And bang into the bin goes my complaint about excessive moderation.
Frankly if its going ot be a oppressive as this I might as well go back to the other place.
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What do you object to, exactly, Zero?
Not being confrontational there, just being curious.
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someone mentioned about the word f a r t being in the swear filter, and if this was appropriate. The thread was locked, so I raised a post about the locking of that thread.
My thread was binned.
This one wil be as well.
all rather excessive.
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It's an old chestnut, but I suppose that lines have to be drawn somewhere. I'd rather be somewhere where I know the rules and where I stand.
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One man's meat is another man's poison.
Some stuff that I think should be allowed is going to be blocked. That's life. I don't have a problem with it if it makes the site more pleasant for other people. However, I'm uneasy about too much thread locking.
I'd rather be somewhere where I know the rules and where I stand.
I agree completely, BW.
Last edited by: tyro on Thu 18 Mar 10 at 23:27
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Zero,
I was just in the process of posting in agreement with you when your last thread went the journey.
I too had hoped we'd seen the last of pre-emptive thread locking.
We have a swear filter, so it's not as if anyone could have posted any rude words.
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In relation to the old place, we have till now been given huge leeway. I have been on here a lot and to date I havent seen anyone abuse that limit. Everyone has behaved in an exemplary fashion. If we are to be treated like children then some of us (me) tend to act like them.
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I don't want to see the old type of thread locking here either if it's not going someone's way, but neither do i want to see spacings and dots used to slip rude words in too often, as is the case in many other forums.
I'm not averse to swearing and have a fair vocabulary, but it's nice to know where one stands too, bit of give and take.
I've tried to be part of a couple of younger forums, but the childish nature of the postings gave me a headache.
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Its the not the swearing ban or the swear filter I have any issue with. Its the locking of a thread discussing it. And then binning my thread to complain about it.
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>> Its the not the swearing ban or the swear filter I have any issue with.
>> Its the locking of a thread discussing it.
Someone asked if a word could be removed from the filter, I said no and gave the reason. Do we really need a whole load of replies arguing the whys and why nots? It's pointless, pretty much as this thread is.
>> And then binning my thread to complain about it.
I don't know what happened to that one.
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>> all rather excessive.
Oh come on. Stop exaggerating. The swear filter is there for a reason, as are the words that are included in the filter. Simple as that.
One of the many positive comments on the other site was how pleasant it was to visit a forum without it being full of expletives - both mild or otherwise. That is one of the few things that we ask people to abide by here.
Although we are slightly more relaxed with the moderation here, threads will still be moderated where we deem necessary.
Now we could go overboard and start imposing rules left, right and centre, but we hope that most people here are sensible enough to conduct themselves in an appropriate and friendly manner without the need to.
Look at it another way, if you invite someone into your house and they started cursing and swearing, criticising what carpets, furniture and fittings you've got, then I think you'd object too.
All that we ask is that you're courteous and polite whilst here.
Vx
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 18 Mar 10 at 23:30
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Yes I could have laid money on that.
Its all so familiar
Last edited by: Zero on Thu 18 Mar 10 at 23:31
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The moderation is more relaxed though, on one motoring subject we (i) waffled a fair bit about newspapers, i fully expected a telling off but it didn't come though it probably wasn't far off.
I was pleased that our drifts are allowed within reason, gives the threads a bit of side interest too, even if IIH is wrong every time..;)
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...even if IIH is wrong every time..;)...
Like your attitude, gb, spot on.
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I think he works for the Sun. You are in for a dreadful expose in tomorrows issue GB
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Its ok i shan't see it, off work till Monday, by then they'll have changed sides..;)
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Missed all this excitement. Not being a mod I don't read most threads now ;-) Saves me a few hours a day probably.
snip, come on Rob, there's no need to encourage them.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 19 Mar 10 at 00:09
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I must admit i was somewhat surprised when I posted about my ' lady dogs ' messing my lawn and the word for them, the correct word, didn't pass the swear filter.
I have no wish to see gratuitous swearing anywhere but when it comes to binning a perfectly correct word !!
Now, B**ch may have insulting connotations but so does Cow, Dog, and others.
Surely, if used in the correct context, they should all be allowed.
Ted
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>> I have no wish to see gratuitous swearing anywhere but when it comes to binning
>> a perfectly correct word !!
>> Surely, if used in the correct context, they should all be allowed.
Unfortunately the filter isn't intelligent enough to distinguish between the two. If however we see the filter has been triggered by an innocent word that also happens to contain a swearword, then we'll edit the post accordingly.
Vx.
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So, the *whole* post was censored - that is not very good at all! Grr! How silly!
I posted words to the effect that:
In another place, I asked about the name of the town - Scun Thorpe". I was told nothing could be done. On the other hand, the legitimate word - pi sh! - was removed from the filter, as it was a word that had been abused, but the abuse had ceased.
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>> In another place I asked about the name of the town - Scun Thorpe". I was told nothing could be done.
I'll see if I can tweak the filter. Scunthorpe will still get picked up by the filter as it's not intelligent enough to distinguish between an innocent word and one that contains a swearword, but it hopefully now won't totally remove the sentence / whole post.
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>> I'll see if I can tweak the filter. Scunthorpe will still get picked up by the filter....
Or maybe it won't. This might need further tweaking though.
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>> Look at it another way if you invite someone into your house and they started
>> cursing and swearing criticising what carpets furniture and fittings you've got then I think you'd
>> object too.
Frankly I am still a bit annoyed with the response that I got to my posts about the technical section bug. But now that I read this, do you consider us all guests in your house, or do you consider that we are contributors, fundamental to the success of this site?
Frankly, I would suggest that the attitude here is toned down a bit, or you do risk losing people.
I am saddened by this to be honest, I really felt at home for the last few weeks.
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>> Frankly I am still a bit annoyed with the response that I got to my posts about the technical section bug.
I think the point trying to be made was that you picked up on a minor bug, then commented twice that you wanted paying for noticing it, then go and post on another forum that is so infested with bugs (but failed to make any comment over there about it) you could have got rich beyond your wildest dreams by sending them your bill ;o)
Anyway, on behalf of car4play, I apologise for the terse comment that was made.
Vx.
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>> Anyway on behalf of car4play I apologise for the terse comment that was made.
I appreciate it. All the best.
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I got censored there, I got censored here, quite likely by the same person too.
I didn't take it to heart then, or not much, and I don't now. Seems sporting enough to me. If the limits were too silly I wouldn't be here.
I seem to remember that at school there were three sorts of prefect or captain: ones who didn't much care, ones who took their functions seriously but in a decent humane manner, and power-crazed idiots capable of anything.
Decent website moderators are like the middle sort. The others become unpopular or drift away.
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I do think a bit more time should be allowed for late-night second thoughts. I loathe that damn pink band. But I can't be rectumed to write it all again.
This is a serious suggestion actually Vxman.
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I don't know if this is off topic but the standard of debate and repartee (both here and in the old place) is/was so much higher than other forums I occasionally visit. But I think that's more due to the kind of people that frequent the site, more than the mere effect of a swear filter. Or so it seems to me. With the very odd exception you don't seem to get people being abusive here... or maybe the mods are doing such a good job that we don't notice :-)
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I've not noticed any evidence of excessive moderation. In fact I've not noticed any moderation at all so far. Perhaps it's because I see no reason, or have any desire, to be naughty. I'm completely happy with Car4play.
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...I'm completely happy with Car4play...
More than 400 posts yesterday would suggest there's not a lot wrong with it.
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I'm so disappointed - I've never been banned, edited, or even had a minor telling-off on any web forum. Maybe I need to go to some of those other sites frequented by young thrusting types and bone up on the latest lingo and insults.
My parents always told me I'd never get anywhere in life by just being 'normal'. Ha, they were right.
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...I've never been banned, edited, or even had a minor telling-off on any web forum...
Dave,
You don't know what your missing.
It's usually over something you didn't mean for which the mod refuses to accept your explanation.
So you get a public ticking off, often with a threat of cyber extermination, which leaves you with a crushing sense of injustice.
It's great. :)
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I used to be coarse and crude in my younger days but I grew out of it. I realised that crude words added nothing to what I wanted to say, and bored more of my listeners than it impressed. Using crude words in a forum in which most members are complete strangers to one another is pointless to say the least.
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>> Using crude words in a forum
>> in which most members are complete strangers to one another is pointless to say the
>> least.
Agreed, but this is at least partly about a word which I and many others wouldn't class as crude, or at worst is less crude than one which doesn't get filtered.
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Its not really about the word or use of bad words. Perfectly happy to have slapped wrist or swear filter. It all about the abuse of threadlocking, thread binning, when anyone discusses it.
Further up the comment was "it was pointless so I locked it"
Who is the arbiter of "pointless" If your in the pub and you swear, OK you can be thrown out. YOu cant tho say "YOur here for a pint but you cant talk about this or that, and I, the landlord, decide what you talk about"
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I get your point entirely. Think it is answered in my other post here.
Sometimes when a thread gets locked it's simply down to the fact that it can be really difficult to go to great lengths for a mod to explain themselves. After all they need to chill here too if they can and this kind of thing is really hard for them to do because if they don't, they face backlash, and if they do, they also face criticism.
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>> is really hard for them to do because if they don't they face backlash and if they do they also face criticism.
Yep, a case of damned if I do, damned if I don't.
Vx.
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I used the word pill0ck's in a thread yesterday which was nuked by the filter.
I couldn't quite understand why though.
When I told my superior half she said it could be used in a derogatory manner (wotever that means)
No worries though - life goes on :)
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I do appreciate the moderators work and the lack of hard core swearing on the site (s) reflects that.
However it does sometimes grate when the mildest of innuendoes is pulled by over zealous moderation.....
The example of innuendo which got my post deleted from the backroom was to do with a type of bird ( c***katoo). I am sure most people here can see where I am going with this.
An old joke from me which would not have offended your granny was wiped out.
Even that nice James May uses the word quite frequently on Top Gear....
Within days there was a thread about a type of Spaniel ( C***ker) and I trotted out the old joke again. Again deleted.
It's just sad really...
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>> I used the word pillock's in a thread yesterday which was nuked by the filter.
>> When I told my superior half she said it could be used in a derogatory manner.
That was the reason for it being there in the first place. However as no one has used it in a derogatory manner for quite a while I've now removed it again.
Vx.
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pillock
noun
a person who is not very bright; "The economy, stupid!" [syn: stupid]
Just about sums me up then ;-)
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I suppose it was inevitable that at some stage moderation would kick in. I asked all the mods to be as light as possible, and they have done this to the best of my knowledge. It's not an easy job knowing always when to use the scissors, but they do have them for a reason.
The emphasis is always on keeping this place as friendly, polite, courteous and inoffensive as possible. On the whole, much of the time I think we would all agree that the atmosphere has been like this.
The thing is, that at some point, no matter where we put the line, the modding will occur. Clearly not all will agree with where this point is. That's just life, and it can be tough on the one getting snipped. The other problem is that once you are snipped, no one else (unless they were part of the discussion and read the snipped post) can agree or disagree that you have been snipped correctly. So you don't get your day in court to be vindicated. The mod doesn't get vindicated either and we are expected to believe that he / she did the right thing. The one being snipped will rarely believe this because of course they would feel that it was unjustified (unless they are being knowingly malicious and realise this - a very rare thing).
So I am sorry Zero that this happened - better than policing with "zero tolerance". ;-)
(.. had to get that one in :-)))
We will put in a system shortly which will mod itself more so that we all won't take modding so personally, where the mod ends up as the bad guy/girl and the snipped one as the victim. Until then can I ask that we all be patient when maybe we are the ones being snipped, feel unheard or whatever. None of this makes either side "bad" IMHO.
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Its not really about the word or use of bad words. Perfectly happy to have slapped wrist or swear filter. It all about the abuse of threadlocking, thread binning, when anyone discusses it.
That is the key point. When some people see the thread title - "excessive moderation" - they think that the complaint is about words being deleted, and about the swear filter. But moderation is not simply about removing potentially offensive words and phrases. It is also about binning and locking whole threads. That is where the moderation had gotten excessive.
The problem is not that the filter removes references to female spaniels; it is that threads got locked and binned.
Last edited by: tyro on Fri 19 Mar 10 at 09:52
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What's the problem?
It's their ball, so they can make the rules.
We've been (not unfairly IMHO) likened to a group of naughty schoolkids. We'll push the boundaries, but when we see someone else get a slap, we'll not do it again (for a while).
I've had my wrist slapped, but not here (yet)!
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>> What's the problem?
>>
>> It's their ball so they can make the rules.
In this case, its not. It was on the "other place" but not here. As far as i can tell its *our* ball with a referee in charge in case we break the offside trap.
Last edited by: Zero on Fri 19 Mar 10 at 13:49
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Totally agree with Tyro.
And Mods, if you find the answer to Scun.thorpe and the swear filter please tell me because ours does exactly the same:)
Pat
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>> And Mods if you find the answer to Scun.thorpe and the swear filter ....
I think I've managed to fix it. However the software here is probably different to what you're using.
Vx
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Frankly I would be happy if the whole word scun.thorpe was blotted out. Its aptly named and who on earth wants to talk about it?
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i will have you know i bought my pl112d record deck there in 1980
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Do we still have to say 'A football club managed by Mr Wenger?'
Let's try - a***NAL.
You might reasonably reply that it won't have a place in the motoring section.....
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Best laugh I've had all week - the filter has made it worse!!!!
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rather they werent mentioned either,
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...think Alf Garnett...
Well, he was a Hammer on the telly, but a Spur in real life.
Saw him at the Lane a few times.
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...and at Upton park...
In the away end. :)
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...A North London (Stoke Newington)-born Spurs supporter of Russian Jewish descent, with strongly left-wing political leanings...
Come on you Lilywhites!
tinyurl.com/ygrr3t4
Last edited by: ifithelps on Sat 20 Mar 10 at 13:00
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Nah - he was on the pitch in Claret and Blue.
Anyone remember the deeply racist tale he told of Hitlers bombers using the floodlights at Upton park and highbury to find White Hart Lane and bomb it?
really funny but completely inapropriate.
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 20 Mar 10 at 13:06
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...Nah - he was on the pitch in Claret and Blue...
I seem to recall he 'came out' as a Spur some time in the mid-1980s.
He made an appearance on the pitch at the Lane before a West Ham game and got a decent reception from both sets of supporters.
Speaking of anti-Semitism, I heard a rare witty chant from West Ham fans before a Tottenham game.
It was Boxing Day and Band Aid was number one with Do they know it's Christmas?
Using the tune of the chorus, the Hammers fans chanted at us: "Kill a y**do, let them know it's Christmas."
Edit: Swear filter strikes again - it's a word we Spurs fans use to describe ourselves, so I don't think there should be any offence caused.
Last edited by: ifithelps on Sat 20 Mar 10 at 13:18
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I much prefer the lyrics of "in your liverpool homes" tho Pat would be upset at the treats found within!
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 20 Mar 10 at 13:19
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Oh and watch out that Harry doesent do a portsmouth job on you.
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Liverpool 'homes'?
Not what we used to sing. :)
As regards my team, no-one's more surprised than me we're still fourth, given the games we've lost and points we've dropped.
It's happening on Harry's watch, so good luck to him.
We're in a much better position financially than Portsmouth, although there is the small matter of a new ground to build which is going to test the business acumen of our board.
Still, if those impostors from south of the Thames can do it, so can we.
Last edited by: ifithelps on Sat 20 Mar 10 at 13:35
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yes Harrys watch is great - The bills come later.
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...The bills come later...
Or in Harry's case, the old Bill.
Steady on now, murky waters ahead. :)
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>> think Alf Garnet.
That explains everything. He was a moany old git as well ;o)
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I remember Warren Mitchell appearing at Upton Park in his Alf Garnet guise at least once during the sixties, and he got a rousing reception from the fans too. He never hid his allegience to Spurs during that period, but he was on record as saying that he was treated like royalty by West Ham when he went there and like something that came in on your shoe when he went to Tottenham.
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Oh, do stop all this chatter about Suvvern teams ! You know the best two teams in Britain are in Manchester.......Manchester City and Manchester City Reserves !!
Ted
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>> You know the best two teams in Britain are in Manchester.......Manchester City and Manchester City Reserves !!
Funny... out of all the Manc's I've ever met, none support the 3rd team..... whatever their called.....
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Indeed so, Tony.
All TTTs supporters live over 200 miles away, or abroad.....or on the Moon !
Ted
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There's only one English team worth talking about at the moment.
The one which beat Juventus 4-1.
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Moderators, please delete my post timed at 07:54 on 23rd March. I can't find your email address.
Thanks.
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There's a little bit of a rebel in you, L'es:)
Pat
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>> There's a little bit of a rebel in you L'es:)
>>
>> Pat
>>
I had a moment of weakness, which I later regretted.
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>> please delete my post timed at 07:54 on 23rd March
Done.
>> Moderators I can't find your email address.
Click on one of our usernames and it will bring it up.
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excessive moderation - Badwolf
