I remember the horrific pictures coming through on TV as this unfolded. It now looks like it may not have been an accident...
www.theguardian.com/football/2015/apr/15/bradford-fire-stafford-heginbotham-martin-fletcher
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Blimey.... if that's true then 'the authorities' have missed a big trick.
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>> Blimey.... if that's true then 'the authorities' have missed a big trick.
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Or.... they were involved in some way?
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I worked in the centre of Bradford In the 70s & 80s, surrounded by wool merchant companies. It was a declining industry and there were many unfortunate mill fires. Mystic Meg was an amateur compared to some people I knew.
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There were some unusual fires on my patch during the fire strike of the late 70s, some people thought that -
A, The Navy don't know how to put out fires.
B, The fires would not be forensically investigated.
Wrong on both.
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There is nothing in that article that suggests anyone lost their life at any of the premises previously affected by fire he owned.
If this guy was a bit of a serial insurance claimant then would it not be plausible to torch the stand after the game or at some other part of the week so as not to endanger life.
Doing such a deed with a packed stand would go against his previous behaviour if he was responsible before. Or maybe his hands were clean and he paid someone to do it. Which would have come out over the 30 years from some source.
So I would see there is a natural suspicion, but not conclusive, as it doesn't fit a pattern where no previous life was put at risk.
I used to go to matches in the 60s/70s at Brentford who had similar wooden stands. I would notice the amount of rubbish underneath on my walk round. It would only take a dropped cigarette to have smouldered in the mess under the Bradford stand, and with shielding from eyes and breeze, easily of caused that fire.
Remember the Kings Cross fire was caused by a dropped, lighted match on a wooden escalator.
If you watch the footage of that tragic day, there were coppers in at the back of the stand near to where the fire breaks through and takes hold. Would they not have seen someone creeping about, if it were started deliberately. And would you take the risk of getting caught knowing the TV cameras were rolling that day.
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www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-32330734
The judge who chaired the inquiry into a fire at Bradford City, which killed 56 people, has said claims it was started deliberately are "nonsense".
i listened to the judge this morning on R4
Some points raised.
The stand was due for demolition after the match so had no value.
The judge had been involved with similar cases of fire and believed that the fire service would have detected any non accidental sources of the other fires.
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>> during the fire strike of the late 70s, some people thought that -
>> A, The Navy don't know how to put out fires.
The Navy can certainly put out fires, I've seen them showing how they do it.
It's a tradition. Modern ships can catch fire, but imagine a wooden sailing ship with tarred ropes in hot weather. All seafarers feared fire more than most things, merchants, matelots and passengers.
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>> It's a tradition. Modern ships can catch fire, but imagine a wooden sailing ship with
>> tarred ropes in hot weather. All seafarers feared fire more than most things, merchants, matelots
>> and passengers.
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I think it was the carrying of coal, as cargo and fuel, that really introduced the fire risk. Coal can ignite spontaneously in bulk storage, and is notoriously difficult to put out. Opening the hatches to try and dig it out to jettison runs the risk of letting in more air.
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>> I think it was the carrying of coal, ...........
These days it is a combination of high power electrical generation and supplies, electronics, oils and lubricants, often at high pressure, and high pressure air systems. That is before someone fires something nasty at you. :-)
As for Bradford, does someone have a book to sell?
Last edited by: Old Navy on Thu 16 Apr 15 at 10:51
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Sounds pretty thin to me. And the standard of journalism does the cause no favours.
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Heard the news this morning.
Can't be true can it deliberately set on fire?
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I have total respect for any firefighters that tackle ship fires. Navy or otherwise.
These fires are extreme in regards, heat, humidity and severity. You are confronted with compartment construction of steel that contains the high temperatures and conducts heat in all directions. You have to endure this heat, humidity and steam tackling these and have to descend through a heat layer when moving below decks. Factor in tight access with kit and hoses, these fires are the most demanding any firefighter encounters.
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.I used to be parttime Fireman at the site I was employed.We did some training in Morton on the Marsh.
There where four of us had to go down a ships cargo hole with hose and gear.Put out a fire .We where equipped with breathing gear.I enjoyed the training scared the pants of me do.>:)
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Never done it, but witnessed when very young a test of Navy equipment. It involved firefighters in sort of diving suits made of asbestos walking through sheets of flame (paraffin or petrol) with a big CO2 extinguisher I think. I would imagine those suits would now be regarded as toxic in themselves.
Much later, interviewed some surviving crew of HMS Sheffield, hit during the Falklands war by an Argentine Exocet which didn't go off, but whose propellant continued to burn causing a fire in the bowels of the ship. The youngest crew member, a boy of 17, told me the soles of his boots started slipping on the deck when he was fighting the fire, the deck having become hot enough to melt them.
The armed forces sometimes seem privileged, but remember that they may have to pay their dues.
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Yes been in that concrete ship at M in M myself. Gets pretty hot.
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I can remember when the civil fire brigade used the equipment at Rosyth dockyard for their training. It was way ahead of anything they had. We had hand held thermal imaging cameras years before them. For the fire strike I mentioned earlier we were given a couple of hours training on house specific techniques (chimney fires, safe roof access, burnt through floors) and that was it. We were all breathing apparatus trained already. Our fire school instructors told us later that they had to start by showing the Army guys how to connect hoses. The Army was backed up with RAF and Navy breathing apparatus teams in blue light fitted land rovers.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Thu 16 Apr 15 at 17:07
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The Bradford Fire - Westpig
