News that it seems a disgruntled ex-boyfriend has killed his girlfriend, the girlfriend's sister and mother with a cross-bow.
There was similar near me a few years ago when a disgruntled ex killed his ex-wife and mother in law.
I've been dumped by girl-friends and have dumped girl friends. You leave it at that. Not go on a rampage and kill them.
Unbelievable.
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It’s a primitive reaction which in some very few people is uncontrolled and turns to violence. Mad with jealousy is a real thing unfortunately.
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Surprisingly, I worked in an office where something similar, inc crossbow, happened in 1983!!!!
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 10 Jul 24 at 17:16
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I had the perfect revenge all planned on my ex-wife (who stole my Hampstead house in the divorce).
I knew her regular lottery numbers so for a few months after the split I used to do nine tickets with the same numbers for every draw in the hope that if she won, she'd only get 10% of the jackpot.
It never happened of course but there might be a Netflix movie in there somewhere...
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>> I used to do nine tickets with the same numbers for every draw in the hope
>> that if she won, she'd only get 10% of the jackpot.
>>
LOL!
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Looks like they've caught him with no shots fired.
Well done police!!!
www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/c6p284ng14yt
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The brother of the arrested man is doing 23 years for murder!
He murdered a young man who marked his Ford Mustang, attempted murder of another
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>> Looks like they've caught him with no shots fired.
That’s a shame
More tax payers money down the drain
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Seems he had shot (or bolted?) himself first though.
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Its extremely awkward to shoot yourself anywhere serious with a crossbow.
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I worked with someone who did the same numbers every week. One of these was his ex-wife’s birthday. New partner insisted he changed that one number. You know the rest……ouch.
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I worked for a big publishing house in the 90s and they had a lottery pool. I think there was only a Saturday draw in those days so the guy running it would collect the pound from those involved on a Friday afternoon. It must have taken him the whole afternoon. There were perhaps 50 people doing it and it was always a tenner or two that won every week. I said to the guy, why don't you stop using 50 sets of random numbers and instead use the same 5 numbers and just change the last number. Then if those 5 numbers ever get you a tenner, you get it x50 - £500. Then you can use that money to run it for ten weeks without wasting so much time.
He thought about for a moment and said, no. We've a greater chance if they're all different.
No you don't, matey, I said. It's just the same.
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With the first Mrs LL we have an agreement that any P Bond wins £20k and over, we give the other party 20% of the winnings…neither of us have been that lucky, but you never know.
And we trust one another…
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Back in 1988 an ex boyfriend turned up one evening at his former girlfriends parents house in the village a mile down the road from where I live. Shot her and new boyfriend with a shotgun, then reloaded it and shot himself.
Apparent reason, jealously and couldn't stand her being with someone else.
She was someone I knew from primary school days. Lovely girl, who had the whole of her life ahead of her, but murdered at 20 yrs old.
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Shocking, sickening.
I will never understand why someone would do this.
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Aye, vile scum rioting.
This guy will be famous for ever though...
twitter.com/tim_brannigan/status/1818392714406511075
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Seen on a FB Forum;
'The dildo of consequence seldom arrives lubed.' :))
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>>
>> Aye, vile scum rioting.
>>
Farage doesn't help...
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13695445/Nigel-Farage-Tommy-Robinson-rioters-Southport-stabbings.html
Asking " asking whether 'the truth was being withheld' about the Southport stabbings"
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Son, currently on his hollies, has seen a demo/riot is planned at the Quilliam Mosque in Liverpool, the oldest in the UK, on Friday.
His fiancee teaches at a school over the road and several of her pupils and/or their families attend that Mosque.
I'm finding the stuff in the last few days really quite frightening. The people protesting in London last night and interviewed on the radio were quoting alarming stuff about people on small boats etc.
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>>I'm finding the stuff in the last few days really quite frightening. The people protesting in
>>London last night and interviewed on the radio were quoting alarming stuff about people on
>>small boats etc.
Outrageous bigotry.
According to the Telegraph, the Russians are stoking it on social media.
Plus some of the new Reform politicians.
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Transpires the family of the accused are from a Christian background, does this mean that they'll switch to torching churches ?
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Looting as well. Beating up coppers.
Unforgivable.
I didn't like the pro-Palestinian protests, but I don't believe that they turned to violence.
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>>I didn't like the pro-Palestinian protests, but I don't believe that they turned to violence.
Whatever you think of their views those participating in those protests are overwhelmingly peaceful. A few individuals on the margins are/were out for trouble but no more.
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I heard an interview from the ex head of the prison governors association yesterday. He was talking about not lumping everybody who is concerned about immigration, two tier policing and so on with those lobbing bricks.
The interviewer tried to goad him into saying he was justifying the riots but he was having none of it.
All in all it was an interesting interview I'll have to try and find a link.
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>> youtu.be/9WOZf5TIkCA?si=sGSC72piFtnC2uAR
>>
>> This was the interview.
Thank you. I've heard him before on current affairs shows and he talks a lot of sense.
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>>those protests are overwhelmingly peaceful
That was the point I was trying to make.
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Sorry Zippy, I meant I agreed with you.
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I think that's one of the issues is that that is highly disputed. The term two tier policing seems to be a fairly mainstream talking point.
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I'm not sure I've seen so many protests & riots across so many cities in such a short space of time.
Seems a hotel in Rotherham has been set on fire.
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>> I'm not sure I've seen so many protests & riots across so many cities in
>> such a short space of time.
1981 'red sky at night Toxteth's alight' and 2014 following the death of Mark Duggan are the years I remember.
Nothing I'm aware of round here or the other big towns in the county that I've heard of. Glad I didn't choose last Friday in Northampton for my leaving drink from local CA though; chucking out time on a Friday night is a flashpoint at the best of times.
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1981 'red sky at night Toxteth's alight' and 2014 following the death of Mark Duggan
>> are the years I remember.
>>
>>
Were they as widespread though? I think it's spread to 30 towns now.
Last edited by: sooty123 on Sun 4 Aug 24 at 15:15
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>> Were they as widespread though? I think it's spread to 30 towns now.
81 was pretty fraught with parts of London, Manchester and certainly Liverpool, Mrs B was just finishing Uni there in 81. Leeds too - Chapeltown etc? Remember work colleagues being concerned about me meeting a friend who lived just off the Holloway Rd after work in broad daylight.
But 30 towns, whhoof, I'd not been counting but I'd be surprised if that number have had actual serious disturbances rather than just people from opposing sides shouting the odds.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 4 Aug 24 at 15:20
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Yes i think 30 is the total of protest locations. But there's been at least 10 towns where people have been arrested, I've not counted but I'd put serious disorder at maybe 6-8 towns from scrolling news.
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>> I've not counted but I'd put serious disorder
>> at maybe 6-8 towns from scrolling news.
That's about my count too.
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The police must be really stretched now with similar riots in the same region.
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>> The police must be really stretched now with similar riots in the same region.
They have a process. Notice how few get scooped up and arrested at the time it happens? Takes too much manpower to haul someone off on the scene. They get identified (prior intel works here) evidence is collated "hot" (body cams, street cameras, drones etc) and they are swept up later. On scene at the time the police simply bottle it up and contain it.
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Yes I aware of that process. Nevertheless it can be difficult to call on the same pool of officers when it's happening in the region at very similar times.
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>> The police must be really stretched now with similar riots in the same region.
>>
...well, not if more of them are like Doncaster, where apparently only one Right-Wing protester turned up, and then went home "unrequited"....
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>> Yes i think 30 is the total of protest locations. But there's been at least
>> 10 towns where people have been arrested, I've not counted but I'd put serious disorder
>> at maybe 6-8 towns from scrolling news.
Stephen Yaxley-Lennon (who pretends to be called Tommy Robinson and who has fled the country) published 21 locations in advance on his twitter feed
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 4 Aug 24 at 21:07
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>> I think that's one of the issues is that that is highly disputed. The term
That's right I think. It needs fact checking as to whether some groups whether by ethnicity, class or where they live are getting an easy or hard time from the Police.
It doesn't help when we have politicians like Farage and Braverman fuelling the fire.
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Two tier policing? Doubtful. Cracking down hardest on what is perceived to be the biggest threat/risk, based on intelegence? Likely. Can be seen the wrong way.
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We need PC Rain to arrive, the most effective riot copper on the force.
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Just watched this evenings news.
Rioters set fire to a migrant hotel - with people in side - sick and evil comes to mind.
Should be charged with arson - that's a life sentence.
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>> We need PC Rain to arrive, the most effective riot copper on the force.
Whatever happened to the water cannon Boris ordered?
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>> Whatever happened to the water cannon Boris ordered?
He jumped the gun ordering them as their use required the consent of the Home Secretary which was not forthcoming.
Whether water cannon are effective to deal safely with rioters unless all you want is to get people very wet is another question.
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PC Rain has always been the best deterrent.
We've had copycat public order issues before. Good weather being the common denominator.
We've had the great unwashed ironically attacking a Lush store in Hull. :)
tinyurl.com/4yyas828 (Youtube link)
Watching the video it would seem that the offenders couldn't even spell 'immigrant'. What is amazing is that mostly they seem either so thick or unfearful of consequences that they make no attempt to hide their faces. The guy in the orange Puffa jacket is always in the immediate area.
So how do you get from protests outside a migrant hotel to attempt burglary? Is it orchestrated with someone in the vicinity playing Pied Piper?
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>>So how do you get from protests outside a migrant hotel to attempt burglary? Is it orchestrated with someone >>in the vicinity playing Pied Piper?
I've a young grandson who's a vociferous supporter of a certain football team. He spends most of his days reading social media and believes all of it. He's not exactly academic. I can see how the mob are easily lead.
On the other hand, can those in power not see what's going on, with our PM boning off on holiday? Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that are invading us now. I'm not in favour of violence and have no intention of demonstrating, but can understand why others are.
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Where are the battalions invading us?
If Starmer was ever going on his holidays this week then according to his spokesman he's not now.
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Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that are invading us now.
Really? That would be your solution?
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>>Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that are invading us
>>now.
You do realise that there are woman and children on these boats?
>>I'm not in favour of violence
Then why write that previous sentence?
Last edited by: zippy on Mon 5 Aug 24 at 10:17
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>> You do realise that there are woman and children on these boats?
Its a pity the male members of the illegal economic migrants dont take that into consideration when they make the risky journey.
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>>
>> >> You do realise that there are woman and children on these boats?
>>
>> Its a pity the male members of the illegal economic migrants dont take that into
>> consideration when they make the risky journey.
>>
Totally misses the point that Bathtub Tom has roundabout advocated the killing of unarmed civilians - illegal immigrants or not.
"Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that are invading us now."
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>> "Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that are
>> invading us now."
Trouble is we've had years of politicians telling us about this invasion as though Dungeness is being stormed D-Day style.
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>> "Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that
>> are
>> >> invading us now."
>>
>> Trouble is we've had years of politicians telling us about this invasion as though Dungeness
>> is being stormed D-Day style.
>>
And seemingly forgot that what we did as a country for several hundred years.
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I'm more disturbed by "the battalions that are now invading us" TBH.
By endlessly using words like invasion, the fascists have normalised such language and made refugees a legitimate target.
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>> I'm more disturbed by "the battalions that are now invading us" TBH.
>>
>> By endlessly using words like invasion, the fascists have normalised such language and made refugees
>> a legitimate target.
>>
I am more disgusted rather than disturbed by the number of forum members who think the suggestion of blasting unarmed civilians out of the water deserves praise!!!
Ironic really, as the original title of the thread was “what the fk is wrong with people”
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I wasn't taking the idea of drowning people seriously.
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That's none Zippy. Not that I can see anyway.
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Methinks you're reading more into BT's post than he actually meant and owe him an apology.
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I humbly disagree.
If you state " Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the water the battalions that are invading us now."
You are implying that they are as dangerous as the Nazis and deserve the same treatment.
The following has no meaning "I'm not in favour of violence and have no intention of demonstrating"
Especially when followed by "but can understand why others are."
Effectively giving some support to the rioters.
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How many are refugees entitled to asylum?
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>> How many are refugees entitled to asylum?
Terminology check.
If you're entitled to asylum then you are recognised as a Refugee; a person with a well-founded fear of persecution for reasons of race, religion, nationality, political opinion or membership in a particular social group.
Once you arrive in the UK and claim to meet those criteria you're an Asylum seeker. If successful you'll be granted Refugee status for, say, five years.
Last time I looked something like 60% of Asylum seekers had their claims accepted.
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I didn't give you the frownie bt!
It's disgusting that austerity directed at the people with the least, and at essential public services, has left so many people struggling with just living.
But I cannot see that immigration is the materially the source of these problems. Immigrants in general contribute to the economy.
It's heartbreaking that 15 years after huge progress had been made on reducing poverty, and practically eradicating homelessness and NHS waiting lists, that so many people are now struggling to pay bills and using food banks.
I understand why there is genuine frustration. Nearly everything has been left broken by ideological spending cuts to oblige the oligarchs who funded the Tories and leave them free to add to their billions without the inconvenience of paying tax at anything like the rates paid by ordinary folk. This is an observation, not a conspiracy theory.
But blaming brown people and Muslims is a con. Most immigration is legal, most of our Muslim citizens are now second and third generation. Johnson himself trebled it with his points system designed to filter in the people we need! We will undoubtedly need more immigration if we are to cut NHS waiting times and make a dent in social care.
All those people are in hotels at vast expense because the Cons, for reasons that elude me, declined to process them. Over 100,000 at one point! Around 60,000 when the new government came in. Labour will process them and some, most probably, will stay. What else could we do? The pretence that any meaningful number of them would be sent to Africa was criminal deception.
That basically decent people now blame migrants for all ills is due basically to sustained racist propaganda by the Daily Mail, Telegraph, Express, Sun, Alisin Pearson, JHB, Andrew Tate, Nigel Farage, Isabel Oakeshott, GB News, Lee Anderson, Yaxley Lennon, Braverman, the ERG/Brexit movement, there's a whole industry devoted to it which has gathered many useful idiots along the way.
Maybe the Cons started all the Rwanda/Stop the Boats stuff cynically to distract from their other failings but they dramatically over-succeeded and it's got out of hand. No good will ever come of setting one part of the population against another. What we have now, this weekend, is turbocharged, orchestrated racism.
The far right 'sub contractors' who turn up at every riot want a version of the England of 70 years ago that never existed. They are morons.
Moderate people who think the 'protests' somehow have a legitimate cause should find another way to protest. In reality, people don't fall neatly into right, left and centre. Moderate people will usually find that some right wing ideas have appeal for them. Fair enough. But please don't let's fall for the propaganda and accidentally find ourselves supporting people who aim is not solutions, but the conflict itself.
Last edited by: Manatee on Mon 5 Aug 24 at 11:16
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If austerity is the reason behind the protests I suppose we should blame Reeves for providing the spark that ignited all this trouble and the rioting pensioners.
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Eighty years ago we would have blasted out of the
>> water the battalions that are invading us now.
Eighty years ago we were very adept at landing large numbers of people on French beaches. Build some landing craft, round up the rubber boats at sea and drop the travellers on remote French beaches. Give each person 50 Euros and wave them goodbye and good luck !
Tell the French " They came from you..now have them back " !
Ted
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I am not convinced that analysing cause and effect of racism, rioting and immigration on a rational basis from a comfortable middle class perspective is going to find a solution.
The rational and decent view may be that:
- illegal immigration which may result in a grant of asylum is relatively trivial in number
- legal immigration provides critical skills in short supply to the benefit of the whole community
- basic human decency should prevail irrespective of race, colour, ethnicity etc
I can buy into this. I am fortunate in living on the edge of the Cotswolds, 12 miles from Bristol, with a comfortable income. I have no problem with immigration, save that is unsustainable - we cannot forever rely upon imported labour.
Yet some parts of Bristol are best described as urban grot - poor quality housing, drugs, relative poverty, poor infrastructure, low wages, etc. Real poverty and deprivation is obvious.
Many rioting may not be the cream of the intellectual crop. Their lives are difficult, and they want someone to blame. The high level of immigration and the relative ease with which many can be visually identified makes them a target.
Immigration over the last 30 years has put real pressure on housing, healthcare, schools - it is no surprise that some, when seeing immigrants apparently (or actually) taking priority over locals, become a target for their frustrations.
Possible solutions which may need to be deployed in concert:
- more extreme police action - water cannon, rubber bullets, - make violent protest "painful"
- limit immigration - the benefits measured against the social stress may not be justified
- positive budgetary help for those areas where immigration population growth is highest
- training opportunities for UK nationals - work should pay, limit dependency culture
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I never realised a library was burned down during the riots. Perhaps it sums up the intelligence of the rioters, "we don't need libraries".
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>> I never realised a library was burned down during the riots. Perhaps it sums up
>> the intelligence of the rioters, "we don't need libraries".
>>
There seems to be a backlash against "intellectuals". Look at the "Flat Earth" believers, anti vaxers, climate change deniers etc.
Tends not to have good outcomes.
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>> Tends not to have good outcomes.
tho they do get jobs in trumps cabinet.
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www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0mnnje4wlro
Seems its kicking off in all manner of places.
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Crazy...
One thing I never get is why, if you are going to be a criminal anyway, and likely to get busted, don't you just go for broke and steal a large amount of cash or jewellery or something else with value that's difficult to trace to give yourself better opportunities. Why risk your liberty mugging an old lady for her pension, or for the "joy" of smashing up an office, just for your pet cause.? I suppose I've never felt strongly enough about something to understand. Thankfully!
Last edited by: smokie on Wed 7 Aug 24 at 09:47
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"Why risk your liberty mugging an old lady for her pension, or for the "joy" of smashing up an office, just for your pet cause.?"
I'm not convinced that the rioters are driven by deeply-held convictions. Many, perhaps most, see the riots as an opportunity to express the sort of nastiness quite ordinary people unleash against each other on the internet, particularly on social media.
The chance of a brawl with the police is obviously too great a temptation to resist, and a bit of casual vandalism against innocent people's property, or a bit of opportunistic looting, are all fair game to these people.
At the heart of it all is the social media that so dominates and distorts people's minds, with its false information, its raw hatred and the stupidity of its consumers, who have lost any critical abilities or moral compass they may once have had.
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>> One thing I never get is why, if you are going to be a criminal
>> anyway, and likely to get busted, don't you just go for broke and steal a
>> large amount of cash or jewellery or something else with value that's difficult to trace
>> to give yourself better opportunities.
Where mob violence is involved, criminal pickings are small and opportunistic, because it wasn't planned as such.
>> Why risk your liberty mugging an old lady for her
>> pension, or for the "joy" of smashing up an office, just for your pet cause.?
The pet cause is unimportant for most of them, there is no plan or goal. Mob violence is unique fast moving and dynamic. Ideas, targets, opportunities rapidly develop, stuff takes on a life of its own. Anyone who has run with a football firm of the 70's or 80's will know and recognise this, and there is a safety of the crowd wont get caught attitude. In the 70's 80s this was true, now with modern surveillance that is not the case. As they will find out.
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"The Bunker" podcast out earlier today interviewed somebody on the psychology of riots - the model discussed uses 3 main types. Interesting actually - the point was well made that most of us give up trying to explain it at "mindless violence".
pod.link/1496246490
I'm hopeful that when realisation dawns that it really could end in loss of liberty, job, and a clean sheet, most of the potential rioters will stay at home.
The best moment so far was the video of one angry rioter, after taking an earlier one on the head, catching a half brick from his own side in the wedding vegetables. "Another brick in the b....."
metro.co.uk/2024/08/01/rioter-bricked-privates-revealed-party-animal-dad-of-two-21342214/
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Good to see some robust positive policing of these hooligans.
The moment of realisation that he'd just f***** up :)
metro.co.uk/video/man-holding-object-like-javelin-rotherham-riot-gets-taken-police-dogs-3247135/?ito=vjs-link
Last edited by: Fullchat on Wed 7 Aug 24 at 16:53
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Sky news reporting that they'll be 100 protests/events planned for tonight. Covers 41 of the 43 forces in E&W. Usual caveats appeal.
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"Sky news reporting that they'll be 100 protests/events planned for tonight."
I rather think there won't be much be much happening at all.
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>> Good to see some robust positive policing of these hooligans.
>>
>> The moment of realisation that he'd just f***** up :)
>>
>> metro.co.uk/video/man-holding-object-like-javelin-rotherham-riot-gets-taken-police-dogs-3247135/?ito=vjs-link
Its the second following clip thats really funny!!!!
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 7 Aug 24 at 21:32
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>>Its the second following clip thats really funny!!!!
Another brick in balls??
That'll be around for years!!
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Wed 7 Aug 24 at 21:44
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So he raised money for his legal defence and then pled guilty??
Why are there so many stupid gullible racists in our country??
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>> :-)
Agree with the sentiment. Especially as he wound the horde up then skipped the country.
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"Why are there so many stupid gullible racists in our country??"
It's not just in our country Being racist or more correctly disliking, being wary of or fearing outsiders or those not in your tribe is unfortunately the default view of humans. That position served humans well for millions of year. Only a thin veneer of civilisation and education prevents it prevailing today. Remove that veneer and racism rears its ugly head.
Last edited by: CGNorwich on Mon 28 Oct 24 at 17:11
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A very distasteful thuggish individual with a mouth on him. Appeals to a certain section of society who will see him as a martyr to the cause.
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He has pleaded not guilty.
He allegedly raped one of the victims before killing her.
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>> He has pleaded not guilty.
>>
>> He allegedly raped one of the victims before killing her.
The Jury will decide....
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>> >> He has pleaded not guilty.
>> >>
>> >> He allegedly raped one of the victims before killing her.
>>
>> The Jury will decide....
>>
Whole life order! Good!
I feel for the three victims' husband / father and surviving sister.
Last edited by: zippy on Tue 11 Mar 25 at 15:05
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It revives that old debate about reintroducing the death penalty. That was a planned cold and calculated attack.
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>> It revives that old debate about reintroducing the death penalty. That was a planned cold
>> and calculated attack.
I think the debate was laid to rest after the last attempt in 1979*.
It has no place in a civilised country.
EDIT: Some sources suggest it was voted on in each Parliament until the late nineties.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 11 Mar 25 at 16:59
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There have been so many miscarriages of justice that the death-penalty could never be considered safe. The Birmingham
Some countries have the death penalty for rape.
Imagine being Andrew Malkinson who served, I think 17 years for a crime he did not commit. If there was the death penalty it would be too late.
The Birmingham 6 also spring to mind as does Timothy Evans.
I would support it only if those that contributed to what was later found to be a miscarriage of justice were also executed, from police, barristers, forensic experts and judges.
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I agree it's not civilised and tragically error prone.
OTOH if the victim was your loved one there would probably be times when you'd be ready to pull the trigger yourself. I'm pretty sure I'd feel that way.
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>>
>>
>> OTOH if the victim was your loved one there would probably be times when you'd
>> be ready to pull the trigger yourself. I'm pretty sure I'd feel that way.
>>
So would I, and when I had my car nicked years ago I'd have been more that happy to have seen whoever nicked it to be rammed off the road by the police and and buried against a tree.
Which is why justice needs to be blind and not influenced by revenge.
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In his autobiography, Sir Joseph Simpson, who carried out the autopsies on Mrs Evans and the baby Geraldine, was adamant that Evans had killed his wife but not the baby. The police knew this but only charged him with the murder of Geraldine as there could be no defence brought forward of self defence or some sort of 'crime of passion'. They could not believe that there were two murderers in the same house !
The MO for Mrs Evans killing was not Christies. Her murder was allowed to lie on file and Evans went to the gallows for killing the baby, which he vigorously denied to the end.
Evans fled to South Wales leaving the baby in the care of the Christies. Of course Christie didn't want her and killed her and his wife plus many others.
Evans was topped in due course, but for the wrong murder.
The book is a good read as is the one by Sir Bentley Purchase, the West London Coroner at the time.
Ted
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Sir Bentley Purchase
Didn't he have something to do with the body in Operation MIncemeat??
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>> Didn't he have something to do with the body in Operation MIncemeat??
He was responsible, as coroner, for providing a corpse that had the characteristics needed ie the appearance of having drowned.
I was watching the film, the recent one, on Netflix in the last couple of days.
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I recently read the book on holiday and then saw the film on return. A couple of differences in the film to the book but they aligned fairly well. Ben McIntyre is a very well informed author.
Who could forget a name like Bentley Purchase? :)
Last edited by: Fullchat on Wed 12 Mar 25 at 17:24
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I read the original book by Ewan Montagu, possibly in an abridged version, as a child and remember the post war film which I think was black and white.
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Saw both the original and re-make recently.
I enjoyed them both and don't know which is more accurate, but I think I enjoyed the original film better, especially the touch at the end when Clifton Webb's character Lt. Cmdr. Ewen Montagu visited the grave of the dead man.
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>> >
>>
>> I think the debate was laid to rest after the last attempt in 1979*.
>>
>> It has no place in a civilised country.
>>
>>
Agreed.
A society's worth is determined not by how it treats it's best citizens, but by how it treats it's worst.
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What the fk is wrong with people? - CGNorwich
