My Hyundai ix35 is 3 years old and 39k miles on the clock. At its service a year ago, I mentioned that I thought the clutch was slightly slipping when cold but they couldn't find anything wrong.
At its service this year, back in Oct I mentioned it again but still they couldn't find anything.
Just had it in for its first MOT and mentioned it again.
They have advised me that the clutch has got a very high biting point and this is due to bad driving technique, in particular , riding the clutch. This is classed as wear and tear and won't be covered under warranty.
Now what is "riding the clutch"? I always thought this was where you partly dipped the clutch to save going down the gears when you knew that you would be setting off again? Something like you would maybe do going through deep water where you would do this to keep the revs up? If that is the true definition, this is something I never ever do.
I don't drive with foot resting on clutch, I always use the footrest to the side.
Would be interested to know what the definition of this is - some googling suggests that this seems to be a common problem with some Hyundais and this is the reason always given for not honouring it under warranty
|
My understanding of riding the clutch is keeping the left foot on pedal between changes or worse, driving with it there. Effect though would be to wear the release bearing rather than the friction surfaces; clutch fails to release with pedal fully depressed meaning changes are baulked.
I nag The Lad for doing it and wonder if he was responsible for second clutch in by Berlingo going after 50k miles rather than 100 the first managed.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 6 Dec 15 at 17:40
|
Riding the clutch has two main meanings.
1/ Resting foot on pedal while driving, does not wear the clutch plates but will wear the thrust and release bearings.
2/ Not using the handbrake on gradients but holding the car in gear on the slope with the clutch.
This will wear the clutch plate and give you a high bite point.
|
My understanding has always been when waiting at a junction on an upward slope, for instance, the car is held in place by semi engaging the clutch rather than using the hand brake.
My wife does this and even after me trying to explain the troubles this may cause, so it will be her bill when the clutch fails.
|
Probably no current model car has one, but my vintage car has a carbon thrust bearing. With one of those, you spend the absolute minimum amount of time with the clutch pedal depressed to try and make it last.
I've done a clutch in 20000 miles, but they were mostly full on racing starts when I competed in tarmac hill climbs. With most UK hills being very short, a good start is imperative, I've actually been the fastest car over the first 60 feet at Prescott once, a road car beating open wheel single seaters. You don't do that by being nice to things!
|
Clutch lining plate is designed to wear of course, since it has to be slipped a bit even to start off from rest. But a proper sympathetic driver can make one last ten times as long as a crap driving-school-trained tyro lady pilot.
Anyone who holds a car on the clutch on any sort of slope for more than (say) ten seconds is a philistine and car-destroyer. People who burn and score pressure plates before their time are beneath contempt.
Driving instructors have a lot to answer for. They teach tyros all this guff about bite points and the more naive punters carry on driving like that through thick and thin, trashing their husbands' and their own cars. They can even melt the rubber in flywheels.
I sometimes suspect the aftermarket components makers bribe them to do it. In my spannering days I saw and smelt some abominable things, abominable. Even now they make me shudder.
|
>>>> Driving instructors have a lot to answer for. They teach tyros all this guff about
>> bite points and the more naive punters carry on driving like that through thick and
>> thin, trashing their husbands' and their own cars. They can even melt the rubber in
>> flywheels.
>>
>>
Unmitigated rubbish. Where on earth do you get this stuff from?
|
Yaroo! Managed to find your bite point again Robino! Ouch!
However in answer to your question: I get all this stuff from hands-on, filthy, difficult dealing with actual clutches and flywheels in cars I have abused myself. Can you say the same? If so, sorry for the slight on driving instructors.
|
"in cars I have abused myself. "
That the bit that caught my eye. Bit disappointed when I read the whole thing.
|
>> Bit disappointed when I read the whole thing.
Oh sorry CGN. I'll try harder, promise.
I was making a serious point however.
Herself was trained by a driving instructor to wear the clutch out regardless. By dint of gentle persuasion I managed to overcome that to some extent, leaning heavily on the economic argument which always works well with Herself. It's poor practice to seem to be criticizing someone's driving of course. You need to be a bit devious.
She's an intelligent old girl and her driving has improved as a result. I'm happy to lounge in the passenger seat for hundreds of miles unless we are in a hurry.
|
>> Yaroo! Managed to find your bite point again Robino! Ouch!
>>
>>>>
I'll let you off.
For the record, the only clutch I had replaced as an instructor was on a Mk2 Fiesta at 48k, and the clutches on them were diabolical anyway. No two of them felt the same even when new, some would bite near the bottom of the pedal stroke and others would come within half inch of the top before you got any drive. Some were smooth, others snatched like crazy.
On the subject of driving instructors, most are one man bands buying and maintaining their cars at their own expense. You made damn sure car sympathy was top of your teaching agenda and the last thing you needed was to be constantly forking out for clutches.
|
>> On the subject of driving instructors, most are one man bands buying and maintaining their
>> cars at their own expense. You made damn sure car sympathy was top of your
>> teaching agenda and the last thing you needed was to be constantly forking out for
>> clutches.
That sums up my instructor Tom. He'd whack my knee with his rolled up Daily Mirror if he thought I was leaving my foot on the pedal unnecessarily. He also chain smoked and had an inexhaustible supply of dirty jokes.
He taught my Mother, several of her friends and my sister to drive. I doubt he told them the jokes. He did though have a comely friend of my sister drive out towards Ilkley Moor where he spun her the 'my wife doesn't understand me' yarn.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 6 Dec 15 at 19:32
|
>> >>
>> That sums up my instructor Tom. He'd whack my knee with his rolled up Daily
>> Mirror if he thought I was leaving my foot on the pedal unnecessarily. He also
>> chain smoked and had an inexhaustible supply of dirty jokes.
>>
>> He taught my Mother, several of her friends and my sister to drive. I doubt
>> he told them the jokes. He did though have a comely friend of my sister
>> drive out towards Ilkley Moor where he spun her the 'my wife doesn't understand me'
>> yarn.
>>
I also had a massive supply of dirty jokes, believe me the women liked them as much as the men did. One had to exercise care, of course. You soon got to know who would appreciate the tale of the babysitter and the vicar and who you just would not tell it too. I never got it wrong.
Smoking? When I first started you'd light up without thinking about it as did every smoker in those more tolerant times, as the years went on you'd ask if they minded, towards the end the cigarette only came out if the pupil was also a smoker. These days it's a no-no as examiners have been instructed to refuse a car for a test if there is any evidence the dreadful habit has been practiced therein.
One also needs to avoid giving in to any carnal urges towards your trainees unless the person in question literally throws themselves at you.
|
|
Had a clutch replace once in the old VW Beetle it had done 120000 miles.Do instructors teach anything about the clutch? I remember my instructor nice bloke we talked about all sorts but never the clutch.
|
|
Hyundai don't have a very good track record where clutches are concerned. Sharp biting clutch was one of the few things which marred the original i10, leading to recalls and warranty replacements in some cases.
|
Hyundai and Kia do have problems with cluth require premature replacement in some models.
Have a look at those forums.
|
A widow of a former teacher of mine (long since departed) bought a newish Yaris about 6 years ago - she managed to go through 3 clutches in 1 year - the son stepped in & sold the car before she killed someone - screaming revs and little or no progress and that was getting out of the drive.
Posh house drive in one gate & out the other! I do not think reversing was one of her strengths either..
|
>> I get all this stuff from hands-on, filthy, difficult dealing with actual clutches and flywheels in cars I have abused myself.
Sorry to go on and repeat myself, but I've owned two Citroen flat-twins which had two clutches in series, one of them a centrifugal clutch for starting from rest.
The Dyane was fine, but the old Bijou wore out its centrifugal linings and started making an unseemly noise, which I ignored until the centrifugal drum wore through and fell apart, and the whole thing filled with swarf. EEE, it were lovely...
|
>> >>>> Driving instructors have a lot to answer for. They teach tyros all this guff
>> Unmitigated rubbish. Where on earth do you get this stuff from?
>>
I'd say AC has a point. A colleague of mine would happily sit for a minute or more at traffic lights on a hill, holding the car on its clutch. When I could bear it no longer and gently suggested it might not be good for it, the response was "that's what it's for".
|
>> I'd say AC has a point.
Come to think of it I had to encourage my kids to do handbrake/neutral when stopped at lights on the level. Instructor (same for both) thought it better to sit with clutch fully down as green light>clutch down>engage first>bite>handbrake was too much of a one armed paper hanger job for newbies.
|
|
I used to ride the crutch a lot when I was younger, but I don't do it so much now that I've gorn automatic.
|
I don't have the pedal depressed a second longer than necessary. My last Volvo clutch was still fine at 430,000 miles when I scrapped the car for other reasons.
I agree about driving instructors. Our son's instructor encourages him to hold the car on the clutch while waiting for an opportunity to start off up a hill. But that's the point of having an instructor - you wear his car out and then after passing the test you treat your own with more respect.
Clutches hardly need to slip at all in most circumstances - you engage them at idling and then increase speed. But many drivers rev the engine before letting in the clutch, so of course they wear the clutch out.
With the Triumph there's another reason for minimising time with the pedal depressed. The crankshaft thrust washers are known to be inadequate, and can wear so thin that they fall out, resulting in severe crankshaft damage. It pays to monitor crankshaft end-float occasionally.
|
|
Can't claim 430,000 in anything but I've run a fair few cars up to 200,000 before bailing out. Never had to replace a clutch.
|
Edit to above - including 3 manual Mondeo TDCis which apparently have clutches/DMFs made of cream cheese. ( whisper this if necessary but actually they don't )
;-)
|
I have never had to replace a clutch even in second hand cars of unknown history.
No doubt there are some design issues but I suspect heat is the main killer in DMF equipped cars, that seem to cause some people so many problems.
|
Yeah, but you've got a DSG now...( exits stage left sucking teeth and muttering something about a matter of time...)
;-)
|
A hire car's clutch died on me a few weeks ago!
15 miles travelled then it wouldn't go in to gear any more. It had about 8500 miles on the clock.
First time I have ever had any problems with a clutch and the hire car co has charged my credit card £800 for a new clutch, regardless that it was driven by numerous other people before me!
I have disputed the bill with the credit card co, ho hum!
Last edited by: zippy on Mon 7 Dec 15 at 15:25
|
|
Unbelievable Zippy, never heard of that one, was this in the UK?
|
|
Belfast Europcar petrol Vauxhall Astra, I guess 1.4 but couldn't be sure.
Last edited by: zippy on Mon 7 Dec 15 at 17:16
|
Joy! But would a clutch fail in 15 miles?
I would argue in my case, that the previous driver didn't report a problem for fear of a large bill!
Last edited by: zippy on Mon 7 Dec 15 at 17:38
|
|
Don't worry just enjoy it, mine will be 10 years old first thing next year and it's been no problem, I wouldn't be without it, just keep it serviced every 40K (that's if you have the 6 speed wet-clutch).
|
|
So if you hire a manual car, first thing to do before you drive off, is to complain in writing that the clutch is faulty...
|
|
Sounds outrageous to me. I wonder how long it will be before this gains traction and some bright spark in one of the rental companies comes up with the idea of selling mechanical insurance cover.
|
>> Slushmatic.
Yes, reliable, long-lasting and only thirsty if you have a heavy foot or a 7 litre engine.
Done a lot of miles behind one and it never put a foot wrong.
|
Yes, reliable, long-lasting and only thirsty if you have a heavy foot or a 7 litre engine.
Done a lot of miles behind one and it never put a foot wrong. My 3.7litre Plymouth slant six had a slushpump with 3 speed transmission and big buttons in the facia for intermediate gear holds. It revved a bit high once or twice but it quite liked wafting along at 70 or 80 on the hot US highways. You didn't want to do anything sudden though, given the handling of the US automobile. Best to take a longish view and make inputs gently and well in advance.
A sensitive throttle foot, not always obsessively light, will carry you through many a peripety. Chrysler Corporation though, chapeau! Good product that motor.
|
The Plymouth used a bit of transmission fluid and topping it up was awkward. If the level was too low the transmission slipped and whined, but it was possible to overfill the system too.
It was still an ace product though, strong in the American manner.
|
Riding the clutch - Bromptonaut
