I see the media is talking about the government's intention to ban the sale of cheap alcohol.
Our city already is looking to get a by-law to this end.
Now, no-one likes the situation in most town centres at the moment but what about poverty stricken pensioners like TTQ and me, who like an occasional, modest drink at home.
I've never been one to parade up and down the high street in me trolleys, swearing loudly and vomiting down the fronts of policemen. I assume the restrictions will apply to all booze, not just White Lightening and Wife-beater.
I certainly don't want to be paying £1.89 for a bottle of beer and the 3 wines for £9.99 at Lidl might come to an end........a tragic time for home drinkers.
I was in Aldi today and they had Spitfire and a pale ale at 99p.....just the job. Lidl have Marstons Pedigree at £1....This isn't the sort of stuff the yobs go for !
To this end, I have decided to stock up while the going's good. I've got 49 bottles in the beer shed plus a lot of home brew as reserve. Gonna start on the wine when me Giro comes !
Again, being made to suffer by the idiots in society.
Ted
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...ban the sale of cheap alcohol...
The supermarkets, particularly the large out-of-town ones, are deemed to be least responsible for binge drinking, which puts them at the bottom of the hit list.
What is worrying is if a 'blunt instrument' approach is taken by massively increasing duty, forcing all retailers of alcohol to put up prices.
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It couldn't possibly be the pubs staying open until 2am could it? Or happy hour that runs for 3 hours in a pub I pass from time to time? Or ladies night, a tray of pints for about a fiver iirc (Saxmundham)? I'm not sure what that says about the ladies of that town! Or police not nicking people for d&d if you believe the papers?
No, none of them. Take the easy option / false, moral high ground and raise a few bob in tax while you're doing it.
I'm getting grumpy this norning, time to go and do something else :-)
John
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You can give people an implant or injection that makes them intolerant of alcohol and be sick after one swallow.
Far more effective in my view. Target the offenders...
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Another case where the majority are penalized for the delinquent minority.
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I wish I knew the solution. I'm not sure if there is one to be honest. The only constructive observation I can make is that it strikes me to be more of a need to try to re-position society's general attitude to alcohol. To try to get to a position where it is seen as something to be enjoyed but not taken to excess.
The extended opening hours debate interests me. There does seem to be some evidence of a negative effect but I would offer the counter point that this has been the norm in many countries ( including Scotland ) for many years. I travel to contintental Europe on a regular basis and while of course they too have alcohol related crime and disorder, it just feels a lot more controlled at the general will of the population. Some UK town centres are no go areas at night due to alcohol related behaviour and it does occur to me that we should be less tolerant of that. I was brought up in Edinburgh, a cosmopolitan city where alcohol and other drugs were freely and more or less round the clock available. Some of course abuse that facility and there are as elsewhere dire consequenses to health and cultural stability. However, the difference I encountered was the lack of high speed binge drinking by comparison to my experience of English towns and cities. Drinking was a more leisurely and paced activity perhaps because there was less time pressure to "get it down your neck" before closing time. The problem in England seems to me anyway that they continue to drink at the same pace despite the longer opening hours and severe drunkeness results.
I was perhaps lucky in that I and my circle of friends were all quite sporty. We all participated in something or other at weekends which necessitated our being at least reasonably on form. We drank of course, but never to excess. We all felt enough of a responsibility to our fitness and health not to.
I feel the only real long term solution is education of the next generation to treat alcohol and themselves with a greater respect than that which is the current norm.
It angers me at one level but also saddens me to see the state of some people when you venture into our towns and cities at night. It does strike me that they can't all be idiots but are caught up in a wave of acceptance of cultural debauchery which we as the the current adults have a responsibilty to at least try to resist.
What form and with what methodology that resistance should take I really wouldn't know but fire fighting with price seems a very limp response to a much bigger problem to me.
It's about cultural attitude change and education, not restriction. In my opinion.
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The Scottish Parliament recently tried to pass a bill along these lines on a minimum price per unit of alcohol but failed. Not surprisingly, the boss of Tesco was canvassing for it to be implemented.
I buy my beer when its on offer, and similarly with wine. Do I drink more than if it wasn't on offer, probably due to the fact I buy in bulk so always have a case or two lying whereas if I was only buying as and when I needed then I might not be bothered going to buy some.
One of the arguments that is often put acoss is the British culture towards children in pubs - not sure what the rules are now but France used to be held up as an example to follow where kids could have wine at their meal at a certain age and go to the pubs. This was argued, could prevent parents getting sloshed as they had kids to look after .
I am sure everyone on here could name an area close to them that letting the kids go to the pub with their parents would be a recipe for disaster though!
I may be outdated but when I think of Glasgow at night, I see loads of drunks spewing in the streets, getting dragged along the ground by their mates and propped up in bus shelters. You think of Paris and you think of lots of people drinking wine in a pavement cafe and being very mature. You think of Dublin of crowds swilling Guiness whilst singing songs and enjoying the craic.
So is it a British culture, is it a class-culture? Does it only affect the lower classes the street brawls and drunken behaviours?
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It's the acceptance of excess drinking throughout society which should concern us the most. While there may be a possible demographic split it is endemic at any level or measure of society you care to use.
I know many otherwise "normal" people who freely speak of going out "to get lashed" or "have a skinful" or whatever. While this is seen as culturally acceptable we will never find a solution.
I would prefer a society where drinking was seen as a more than acceptable leisure activity but being drunk was seen as embarrassing. It is at one level, that simple and self policing.
Maybe it's a self-respect thing more than anything. If you don't honour yourself you are hardly likely care about your effect on others.
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When I was 5/6 years old a bottle of whisky/gin etc was approximately £1.50 (my grandpa would send me for a bottle at the corner shop!)- wages were say £7.00/week - say 8 hours to earn enough to buy a bottle
Today a bottle can be £10 upwards and wages are £6.00 upwards so even on minimum wages a person only needs to work 1.7 hours.
I am not saying there was no drunkeness 60 years ago but there was less and everybody trundled home at 10pm when the pub closed.
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A relative of friend drives cabs (he downshifted from the building trade) he was shocked to get a regular "job" to call at a social housing property to deliver a half a bottle of Scotch to the disabled resident. All paid for by the Local Authority......Institutionalized drinking it seems.
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Can't disagree with anything that anyone's posted but a small point about our continental neighbours: my GP friend tells me that the rate of liver cirrhosis in France is twice that of the UK. We're definitely not alone in excess consumption, we merely cling to a genteel image of French drinking.
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I am never convinced there is even a major problem. I am in Manchester city centre nearly every weekend and haven't seen any trouble. I have seen none of the images the media like to show us but I suspect the problem is far worse in the smaller fringe towns.
There is a huge number of people in Manchester city centre at the weekends, I read that a typical figure is 200,000 but it can be a lot more. Out of those lot of course some of them will kick off and get arrested etc.
Drink promotions are now largely banned. You cannot do the happy hours in pubs you used to be able to do but some landlords flout this.
I do actually think certain booze is too cheap, I cannot understand why such drink as white lightening is legal for a start.
I spent £25.00 on saturday night, I had about 8 pints, went to a club, shared a taxi back etc. However that might be because two regulars bought me drinks.
So yes I do think we have a problem but I don't think its half as bad as people make out. I am sure people who work in A&E etc will say a very different thing, but they don't see the millions out on a saturday night who do not get into any bother.
slight edit to fix a typo that spelt an unfortunate word when linked to others in your post.
Last edited by: Pugugly on Tue 19 Oct 10 at 12:17
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www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=1091 shows that
"I am never convinced there is even a major problem" is written out of ignorance I am afraid.
Doubling of alcohol related deaths for men in 16 years.. not a problem?
See also earlier statistics..
www.statistics.gov.uk/STATBASE/ssdataset.asp?vlnk=7452
Last edited by: madf on Tue 19 Oct 10 at 13:57
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All this is another example of solving the wrong problem.
Most of the local scrotes causing trouble in my nearest town centre have already been banned from all the local drinking emporia - so they just shoplift it out of the nearest Tesco Express and have it in the street instead. Wouldn't matter to them whether a bottle of WKD or whatever cost a quid or a tenner - they'd just pinch it.
Cheap drink promotions in the bars round here aren't the problem either. I'd far rather these people were guzzling beer at a quid a pint - let's face it, there's a physical limit to how much you can have before you go bang anyway. But they're not. It's alcopops, it's spirits, it's Red Bull and other accelerants, all mixed up with various other chemicals acquired from a number of sources and necked quickly at the start of proceedings. No wonder they're off their heads on that lot.
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A fair proportion of the population will accept any conditions provided they have enough alcohol. See inner Glasgow where life expectancy is LOWER than Iraq...
That's why cheap drink was not banned by the Labour Party when in power. When sober, these people voted Labour...
www.guardian.co.uk/society/2006/jan/21/health.politics
What's a few murdered people or a few deaths from alcohol when your constituents depend on you for benfits and cheap booze? take it away?
No chance.
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And in the spirit of this thread, Asda currently have a load of multipack beers for £6 including the likes of Miller 15 pack.
Thats 40p a bottle. I repeat 40p a bottle.
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Thanks Bobby I shall get them in for Saturday night :).
I am sure I can handle the 15 bottles before I go out*
Glasgow has a high death rate not just because of booze but lots of other issues too.
I am not saying there isn't a problem with alchohol I am just saying the media like to make the problem out to be a lot worse than it is.
I just really know how people end up in the state they do, I do get drunk, I will have 8-9 pints over 6-8 hours on a typical saturday night but I am always fine. I think its because its all beer with the odd cider. None of this alchopop crap.
The reason I drink so much? Well I don't have much of a fun life, its boring but after a few beers on the dance floor with my air guitar all problems have gone. I am very aware of what booze can do so I don't touch it during the week unless I am out in which case I will have a couple of pints.
I never feel the need to have a drink when I get back from work etc.
*But I won't wake up again if I have the usual 6-7 pints on top.
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I never drink at home - I much prefer it in a pub or my club - although I don't mind drinking in someone else's house...:-)
However, I've personally never seen young people (i.e teenagers) buying booze in any of our local supermarkets (they'd probably quickly be thrown out if they tried) and any attempt to put up prices would merely hit responsible people taking advantage of keen prices.
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>> And in the spirit of this thread, Asda currently have a load of multipack beers
>> for £6 including the likes of Miller 15 pack.
>>
>> Thats 40p a bottle. I repeat 40p a bottle.
Its MILLER
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Its MILLER
And thats what I drink... mostly.
In fact, thinking back, the first time I tasted it was when Safeway had the 24 pack on a BOGOF deal and I bought it and have bought it ever since. Am sure there is a message in there for marketing depts........
although having said that, I don't think I have ever, ever , bought it at full price.
And Zero, my other choices are Belhaven Best, Deuchars IPA and Tennents Velvet..
Just in case you are buying.. :)
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When I was growing up in the North West of England in the 80s it was considered normal on a Friday or Saturday to buy 3 or 4 pints each at last orders, having already consumed a skin full, and then throw them down in the half hour or so until the bouncers threw us out of the pub. Then the streets would be full of drunken louts, there would be fights and periodically the police would appear.
Sometimes people used to go to clubs and the scenario would be repeated at 2 in the morning when the clubs closed. The pubs were closed in the afternoon so people would binge drink illegally at lock-ins before vomiting on the street outside.
I think it was these situations that the changes in the licencing laws were intended to address. My experience of Liverpool and Manchester city centres these days is that there is far less obvious violence at the weekends than I remember when I used to live there.
There do seem to be more binge drinking women these days than there used to be though. But the general quantity rather than quality attitude to alchohol in the UK hasn't changed, I think this is something dreamed up by the likes of the Daily Mail. I shudder when I remember that people used to drink the crap that Yate's Wine Lodge served to get the evening going, just because it was cheap and strong.
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I think that a lot of underage drinking goes on in this little village, couple of beer cans and a Curly Wurly wrapper on the verge this morning !
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>> I think that a lot of underage drinking goes on in this little village, couple
>> of beer cans and a Curly Wurly wrapper on the verge this morning !
>
Sorry those two small cans of courage Pale Ale went to my head, I will come and clean up the curly wurly wrapper tomorrow. Did you find the 5 pack of woodbines? I think there was half a one left in it.
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I certainly agree with you. I have never seen any violence in Manchester city centre, but I stick to the rock type bars/clubs. I am sure the Printworks area which is full of chain bars may be a different story but haven't been there for years.
There is a bit of trouble in the club I go to but its usualy caused by younger chav sorts who soon get kicked out. The age range in there is 18 - 65 but there is one bloke who goes who is 70.
I am slighlty out of touch with the main stream city centre scene now as but my idea of a typical small town night club is my idea of hell.
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Asda are also back on 3 wines for a tenner today...bought some this morning.
Lidl are doing 6 or 7 bitters for a quid from tomorrow......I'll be there clutching a £20 note.
Ted
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Ted
you need to get in touch with rattle and come to one of my meetings.
My name is Ted, and I am an ......
You get the drift!
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>> My name is Ted, and I am an ......
>>
>> You get the drift!
More correct would be ' My name is Ted and I am a lickpenny ' !
I succumbed to temptation and bought 30 mixed. I didn't have a £30 note so I put them on the debit card.......again.
I had a bottle of Marstons Double Drop with me tea at 7pm....finished drinking it just after !0 pm. That's how bad a lush I am !
Only drink about 3 a week but I do like to get them when they're cheap. Won't buy any more this year.....unless we have a party.
Ted
>>
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Tesco were doing 3x12 packs of all sorts of stuff for £20a a few days ago. My Garage is full of Magners as I like 5 pieces of fruit a day!
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>> beers for £6 including the likes of Miller 15 pack.
Yuck. I'd rather drink Aldi's perry (£3.49/3L).
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Just started going to clubs that is the WMC a nice cold pint of carling £2.00 old mans bitter £1.90 so armed with £20.00 i had a great afternoon on sunday gone!
Stella 18 cans at Asda £12.00 440ml will it stop me drinking will it heck, The pub prices for the carling is usual £2.85-3.00.
All we need now is clubs to start selling food like a pub does & get rid of this thats our seat culture i'll sit were i want!!
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I don't buy beer as much as I used to, but it seems to me prices have gone up quite a lot in the last few months.
Several brands are now more often in 440ml tins than 500ml ones.
I tend to buy so-called premium lagers, such as Stella or Budweiser.
Not so long ago, they were a £1 or less a tin.
Four-packs are now at least £4.50, and that's usually for the smaller size.
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I've noticed that Iffy, more so in the "premium" bottled beers.
My favourite Fuller's ESB and 1845 have both increased substantially over the last few months, and the multi-buy options seem less generous than they were.
The recent increases in raw materials prices, plus the ever-increasing cost of energy, no doubt contributed most of this.
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All we need now is clubs to start selling food like a pub does & get rid of this thats our seat culture i'll sit were i want!!
>...
>>>>>>>>>>>> er i think no
the seat inthe corner belongs to the wife and i how dare you suggest you can park your bum there
as for food well no thank you,horrible smelly stuff ,theres pork scratchings behind our club bar if thas ungry
oh and old mans beer indeed
pah...........
Last edited by: Bellboy on Thu 21 Oct 10 at 19:24
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Bellboy. lol..........
Really the time has come to move forward selling food in clubs will attract more folk and they will bring there kids lots of kids running around but better to have a play room for them and leave the club to serve cheap beer.
I mentioned this in a club i go in occasionally the look on one member of the comittee face was enough but he's a dinosaur must be 80 so move on mr dinosaur and let the young uns in and turn a club into a happy place you can still have your bingo and your line dancing on a monday night!!
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Prices of my favourite tipple vary.
I kinda fluctuate between Becks, Peroni, and Birra Morretti, depending which one is under £4 quid for a four pack.
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Morretti is far superior. I should know having been given a lovely set of glasses by my Italian Restaurant owner friend. o:-)
Shame the ' Silly Ol' Moo ' put them through the Dishwasher!!!!!
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Aldi have 15x330ml bottles of Stella for £9.99. Cheapest in UK..
Margins on alcohol are normally 50% + I think.
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...Aldi have 15x330ml bottles of Stella for £9.99. Cheapest in UK...
That's the almost exact equivalent of 10 half-litre cans, which for a pound each is pretty good.
And it tastes nicer out of bottles, too. :)
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Yes all booze does, I hate beer from cans.
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I'm just enjoying a few shots of tequila while I work. It was free. That is, I stole from a neighbour's house party a few weeks ago. I was drinking on his patio, I spotted the bottle and carefully lowered it over the gate into a small, dark corner of his driveway and went back for it after we left his house.
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...a few shots of tequila while I work...
I remember the yuppies in the 80s drinking this stuff with a line of salt - or was it sugar? - on the side of their hands.
Never did anything for me.
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I thought it was vodka, it was very dark.
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He knows you are a tea leaf so he probably peed in it.
Its the same colour and taste
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speaking of tequila...Patron Gold is lovely stuff. Far too good to be used in Margueritas. Lovely served neat in a chilled glass with sea salt on the rim, and a twist of lemon & lime.
I still prefer a decent bitter, and fortunately my local Booth's always has something on offer at £1 per bottle.
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This is what I was thinking of:
"Another common way to drink tequila is straight along side salt and lime/lemon. In your left hand, palm down add a touch of salt just below the thumb and hold your lime or lemon. Take a shooter glass filled with tequila in your right hand. Then consume as follows; lick the salt, down the shot and suck on the lime/lemon. This method complements the tequila; however, the order can be changed for your liking."
Extracted from: www.greatcocktails.co.uk/TequilaSlammer.html
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Seen in LIDL (Costa del Sol: steady on chaps!) today - a 75CL bottle of red wine for just under 0.70€.
Didn't dare try it though, but a litre of Don Simon red, white or rosé, in a tetra-pack, is less than a euro. (You can drink it - it's perfectly OK, but a little thin)
We use wine a LOT in our cooking!
Last edited by: landsker on Thu 21 Oct 10 at 23:04
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Recently Netto had Oyster Bay S. Blanc at £5 a bottle. I took full advantage and bought 6 cases. A bargain at that price..I returned for seconds but it had all gone!
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Booze prices. - Iffy
