it takes all sorts as they say and in the scheme of things remains more or less irrelevant.. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:34   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

This makes me wonder - what sort of car would Narcissus drive? Last edited by: Avant on Mon 18 Apr 16 at 10:34 Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:36   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - WillDeBeest

Nissan Juke. A Qashqai wouldn't do; not enough mirrors. Reply to this message | Report message       1

Mon 18 Apr 16 10:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

Ho Ho Ho ! ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 12:20   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

>> This makes me wonder - what sort of car would Narcissus drive? >> Not sure but I understand he came to a sticky end. Completely ignored a pretty Toyota Echo as he was admiring himself in the rear view mirror and collided head on with a Nemesis coming the other way. Might be a myth of course.... Reply to this message | Report message       4

Mon 18 Apr 16 13:24   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Runfer D'Hills

You've been mythed, good to see you back ! ;-) Reply to this message | Report message       2

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:16   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Avant

You're all too young to remember the DAFfodil. (It did exist!) Last edited by: Avant on Mon 18 Apr 16 at 18:18 Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:20   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Runfer D'Hills

I remember DAFs I think. Yellow usually I want to think. Apocryphallly ( is that a word? ) the engine drove a big elastic band. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:25   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Armel Coussine

>> You're all too young to remember the DAFfodil. (It did exist!) I'm not. Ugly little thing it was, with rubber-band transmission and I think a flat-twin engine. It became bigger and more upmarket, acquired a normal four-cylinder engine (Renault I think) and called itself a Volvo, but still had the rubber bands which made a seductive whistling noise on the overrun. My ex-wife, who didn't drive, was given one by her company and I drove it a bit. It was painted gold and I didn't like it much. Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Mon 18 Apr 16 at 18:27 Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 18:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - John Boy

>> >> You're all too young to remember the DAFfodil. (It did exist!) >> I remember them too well. One of my embarrassing moments was to offer to help a woman who couldn't get one started. I got the bonnet open, found the throttle and said "Try the starter now". As the engine churned over, I gave the throttle a blip and, as I expected, it started. My brain wasn't in gear, however, and the car lurched forward. Fortunately, the sensible woman had the handbrake on or got her foot on the brake pedal PDQ. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 19:44   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Dog

>>and I think a flat-twin engine Yup, a boxer: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DAF_Daffodil#/media/File:DAF_2-Zyl-Boxermotor.jpg Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 20:14   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - bathtub tom

All variants didn't have a diff too, relying on belt slip instead. You could see the tyres skidding if they did a tight turn. IIRC there was also a single seat racing formula. Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 20:20   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Runfer D'Hills

I wonder how many constituted a bunch? Reply to this message | Report message

Mon 18 Apr 16 21:31   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - VxFan

>> You're all too young to remember the DAF Not at all. My ex brother in law had one. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 16:41   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Manatee

Did he discover that they could be driven just as fast backwards as forwards? Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 19:31   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Runfer D'Hills

Well, I must say, it's been a long old trip to France. Been a couple of breakdowns, one fairly serious crash, a roadside repair or two, lots of diversions and a fair bit of back tracking. Are we there yet? I do hope so ! ;-) Reply to this message | Report message       1

Tue 19 Apr 16 19:36   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - WillDeBeest

At least there's been no wittering about a Westfield. Lucky we don't know anyone that boring. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 19:59   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Runfer D'Hills

I used to have a Westfield you know. I could start a thread about it if anyone wanted to know more? :-) Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 21:37   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - VxFan

>> Did he discover that they could be driven just as fast backwards as forwards? Probably not. Having had a serious accident driving a dust cart (not his fault), the ex bro in law drove like a snail ever since. Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 22:52   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Avant

This is a fascinating thread - a titanic battle of wills, and I suspect egos, halfway upthread, and a charming thread-drifting chat down this end. The former reminds me of the tag wrestling that they used to show on ITV on Saturday afternoons, whose inevitable result was all four wrestlers jumping into the ring and attacking the referee. The latter is what Car4play is so good at and the reason why I happily look in most days. I have a feeling that the Volvo V60 that I have on order is a direct descendant of the DAF, via the DAF/Volvo 66, the 340, 440, S40/V50/S60. I understand that V60s are now made in Belgium. There we are, Dave - nearly back to France.... Last edited by: Avant on Tue 19 Apr 16 at 22:53 Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 01:16   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - VxFan

>> There we are, Dave - nearly back to France.... Actually I don't "think" I've ever mentioned anything about thread drift on this side of the fence. Last edited by: VxFan on Wed 20 Apr 16 at 01:17 Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 07:52   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - R.P.

My father had a Volvo 66 estate for a while, fine little motor it was - very quick "in the gears" so to speak. Drove it on L plates. I like to think my old T5 was a sort of descendent, international mongrel as it was. Swedish make, engine made in Wales and built in Holland. Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 08:04   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Skip

I understand that the merits of the Volvo 340 was often a topic of conversation in the pension queue at the Post Office on a Tuesday. These days it would be the Jazz ! Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 09:39   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Alanovich

>> I understand >> that V60s are now made in Belgium. This is an interesting point. Has Belgium ever had its own marque? None that I can remember. However, it seems that the cars they assemble for foreign marques are always of good quality and reputation. The most reliable and, in all honesty, the best car I ever had, was made in Belgium. My Mk2 Mondeo 1.8LX estate. Yummy non-metallic purple colour. 100,000 miles I did in that and I only ever had to replace tyres. I don't recall a single item other than that failing, I just had it regularly serviced at the local Ford dealer. Really shouldn't have sold it, but as usual I got bored and wanted shiny. Silly sausage. My sister bought it for peanuts and her daft military husband stacked it in to a tree on Salisbury Plain. It was written off, but subsequent enquiries revealed it had been returned to the road. My sis replaced it with an Alfa 156 Sportwagon, which was a nice drive but by God/Zeus/Allah/FSM/Vishnu did it go wrong a lot. Since then they've had a succession of Volvo XC70s. Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 10:27   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - Alanovich

Oh howl! Looks like the old Mondeo has finally given up the ghost. MOT ran out January this year (one day before my sister's birthday), now on SORN. I wonder how many miles it clocked up, seeing as it had 100k in 2003? Sniff. Rust in Peace, Parrot (for that was the name bestowed upon its purple magnificence by my nieces). Reply to this message | Report message

Tue 19 Apr 16 23:17   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to France - bathtub tom

>> Did he discover that they could be driven just as fast backwards as forwards? I had a bubble car that could that. Villiers 2-stroke engine and Dynastart with two sets of points. To reverse it you started the engine backwards. I think it should've had a restricter that prevented you from changing up beyond first whilst in reverse, but mine hadn't. I used to offer detractors a ride and display this party trick to them - never dared to get beyond third (of four) myself, they tended to go very quiet after. Have you ever tried driving at over 20MPH with rear wheel steering? Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 18:38   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - Avant

"This is an interesting point. Has Belgium ever had its own marque? None that I can remember." The only one I can think of was the Minerva, a stately limousine built between the wars I think. Reply to this message | Report message

Wed 20 Apr 16 18:43   Mercedes Benz E-Class W211 - trip to france - CGNorwich

Seven in all. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Car_manufacturers_of_Belgium Reply to this message | Report message