Hi All,
Some may have seen in previous posts that I left my job at Everest and began a new one as an energy consultant. Unfortunately this week I was told the job is no more-goodbye!
Now I could have felt sorry for myself, moaned and groaned and sank a few beers.
Instead I sat down on t'internet and started applying for new jobs.
Result of 1 days 'work' - 22 applications and 5 interviews already. They may not come to anything, but the point surely is that you keep hearing 'oh its so hard out there, there's no jobs. I've applied for 50000 jobs and never got a reply' etc etc (Heard this being trotted out again in interviews about the riots)
Well it does seem that if you have a decent CV, put in the work to sell yourself and actually have something to offer employers then at least the opportunity is still there. It may be a while until something clicks (or I may already have found something - will know next week), but what do others think? Have I been lucky so far or is just that some people go about it the wrong way?
Any comments (or offers of employment :-))?
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Some jobs are easier to come by, certain jobs people often don't want to do. It just depends how fussy you are etc.
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Top CV item is a volunteer role. The CAB is one of the prime one - apparently. Seems I unwittingly acquired something I never had before since I've been with them an NVQ (Level 3 no less) !
Sorry to hear about your bad luck
Last edited by: R.P. on Fri 19 Aug 11 at 16:52
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I think if you're positive, determined and persistent there are jobs about and certainly not the ones no-one else wants to do.
It's well documented that a newly qualified lorry driver needs two years experience to get a job, yet we always encourage them to go knocking on doors of haulage firms.
Look presentable, be honest about the lack of experience and point out that they would love to be taught 'that' companies procedures.
In 80% of cases it results in a job.
Pat
Last edited by: pda on Fri 19 Aug 11 at 16:52
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Depends on the area. Jobs are still plentiful in the south east/commuter belt as long as you can sell yourself and don't turn up with your trousers round your ankles speaking some kind of street patois - init.
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Some 20 years ago, I used to interview school leavers for a clerical job which usually led to promotion for a competent candidate.
The job description mentioned that, and stated quite clearly that it was a good way to join the company and gain experience. (and be paid a lot more money: one holder went from clerk to Senior Purchaser over 4 years)...
My experience over a 7 year period was we interviewed about 50 candidates at a time.
About 6 were employable: the rest were totally lacking in any form of commitment to get a job : either through being incapable of expressing themselves in English, being totally disinterested or reluctant to do any hard work..
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To the OP
Hi
Can I ask which job sites you use
I use reed, and all the jobs I've applied for not one interview
I signed up to Monster and all I got and still get is SPAM Mail from someone who got my email address and just junk email from Monster
I have a good CV, as I went on a CV Course and they gave me its "Seal of approval" I applied for a job at Network Rail, got a interview however I was not successful, still waiting for feedback.
Regards
Last edited by: Redviper on Fri 19 Aug 11 at 17:11
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>>Can I ask which job sites you use
I've been registered with Monster, Jobsite, Reed and Totaljobs for some time - kept my CV updated as necessary. Often had agencies etc phone me on spec. Sometimes rubbish, sometimes not. As it happens I've now got another interview in the strength of my posted CV beong seen by the companies own recruiter.
I do get spam but my Virgin filter sorts this out so its not a problem.
I'm quite lucky I guess because I have quite an interesting mix of skills/experience and a stable career history with only 3 previous employers in 26 years ( plus this shower for 6 months!)
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My recent experience.
Cold called dressed in my normal smart but work clothes, it's how i would be dressed if they employed me and sent me to their customers (tanker driver not male model), i managed to get a couple of minutes face to face with 'the man', he was kind enough to pop down and see the oddball that had walked in and asked for a job, that was the most valuable 2 mins of my recent life.
Followed up with requested checkable CV, concise with the important stuff listed clearly, all on one page.
It worked, probably the best job i've had.
Agree with Z's comments, if they converse in grunts and innits and look like street muggers they're not likely to get past the door.
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Forget about employment and work for yourself. There are plenty of low startup cost things you can do from cleaning windows, garden maintenance, car valeting etc.
Maybe you have a talent for something practical that people will pay for, it is always worth grabbing the opportunity to control your own destiny and not suddenly lose your job at the whim of a bean counter in head office.
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What type of work do you want Pete?
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>>What type of work do you want Pete?
Ideally a very customer service orientated sales/marketing role. No hard sell, but a good, honest , consultative approach. Or some sort of service coordinator role. What I don't want anymore is to be managing lots of people - done that in various guises for nearly 20 years and have had the nervous breakdown to prove it!!
What I have found is that almost every job out there is paying considerably less than even 5/6 years ago. In fact the retail management jobs I had back in the early 1990's are paying LESS now than I was earning then. So its really only jobs involving a basic plus commission that offer much chance of me earning what I consider to be an almost reasonable (£25k +) wage.
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>>work for yourself
After nearly 5 years self employed this is precisely what I don't want again!
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>> About 6 were employable: the rest were totally lacking in any form of commitment to
>> get a job : either through being incapable of expressing themselves in English, being totally
>> disinterested or reluctant to do any hard work..
>>
Pretty much my experience as a recruitment consultant in a previous life.
Respect to the OP for his determination; my guess is that he won't be out of work for long.
Unfortunately, the "want it now" culture of today's youth also extends to jobs, and many cannot grasp the fact that to succeed in life you have to take the crap in order to win the cream.
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My last experience was in 2006, turned up for interview and got the job, it was in Curry's though. Only did it for 6 months though, as my business had started to pick up and decided to concentrate on that. I do wonder if I should have stayed though but I just felt I was loosing money by working there.
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I think it depends on your qualifications, local conditions, how far you can travel etc.
I think, if like me your not qualified in anything, its perhaps harder although not impossible by any stretch - the limitation is travel costs if its for a minimum wage job.
I keep my eye out and there are the odd job I might apply for if I needed to, but what I found was that in several cases, id apply on the Friday the advert was placed and id get a letter dated the following Monday that id missed the closing date - that happened several times so Im not sure the jobs existed or were ever meant to be filled since the Royal Mail doesnt get much quicker than 1 working day.
I think if I needed to I could pick up 2-3 part time jobs and my local council is still taking people on in certain sectors.
Whether there is that much opportunity to actually secure a position I dont know.
Of course, failing all that, buy a petrol lawnmower, sling it in the back of the car and knock on doors in posh neighbourhoods, just look smart and talk nicely - the gardener is the last to go in recession from what ive seen and alot of my customers have a guy just turn up in a ratty old banger with a petrol mower and they get £20 for an hours work - line them up each day and it would pay the bills.
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I'm applying for a part time job (21 hrs)- it's with the local Council - so I'll hand deliver the form a couple of days before the closing date....
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It's a good time to get into home security, CCTV, burgler/panic alarms, security grills, baseball bats etc., etc.
Send your CV to Chubb ~ tinyurl.com/3lxkzhe
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Or security patroling streets defending neighbourhoods one's the S... hits the van.
Listening to people in the know we are heading for a recession.Depression.?
Hope I'm wrong.Baseball bats Dog? Sawn off shotgun.;)
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This site is bringing a wonderful new slant on worn out hackneyed old sayings.
In the space of a week we have had cars shod with dishfinders and now S--- hitting vans!
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>> I'm applying for a part time job (21 hrs)- it's with the local Council -
>> so I'll hand deliver the form a couple of days before the closing date....
>>
When as a young man, I worked for a Contractor who tendered for a lot of local authority work, he/we/ I would hand deliver the submission an hour or so before the deadline, insist on speaking to a person of some standing, not the Tea boy and get a receipt and get the envelope stamped too. Made them think cos they're all as bent as hell if you let them be.
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Have you met my eldest madf? - sounds just like him....
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In terms of job sites than I find Jobsite far better than Monster of Planetrecruit, my CV has had literally 10x as many views on Jobsite as Monster.
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Sauntered into a recruitment agency in the afternoon, was out working a couple of hours later delivering parcels in a van. Unfortunately, I did have to embellish my CV a touch (having never done it before at all) but they didn't seem to notice.
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Part of the joys of having a driving licence :).
I really do wonder why some of my mates can't get jobs, it is not like they don't try, they keep going for interviews. The problem although they do have experience, they have little hard skills, so many local shops will rather employ 16 year olds for cheap labour.
I got my DIxons job simply because they knew I had to much product knowledge, despite having no retail or sales experience.
It would be interesting to see how hard I find it five years later.
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They say that there are two basic points :
1) A CV has to be tailored to the particular job. It shouldn't be a general purpose one that you just fire off to everyone, but carefully addressed to the job you are applying for.
2) Do some groundwork. Research the company, phone up the relevant person and ask for a brief chat about what the job entails, etc. Then when they get 1001 applications he may just sub-consciously remember your name as being the keen person who has already impressed him.
But don't overdo it. We are wary now of over-keen pushy people who speak a good line. In the end the conscientious plodder may be the safer bet.
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I can add a 3) to that, from recent experience: "apply now" buttons on agency websites are a total waste of time, no-one ever reads applications submitted that way, no matter how carefully they are crafted.
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>> 3) ... "apply now" buttons on agency websites are a total waste of time, no-one ever reads [submissions]
I'm finding that out quickly enough! Got my first interview tomorrow though, and had a good chat today with a customer of my previous work which may lead somewhere quite soon. Things are looking up.
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>> >> 3) ... "apply now" buttons on agency websites are a total waste of time,
>> no-one ever reads [submissions]
I am noticing this as well, as Reed have these "apply now" and I must have submitted over 100 applications, and not one have got back to me. - I thought at least one would have at least got back to me.
So what would be the alternative? for that "advert" post it in directly?
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I reckon for every 10 applications I make via 'apply now' then 6 I hear nothing, a couple send an automated 'If we don't ring in a week forget it' and a couple, the agent actually rings me up.
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I actually had a letter - an actual, real piece of paper with WORDS on it - from someone about one application. Fair near fell off my chair, I did.
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I'm taking my application to the Council tomorrow...the application process was quite a therapy in itself...
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All the fancy CV's and all the correctly filled in application forms don't compare with getting out there and showing the potential employer a face, polite understandable and correct attitude and a willingness to go out and present yourself, including the wiles to get face to face with the right person who has the say in recruiting.
It's my experience that most jobs are semi or fully allocted long before an advert is ever placed, to get a job worth having you've got to present yourself and make yourself the one they've already pencilled in.
Get yourself noticed, be a polite friendly and presentable pain in the rear.
Obviously this approach doesn't apply in all areas, but it does in many especially the private sector.
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Quick update.
I have now had 8 interviews in the space of a week, and so far 2 job offers. Hearing back from 3 more between now and Monday. And still have 3 more interviews in the pipe line next week.
So my experience has been positive. I have had no issue with 'apply now' on agency websites. The majority have been professionally acknowledged, and if unsuccessful timeously responded to to avoid wasting my time.
I think some of the problems may stem from the companies using the agencies as a convenient get out for their own recruitment rules which say they have to advertise externally even when they have internal candidates. I have spoken to a few agencies regarding this, and they say its quite common - and very frustrating!
Anyway the biggest problem I now have is deciding what to accept, and how long I give other options the chance to get back to me before committing myself. Do I accept everything and then commit to one, letting down the others, or delay and potentially lose out? It seems that the professional approach may actually be detrimental to me on this occasion!
Opinions please...
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>> I have had no issue with 'apply now' on
>> agency websites.
You've had a good experience, there. A lot of the jobs I've gone for lately have insisted on an application via some system called Aplitrak (or similar). You get an automated "we have updated our database" response but that's it. You try ringing to speak to the contact name listed (if there is one) but they're never available and in some cases have actually left the company (and believe me, I have some experience in getting hold of people who don't want to be got hold of). No wonder people lose heart.
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...Do I accept everything and then commit to one, letting down the others...
Pete,
I'm surprised you are considering doing anything dishonourable, so perhaps I've misread that statement.
You've done very well in what is a difficult market.
Don't let that success go to your head, which again I didn't think was in your nature.
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>> You've done very well in what is a difficult market.
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Aye, hats off to him, most sincerely.
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>>Do I accept everything and then commit to one, letting down the others...
Thought that might get a response! To be clear, I have no intention of doing this, but it would be interesting to see what others would do in the same situation. Basically I am making a decision over the long weekend, and have let the 2 companies know that, which they seemed okay about. My only concern really is that there are one or two positions I have yet to hear from which do sound very interesting. Unfortunately, despite as you say my success so far, I don't think turning down a job I am happy with 'just incase' is a particularly sensible option in the current climate!!
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I think you have to be honest with all of them - particularly those from whom you have not heard - nothing like being told you're in demand for making them make you an offer.
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>>energy consultant
What on earth was one of those?
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>>>>energy consultant
What on earth was one of those?<<
Someone who talks to radiators...? Possibly to be found in a cupboard chatting away to a 3-pin plug...
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>> >>energy consultant
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>> What on earth was one of those?
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Flogging solar panels would be my guess.
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>>Flogging solar panels would be my guess.
Or loft insulation.
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These sound like high turnover jobs, and jobs which not many people like the look of. Sales jobs in cut throat businesses (double glazing and the like). Perhaps this is why the OP has found it easier to come by employment than others do - the nature of the industries in which he is seeking employment.
Without wishing to belittle the achievement.
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It's like join the dots this !
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We had what might be described as an energy consultant come around here once. We were thinking of wall insulation anyway. So he came up with a price etc and said someone would be in touch.
He didn't drill any holes etc. to view cavities, measure them etc. And claimed they would drill holes between the bricks.
Anyway, when we got the call I asked questions: (1) how do we know the cavity is suitable and (2) what size holes as surely the corner of bricks would be destroyed if you drilled between them. In the end the neighbour who was interested had them around to check things out.
The results were: (1) rear wall of house was solid brick, (2) cavity in side wall was too small to do it at the price quoted. So part of the front was all they could do and the side wall if you paid them to do it slowly. Oh and the hole would have been through bricks.
End result - we didn't go for it and the energy consultant was asked to leave. A lot of wasted time for all concerned.
But to the OP - best of luck with your job hunt. Sounds like you have at least something lined up for now.
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>>Perhaps this is why the OP has found it easier to come by employment than others do - the nature of the industries in which he is seeking employment.
Not really. My career has been mainly customer service/management and only in the last few years have I swam the murky depth of direct sales! My interviews thus far have ranged from a building society; account management roles and a technical surveyor. It is the latter which is the front runner simply because it gets me seeing different people each day, does not have me stuck in an office, and quite perversely will utilise much of the knowledge I gained during the training in my old job which I never used!
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>>>>energy consultant
What on earth was one of those?
Selling gas and electric, insulation, home energy audits, solar pv etc. The job as described on recruitment and that I was trained for (including City and Guilds exam) ended up being nothing like it. Total waste of the knowledge gained in energy conservation and reduction which was what we were led to believe was the main focus. Ended up being just another high pressure 'we can save you money on your gas and electric bill' job as seen on watchdog and the like. Glad to be out. As are all but one of my collegues who started with me!
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>>Selling gas and electric, insulation, home energy audits, solar pv etc.
Preying on widows; just like DG. I'm sorry, and no disrespect but I have little sympathy with people who sell things at over-inflated prices to those who often can least afford it, purely by identifying their insecurities.
Solar PV is the biggest scam in the book. Almost as bad as boiler rooms (selling duff shares).
Last edited by: Mapmaker on Thu 25 Aug 11 at 15:38
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>>I have little sympathy with people who sell things at over-inflated prices to those who often can least afford it, purely by identifying their insecurities.
Couldn't agree more. Which is probably why I never became a millionaire and am not spending the summer on a tropical island all expenses paid by my ripped off customers!!
Disagree about solar PV though. In isolation the product itself does not produce anything like enough electricity to pay for itself in a reasonable timeframe. But since the government introduced FIT (FeedIn Tariff), the sums do add up. An annual return of around £800 for 25 years on a £10000 investment is better than any bank can or is likely to offer. Sure its all artificial, but thats what government had to do to increase takeup/reduce CO2 etc etc.
And like any other business there will be rogues and there will be saints (and all colours in between). I'd like to think that I'm in the latter category!
Last edited by: PeteW on Thu 25 Aug 11 at 17:15
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Yes as a taxpayer (well just about at the moment) I am funding other people's solar installs so they can get 10% p.a. return on their investment, which just about sums up HMG's 'eco' policy. If they're going to burn taxpayer funding it should at least be used in researching viable solutions, not subsidising inefficient, environmentally hostile (from a creation and disposal viewpoint) old technology like solar p.v.
I'll get off my soapbox now.
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>>But since the government introduced FIT (FeedIn Tariff), the sums do add up.
Are you sure???
>>An annual return of around £800 for 25 years on a £10000 investment is better than any
>>nk can or is likely to offer.
That's a theoretical maximum though. Do you have any real-life figures over a 12 month period for people to whom you sold them?
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All the best Pete - it's easy to flack from the sidelines of secure employment.
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>> Disagree about solar PV though. In isolation the product itself does not produce anything like
>> enough electricity to pay for itself in a reasonable timeframe. But since the government introduced
>> FIT (FeedIn Tariff), the sums do add up. An annual return of around £800 for
>> 25 years on a £10000 investment is better than any bank can or is likely
>> to offer. Sure its all artificial, but thats what government had to do to increase
>> takeup/reduce CO2 etc etc.
The installed PV schemes are already proving that the income was overestimated by at least a factor of 2.
From next year, new schemes will not get anything like the rates being paid to schemes installed this round. The worst cuts will be for larger schemes but even domestic ones will have a cut.
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>>The installed PV schemes are already proving that the income was overestimated by at least a factor of 2
I know 2 people personally who had PV fitted at the beginning of 2010. One paid about £7500, the other £12500 (they were previous Everest customers of mine, although as at that point Everest didn't do PV, only Thermal, they went elsewhere).
I have been in touch with them, and they have confirmed the following:
The £7500 system has provided a pay back of £440 in the last year.
The £12500 system has provided £980.
Both have also altered their usage to make best use of the daytime 'free' electricity for dishwashers/washing machines etc.
So not perhaps quite as good as promised but certainly still better than they were getting from their savings. Also they went into it with their eyes open and accepted that ANY quoted figures for savings/income etc for virtually anything are based on assumptions/ideals and often a bit of fairy dust(!)
There may also be a case to be made that the price paid, technology used and the quality of the installation etc will affect the outcome to quite a degree - these examples show a nearly 2% better return with the more expensive system. From memory I do not believe the houses were dissimilar in size/orientation.
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Here seems as good a place as any to update my brother's solar panel experience.
Nett installation cost to him about two years ago was £14,500.
His return in the first two years was £1,000 each year, and looks like being the same this year.
He is now all electric for heating and his annual energy bill - including about £20 for cooking on gas - is £1,200.
Incidentally, he fully accepts it's all down to subsidy, but points out the scheme is paid for by a levy on everyones' electricity bill.
So it's not funded from taxes, although for most of us, it comes to the same thing.
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>> Incidentally, he fully accepts it's all down to subsidy, but points out the scheme is
>> paid for by a levy on everyones' electricity bill.
Good for him i say.
However the things that would worry me...is the arrangement quaranteed, if so by whom and are they honourable...please don't tell me a politician has his grubby paws in it, and what of maintenance/repairs after say ten years.
I did toy with doing similar having a sizeable roof area, but it seemed to good to be true, so nada.
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... if so by whom and are they honourable...
I suspect it's guaranteed by some bloated, over-staffed and underworked government 'agency' which administers the scheme.
Probably as safe as any long-term contract can be.
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No Job - How hard is it to get one? - RattleandSmoke
