Computer Related > Broad Band Speed Miscellaneous
Thread Author: Ambo Replies: 31
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 14:17 
 Broad Band Speed - Ambo
What speed should I expect from BT? What I am geting is 0.7 mb - and I am only about 300 metres from my exchange.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 15:06 
 Broad Band Speed - Tooslow
d, almost impossible to answer but if you go to BT's web site and put in your phone nbr they'll give you an expected speed. My guess would be not far short of 8Mb if you're on a 8Mb contract. Other ISPs wil do this too, though I think they get the distance from the exchange off BT so they should give the same answer.

www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumerProducts/displayCategory.do?categoryId=CON-TOTAL-BB-R1

Have you tried connecting your router to the main phone socket where it comes into the house, just to prove that it is not a problem with your internal wiring?

It may be that the connection to your house is not direct but goes the pretty way.

John
Last edited by: Tooslow on Wed 24 Nov 10 at 15:07
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 15:06 
 Broad Band Speed - spamcan61
Depends on what service you're paying for - if that's supposed to be the typical ' up to 8 meg' then that's pretty crap.

Some typical speeds in this thread:-

www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?f=6&t=3008
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 19:03 
 Broad Band Speed - J Bonington Jagworth
That's worse than we get, 5 miles from the exchange! Have you just got BB, or did you have it previously with another ISP?

As Tooslow says, make sure you're connected to the main socket (usually with a removable lower section) and that every telephone connection goes through a filter. If in doubt, unplug everything apart from your router and check the speed.
Last edited by: J Bonington Jagworth on Wed 24 Nov 10 at 19:05
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 19:50 
 Broad Band Speed - Focusless
>> As Tooslow says, make sure ... every telephone connection goes through a filter.

Does the router itself need a filter? My O2 instructions said use a filter between the O2 router and the BT socket, so I did, but I thought I'd read somewhere that the router doesn't need one?
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 20:04 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
If anything needs one your router does!
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 20:06 
 Broad Band Speed - Suppose
>> Does the router itself need a filter?

Not as far I understand these things.

The filter is there to remove adsl noise from the voice side of the signal; i.e. you need the filters to remove the adsl signal for your phones supplies only.

AFAIK, the router gets the full raw signal every time, i.e. it does not have the voice signal removed from it.


>> If anything needs one your router does!
It follows from my above statement that I do not agree with Zero on this.
Last edited by: Suppose on Wed 24 Nov 10 at 20:08
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 20:11 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
If that were the case there would be only one socket on the filter for the phone, not for broadband and phone.

It needs a filter.

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New Wed 24 Nov 10 21:01 
 Broad Band Speed - Suppose
>> If that were the case there would be only one socket on the filter for
>> the phone, not for broadband and phone.
>>

The 2nd socket is simply to provide a RJ11 connection for the router.

Zero - I remain willing to be proved wrong in my belief. If you have any sources you can link to that show the internal electronics, please post them as I wish to learn about this issue.

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New Wed 24 Nov 10 21:11 
 Broad Band Speed - Tooslow
www.dslzoneuk.net/socket.php
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 21:12 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
www.adslnation.com/support/filters.php

well how about that your right. I never bothered to check.

you dont need a microfilter for your router. Just an RJ11 socket.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 21:21 
 Broad Band Speed - Focusless
>> www.adslnation.com/support/filters.php

No idea how you worked it out but thanks for info. I'll free up the filter then.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 22:29 
 Broad Band Speed - rtj70
I have only recently got xDSL (VDSL in fact), having Virgin broadband via cable before. I always though the ADSL modem should not be plugged into a filter as it should remove the noise (i.e. signal) created by ADSL.

With VDSL you get a new face plate with a phone socket and a socket for the VDSL modem which runs over CAT5 cabling.

As I said earlier, I only got 300-400Kbs for my installation a few months ago and were it a self install ADSL I might have thought that was all I could get. And then got cable with Virgin. But with a VDSL package (BT Infinity) and therefore expecting a lot faster and, more importantly, a BT Openreach engineer on hand, we realised (well he did) that it was the extra phone socket wiring.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 22:28 
 Broad Band Speed - Stuartli
>>AFAIK, the router gets the full raw signal every time, i.e. it does not have the voice signal removed from it.>>

It HAS to go through an ADSL splitter/filter first before your router, unless you have a FILTERED Master Socket faceplace, which also removes the need to have a splitter/filter on all phones, Sky boxes etc. See:

solwise.co.uk/adsl_splitters-faceplates.htm

for filtered faceplates.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 22:44 
 Broad Band Speed - Focusless
>> It HAS to go through an ADSL splitter/filter first before your router, unless you have
>> a FILTERED Master Socket faceplace, which also removes the need to have a splitter/filter on
>> all phones, Sky boxes etc. See:

Ok - BT engineer has only fitted an NTE5 Linebox, so I guess the filter has to stay.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 22:56 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
>> >>AFAIK, the router gets the full raw signal every time, i.e. it does not have
>> the voice signal removed from it.>>
>>
>> It HAS to go through an ADSL splitter/filter first before your router, unless you have
>> a FILTERED Master Socket faceplace, which also removes the need to have a splitter/filter on
>> all phones, Sky boxes etc. See:
>>
>> solwise.co.uk/adsl_splitters-faceplates.htm
>>
>> for filtered faceplates.

Look at the circuit diagram, you can see it doesen't, the data lines are not filtered.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 23:44 
 Broad Band Speed - Suppose
>> www.adslnation.com/support/filters.php
>> well how about that your right. I never bothered to check.
>> you dont need a microfilter for your router. Just an RJ11 socket.
>>


>> Look at the circuit diagram, you can see it doesen't, the data lines are not
>> filtered.
>>

Phew! Thank you so much, Zero. I am sincerely relieved that you have confirmed that I believed about splitters/filters is indeed true.

Focus - do what Zero said. Stuartli is mistaken in his belief. You do not need a filter to the router.
Unless you or he is using some special ADSL filter, you will find that most ADSL filters as I know them, just pass the raw signal (i.e. ADSL+voice) straight through to RJ11 socket. The only part that gets filtered is the voice signal to the phone that gets the ADSL signal stripped out.

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New Wed 24 Nov 10 23:49 
 Broad Band Speed - rtj70
>> Focus - do what Zero said. Stuartli is mistaken in his belief. You do not need a filter to the router.

The filtering is required for the phones so what Stuartli says could be referred to as *ollocks from a technical point. She is usually spot on though. :-)
Last edited by: rtj70 on Wed 24 Nov 10 at 23:50
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 16:21 
 Broad Band Speed - Stuartli
>>You do not need a filter to the router.>>

You do, unless you have a filtered faceplate, to separate the narrowband from the broadband. If you don't you will very likely have land line problems.

It's also why a splitter is needed on extension phones etc unless, of course, you have a filtered faceplate...:-)

My filtered faceplate is used to connect the ADSL lead direct to the modem router - previously it was from an ADSL splitter connected to the Master Socket.

>>She is usually spot on though. :-) >>

Don't remember the gender change operation...
Last edited by: Stuartli on Fri 24 Dec 10 at 16:22
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 16:26 
 Broad Band Speed - John H
>> >>You do not need a filter to the router.>>
>>
>> You do, unless you have a filtered faceplate, to separate the narrowband from the broadband.

No you don't.
ADSL filters do NOT filter ADSL signal, it is passed straight through. So the filters have no effect on the ADSL signal and speed.

>> It's also why a splitter is needed on extension phones
yes, Filters are needed to stop ADSL signal interference with VOICE signals.
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 16:26 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
>> >>You do not need a filter to the router.>>
>>
>> You do, unless you have a filtered faceplate, to separate the narrowband from the broadband.

No you dont. You need it on the phones.

Your broadband faceplate has NO filter on the rj11 socket, only the BT phone socket.

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New Fri 24 Dec 10 13:25 
 Broad Band Speed - John H
>> It HAS to go through an ADSL splitter/filter first before your router, unless you have
>> a FILTERED Master Socket faceplace, which also removes the need to have a splitter/filter on
>> all phones, Sky boxes etc. See:
>>


I agree with what rtj70 says in one of his replies
"what Stuartli says could be referred to as snip from a technical point.

Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 24 Dec 10 at 13:48
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 20:10 
 Broad Band Speed - Suppose
>> What speed should I expect from BT? What I am geting is 0.7 mb -
>> and I am only about 300 metres from my exchange.
>>

Are you sure you are not on their ancient 1 Meg contract?
Anyway, we need to know where you are according to Samknows exchange database.

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New Wed 24 Nov 10 20:12 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
yer - postcode needed.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 21:10 
 Broad Band Speed - rtj70
draiber, how is your house wired for phone socket? Is it either:

1. Line comes into house to a master socket and then splits to other sockets AFTER the master socket
2. Line comes into some sort of junction box that runs wires around the house including the socket the ADSL modem plugs into? This is referred to as star wiring.

If the answer is 2... then this may be the problem. The extra wiring interfere with ADSL signals. Someone on here told me it was obvious/common knowledge but being an ex cable boradband user I was not aware.

I got about 300kbs and then we disconnected two wires and I got 38Mbps.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 22:34 
 Broad Band Speed - Stuartli
>>I got about 300kbs and then we disconnected two wires and I got 38Mbps.>>

Sounds like the bell ring wiring was disconnected - it's not necessary these days. See:

www.kitz.co.uk/adsl/socket.htm

This is an excellent all round site for broadband advice and solving problems.
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 23:09 
 Broad Band Speed - rtj70
All wires went to the main socket and one upstairs. The bellwire went to the main socket also. Does not matter because the new faceplate keeps the signals separate.

The problem in our house was the star wiring to another phone socket before the master socket.

This had nothing to do with a bellwire. Period.

Edit: And this is a VDSL installation with a VDSL modem. Probably makes no difference but some claim to be experts on ADSL and I have VDSL.

Back to helping draiber!
Last edited by: rtj70 on Wed 24 Nov 10 at 23:11
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New Wed 24 Nov 10 23:18 
 Broad Band Speed - rtj70
>> Sounds like the bell ring wiring was disconnected - it's not necessary these days. See:

A further reply seemed appropriate.... and bell wires for VDSL installs are irrelevant because of the base plate installed (stuartli must know of VDSL to comment?)

We had a BT Openreach engineer doing the install. His handheld device synchronised fine and he said we should get close to 40Mbit/s download... we got 300kbits (ish). Bear in mind the VDSL faceplate installed disconnected the bellwire (note Stuartli I say VDSL).

Disconnect the extra phone line running to upstairs and all fixed.

So back in June and now again I say, are some getting crap xDSL speeds due to phone wiring? The previous owners here had ADSL and there was a wiring problem in the house. I get VDSL and it is obviously a problem.

But if you signed for up to 8Mbps and get say 300Kbs you might live with it and blame BT. Get upto 40Mbps and expect at least 22Mbps and get a tenth of that and something is wrong. A lot of homes are accepting poor Internet speeds and it is a problem with phone wiring!

Hands up... how many people had their xDSL system setup by a BT Openreach engineer?
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 16:27 
 Broad Band Speed - Stuartli
>>Hands up... how many people had their xDSL system setup by a BT Openreach engineer?>>

The OpenReach engineer who kindly fitted my filtered faceplate (he was actually sorting out a noisy line) was telling me about the poor level of training BT provides for engineers who install broadband for customers.

In fact he'd never seen a router's configuration pages until I showed him mine whilst checking the bandwidth figures etc after the line was repaired. Presumably the engineers just use a CD installation disk.
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 16:44 
 Broad Band Speed - Tooslow
" he'd never seen a router's configuration pages "

Hard to believe he doesn't have one at home, especially in his line of work. Or maybe he was laggng under cold water tanks just a few weeks earlier :-)
John
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 18:42 
 Broad Band Speed - Stuartli
>>Or maybe he was laggng under cold water tanks just a few weeks earlier :-)>>

No, been in the job most of his life.

Certainly knew his landline stuff, but got the impression that broadband is being thrust on engineers rather than that they really want to do it. Seems to require, in his case at least, additional hours as well.

Also heard quite a few interesting tales about BT managers, but not going to repeat them here...:-)
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New Fri 24 Dec 10 19:06 
 Broad Band Speed - Zero
Sounds like he failed his customer service skills as well.

Rule no 1 is don't denigrate your
a:/company
b:/product
c:/training
d:/management

in front of the customer.
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