Internet connectivity is a bit hit and miss here.
When I first moved in there was no FTTC (Fiber To The Cabinet) availability and old fashioned ADSL was about 1mb which was too slow for work so I used unlimited data sims and a MiFi unit before upgrading to a more capable SIM based router. I checked availability for FTTC everyday (someone moves and disconnects - I jumped to get the now spare connection).
We have had a few local internet companies (no main players) dig up the town laying cable but they stopped at the top of our road because it's unadopted.
One of these local cos have offered me FTTP (Fiber To The Premises) for £30 a month for 900mb.
I have signed up and they have booked installation for two weeks time.
Considering that they don't have permission to dig up our road and won't have permission to use existing telephone poles (the wayleave is to "The Post Office"), I am wondering how they are going to get it to me and I suspect that I will get a call nearer the time to tell me that they cannot connect me or the engineer will turn up and say the same!
So the two options are:
1. FTTP will be installed and will be hassle free.
2. FTTP will not be installed because they forgot that they need to put in the infrastructure.
Place your bets here. :-D
Last edited by: zippy on Fri 26 Apr 24 at 19:29
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I don't think the wayleave should be a problem if your installer has an agreement with Openreach, who will have been the ultimate inheritor.
Current legislation encourages sharing of infrastructure (indeed it seems to mandate agreement if it is sought from Openreach.)
The majority of the streets round here have recently had fttp enabled by a third party largely using Openreach poles (with a few extra of their own, which needs no planning permission). Unfortunately my street isn't poled, but conduited, and Virgin are doing a catch-up here only laying fibre in the pavement. Can't say I fancy Virgin as a supplier, so I'm waiting for Openreach to equip, so l have a choice of ISP.
I suppose it still doesn't mean they won't turn up expecting a simple connection.
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We are served by, what was, the only independent telephone company - Kingston Communications which is now Kcom.
Allegedly they made is so difficult for other companies to share their infrastructure that none bothered. They had the monopoly.
The passing of the Telecommunications Act in 2021 changed the law so that telegraph poles are now classed as "permitted development". This means companies are no longer required to ask councils' permission, in addition to not having to consult with affected residents.
Two companies are now banging up telegraph poles like no tomorrow. And duplicating them as well The natives are very restless.
www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/broadband-poles-hull-explained-rules-8187429
Would a pole would be a solution to your issue? Maybe there would be an issue on an unadopted road unless all the residents agreed?
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>>Would a pole be a solution...
They would need permission from all the land owners between the box and my house to site them. The road is owned by each house owner to the centre line on each side. .
Open-reach poles are already up the road but none have been touched in years. Perhaps they are planning to use those?
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>> Two companies are now banging up telegraph poles like no tomorrow. And duplicating them as
>> well The natives are very restless.
Big issue in the Cadbury developed Bourneville village, a conservation area, right now.
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>>the engineer will turn up
I spent nigh on forty years at BT (PO, PO engineering department and whatever else they decided to call themselves at the time) and I never called myself an engineer. I always understood an 'engineer' was someone with a degree in engineering.
Am I mistaken?
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>>Engineer
>>Am I mistaken?
It's the word they used. Many installers / fitters are called engineers when they are clearly not. I do think it's one of the few "professions" where someone can be an engineer without formal qualifications. One business I know has a small team of staff who are electronic / mechanical engineers, qualified to "A" levels and similar plus years of experience is designing solutions to their customers' problems.
Father-in-law was a BT line installer then worked in the engineering department planning instals, upgrades etc.
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BT/Openreach had done nothing in our street for decades (apart from repairs to aluminium wiring)
FTTP announce January - estimated March, some time
April 1st - Openreach arrives, chaps at door and tells me he was expecting to connect my house to the street BUT there was no connection! 2nd visit of the day where he could not connect a cable.
He said "civils" needed and will be here in a week.
April 5th - 2 x Openreach vans arrive and jointly tell me they were told to see if there was an alternative/cheaper way to connect their cable.
April 9th - Openreach "civils" arrive - tell me it will take 90 mins/ 2 hours. 3.5 hours later they finished.
Brilliant connection day will be the promised 15th April!!
April 10th - Tar man arrives and fills the hole
April 10th - 15th April install date cancelled
May 13th - New date
Openreach Left hand and right hand do not seem to work together
They announced FTTP and the installers do not work through the whole street connecting houses. They will come to each house when there is an order despite the fact that all phone connections have to be changed by the end of 2025!
It's not a one off issue - my son had 6/7 visits and delays of 2 months with Openreach at Xmas.
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>> I spent nigh on forty years at BT (PO, PO engineering department and whatever else
>> they decided to call themselves at the time) and I never called myself an engineer.
Did you need/have a qualification for the roles you filled?
My maternal uncle worked for GPO telephones and its successors from being demobbed c1949 until his death in 1983. He was I think an MIEE which we understood to be degree equivalent.
He described himself as Post Office Engineer.
By the time I was on the scene he was office based and involved in building and commissioning the microwave 'spine' in the sixties. This including a tower on the outskirts of Leeds we could see from our back window at home.
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Zippy, how does your present telephone/broadband get to your house?
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>> Zippy, how does your present telephone/broadband get to your house?
>>
Via Telephone poles.
The wayleaves, held by the road association give a non-transferable, non-assignable right so I am not sure how they will do it.
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I suspect that if the poles went up for PO Telecoms/BT etc they'll now be Openreach and probably be used to support telecoms wires whether cable ir fibre.
We've had pretty much the entire village cabled for FTTP. Work was done by Gigaclear who offer a retail deal. However the work was funded by the Council and others and other providers use it.
Some places needed the pavements up with some inconvenience but in this road, built c1998, they just threaded the fibre though the conduit used for the copper stuff.
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>>Did you need/have a qualification for the roles you filled?
I've a C&G full tech certificate in telecommunications. This has been referred to as equivalent to a degree. I declined the invitation to study for a master tech as I'd had enough of further education, having obtained an ONC in electrical/mechanical engineering along the way.
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I was once an engineer without a degree in engineering. Ubique.
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Chambers gives a wide ranging definition of engineer, including those undertaking public works, so strictly the man bringing the fibre could be considered an engineer. However, as the aforementioned Degree Qualified Chartered Engineer, this does irk somewhat! I tend to refer to my self as Chartered or Professional engineer. Many other countries, notably the US, have a Professional Engineer registration.
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>>Many other countries, notably the US, have a Professional Engineer registration.
There was this interesting case in the USA recently:
ij.org/press-release/federal-judge-hands-free-speech-victory-to-retired-engineer/
ij.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/Nutt-v.-Ritter-opinion.pdf
But then this is the country that banned medical professionals from quitting their "at will" jobs and getting better paid jobs elsewhere. (At will is where the employer can sack you without reason.)
www.latimes.com/business/story/2022-01-24/wisconsin-hospital-sued-workers-for-quitting-thedacare
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In the states, a train driver is called "The Engineer"
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Well they certainly have the right to use OpenReach poles here. At this moment planning my move from virgin to box broadband FTTP. Neighbours was strung over the BT poles.
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My brother was a highly skilled technician at PO then BT for thirty odd years. He served an apprenticeship and was regularly retrained as technology advanced.
Part of the reason they were termed “engineers” was their union’s understandable drive to protect pay and conditions. Being an “engineer” was worth a few pay percentage points.
Although pay assessment has moved on there may still remain some halo effect in being considered an engineer.
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Better than being called a "poles 'n holes" guy I guess
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Well, I don't mind admitting when I am wrong and this is a bet I lost.
A lad turned up at the appointed time (a bit early TBH).
Said he'd not been to this road before. No problem, he has two mates and a cherry picker.
Fiber connected across several poles, using BT infrastructure and to the house.
Set up nicely, cleaned up (not to Mrs Z's satisfaction).
Getting the promised 900mbs with a wired ethernet connection and between 150mbs and 400mbs on wifi depending on the device and location.
Something I didn't know, it needs two plugs. One for the router and one for the device on the wall and there are two new boxes on the wall, one for the fiber with a laser warning label and the one I just mentioned - the "modem" I guess or whatever it's called in digital terms.
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One thing I missed...
The guys all confirmed that they were using BT infrastructure (well Open Reach I guess), but none of the other suppliers around here that use BT can connect, even Sky, Talk-Talk etc.
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Yeah, you have an ONT, Optical Network Terminal, and a Modem/Router. Most people don't realise you need two power plugs.
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Waited 6 weeks Openreach & Sky
Chap arrived at 8.10 - left 9.40 - failed installation.
FTTP cable laid 5/6 weeks ago does not work.
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Openreach 2 vans, 2 men down holes.
20/30 minutes came to the door and asked the history.
5 mins later all green lights on the ONT.
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My house is located on a hill.
The Openreach men were looking in 3 x holes below the level of my house where the cables come into our street.
They came to the door to tell me they could not see a problem but would have it fixed later on in the day.
I knew the likely unmade connection fault was above my house as that was where the cable was drawn down from then into my garden.
I pointed out that "fact" and it took them 2 minutes to fix.
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Next door has just had FTTP installed.
Openreach were outside around 90 mins ago. Knocked on our door as the duct was blocked under my front lawn and the might need to remove a small patch of grass.
Either it's done now or there's a real problem and they've gone off for the day.
No hole in my lawn.
I need to get ours done. Current Fibre to Cabinet set up is fine 99% of the time. Occasionally goes slow on i-player but that's all.
FTTP is far less than we pay at the moment and I think the landline can go. Only people wh call on it ar Mrs B and our daughter. Far more activity is nuisance calls.
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Yeah, come to the conclusion the Land Line can go when I get FTTP, no point paying a fiver a month extra so the "home Energy Advisor" can ring me every two weeks and get a mouthful of abuse. It's always the same woman, so I suspect she will be relieved. I will miss her tho, guess I will have to beat the dog instead.
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Why is it necessary to be abusive? She probably has no option, but to have a rubbish job. A simple "No Thanks" would probably improve her life no end.
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>> Why is it necessary to be abusive? She probably has no option, but to have
>> a rubbish job. A simple "No Thanks" would probably improve her life no end.
>>
You do get rather fed up of continually saying "No thanks" to the same person or company who phones on a regular basis. The simple answer for them is to not keep calling people who have said they are not interested.
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I had it done a few weeks ago. A BT contractor arrived on time. Set the whole thing including climbing two poles to make or do something technical 500mb to the router within the hour.
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Booked for next Friday afternoon. Cheaper than current fibre to the cabinet!!
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Fri 17 May 24 at 15:46
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>> Booked for next Friday afternoon. Cheaper than current fibre to the cabinet!!
Got an email at 08:08 this morning from Plusnet to say they'd dispatched my FTTP router and it would be with me in the next couple of days.
Assumed it meant they'd sent it today and was mildly hacked off with them cutting it fine for installation tomorrow.
Within an hour the postie was knocking on the door with a bundle of stuff including the router!!
Either the email was sent late or it bounced round cyberspace for a bit.
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>> Within an hour the postie was knocking on the door with a bundle of stuff
>> including the router!!
>>
>> Either the email was sent late or it bounced round cyberspace for a bit.
I'm due to go live on Monday. Our phone cable comes in underground and the router is on it's way from Plusnet.
What happens next, does an engineer need access to connect the fibre cable to the socket? Because they haven't said yet.
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 30 May 24 at 10:50
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>>What happens next, does an engineer need access to connect the fibre cable to the socket?
>>Because they haven't said yet.
Yes
They run a new cable to the house and attach it to a new socket on the wall.
You need two spare sockets, one for the Optical Network Terminal, and one for the Modem/Router (thanks for the info elsewhere on this thread from Zero).
From first knock on the door to them leaving they took about 3 hours, but that included stringing the cable across several telephone poles then to the house. Time in the house was about 30 to 45 minutes, which was probably longer than normally required because the chap was teaching a trainee.
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My recent experience
Survey by Openreach around the cable from the street - 3 people!
"Openreach Civils" dug a hole in pavement and ran a cable 20+ yards under the front grass/path etc - estimated a 90 mins+ - took 3.5 hours . They tidied up reasonably well.
Sky man appears on time. White box on the outside wall and installed the ONT in the house.
Failed to connect and he left.
Openreach come along 4 days later, 2 vans/3 men spend 30 mins+ at the foot of the road and cannot see the problem. Came to the door to apologise but said they would connect later in the day. I told them the cable came from higher up the road.
2 mins later we had 3 green lights on the ONT.
7.5 weeks rather than the 3 weeks promised when order placed.
I should receive some £220 credit from Sky
£30 for failure to turn up on 15th April and £6.10 per day for 31 days delay.
However, I foresee a battle to get them to cough up despite BT/Openreach/Sky etc signing up to the 2019 agreement to compensate for missed appointments and subsequent delays.
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>> I'm due to go live on Monday. Our phone cable comes in underground and the
>> router is on it's way from Plusnet.
>>
>> What happens next, does an engineer need access to connect the fibre cable to the
>> socket? Because they haven't said yet.
We're Plusnet too. You need to be in and, at least in our house they needed access, though they never went further than the hall.
We had an appointment for after 1pm last Friday. Two Openreach chaps (in two vans) arrived a little early. Discussed where cable would go and agreed to leave it where the old one was.
They removed the cover from the point where the old copper cable entered the house and covers from two access points to the underground ducts where the cables run. The Fibre Optic cable installed last year across the village is already in there.
One guy shoved piece of kit down from the house end and with a pit of pushing it popped out in the access point. While he was doing that the other guy removed the old BT master socket and fitted the termination box for fibre into which the router plugs. The fibre cable was pulled back through the duct and connected at both ends.
They set up the router, including changing the changing the network name and wi-fi passkey to match the old ones and left it allegedly working.
When I tried to connect my PC it kept saying connected no internet. A call to Plusnet who reset something remotely sorted that and now we're flying!!
Even just browsing sites like this over wi-fi it's noticeably quicker.
There is, by the way, nothing special about the red cable with the router to connect to the fibre termination, it's just a short cat5 cable. It's only red to make it easier to check the connections if the consumer reports a fault.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Thu 30 May 24 at 07:16
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>>
>>
>> We're Plusnet too. You need to be in and, at least in our house they
>> needed access, though they never went further than the hall.
>>
>>
So much for that!
Despite having the optic cables laid recently it turns out we have not yet been enabled for it, so it has been cancelled. I was a bit annoyed that Plusnet's website let me go ahead with the application despite this and it was only a phone call to query the engineer's visit that sorted it out. So as we were for now.
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>>They set up the router, including changing the changing the network name and wi-fi passkey to >>match the old ones and left it allegedly working.
As Muttley might say...
"Snazza frazza rashin' fashin' Brompt!
I am still going around changing wifi settings on the myriad of devices.
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2 x TVs, 2 x SkyQ, 2 x I-pads, 2 x i-phones, 3 outside cameras, 1 x Firestick, 1 x Photo Screen (a present we have to be seen to use!!)
A son came in and connected his i-phone - his wife's & 2 daughters' i-phones, i-pads etc automatically updated even when the equipment was not in our house. My son has all the Apple equipment under his name.
Took me about 45 minutes after scrabbling around initially.
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>> Why is it necessary to be abusive? She probably has no option, but to have
>> a rubbish job. A simple "No Thanks" would probably improve her life no end.
wont improve her intelligence tho, she should be reporting it up the channel and the calls would stop.
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I'd list home energy 'advisers' amongst the nuisance calls on my landline. Some, I think, are a recording.
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I got an email from the supplier yesterday apologising that the network would not be available in my area for 4 hours (0:00 to 04:00) this morning for maintenance.
The service went down and was back this morning.
My previous supplier used to do maintenance at similar times, but I never got an email warning.
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I received an email from Sky - £18.30 credit on my account for delayed FTTP installation.
This is 3 days @ £6.10
Only issue was it was a failed appointment (£30), they did not turn up, plus 31 days late with installation. (£189)
Phoned, highlighted the issue, they have to reply within 31 days!
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Taking Bets On FTTP installation - tyrednemotional
