Whilst in the local Vauxhall garage this morning I did see a notice regarding cam belt changes.
Something along the lines of 'Vauxhall recommends cam belt changes. please note cam belts are only changed at customers request'
Does this mean that at service intervals requiring a cam belt change, Vauxhall do not do it then ?
How many vauxhall owners are driving around thinking they have had a cam belt change during a service to later find out it has not been done ?
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The ones who think their car is a domestic appliance which only needs attention when it breaks.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Mon 17 Sep 12 at 11:28
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Are not most Vauxhall Engines nowadays "fail-safe" in the event of cam-belt failure? It may not now be quite as serious as it used to be if it failed, i.e New Head/Engine. Therefore only as inconvenient as a fan-belt failure. With it being quite a time consuming, therefore expensive job, maybe they now leave it up to customer preference to decide when or if they want it doing?
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Cambelts and chains have never been changed as part of a service, it can be an expensive and time-consuming additional job. In terms of signage, this compares with "This is a sign".
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A cambelt change is expensive, so I guess the garage doesn't want mechanics doing the work until the customer has been asked to approve it.
I'd be pretty annoyed if I left the car in for what I thought was a routine service and got a bill for several hundred euro extra for a belt, tensioners, water pump etc. I'd rather have the choice to schedule the work when I can afford to pay for it! Others would no doubt refuse to pay on the grounds that the work wasn't authorised, and I expect they'd be found in the right if push came to shove.
If its a car the garage services routinely, you'll probably find the service manager flags that Vx's recommended belt change will fall due at least one service in advance, so the customer knows what to expect. The "big bill" on a typcial 60k service needing belt, brakes, plugs etc. sends a share of owners over to sales looking to trade in instead, too. (Though I never understood why, the new car will depreciate by more than the cost of the service as soon as they drive it off the lot!)
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Usually in your service book its listed as a supplemental item
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I wouldn't expect the garage to do such an expensive job automatically. If they did they'd include it in the price of the service wouldn't they. And people would then be shocked at how expensive the service is.
I would expect the dealer to suggest it is something that ought to be done.
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There are lots of muppets who when thebelt breaks blame the dealer for not changing it "as part of the service".
So it's for legal protection.. (There have been court cases about people thinking dealers should do things - which they were not instructed to do.. but which were in the "recommendations".
One woman never serviced her Frontera and sued the garage when the engine went bang. She had taken the car to the garage to have several faults fixed but never asked for it to be serviced... (Source: Car Mechanics a number of years ago).
She lost.
Last edited by: madf on Mon 17 Sep 12 at 12:59
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>> How many vauxhall owners are driving around thinking they have had a cam belt change during a service to later find out it has not been done ?
Those who didn't bother to read the notice.
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Same thing with brake fluid. Manual recommends changing every two years, but it is not a part of any normal service routine I know of. Always charged extra, AFAIK.
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>> Same thing with brake fluid. Manual recommends changing every two years, but it is not
>> a part of any normal service routine I know of. Always charged extra, AFAIK.
Our 2001 Fiesta had a separate page at the back of the service book for the dealer to stamp for brake fluid changes, and I had to request this as a separate item at the second service. It wasn't a lot - about £20 IIRC.
Even then, although it was listed on the invoice, they forgot to stamp the book, and I had to go back the next day.
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>> Same thing with brake fluid. Manual recommends changing every two years, but it is not
>> a part of any normal service routine I know of. Always charged extra, AFAIK.
>>
It is on my daughter's Mitsubishi Colt, as is coolant change.
I had a row with a SEAT dealer once as the car was on a service plan but they wouldn't do the brake fluid unless I paid separately for it. The female service advisior then going on to tell me that the car was "overdue for an air conditioning service" wasn't their smartest move.
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>> Same thing with brake fluid. Manual recommends changing every two years, but it is not
>> a part of any normal service routine I know of. Always charged extra, AFAIK.
>>
Daughters 4 year old Fiesta serviced in July, asked dealer and they said it wasn't included but extra, I queried this and they confirmed as extra despite the surprise I expressed.
Bought bottle of brake fluid ready to do it myself, when she picked the car up they said it had been done and there was no charge - result. Now have an unopened bottle of brake fluid in the garage.
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>> Bought bottle of brake fluid ready to do it myself, when she picked the car
>> up they said it had been done and there was no charge - result. Now
>> have an unopened bottle of brake fluid in the garage.
Unopened it would appear to have a 2 year shelf life.
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>> How many vauxhall owners are driving around thinking they have had a cam belt change
>> during a service to later find out it has not been done ?
>>
Work carried out, and parts fitted, should be stated on the invoice.
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Most modern Vauxhall engines seem to have 100,000 miles or 10 year recommended cambelt change intervals if you dare leave it that long .... or about 40K when the 1.9 diesel lunches its waterpump taking the cambelt with it.
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Our VW dealer were on the ball and wrote to us advising when it was due (as the car approached 4 years old)
As it happens their price was broadly in line with the local indy and the service manager suggested doing the water pump for an extra 25 quid at the same time. They also guaranteed their work for 2 years.
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>> Our VW dealer were on the ball and wrote to us advising when it was
>> due (as the car approached 4 years old)
>>
I thought that was a scam though, and VW don't change them at that interval anywhere else? Think it's 120K miles for Golfs sold in the US.
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>> >> Our VW dealer were on the ball and wrote to us advising when it
>> was
>> >> due (as the car approached 4 years old)
>> >>
>> I thought that was a scam though, and VW don't change them at that interval
>> anywhere else? Think it's 120K miles for Golfs sold in the US.
>>
Probably is, but given that you do hear the odd story of them failing on the PD engines I didn't fancy chancing it. The interval was 60K / 4 years, and at 4 yrs it had 56 or 58K on it (I forget which) so it was due on both grounds
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Certainly when we used to quote on the 60k/5 year service on Rover/MG we ALWAYS quoted with cambelt change which even back in '99 was about a £400 service all in, prob over £600 now at their prices.
If people said they didnt want the belt changed they were asked to sign and print the job card to that effect.
And yes, the belts did break, especially on MGFs.
On my cars I always service to book, even if the fluid looks ok, even gearbox fluid which nearly always gets ignored, but had it changed on the Charade and it improved the change no end and the brake fluid change gave a far meatier response on the pedal - its so cheap to freshen the fluids ive no idea why people are so tight about doing it.
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They don't change the brake fluid without asking which is £60.00 so they won't swap the belt which is £300.00
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>> They don't change the brake fluid without asking which is £60.00
My local Vx main dealer only charges £25 for a brake fluid change.
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My Citroen specialist will tell me when an item like the cambelt or brake fluid/coolant change is due. IIRC when we used to go to the franchise guys they'd do same or at least say something when booking in to alert me to fact that (say 48k on a BX) would be expensive.
Berlingo had had out of course cambelt change after an 'odd noise' was traced to it fraying. I'd be pretty annoyed if another garage just changed it and charged me sans reference.
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Over recent years I've had a heck of a lot of VX dealer service receipts supplied with the old stuff I buy, and pretty much every one has had wording printed on it close to that mentioned in the OP.
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>> Over recent years I've had a heck of a lot of VX dealer service receipts
>> supplied with the old stuff I buy, and pretty much every one has had wording
>> printed on it close to that mentioned in the OP.
>>
Makes me think Vx's breaking cambelts is still common - I ran Cavaliers as company cars in the late 80's and had 3 break, one of them after coming to a halt in traffic in lane 3 of the M62.
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When I book my car in for a service I state what I want doing or not doing relative to what Ford detail in their schedule. I always instruct them to not adjust the tyre pressures (particularly the spare which I inflate to 50 psi) and not to top up the washer reservoir. I ask for the brake fluid to be renewed every two years. If I've still got the car when it's ten years old I'll ask for the cambelt to be changed.
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>> When I book my car in for a service I state what I want doing
>> or not doing relative to what Ford detail in their schedule. I always instruct them
>> to not adjust the tyre pressures (particularly the spare which I inflate to 50 psi)
>> and not to top up the washer reservoir. I ask for the brake fluid to
>> be renewed every two years. If I've still got the car when it's ten years
>> old I'll ask for the cambelt to be changed.
Unless it breaks before then. Wouldn't let one of mine go on for 10 years.
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>>
>>
>> Unless it breaks before then. Wouldn't let one of mine go on for 10 years.
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>>
Anyone who makes a cra with a cambelt lasting under 10 years has been cheap and underspecced it.
(Son's Peugeot 106 was 12 years old and on original belt when it was crashed.. RIP.)
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>> particularly the spare which I inflate to 50 psi
Surely that puts undue stress on the tyre (unless its a space saver, which I think yours isn't)
Why not just inflate it to the same pressure as the ones on the car?
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What does the car handbook say?
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>> What does the car handbook say?
>>
It doesn't say what pressure the spare should be inflated to when it's in the boot.
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>> Surely that puts undue stress on the tyre (unless its a space saver, which I
>> think yours isn't)
What a memory. It's an optional full size steel spare.
>> Why not just inflate it to the same pressure as the ones on the car?
All tyres lose pressure over time. If I inflated it to the normal pressure then it would probably have lost pressure by the time I needed to use it and I would have to pump it up in goodness knows what situation. If I inflate it periodically to 50psi (with my electric pump) there's a fair chance that it would still be above normal pressure and I would then just have to let a bit of air out after I'd fitted it ~ and that's a lot easier to do. The maximum pressure (marked on the sidewall) is 51 psi.
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Always been my habit to keep a spare at approx 40psi for reasons mentioned by L'es. However not had a spare for 2.5yrs so not an issue now.
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>> All tyres lose pressure over time. If I inflated it to the normal pressure then
>> it would probably have lost pressure by the time I needed to use it
My space saver is 61 psi. Checked it the other day (1st time in ages) and was still 61 psi.
Is there something wrong with it because it hasn't lost any pressure?
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>> Is there something wrong with it because it hasn't lost any pressure?
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It's probably solid.
They're hoping that if you have to use it you'll put the crappy ride down to the different size.
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>> Is there something wrong with it because it hasn't lost any pressure?
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On the contrary, it's good. It indicates that it's less permeable than some other tyres.
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>> Is there something wrong with it because it hasn't lost any pressure?
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It's your pressure gauge or you need to go to specsavers. :-)
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My handbook for my Mk4 Golf states 60psi for the spare. Seems very high to me, but thats what Ive pumped it up to.
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>> My handbook for my Mk4 Golf states 60psi for the spare.
Space saver by chance? If so, then it doesn't surprise me.
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Nope, not a space saver, a 16" steel wheel with normal size tyre.
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I'd check the tyre wall to make sure it's rated to that level.
Regular low rolling resistance tyres can be rated to around 60psi but normal tyres are usually only rated to 45-50psi or so.
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>> My handbook for my Mk4 Golf states 60psi for the spare.
If that's for when it's in the boot then it may be to allow for it naturally losing pressure in the time between it being inflated and the time it being used. The last thing you want when you need to use the spare is to find it has gone flat.
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>> it may be to allow for it naturally losing pressure in the time between it being inflated and the time it being used.
About 10 years then.
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>> >> My handbook for my Mk4 Golf states 60psi for the spare.
>>
>> If that's for when it's in the boot then it may be to allow for
>> it naturally losing pressure in the time between it being inflated and the time it
>> being used. The last thing you want when you need to use the spare is
>> to find it has gone flat.
>>
When you have a puncture and it is raining (as it always seems to be!) I find it easier to let air out of an over inflated tyre than try and pump air in a flat one
please don't use $@$# symbols to get around the swear filter
Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 25 Sep 12 at 13:57
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Plus, 10 miles on an overinflated tyre won't cause that much of a problem whereas 10 miles on an underinflated tyre may cause that to puncture too.
Always kept the spare at a higher pressure for that reason.
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If I have a puncture in the pouring rain then as long as the tyre looks ok, its going on. I'll stop at a gas station somewhere and check it in the dry.
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>> I'll stop at a gas station somewhere and check it in the dry.
You've been living abroad far too long ;)
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Car servicing notice seen at Vauxhall garage - Old Navy
