Heard at work, also on BBC news...
www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/business-38933208
I hope it doesn't lead to the UK plants being closed like they did with the old Talbot factories!
Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 14 Feb 17 at 13:57
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So one mediocre company (PSA) to merge with a bad one (GM Europe).. That will go well.
Last edited by: madf on Tue 14 Feb 17 at 13:28
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The new names that Vauxhall has for their new SUVs (re-badged Peugeots) sound dreadful: Crossland and Grandland!
I hope their marketing guys come up with something better before launch!
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It's not that long ago that PSA funded all their expenditure on new factories, models & dealer finance from their "own bank".
The poor performance over the last 7-10 years has drained their resources.
I cannot see how an ailing French carmaker can fund & revive an ailing German based company.
Both car groups have weaknesses in the quality of their offerings - merging problems does not seem a solution to either party's problems.
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The new Astra is a fine car as is the Insignia but yes, what is the Viva doing in the range?
I suppose it means that they can share platforms, with at least three different cars based on one platform should spread development costs and if they are anything like VW, 14 models are based on the MQB platform and another 5 are coming. This must reduce design and build costs?
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>> Both car groups have weaknesses in the quality of their offerings - merging problems does
>> not seem a solution to either party's problems.
>>
I thought the same about Renault / Nissan but it appears to have worked for them.
I'd put money on the Vauxhall badge being gone within 3 years along with the UK plants unless the low £ keeps them viable for a while
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I don't particularly like either set of cars... but I like some elements. And the new Insignia looks interesting.
Combining the two groups might be a good thing.
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While I do quite like Vauxhalls, and the new Astra is a neat looking car, I don't know who buys them. It's certainly not the hire companies, in my experience. Their fleets (Avis, Budget, Europcar being those I use the most) seem to consist almost entirely of VAG, Mercedes, BMW and PSA with a smattering of Hyundai / Kia / Ford.
Fortunately I'm usually upgraded, so haven't had to repeat my broken down Avis Focus experience, or indeed the National Car Rental Hyundai with a half eaten sandwhich in the centre console ;)
As an aside, the Merc A class I had for a couple of days last week had Apple CarPlay. What a load of rubbish that is. You know how when you use the satnav on your phone while walking it had a tendency to keep rotate the display every time you move it slightly? Well, imagine that effect on the screen in the car... infuriating!
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>> As an aside, the Merc A class I had for a couple of days last
>> week had Apple CarPlay. What a load of rubbish that is. You know how when
>> you use the satnav on your phone while walking it had a tendency to keep
>> rotate the display every time you move it slightly? Well, imagine that effect on the
>> screen in the car... infuriating!
>>
Wow, I'm amazed they didn't sort that, assuming you mean your phone was doing that and the in-car screen was just showing what it was fed?
On the other hand, I guess you only have to turn on orientation lock on the phone with one swipe and a press?
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>>On the other hand, I guess you only have to turn on orientation lock on the phone with one swipe and a press?
I don't think its that, the phone knows your location but not direction of travel for a few moments and so rotates the satnav bearings (and screen) until it can tell.
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>> While I do quite like Vauxhalls, and the new Astra is a neat looking car,
>> I don't know who buys them. It's certainly not the hire companies....
Enterprise have a few.
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>> Heard at work, also on BBC news...
>>
>> www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/business-38933208
>>
>> I hope it doesn't lead to the UK plants being closed like they did with
>> the old Talbot factories!
French company? Brexit? if this goes ahead the UK plants are gone.
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Lets look at the facts: GM is losing money with GM Europe. To cut costs they need to cut overheads and therefore probably close production facilities.
Sell it to PSA and then PSA can take the flack. PSA will keep manufacturing in the EU. Vauxhall are therefore at risk. GM Europe will consolidate production in EU plants. Use of PSA capacity comes into it.
This has nothing to do with what happened to Roots/Talbot. Apart from the similar closures and jobs losses.
But it's not Brexit is it? Surely not. GM Europe was struggling anyway.
But the outcome for Vauxhall workers will be connected to Brexit.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Thu 16 Feb 17 at 22:20
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I think the UK plants will close. The low pound won't help them if they countries have to pay 20% import tax just to import them under WTO rules. Also the input cost of raw materials and everything else will increase further.
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I suspect Brexit will be used as a convenient excuse for cutting some jobs or even closing the odd factory or two, although not necessarily as Renault-Nissan seem to be content for now with their UK operations.
The real reason is quite simple - Opel / Vauxhall just don't produce enough cars people want to buy. I cannot think of one Vauxhall I would want to own in preference to another make.
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>> The real reason is quite simple - Opel / Vauxhall just don't produce enough cars
>> people want to buy. I cannot think of one Vauxhall I would want to own
>> in preference to another make.
>>
Not even a Vauxhall Adam Glam? :-)
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" Opel / Vauxhall just don't produce enough cars people want to buy. "
Clearly the British public thinks otherwise.
Vauxhall were the second most popular manufacturer in the UK last year in terms of sales and have nearly 10% of the fiercely competitive UK market. They had three cars in the top ten namely the Corsa 2nd, the Astra 7th and the Mokka 9th
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But in decline compared to the previous year, by almost 1%, and would have been more had it not been for the success of the Mokka.
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Doesn't he Mokka count then? I'm sure Vauxhall would have liked to sell more cars but by any objective standards they are a major player in the market whether you like their cars or not.
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I was very close to getting a Mokka in late 2013 when I ended up getting the Hyundai ix35. It ticked a lot of my then boxes, high up positioning, chunky looking but not a family people carrier.
However I felt the dashboard let it down, at a time when many of the competitors were moving to touch screen radios and colour screens, the Mokkas seemed so outdated.
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>> I suspect Brexit will be used as a convenient excuse for cutting some jobs or even closing the
>> odd factory or two,
I fear the same. The current Insignia is not a favourite of mine but the new one due soon looks good. Current Astra (not the estate) looks good too.
I still prefer VAG cars.
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Insignia - a shrinking market segment;
Astra - perennially outsold by the Focus;
Corsa - perennially outsold by the Fiesta;
Can't see the French doing any better, even if they can reskin and rebadge a common platform for both brands and save some production costs.
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>I still prefer VAG cars
That's interesting. I recently driven cars from both Vauxhall and VW and the VW's seemed better on paper but, I preferred the Vauxhalls. (Medium term hires.)
The Passat was competent but so so boring. The Insignia was actually more fun to drive until you had to park it. It also looked better imho and the "cockpit" looked better and was more comfortable.
The new Astra has sparkling performance and good kit and was a rewarding drive. The Golf was reassuringly solid but dull even in TDI version (I forget what trim it was but it was an Auto with Navigation and at the time - about a year ago - had a £22k to £24k price tag).
Vauxhall have removed buttons from the dashboard of the new Astra which makes finding functions difficult. Save for that, I would buy the Astra over the Golf but in truth until they offer decent warranties, I will ignore them and go for something Korean that has an unlimited mileage warranty.
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I wouldn't focus too much on warranties. Hyundai wouldn't cover my clutch failure at 3 years.
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Most new car warranties only provide limited cover for clutches. Having said that, Hyundai replaced the clutch under warranty on our 2012 i20 at 2 years 10 months and fitted a modified clutch.
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I've not driven a new Astra but keep hearing positive comments about them. On paper it looks a good choice - the battle will be overcoming the perception of the old model.
Corsa selling I kind of get - it has a target market and appears to be popular with the younger generation combined with 0% finance, free insurance etc.
Mokka - dated when it launched and looks pretty old now compared to the competition. I see it more of a rival to the Duster
Insignia - pretty good in some derivatives but a shrinking market.
Zafira - not seen many of the new model about
What I don't get is who is buying them new? I don't know anyone who has bought a new one, and I think there was 1 Insignia owned by someone on here (I forget who). Europcar used to have bucket loads a couple of years ago, but not anymore so who is registering them!
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>>Mokka - dated when it launched and looks pretty old now compared to the competition. I see it more of a rival to the Duster
Having had one for 4 years and having come from 3.2l v6 Audis, it wasn't the dreadful ride that some motoring journalists have suggested, it had its problems but the technology and included kit was superb with decent satnav, bluetooth that read texts in proper voices and took dictation, heated seats and steering wheel etc.
Reliability was crap though. I have a long list of woes, some of which occurred just after the warranty expired and VX contributed on some but not others.
The face lifted Mokka X looks much better.
>>I've not driven a new Astra but keep hearing positive comments about them. On paper it looks a good choice - the battle will be overcoming the perception of the old model.
The Astra is a good car. Perky 1.4T engine and reasonable level of kit but the VX have done away with too many buttons which are now on the touch screen and that's not safe imho.
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Death knell for Vauxhall I fear, especially their manufacturing base in the UK. GM tried to flog it off at the height of the financial crisis in 2008 - 2009 didn't they but never pulled it off. Can't see them letting this opportunity pass. Peugeot will want the whole shooting match based in the EU, because that makes sense to them as they will want a free market, anyone that thinks that that isn't a direct consequence of Brexit is naïve.
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Maybe, but remember 2 things:
Manufacturing costs in the UK may be cheaper than EU, especially if the pound is weak and there are lower costs associated to employment than France - remember the explosion of manufacturing plant going up in Eastern Europe.
The UK may have favourable access to areas of the world after Brexit compared to the EU depending upon trade deals.
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There are no trade deals....nothing zilch at the moment, whereas the EU have them in place, bearing in mind that most cars and vans made in the UK head to Europe.
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And that the point people don't seem to get. Hyundai is a great example they are so cheap because the EU has a trade deal with South Korea. When we leave we will loose that trade deal with South Korea for example.
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>> And that the point people don't seem to get. Hyundai is a great example they
>> are so cheap because the EU has a trade deal with South Korea. When we
>> leave we will lose that trade deal with South Korea for example.
Alternatively -
- we can almost certainly replicate that trade deal with South Korea; or
- we can tell South Korea the deal's off if we don't like it; or
- we can try to negotiate a different trade deal with South Korea.
You can bet that the EU trade deal was not optimised for the UK. There's no good reason to think that we can't cut and paste the arrangements in the short term and tweak them over time.
All that would require positive thinking of course, not something that all Remainers have come round to.
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I don't know what the trade balance with South Korea is but I strongly suspect we import far more vehicles from them than they take from us. Therefore the Koreans are far more likely to agree to our terms of a trade deal. A point often overlooked by some.
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Mines made in the Czech Republic but I get your point :-)
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>> There are no trade deals....nothing zilch at the moment, whereas the EU have them in
>> place, bearing in mind that most cars and vans made in the UK head to
>> Europe.
>>
So assuming that EU levy a 10% tariff on "most cars and vans made in the UK head to Europe", there is no problem - the £ has lost 10% against the Euro since 23 June.
On top of that, there is the benefit of a compliant workforce in the UK, and freedom to trade with the rest of the world!
Triple whammy. Win, Win, Win all round.
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>the benefit of a compliant workforce in the UK
A UK workforce compliant?
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>> Death knell for Vauxhall I fear,
>>
Possibly. No point in saving a lame duck. Unfortunately the Luton workforce is not rated as highly as that of other automotive manufacturers in cheaper locations North of the Watford Gap.
>> them as they will want a free market, anyone that thinks that that isn't a
>> direct consequence of Brexit is naïve.
>>
In that case I am naïve. I think if it happens, it may be an indirect consequence of Brexit.
I agree with arguments put forward by Lygonos timed at Sun 19 Feb 17 09:40
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We have found the Hyundai warranty to be excellent, they even replaced the gearbox as there was a tiny hole in the bell housing. At five years old they have just replaced the rear windscreen as one of the heater bars stopped working on it.
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Looks the pension fund could be a problem....
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-39021319
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>> Looks the pension fund could be a problem....
>>
I wonder is there's a problem for French PSA employees, or are their pensions handily underwritten by the French Government?
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>> I wonder is there's a problem for French PSA employees, or are their pensions handily
>> underwritten by the French Government?
Or are the accounting principles different?
AIUI one reason for deficits in UK pension funds is accounting principles and assumptions that interest rates set in short term are there for good.
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Deal expected to be announced tomorrow in advance of the Geneva motor show
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-39172225
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PSA might do well out of the UK. They now have 20 odd manufacturing plants across Europe which is clearly to many, so in the light of brexit I'm sure the govt will be keen to offer incentives to keep manufacturing in the UK.
Current exchange rate should also help in the short term
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Thought the price looked a bit high for a loss making organisation, but having just read this on the bbc news site it makes a bit more sense
The fine print of the deal suggests something slightly different, and shows that GM has in fact taken a hit of up to £6bn in order to get shot of Vauxhall and Opel.
First, a big chunk of the price - three-quarters of a billion pounds - is not for car plants, but for loans taken out by the owners of Opel and Vauxhall cars through GM's finance arm. Peugeot is paying four-fifths of the book value of the outstanding loans.
Second, GM is keeping most of the outstanding pension liabilities. Peugeot will take on a few of the schemes, and is being paid £2.6bn by GM for agreeing to do so.
Third, the Detroit giant will take an accounting hit of £3.2bn on the deal - a confirmation that the value it had placed on Opel and Vauxhall in its own books was born more out of hope and the scale of past investments than any solid expectation of future profits.
Last edited by: mikeyb on Mon 6 Mar 17 at 15:12
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>> PSA might do well out of the UK. They now have 20 odd manufacturing plants
>> across Europe which is clearly to many, so in the light of brexit I'm sure
>> the govt will be keen to offer incentives to keep manufacturing in the UK.
>>
>> Current exchange rate should also help in the short term
NOT, Everything in car land is priced in dollars and stuff needs to be bought in. As soon as the current Astra model runs out, the plant will close. The Van plant at Luton, possibly sooner as its basically a Renault assembler, the plant is 40% below capacity, and can be moved to Spain where they have the same tooling and line.
Its fate is the same Brexit or no Brexit, tho brexit is the dirt on the coffin.
Last edited by: Zero on Mon 6 Mar 17 at 16:47
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Going forward it makes no sense to have a different car platform/architecture for Opel/Vauxhall and PSA. So the next Astra and 308 for example will share a platform - probably. And therefore might be assembled in the same factory.
I don't think this is because of Brexit either - the re-assurances on jobs had mentioned 2021 I think. So a few years for this to play out.
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>> I don't think this is because of Brexit either - the re-assurances on jobs had
>> mentioned 2021 I think. So a few years for this to play out.
>>
New Astra last year - 5 year product cycle.............
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>> New Astra last year - 5 year product cycle.............
which is why 2021 has been mentioned.
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This will be political as well as the French state owns 14% of the company and will be very unwilling to see jobs lost in France. Employment laws are also "better" on the continent and that will mean it is easier to sack British workers.
A GM Europe executive was interviewed on the evening news and said that GM UK uses a disproportionately more imported parts than other plants and therefore this will be a risk to the plants here.
Totally agree with the platform sharing proposition, it has got to be a no - brainer. The question is what platforms. The current Astra is very good and the forthcoming Insignia looks promising. Will they be used or will it be a case of "not invented here"?
Do VW make the GOLF, Leon and Octavia in different plants, after all they are the same platform?
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>> Do VW make the GOLF, Leon and Octavia in different plants, after all they are
>> the same platform?
>>
Yes they do. My understanding is that the cost of development of the platform is significant, the latter manufacturing costs are not so important. I guess if you have a platform that's cost you X million to develop for one range of cars, and you then platform share across 3 ranges you have massively reduced your development costs of each range.
An acquaintance used to work for Jaguar doing costings - he reckoned if you removed the development costs a fully kitted out XJ was about 12K to build. Based on that I guess an Astra probably costs 5K upwards depending on spec
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>>
>> after all they
>> are the same platform?
>>
>> Yes they do. My understanding is that the cost of development of the platform is
>> significant, the latter manufacturing costs are not so important. I guess if you have a
>> platform that's cost you X million to develop for one range of cars, and you
>> then platform share across 3 ranges you have massively reduced your development costs >> of each range.
>>
>> An acquaintance used to work for Jaguar doing costings - he reckoned if you removed
>> the development costs a fully kitted out XJ was about 12K to build. Based on
>> that I guess an Astra probably costs 5K upwards depending on spec
>>
I wonder how this will impact the smaller manufacturers like Jaguar and Volvo, both of which used to be part of Ford and shared their parts bins extensively.
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>> I wonder how this will impact the smaller manufacturers like Jaguar and Volvo, both of
>> which used to be part of Ford and shared their parts bins extensively.
Volvo is now part of Geely, and with a fat injection of cash have developed a new non ford scaleable platform. The XC90 and the V90 are the first of those, the XC 60 is soon to come.
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>> I wonder how this will impact the smaller manufacturers like Jaguar and Volvo, both of which
>> used to be part of Ford and shared their parts bins extensively.
Jaguar Landrover seems to be doing rather well since Tata purchased the company from Ford. Volvo similarly.
I think dipping into a parts bin for a Range Rover is something purchasers want to avoid. Remember that Ford used to own Aston Martin too and they re-used Volvo components.... in cars that should have had bespoke parts. At least those parts on display. Mechanicals is something easily hidden.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Mon 6 Mar 17 at 23:48
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The Jaguar X Type also has some interchangeable parts
e.g. Lincoln ( LS ?) engine
Focus ST calipers as an " upgrade."
One rear suspension arm that is non adjustable can be swoped for a Volvo/Mazda that is adjustable.
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>> The Jaguar X Type also has some interchangeable parts
It was a re-engineered Mondeo. Of course it had interchangeable parts.
>> One rear suspension arm that is non adjustable can be swoped for a Volvo/Mazda that is adjustable.
At the time of the X-Type design Volvo was part of the Ford group. And they part-owned Mazda.
Thankfully for all of us Ford owns none of them and they have all produced better cars without Ford input/restrictions.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Tue 7 Mar 17 at 02:44
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Hasn't this always been the case though? Wasn't it once discussed on here (or HJ) that Rolls Royces share many parts with "lesser" cars.
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Sir prized me howl many Bosch parts on my British built Jap & knees 2010 CR-V (don't mention the war)
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>>It was a re-engineered Mondeo.
A very common boring, statement.
It is generally accepted that it is about 19/20% Ford.
That includes heavily modified floor pan and improved engines.
>> Of course it had interchangeable parts.
So very few parts are interchangeable with the Mondeo/ Contour.
None come to mind from the forums I read.
As I mentioned the only engine swop is the American one.
A few folks have found out the hard way that a very few parts look OK but are not.
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Sounds like snooty Jaguar did the same as Saab with the shared GM/Vectra underpinnings. Wasted time and money re-engineering instead of doing what they were told, i.e. save money by sharing. Otherwise they'd have designed their own.
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>>Sounds like snooty Jaguar did the same as...
.... Aston Martin who do not advertise that their V12 engines are two Mondeo V6 engines ?
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I had a 2.5l Mondeo not so long ago and it was a Volvo V5 engine.... so a V10 maybe?
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>> I had a 2.5l Mondeo not so long ago and it was a Volvo V5 engine.... so a V10 maybe?
>>
i thought Fords were three pot these days :-)
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I thought all the manufacturers used many generic parts bought "off the shelf" but marked with their brand name. Sensors, programmable ECUs, brake parts etc. Complete systems like fuel injection seem to retain the makers name though. Cars are basically a bashed out tin shell full of generic parts and badged to a price level. Unless you have fallen for marketing bullshine.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Tue 7 Mar 17 at 11:42
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Longer ago than that :-) 57 plate
Time flies...
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>> Sounds like snooty Jaguar did the same as Saab with the shared GM/Vectra underpinnings.
Rear brake light switch on my 1963 GMC pick-up turned out to be the same as a Saab 99.
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The piston rings for a Ford Anglia 100E were just fine when used in my 1959 Matchless 650 G12
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>> Do VW make the GOLF, Leon and Octavia in different plants, after all they are the same platform?
They make all those in different plants. And add on to that the SEAT Ateca, VW Passat, VW Tiguan, Skoda Superb, Skoda Kodiaq.
Okay they don't all use the same wheelbase version of the MQB platform but they are all based on the MQB architecture.
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>>Going forward it makes no sense to have a different car platform/architecture for Opel/Vauxhall and PSA.
Going forward is makes little sense to have any competing platforms or architectures.
It will eventually move to the point where there are no competing platforms, and all the effort and profit is in the differentiating equipment and styling.
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PSA had a plant at Ryton on the A45 assembling the 206 model and had plans to assemble a small Citroen there. Then back home for the 207 model and closed down.
They'll milk the government for grants to stay and in five years time be gone.
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The Ryton plant was constructed during the 39-45 war to build aero engines and subsequently became Rootes/Chrysler UK HQ. It survived another 30 years after Chrysler Europe was sold to PSA for $1.
Too soon to say yet what will happen to GM plants. I'd be more optimistic about Ellesmere Port than Luton but too many uncertainties now of which Brexit is a pretty big one.
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Much wailing and gnashing of teeth over what happened to Ryton, completely overlooking the execrably rubbish cars they produced under Chrysler in the latter years. Many of which were sold alongside Peugeots of course.
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It always seems to be the UK employees that suffer with these things.
Perhaps a better balance needs to be sought between securing work and workers rights regarding redundancies?
I wish the workers well. It is not their fault that GM haven't invested in their models in recent years.
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>> Much wailing and gnashing of teeth over what happened to Ryton, completely overlooking the execrably
>> rubbish cars they produced under Chrysler in the latter years.
Agree the Horizon etc were pants. But for last 20 years Ryton made solidly built properly designed Peugeot models starting with 309 and going on to 405, 306 and 207.
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>>the Horizon etc were pants
Pants maybe, but European car of the year in 1979.
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>> Pants maybe, but European car of the year in 1979.
>>
ECOTY is very much a euro political award and is not any measure of a car's quality or guide to future reliability or retained value.
You only have to look at the number of times it has been won by Fiat / Alfa Romeo etc
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>>ECOTY is very much a euro political award and is not any measure of a car's quality or guide to future reliability or retained value. You only have to look at the number of times it has been won by Fiat / Alfa Romeo etc
I came to precisely the same con-clusion only yesterday funnily enuff.
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I have a serious doubt that the Vauxhall plants in the U.K will survive the cutbacks that are approaching.
The two car plants only have orders till 2021. After that who knows.
It is not just the two car plants but an extra 30 thousand workers in the supply chain as well that rely on Vauxhall.
(merged with current thread discussing Vauxhall. Fluffy, can you spend a couple of moments looking through the forum to see if a topic is already being discussed before starting a new one? Something I've previously asked you to do!!)
Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 7 Mar 17 at 10:16
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They don't have orders until 2021 - nobody orders a car that far ahead.
As I mentioned in the other thread, 2021 is probably the life of the current Astra. The replacement will almost certainly be a platform share with the 308 / DS4 / C4
They have too much capacity and too many plants so something has to give - its not that easy to get rid of people in Germany so the UK will be impacted at some point
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I hope they survive.Vauxhall is just a name Opel is the make.Why buying it if you are going to make people redundand.Unless Peugeot wants to get writ of competition.I'm no expert in this.
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>I'm no expert in this.
Let me try to help....
Many moons ago, cars were very different from each other, even those competing in the similar space.
You could choose a Cavalier, a Cortina and a Marina. Or perhaps an Astra, an Escort and an Allegro, or whatever. These cars were all quite different to each other, with different advantages and disadvantages.
Brand loyalty, or at least brand stickiness, was much higher.
So there was no value, financial or commercial, in closer ties.
However, as companies have tried more and more to perfect their cars, and since they are all dealing with the same market place and the same laws of physics, they have increasingly converged on the same answer.
The most aerodynamic shape, the best braking system, the ideal computerisation standards are the same, whichever car you drive.
Consequently the buying decision is based less and less on construction, engineering, structure or technology and more and more on personal preference, service, marketing and other personal experience or desires.
Hence why there is more and more platform sharing, and the difference in cars done in the equipment and styling, marketing and service approaches.
Logically ultimately all cars in each segment will have identical platforms, in order to be as close to the ideal as possible. Well, if they're the same, why make your own?
Beyond that are the economics of company and financial management. Surely you don't want me to go on about that?
Last edited by: No FM2R on Mon 6 Mar 17 at 23:27
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Spot on NoFM except you missed off safety - so much legislation about crumple zones etc also means cars are becoming more similar, in shape as well as the unseen bits.
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As you rightly say, Smokie.
Also environmental legislation.
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Also Dutchie, you specifically asked "Why buying it if you are going to make people redundant."
That is one of the reasons WHY you buy it. If you own a car company and make 100 cars with 50 people and I own a car company and make 100 cars with 50 people, if I buy your company and make 25 people redundant, I am now making 200 cars with 75 people.
that's 25 salaries (and overheads and much more) now as increased profit.
Ditto combining factories, firing middle managers, firing execs, firing half your IT staff, half your HR staff etc. etc. etc.
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There is an element of subcontracting that must also account for some of the similarities between cars.
Bosch for example make radio / satnav systems that are used in several different brands and I am told by a masters student in automotive engineering that whole solutions are now being purchased from the likes of Bosch, Getrag etc and I guess that this has been going on for a while (anyone remember the 4x4 Panda, the 4x4 system was made by Puch - remember them?).
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You'll be telling us next Borg Warner make gearboxes. Or Honeywell (Garrett) makes turbo chargers.
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I think it is sad what might happen to Vauxhall.
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Friend who has taken up a post retirement job driving for Tesco says their brand new IVECO trucks have Jaguar 8 speed auto boxes....
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Engine sharing is already massive. The 'notorious' PSA 1.6 diesel is used not just across the Peugeot/Citroen range but also in Ford and Mini models. In fact engines were, apart from outsourced auto boxes, carbs etc, probably first to be shared with Renault/Peugeot/Volvo's Douvrin plant which began production in seventies.
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>> Engine sharing is already massive. The 'notorious' PSA 1.6 diesel is used not just across
>> the Peugeot/Citroen range but also in Ford and Mini models.
Also used by Mazda.
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>> IVECO trucks have Jaguar 8 speed auto boxes....
Like BMW, Jaguar uses 8-speed ZF auto boxes.
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>> >> IVECO trucks have Jaguar 8 speed auto boxes.
>> Like BMW, Jaguar uses 8-speed ZF auto boxes.
So did my Jeep Grand Cherokee, and many other vehicles besides:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZF_8HP_transmission
I'm impressed that they're being used in vans now though. The Jeep had the best transmission software of anything I've driven yet; it was almost spookily intuitive.
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Apparently the Jaguar implementation of the gearbox is better than BMWs. It's all in the software I guess.
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>> Like BMW, Jaguar uses 8-speed ZF auto boxes.
Not for long, they're designing their own:
www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/tech/dual-clutch-dual-purpose-car-january-2016/
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In answer to OP, it's got nothing to do with Brexit, and everything to do with Eurozone stagnation.
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Vauxhall takeover: Peugeot boss says no plans to shut plants
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-39190080
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Like the dreaded vote of confidence from a football chairman!
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Pull the other one car loss.
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Here in the Antipodes, European-branded cars are perceived as more stylish, but pricier and ultimately less reliable than Japanese/Korean competitors. Nevertheless they sell well to the punters who value brand/style. Quite ironic then that many premium German cars aren't even manufactured in Europe any more...
As if to capitalise on this, Holden are very cleverly importing and marketing the new Astra based upon the fact that it comes from Europe! Will be interesting if people fall for this ruse!
Meanwhile, sales of PSA & Renault are miniscule... can't foresee that changing. And when they launch a Holden-branded Citroen or Peugeot in a few years' time it'll be fun to see how the locals react!
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In my time in Australia anything with less than a 3.0L 6 cylinder engine was a bit of a joke. My pal used to lend me his Ford Falcon, 4.0L 6 cylinder., it made my 2.0 TDCI Focus feel a bit weak on my return home.
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Don't think that's the case any longer Old Navy.
The Ford Falcon is dead; the Commodore about to be replaced by a rebranded Insignia.
A couple of years ago the best-selling car in Oz was the Mazda 3!
Nobody buys 1.4's or 1.6's though, the usual engine choice in a modern hatchback is 1.8 or 2.0...
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>> Don't think that's the case any longer Old Navy.
That was many years ago (50ish) I have returned many times , the last car I rented there was a Camry, next time it will probably be a Corrola local run about for the Perth area.
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Corollas are sold in huge numbers, mostly to rental fleets. Having said that, I rent a car in Queensland every 3-4 weeks, and I always seem to get a Kia or Hyundai these days.
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>> I hope it doesn't lead to the UK plants being closed
Not quite (yet).
However, Vauxhall is cutting about 400 jobs at its Ellesmere Port car plant due to falling sales.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41627237
Seems SUV's are the "in thing" at the moment, whilst 5 door cars are on the decline.
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Um gonna count the doors on my SUV layder on when the sun is up.
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>> I hope it doesn't lead to the UK plants being closed like they did with
>> the old Talbot factories!
The future of Ellesmere Port is still uncertain, but it's good news for Luton, where not only is the next Vivaro van being built there, but could eventually see Peugeot and Citroen-branded vans made their too.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-43638862
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The next Vivaro will be a Peugeot Expert/Citroen Dispatch/Toyota Pro-Ace with Vauxhall badges. I think they plan Luton to make all right hand drive versions of all 4 brands.i
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PSA to By Opel / Vauxhall - madf
