Non-motoring > National Security Act 2023 Legal Questions
Thread Author: zippy Replies: 17
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 00:23 
 National Security Act 2023 - zippy
A law meant to prosecute spies, foreign powers interfering with the UK etc. has criminalised looking at or even photographing certain buildings...

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2023/32/section/5/enacted

The key part is inspects and it's only partly defined to include photography.

So go to Portsmouth, take photos of the the Aircraft carriers and it's 6 months clink.

Same if you're hiking past Fylingdales and pause to have a look - potentially inspecting - that's 6 months!

Don't think this won't be abused. Remember S44 of the Terrorism Act had to be repealed 'cause the police were searching pretty much anyone they saw taking a photo of a building.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 08:31 
 National Security Act 2023 - CGNorwich
Paranoia reigns.

It doesn’t say that at all.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 08:47 
 National Security Act 2023 - zippy
It does. Read section 5.3:

3)In subsection (1)(a) a reference to inspecting a prohibited place includes taking, or procuring the taking of, photographs, videos or other recordings of the prohibited place.

The police have already detained people under the act.

And S8 includes vehicles.
Last edited by: zippy on Tue 26 Mar 24 at 08:49
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 08:59 
 National Security Act 2023 - CGNorwich
You are over interpreting the meaning of inspect.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 09:11 
 National Security Act 2023 - smokie
if a place is "prohibited" and you do whatever it is that is prohibited at that place surely some sanction is appropriate?

Mind you, I don't know how "they" (= those who are out to get you") decide what is prohibited and how "they" let you know.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 09:20 
 National Security Act 2023 - CGNorwich
It’s defined in the act

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/65ba6951c75d300012ca0ff3/ISN_2024-01_National_Security_Act_2023-O.pdf
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 09:25 
 National Security Act 2023 - bathtub tom
Many years ago there was a motorcycle made for our armed forces. They were eventually sold to the public as surplus. It was impossible to obtain a workshop manual as the details were secret!
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 16:23 
 National Security Act 2023 - zippy
>> if a place is "prohibited" and you do whatever it is that is prohibited at
>> that place surely some sanction is appropriate?
>>

No doubt sanctions are appropriate for very secret places but you wait, people will be arrested for photographing the MI6 building on the Thames that's been seen by countless millions who have watched a James Bond film or photographing gate guardians - they're deliberately on show.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 17:06 
 National Security Act 2023 - CGNorwich
Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t out to get you. :-)
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 19:35 
 National Security Act 2023 - Zero

>> No doubt sanctions are appropriate for very secret places but you wait, people will be
>> arrested for photographing the MI6 building on the Thames that's been seen by countless millions
>> who have watched a James Bond film or photographing gate guardians - they're deliberately on
>> show.

No they wont.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 20:53 
 National Security Act 2023 - Bromptonaut
>> No they wont.

Wish I was that certain.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 21:02 
 National Security Act 2023 - Zero
>> >> No they wont.
>>
>> Wish I was that certain.

The easiest way to kick a law off the statute book, is to arrest 3k people a day.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 21:20 
 National Security Act 2023 - Terry
I have little issue with the proposition that confidentiality is a key element in maintaining an effective defence capability - whether against conventional attack or terrorism.

But I do doubt that the new laws will make the slightest difference to intelligence gathering by those who wish the UK harm.

Without secure defensive rings around all sensitive assets, continual vetting of staff and intrusive control of data and comms denial of access or inspection is al but impossible. Increasingly control would need to extend to drone and satellite imagery.

I don't see it as a threat to civil liberties - more an ineffectual effort to create the illusion of tough control.







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New Tue 26 Mar 24 23:14 
 National Security Act 2023 - Fullchat
Maybe a response to those half wits with cameras who go around provoking reactions from various establishments. There MO being masked up and hanging around long enough and making out they photographing to create a response. Having then created a response they then refuse to engage and alleviate any concerns. All for confrontation and Youtube clicks.
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New Tue 26 Mar 24 23:47 
 National Security Act 2023 - zippy
>> Maybe a response to those half wits with cameras who go around provoking reactions from
>> various establishments...

If we are concern about these numpties then we really do have problems.

Best practice is to ignore them. Engaging is what causes the escalation. BTW, I've seen the bank accounts of one of these clowns, because he owns a business. Social media pays a fortune!
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New Wed 27 Mar 24 00:12 
 National Security Act 2023 - Kevin
>Social media pays a fortune!

I've had a page on FansOnly for months and made sod all, not a cent. Even bought new shreddies!
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New Wed 27 Mar 24 00:18 
 National Security Act 2023 - Fullchat
"If we are concern about these numpties then we really do have problems"

Agreed. But how do you engage with them to eliminate them as any form of threat or criminal intent? It is the engagement that becomes the hook for their behaviour. Totally ignoring them is not really an option unless of course they can be identified through prior knowledge.
Last edited by: Fullchat on Wed 27 Mar 24 at 00:20
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New Wed 27 Mar 24 09:52 
 National Security Act 2023 - sooty123
Agreed. But how do you engage with them to eliminate them as any form of
>> threat or criminal intent? It is the engagement that becomes the hook for their behaviour.
>> Totally ignoring them is not really an option unless of course they can be identified
>> through prior knowledge.
>>

Of course these auditors only see what they want people to see, but I'd say there's a fine line between ignoring them and getting bogged down trying to convince them to stop something that's not illegal. It might be weird annoying but they are free to do the vast majority of this 'security audits'.
Spending quite some time in conversation with them just makes the police look stupid quite often anyway.
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