Elite or member of the precariat - check yourself out
www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22000973
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I am Technical Middle Class - whatever than means!
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Established middle class.
Edit
I look down on Meldrew.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 3 Apr 13 at 09:56
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Don't fit in annoys me these surveys.
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Like Meldrew I'm technical middle class.
While I can give firm answers on the employment, earnings/savings type questions my answers about social and cultural were rather nebulous - no exact matches.
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Elite.
I'm completely baffled how it worked that out. I don't socialise with anyone in the categories listed, so I left that section blank.
Give-aways might have been school, university, inherited money, job title, freedom from mortgage/debt, wife not working, 3 children, but it didn't ask about any of those.
It probably all hangs on one answer - theatre perhaps, or not playing bingo.
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Apparently I'm "elite"
Blimey ! They got that wrong !
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Withe respect Cliff perhaps the fact that you don't socialise makes you elite, by definition = Too Posh to Chat? >:)
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"I'm completely baffled how it worked that out."
Like the real world it all depends on money
Tick an income over £35K a house worth over £250,000 and savings over £100,000 and you make it into the elite no matter what you do you in your spare time or who you talk to. :-)
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According to that I'm "Traditional Working Class". In reality I'm retired and a pensioner.
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I think it's because I ticked "ballet". I did go once, fell asleep.
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>> I think it's because I ticked "ballet". I did go once, fell asleep.
>>
Same here, as a child. I deliberately didn't tick that box, suspecting it was a Bolshevic trick, like making a closet aristocrat show his hands to demonstrate he wasn't used to work.
I suppose I could go back and try changing the ticks one by one to spot the offending give-away marker, and then work hard re-educating myself so that I could pass as a worker.
Actually I usually hate and despise all such studies, suspecting they are only conducted by sociologists who can't begin to understand the British class system.
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I am apparently
Emergent service workers
Probably because I don't have much money and listen to rock music!
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Elite
The precariat is a new class ???
"Went to private school and elite universities"
I did not stay for A levels and that was the end of my formal education.
Surveys can say anything
Last edited by: henry k on Wed 3 Apr 13 at 11:17
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Traditional working class
I dont know if that is good or bad. It says Im older, which Im not, so ill take what it says with a pinch of salt.
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Hmm. Technical Middle Class. That didn't sound anything like exciting enough, so I went through again and put completely different fictitious answers to everything, on every page. It came back as Technical Middle Class.
Last edited by: Crankcase on Wed 3 Apr 13 at 11:52
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>> Hmm. Technical Middle Class. That didn't sound anything like exciting enough, so I went through
>> again and put completely different fictitious answers to everything, on every page. It came back
>> as Technical Middle Class.
Funny how the technical classes cant manipulate computer input forms to suit.....
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I am in the "could not give a damn" category.
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"I am in the "could not give a damn" category."
Ah! definitely "elite"
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>> According to that I'm "Traditional Working Class". In reality I'm retired and a pensioner.
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Me too. Hangs head as a downtrodden peasant!
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Another Traditional Working Class.
I'm rather disappointed, I had hoped I'd be in "Immoral Low Life Scum", but I must be too posh. Have to work on it.
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>> Another Traditional Working Class.
>>
>> I'm rather disappointed, I had hoped I'd be in "Immoral Low Life Scum", but I
>> must be too posh. Have to work on it.
There was no option for "have you set fire to your 15 kids and two wives"
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One of the exclusive classes but, alas, not the Elite; instead, Technical Middle Class. This is an odd description of me as there is nothing remotely technical about my career or interests: I could never do the maths. I entered details for my son who is about 100% techical (as a boiler fitter), has half my (retirement) income, no savings and a mortage. According to this survey, he is in the same bracket. Another difference the survey doesn't encompass: he has a Scenic, an Evo and a Merc (well, ok, a Merc van) while I have an i10.
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TMC here too. No surprises really.
Not that it matters, although I always consider background to be more relevant. I consider myself working class as that's what my parents were - rented/council accommodation, no qualifications, manual/unskilled jobs. However, as my wife and I are University educated and have above average incomes in non-manual jobs, live in a mortgaged property in a nice area and send the children to private school, I'd say my children are middle class.
Even so I still don't consider myself middle class. It's all a bit odd.
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I tried the site just out of curiosity but I have always found it abhorrent that one can be labelled as a particular class based purely on a set of parameters dreamt up by social engineers, and that any reference to where you live, what you earn and how you spend your time makes a jot of difference as to who you actually are as an individual.
A class system will always continue to exist as long as people feel they have to conform and fit in to a particular category and the media in general continue to use such phraseology.
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Doesn't every society have a class system? Some of which evolved long before the "media" were there to be blamed, but largely based on income and property, ossified into a sort of caste system. As in the recently deleted verse three of "All things bright and beautiful" the anthem of the Anglican church....
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>> >> who you actually are as an individual.
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>> A class system will always continue to exist as long as people feel they have
>> to conform and fit in to a particular category and the media in general continue
>> to use such phraseology.
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Some class, category or other group will dictate who you are to a great extent via, for example, peer and family group pressure. From public policy and commercial points of vew, it is important to understand the mechisms involved.
The survey kicks off by speculating that “Traditional British social divisions of upper, middle and working class seem out of date…” It seems to me they are still strong and the hierarchy is still based on a mixture of social class and money. This is why the “socioeconomic grade” definitions used in advertising and other marketing studies (and, to some extent, for official purposes) are more useful. This uses three grades in each of two classes; A,B,C1 for white collar occupations and C2,D and E working for blue collar. The distinction between C1, Lower Middle and C2, Skilled Working is blurred by the fact that C2 workers often have far bigger in comes than those in C1.
On the other hand, research into the most affluent C2 workers in the thriving Luton car manufacturing industry of the time revealed that, in spite of greater incomes, the families concerned did not have middle class aspirations to any great degree and retained their working class attitudes. I would like to hear about up-to-date research into this.
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I would hate to be thought of as having any class at all ! :-)
And before you start, I mean that not just as a joke but absolutely sincerely. I don't want to be in anyone's gang, tribe or sub-group. I just want to be me. I'm happy to associate with anyone who treats me with the same respect I give them. Nothing more or less. The rest can swivel.
Ultimately we're all just some clever monkeys with a shared and very temporary tenancy of an insignificant rock spinning through space. There are actually only two "classes" of smart monkeys I'm interested in, the ones who are happy to rub along with the others without deliberately harming or disadvantaging them and the ones who aren't. I'm cool with any of the former and have no patience with the latter.
:-)
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Wed 3 Apr 13 at 14:48
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Very similar views as you Humph... except I hate mud in my bearings.
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Don't mention the "C" word ! I think I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it...
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I am a New Affluent Worker. Which is complete horse-feathers as I am about as far from affluent as you can possibly get at the moment.
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Established middle class. But not as established as all that. And doesn't tell the whole story by a long chalk. But I guess most people could say that.
I used to use the marketing system of categories (ABC1 etc.) in market research. It was a bog-standard measurement applied to all informants. Next to useless for everything except rough income level.
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Funny, isn't it?
Bromp and I can mention the C word and have deep and intense discussions about it, but it's only when the bitter and twisted get involved that it gets out of hand!
Pat
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>> Ultimately we're all just some clever monkeys with a shared and very temporary tenancy of
>> There are actually only two "classes" of smart monkeys
>> I'm interested in, the ones who are happy to rub along with the others without
>> deliberately harming or disadvantaging them and the ones who aren't.
Add exploiting to harming and disadvantaging and that's a rather neat analogy with the Marxian analysis of class.
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Technical Middle Class.
Which is a good thing because it appears to move up the social ladder I need to start talking to CEOs, visiting stately homes, and listening to jazz. Worst nightmare etc.
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good use of bbc licence payers funds to commission a survey on class ?
thats why i always opt out to pay into it
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Isn't class to some extent classified by how one speaks and one's accent or lack of one?
My daughter, when at school in Pembrokeshire, was once called a "snob" because, like her parents, she spoke with practically no regional accent and pronounced her words properly and (mostly) grammatically.
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everyone has an accent...bbc english or geordie, your friends/enemies will catch u out
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>> Technical Middle Class.
>> Which is a good thing because it appears to move up the social ladder I need to start
>> talking to CEOs, visiting stately homes, and listening to jazz. Worst nightmare etc.
A shed-load of cash in the bank propels one up the strata too, according to this survey, without talking to the COE, etc..
Last edited by: AnotherJohnH on Wed 3 Apr 13 at 19:54
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>> Add exploiting to harming and disadvantaging and that's a rather neat analogy with the Marxian analysis of class.
Yup. But it's still not the whole story, or entirely just. When you exploit people you are providing them with paid employment. People demanding jobs are demanding to be exploited, even if they are too dumb to realise it.
Marx and Engels referred to the powers that be, the owning and ruling class, as the Bourgeoisie. They weren't too interested in the landowning aristocracy outside its capitalist investments.
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I've read Engels book good reading.The trick is to try not to be exploited isn't that why the Unions came into force?
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>> Yup. But it's still not the whole story, or entirely just. When you exploit people
>> you are providing them with paid employment. People demanding jobs are demanding to be exploited,
>> even if they are too dumb to realise it.
Time to learn the Socialist ABC....
www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqfz4-sMgak
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Wed 3 Apr 13 at 22:41
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Working class, and proud of it, mate.
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knees up muther brown... knees up muther coventry.. grow a bag
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I seem to be the only member of the precariat on here. Must make me special in some way.
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>> Working class, and proud of it, mate.
But what exactly is 'working class'?
Is the man who empties your wheelie bins a different class of 'working class' compared to the middle manager in a city finance firm who happens to earn four times as much and lives in a bigger house?
This is where the whole system of pigeon holing is pointless since it could be broken down into ever smaller parts and analysed until we come back to the individual.
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>>But what exactly is 'working class'?
Good question NoNameMan, my dad was a postman, my mum scrubbed office floors, they lived on the top floor of a 1920's council estate in SE London.
I'm retired (sort-of) I used to tune cars (to purrfection) I live in an isolated 18th century detached cottage.
Could it be a state-of-mind I wonder? - as in you can take the boy out of London etc. etc.
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Traditional working class.
High social capital, low emerging cultural capital, high highbrow cultural capital.
My household income currently is c. £20000.
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A comment on the radio this evening. Another question that was not asked " Is your TV larger than your bookcase?" :-)
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I took the survey twice.
If I lie about money it gives the result "Technical Middle Class"
If I tell the truth about money, it gives the result "Elite"
Both wrong - what I actually feel is "Skilled Working Class"
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SqueezedEstablished Middle Class. Oddly, lying about money would have the opposite effect on me to Londers. Must be because I went to the theatre once last year.
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>>>A comment on the radio this evening. Another question that was not asked " Is your TV larger than your bookcase?"
Now that's a good one I'd not heard before. Here the packed downstairs bookcases are eight times the area of the TV.
But books aren't popular any more are they? I rarely visit a house these days with a decent choice of reading.
Is it just me or do others here have book collections?
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Book collections. Yes. Yes we do. It's not just you.
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>> Book collections. Yes. Yes we do. It's not just you.
Two and a half full billy's here.
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>> Two and a half full billy's here.
Bunter? Budd? Can? Club? What's a billy Zero?
That's the trouble with reading a lot. You end by not understanding ordinary speech.
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BILLYs are shelves from a shop no one likes but people still frequent.
Here's a simple guide AC.
www.ikea.com/gb/en/catalog/categories/departments/living_room/11683/
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>> Is it just me or do others here have book collections?
Heh heh... one or two, yes. Wouldn't call it a collection exactly but 100 ft of shelves here and another 100 ft in the other sitting room with quite a few boxes still waiting to be emptied. They aren't all mine of course. There are other readers here. Oh yes, another 20 or 30 ft of nipper books upstairs in the corridor, plus books in their rooms.
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>> Is it just me or do others here have book collections?
Six full height and one half height Billy bookcases plus more shelves in kid’s rooms and study bedroom.
Lounge, mostly gardening, cooking and maps/guides. Study, professional stuff - mostly hers on teaching science. Our room, mixture of fiction, history, my aviation/trains collection etc. Landing, full height set of kids books and half height pretty well all political biography – mostly inherited from our respective Fathers.
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Where do I fit my books in ?
Anywhere the floor joists will stand a bit more.
I've been experimenting with the Class Tester and concluded that none of the questions make any difference apart from Income and Savings.
If I have a moderate income and even the lowest valued own house, but tick the maximum wealth box (not difficult as it includes pension pots), I still come out as Elite.
That's despite pretending to know no-one and having no leisure activities.
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I have to say I haven't got many books, maybe a dozen about half I've read. Never really read much now, although I used to, not really sure why I don't any more.
Last edited by: sooty123 on Thu 4 Apr 13 at 15:50
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When we moved into our present home I had a complete wall in a long corridor lined with hand made bookshelves floor to ceiling so we have several hundreds , perhaps even thousands of books ranging from ancient history to my signed copy of Morecambe and Wise scripts..... I like to keep my copies of Private Eye as well
I simply cannot bear to get rid of a book.... SWMBO is the same even though I bought her a Kindle last year she only uses it on holidays.
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>> I simply cannot bear to get rid of a book....
You should, a book read once (maybe twice) and left on the shelf is a dead cold book.
A book passed on to be read by many is a live book.
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>> A book passed on to be read by many is a live book.
Perhaps so. But a book or DVD borrowed, not read or watched and never returned is a stolen dead cold book or DVD. We've got a good few of those, or rather we haven't got them and neither has anyone else it seems. Better to hoard them.
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if only ...my gf flat is so full of books i dont think she has had the heating on this long winter because of the latent stored heat in the mass ..
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It's odd that 'visiting stately homes' is apparently an elite occupation. To most people that would mean paying for the guided tour as a member of the public, rather than going to stay with an old school friend who happens to have inherited a palace and the bread to run it. Theatre, ballet and opera audiences tend to be middle class too I would think. The seven new categories are meaningless pants. As are the six old marketing categories in the final analysis.
We are a bourgeois nation. Anyone can aspire to bourgeois status, and it's no bad thing.
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Ah well good to hear a few more are cluttered up with books.
We have continued an inherited parental style in furnishings so seem to be somewhat at odds with the frequently seen... beech laminate floors, modern leather sofas, painting free walls and big TV with multiple Playstation thingys style... of many houses we visit.
I like a room full of varied things to read, look at or fiddle with... can't beat a bit of show and tell when folks are round.
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>> We are a bourgeois nation. Anyone can aspire to bourgeois status,
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Quite so. Even some of the better families are bourgeois now. :)
(Misquote from the Importance of Being Earnest ?)
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Yesterday I was "Traditional Working Class".
Today I am "New Affluent Workers".
I can't work out what I have entered differently.
At least my average age has gone down from 66 to 46.
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And all I need to do be "Elite" is have an income over £25k.
I think it would take more than that!
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the last book i read was ' janet and john' or could have been 'little red hen' in the wide range series ... brilliant graphics
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>> was ' janet and john' <<
I used to love Terry Wogan's Janet & John;)
Pat
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yeah , made a whole new meaning to my understanding of my childhood too ... always liked/like wogan too...
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wogan for eurovision please...i know i will have to sit through it...
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If my TV was bigger than my bookcase(s), every time it was switched on the lights would dim over the Midlands..
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>> If my TV was bigger than my bookcase(s), every time it was switched on the
>> lights would dim over the Midlands..
Give it time, thats going to happen sooner than you think.
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tinyurl.com/bujdjwr
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 5 Apr 13 at 00:46
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>> >> If my TV was bigger than my bookcase(s), every time it was switched on
>> the
>> >> lights would dim over the Midlands..
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>> Give it time, thats going to happen sooner than you think.
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Yes
I am seriously - like £10k seriously - thinking about installing a proper back up generator and auto switch over system before the panic sets in.
Then I'll let out warm rooms and sell electricity to my neighbours. I reckon I'll see a 100% return in 2016.
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>> I used to love Terry Wogan's Janet & John;)
I was in a lower school car park when an episode of that finished.
The near-simultaneous sound of several car doors slamming indicated most of the teachers were listening too.
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rule of thumb...if you cant remember..TISWAS you shouldnt be posting here...apart from the really old gits
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your thumb and rule is very long....
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and my rule is pound shilling and pence...any one for sweet spanish gold tobacco....and popeye ciggies ?
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lets not forget batman cards , or high chapparell ones niether.. i think the kids today have pogs?
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>>any one for sweet spanish gold tobacco....
Will this do?
www.aquarterof.co.uk/sweet-tobacco-p-409.html
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>> rule of thumb...if you cant remember..TISWAS you shouldnt be posting here...apart from the really old
>> gits
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You mean those who remember ITMA ?
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>>I used to use the marketing system of categories (ABC1 etc.) in market research. It was a bog-standard measurement applied to all informants. Next to useless for everything except rough income level.
So why did you use it? If clients wanted it included, did you get any feedback as to the use they put it to?
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Only just had chance to reply to this thread having been away on a 5-day jaunt visiting stately homes in the west country!
Dad was a coal miner and I was born/brought up in a council prefab so I am ......... naturally, an 'elite'. I should admit that I passed my 11+ and went to grammar school.
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I've met a few coal miners during the miners strike .Tough no nonsense people,would scare me working on the coal face.
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And they know what it's like to be black.
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Hahaha! The BBC says I am a new affluent worker - almost 100 per cent wrong!
I am actually an ageing intellectual yokel who still has his wits about him.
Last edited by: Mike Hannon on Mon 8 Apr 13 at 10:51
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Anyone who's truly "elite" doesn't need to take the test to discover it ~ they just instinctively know they're elite.
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On my first attempt I was quite well up the pecking order, but had mistakenly entered my gross (rather than net) income into the equation. I subsequently corrected this by putting in the lower figure, only to find myself even further up the scale.
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The British just go on being deluded, don't they?
I just had another look and confirmed that the survey asks what you think is the value of your property but doesn't ask the size of your mortgage.
If they put that question in I dare say they'd learn a bit more about 'precarity'.
Ho hum...
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Where do you fit in? - Meldrew
