Motoring Discussion > "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe Miscellaneous
Thread Author: Auntie Lockbrakes Replies: 22
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 03:32 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Auntie Lockbrakes
SWMBO has been moaning regularly about the perceived quality of our 2011 X3 once she realised it is built in the USA. It failed its MOT today with a steering rack end issue...

Our old model X3 (2006) was assembled in Austria. She reckons that non-German built premium cars are rubbish, yet Mercedes also assemble many of their 4WDs in the USA, and Audi assemble in China...

Are we all fools for continuing to pay a premium for the so-called premium brands when the manufacturer has out-sourced to low-cost countries?

Same scenario for clothes, shoes, and so many other consumer goods these days, all made in China for a dollar and sold to us under a premium brand label.

Also begs the question which supposedly "premium" 4WD cars do continue to assemble in Europe? Only one I can see is the VW Touareg (Bratislava plant), and most Tiguans (Wolfsburg)...

Kia Sportage looking more and more appealing at the mo...
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 07:49 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Westpig
Land Rover/Range Rover
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 11:53 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Bromptonaut
>> Land Rover/Range Rover

I know they have off shore plants but the number leaving the UK as exports is pretty big. Was in Southampton over the weekend and used Hythe ferry. Just downriver from cruise terminals was a multi-storey car park of size suitable for a decent regional airport. Full of JLR and MINI models obviously in course of being loaded onto the car transporter ship berthed behind.
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 08:44 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Manatee
Premium has rarely equalled reliable.

BMW and Audi/VAG aren't especially reliable regardless of where made, are they?

I think there were some QA problems back in the 90s when BMW first set up its plant in S. Carolina, but as with Hondas built in the UK there is no reason why a properly designed car built in a modern plant with a defined QA process can't be as good wherever it comes from.

All X3/4/5/6 are made in SC as far as I know.

I don't know much about Kias, apart from knowing a couple of Sorento (old model) owners. They were a bit agricultural and not without problems, though much beloved of caravanners - at least they were well priced (with a bit of negotiation) and came with a decent warranty.

If you want engineering excellence buy a Subaru.
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 09:39 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Mike Hannon
The Honda Accord coupe made in the USA I had some years ago was of excellent build quality. The Honda Accord I have now, built in Japan, is rubbish by comparison.
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 10:16 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Alanovich
>> Are we all fools for continuing to pay a premium for the so-called premium brands

Welcome to the blessed life of those who have seen through branding bullshine.

And it doesn't just apply to cars.

I gave up paying for the brands' marketing campaigns and chi chi packaging years ago.
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 11:14 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Manatee
I've heard that the recently facelifted Panda is more Chi Chi.

Probably explains the price hikes:)
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 22:23 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - spamcan61
>> >> Are we all fools for continuing to pay a premium for the so-called premium
>> brands
>>
>> Welcome to the blessed life of those who have seen through branding bullshine.
>>
>> And it doesn't just apply to cars.
>>
>> I gave up paying for the brands' marketing campaigns and chi chi packaging years ago.
>>
>>
Like he said
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 11:21 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Boxsterboy

>> Also begs the question which supposedly "premium" 4WD cars do continue to assemble in Europe?
>> Only one I can see is the VW Touareg (Bratislava plant), and most Tiguans (Wolfsburg)...
>>

I think all Audi quattros, inc. Q3, Q5, Q7 are assembled in various parts of Europe? BMW x-drive saloons/estates and Mercedes 4-Matic C & E classes likewise?
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 11:47 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Manatee
>>
>> >> Also begs the question which supposedly "premium" 4WD cars do continue to assemble in
>> Europe?
>> >> Only one I can see is the VW Touareg (Bratislava plant), and most Tiguans
>> (Wolfsburg)...
>> >>
>>
>> I think all Audi quattros, inc. Q3, Q5, Q7 are assembled in various parts of
>> Europe? BMW x-drive saloons/estates and Mercedes 4-Matic C & E classes likewise?

But should be irrelevant. How old the factory is is probably a better guide to likely quality, the newer the better, within reason. Robots make fewer mistakes.

It wouldn't worry me from a quality perspective - Ford, BMW, whoever are going to follow a similar process of design, manufacturing and QA wherever the factory is.

There are some problems with rusty Dacias made in India. The problem is with Dacia management, not India.
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 19:59 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - mikeyb
Its really based on how good the processes and QC are. Where its built shouldn't really matter if the people are well trained and have the right attitude.

My employer makes a highly engineered piece of kit in relatively small numbers, but high value. About 55 sets a month.

As an experiment they asked our China facility to oversee the manufacture of a test example to see what the quality etc would be like........

The guys that make them were pretty confident that the China built one would be naff, but it wasn't, and a few of the quality guys commented that it was the equal of the UK manufactured product

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 Mon 23 Jun 14 21:02 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Shiny
www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCttzmmUTwA
The factories and processes look the same as in Germany, but I still wouldn't want one unless I lived in Asia - maybe these are for the Asian market anyway?
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 Mon 23 Jun 14 21:20 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Rudedog
I know I'm going to be slated for this but from my VIN number I can tell my 2006 MK5 was made at the Wolfsburg factory, there's just something that sits better with me knowing it was made in it's home town, sad as I am I did watch the youtube video of them making a MK5 and surprisingly humans still play a big part in their manufacture (from working on the car I know a lot of the 'bits' are made else where in Europe).
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 08:10 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Duncan
>> from my VIN number I can tell my 2006 MK5 was made at the Wolfsburg factory,

How can you tell that?
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 20:28 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Rudedog
The combination of letters and numbers designates where my car was made, if I then look on certain internet sites they will have tables laying out exactly where it was made, so I can tell that my Golf was firstly made in Germany and then that it was put together at the Wolfsburg factory in 2006, I think this works for other makes.
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 20:52 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - mikeyb
>> I know I'm going to be slated for this but from my VIN number I
>> can tell my 2006 MK5 was made at the Wolfsburg factory, there's just something that
>> sits better with me knowing it was made in it's home town, sad as I
>> am I did watch the youtube video of them making a MK5 and surprisingly humans
>> still play a big part in their manufacture (from working on the car I know
>> a lot of the 'bits' are made else where in Europe).
>>

I think that was VW's issue with the MK5 - something like 3 times as many man hours as ford needed to make a focus.
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 22:29 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - rtj70
>> I think that was VW's issue with the MK5 - something like 3 times as many man hours as ford
>> needed to make a focus.

Which is why the MKVI came out so quick. It was a reworked MKV which was quicker and cheaper to assemble.
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 23:03 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - WillDeBeest
It was a reworked MKV which was quicker and cheaper to assemble.

...and with indicators other drivers can see. The MkV is dangerous.
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 23:04 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Bromptonaut
>> ...and with indicators other drivers can see. The MkV is dangerous.

Regrettably it was not a one off.
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 23:28 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - rtj70
>> ...and with indicators other drivers can see. The MkV is dangerous.

Indeed. You're not wrong there. But I bet that's not why they face lifted it. More to do how long it took to get the inside inserted. Too complicated.
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 22:56 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - borasport

>> Our old model X3 (2006) was assembled in Austria. She reckons that non-German built premium
>> cars are rubbish, yet Mercedes also assemble many of their 4WDs in the USA, and
>> Audi assemble in China...
>>
A trend started back in 1921 when a plant was set up in Springfield, Massachusetts by messrs Rolls and Royce ?
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 Tue 24 Jun 14 23:56 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - Avant
This is surely much more to do with the quality of components and the standards of assembly (presumably laid down by HO) than the nationality of the workers.

Most British car workers a generation ago did a rubbish job; but nowadays Nissans, Honda and Toyotas are assembled here with no difference in quality.

One of the Golf estates I had was assembled in Mexico: when they took time off from dancing on their hats, the Mexicans did a good job of it.
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 Wed 25 Jun 14 00:13 
 "Premium" European brands no longer made in Europe - legacylad
Years ago I was fortunate enough to own, third hand, an Urquattro. I thought that was built in Austria, but could be wrong (which is my default setting).
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