I had an enjoyable but ultimately rather sad evening at the end of last week.
Almost 45 years ago, when I returned to Nottingham after some year's absence down South, I joined a mountaineering club with the joint purposes of pursuing my preferred pastime, and (re-)kindling a social life.
For some 8 or 9 years I was a very active member (ultimately joined by SWMBO who also shared the same interests), with nearly every other weekend throughout the year away somewhere in the UK.
I made some very good friends, a fair few of them lifetime ones, though the people I knew then are rather geographically dispersed now.
Ultimately, I moved out of Nottingham, had a family, and we became less active participants in the mid/late 80's, though continuing to meet up individually with friends for outings and occasions.
The club itself was founded in October '53 and, with now dwindling membership, the decision was made to wind things up on the 70th Anniversary. (Though people were still meeting for weekend walks and a weekly pint - and this will continue - the advantages of running a formal club were no longer relevant. Affiliated to the BMC, a good selection of Club "Huts" were bookable for winter weekends, and in my day it was not unusual to have parties of 30 or more making the trip to the Lakes or elsewhere for winter sessions. As of late, very few people have been interested in such and it's become logistically and financially non-viable. Browsing the web, ageing memberships with the lack of attracting younger members appears to be a pretty common theme, with a number of Clubs that owned huts I've used having been wound up over the last few years).
So, the Club was "liquidated" last month, with remaining funds being donated to a variety of deserving outdoor-related organisations.
....and, last week we had a "wake" in Nottingham. Attendees were from every generation of the Club, with those from mine being (slightly disappointingly) somewhat sparse. It has to be acknowledged that at least 4 good friends have "departed" this last 3 years, 2 of whom I was debarred from seeing on their way by Covid restrictions. That said, I made the re-acquaintance with a number of friends that I haven't seen from nigh-on 40 years (and slipped immediately back into the same, long-lasting friendships).
I was encouraged that, though I'm somewhat greyer and "chunkier" (I'll have you know I almost had a six-pack back in the day!) I was immediately recognised. On the other hand, I met a friend from Birmingham for a pub meal beforehand, and when we eventually made the meeting, another friend had to ask me in a quiet moment who he was! Given that I'd seen her (unexpectedly) two days before and confirmed he was coming with me, it was rather revealing. (much less hair, many more pounds). We were all very close years ago, and he'd even pranged her car after taking over driving on a snowy drive to Wales!
So, a mix of happy memories and sad thoughts about the demise - In my time, the club was like an extended family.
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About 40 years ago I played competitive 5 a side , twice a week, with a nucleus of 12/15 friends. This continued for 15 years until I moved out of area and 6 pm starts we’re no longer possible.
I gradually lost touch, then 6 years ago I took my old mum out for Christmas lunch in my local pub and recognised the guys.
They’d recently retired, amazingly 3 of them still played 5 a side, and they had formed a weekly walking group. I joined the group and it continues to this day.
Three of the old 5 a siders moved back to their roots in the NE, and we now meet every 4 months in York for beer. Sadly two of our number are preoccupied pushing up daisies, and two others can no longer manage a pub crawl due to medical conditions and infirmity.
On my first attendance in York I simply did not recognise a few of them...age waits for no man.
I regularly walk past the spot, only two miles from chez LL where we scattered one of our numbers ashes out of his favourite whisky bottle. I always have a brief chat with him.
A bit sobering. Unlike afternoons in York.
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My last cycling club folded in 2007, in what was it's centenary year. It was very sad but failure to attract new members - and a lack of effort to try and do so - left an ever dwindling membership, many of who were too old to even ride any more.
A far cry from it's hey day when the annual dinner and dance attracted around 250 attendants.
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Funny how the world we knew as young adults moves on both practically and socially. The advent of Social Media, in its widest sense, has been a transformation.
I met Mrs B F2F through the YHA's Harrow and Wembley local group in 1983.
SFAIK it's still going albeit with a less overt YHA flavour.
Will post a bit more tommoz when I've marshalled my thoughts/memories.
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...whilst I met the current Mrs nE elsewhere, at least four of the couples present at the above wake met via the mountaineering club, and a good few more who weren't attendees.
(Not for no reason were the contemporaneous CHA and HF known as "Chasing Husbands Association", and "Husbands Found" respectively. ;-) )
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YHA - Your Husband Assured.
My parents met through CHA.
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>> YHA - Your Husband Assured.
>>
>> My parents met through CHA.
>>
I figured out YHA, but CHA, Children's home association? No real idea on HF.
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>> I figured out YHA, but CHA, Children's home association? No real idea on HF.
>>
Countrywide Holidays Association, they used to say grace at meals until 1964 - apparently.
HF Holidays was Holiday Fellowship a walking holiday organisation, still going, have 16? country house hotels around the UK. I used to lead for them.
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> Countrywide Holidays Association, they used to say grace at meals until 1964 - apparently.
>>
>> HF Holidays was Holiday Fellowship a walking holiday organisation, still going, have 16? country house
>> hotels around the UK. I used to lead for them.
>>
Thanks, so these groups offered some sort of subsidised holiday club type of arrangement?
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>> HF Holidays was Holiday Fellowship a walking holiday organisation, still going, have 16? country house
>> hotels around the UK. I used to lead for them.
>>
Missed the edit.
Why do we have such a short edit time? What's the point?
Anyroad
HF Holidays
www.hfholidays.co.uk/
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> Anyroad
>>
>> HF Holidays
>>
>> www.hfholidays.co.uk/
>>
Seems like a slightly odd set up, like a time share/travel agent, but everyday is a school day as they say.
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>> >> I figured out YHA, but CHA, Children's home association? No real idea on HF.
>>
>> >>
>>
>> Countrywide Holidays Association, they used to say grace at meals until 1964 - apparently.
Originally the Co-Operative Holidays Association.
Loads of history here:
douglashope.co.uk/research/
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I am sure that I have bemoaned the demise of membership organisations on here before now - haven't I?
My rugby club in West London has gone from six 15s to one. Other clubs are in the same boat. Local club Esher RFC have gone from 14 or 15 teams to around 3.
Younger people just do not seem to want to join clubs. I have no idea why.
Have you?
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I was a Round Tabler from about age 27 to 40, when you were obliged to leave. I had a few extra years by way of honorary presidency and an extension to the age rule but the club on its own would by now have well and truly folded but I believe they merged with another, which itself is in seeming slow death. Coincidentally I was having a chat with a mate earlier (who is a Lion) and I reckoned I left Round Table in the mid 90s.
So I think the antipathy towards club membership has been going on for many years. I suppose there is a massive amount more stuff where you can choose to spend your leisure time, and the cost (and maybe elitism/single sex) of some of the old fashioned clubs is probably also a deterrent.
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Have you?
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Two working parents, longer commutes, more choice of where to spend leisure time, more after school clubs. Probably more reasons as well.
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My LDWA regional group merged with another several years ago due to lack of members.
We’re still operating now as Lakeland group, with a busy walks calendar, monthly social walks, run two annual flagship events with 360 participants, long weekends away and complete 80/100 mile trails spread over 4 single non consecutive days.
Our AGM was Saturday gone. 10 mile morning walk, lunch, AGM then guest speaker...Victoria Morris who completed a 3500 mile LEJOG walk ( in reverse) including every historic county top, with the vast majority of nights under canvas.
Unfortunately no one volunteered to join our committee, which is a problem as all 4 of us would like to be replaced at some point, and therein lies the nub.
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Well, based on this lot of exciting examples, bring on old age memory loss I say.
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>> Well, based on this lot of exciting examples, bring on old age memory loss I
>> say.
I fear this thread will rumble on a lot longer. Ailments and medications are yet to raise their head.
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>>Well, based on this lot of exciting examples, bring on old age memory loss I say.
...yeah, I think all the "absentees" at our reunion were out trainspotting...
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>> >>Well, based on this lot of exciting examples, bring on old age memory loss I
>> say.
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>> ...yeah, I think all the "absentees" at our reunion were out trainspotting... making a few quid on the side.
>>
There, fixed that for you, no charge this time.
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>> Have you?
>> >>
>>
>> Two working parents, longer commutes, more choice of where to spend leisure time, more after
>> school clubs. Probably more reasons as well.
We have the same problem here with the ever dwindling band of mostly pensioners who keep the village show going, along with other events such as fireworks, year round.
The clear up morning after the fireworks looked like a Dad's Army exercise. Practically everybody had a limp or a bad back after the exertions of setting up tables, gazebos, barbecue etc. the day before. I had twisted a knee while lighting fireworks and to avoid excessive walking about set myself up cleaning down muddy tables before putting them away.
Most of us still involved started 20 to 30 years ago when we were in our late 30s or 40s. We have tried to recruit for years with little success. More recently, even getting people to events such as a fundraising quiz has become difficult. People would rather watch Strictly on a Saturday night. We stopped doing the annual panto during Covid and now we can't find enough people to produce and stage it.
Setting up the show is now a real struggle. I just can't lift and carry stuff like I used to and I'm not the only one.
We do have a few younger friends who will help for a few hours for which we are very grateful, but people generally don't feel able to commit and take on the organisation in the way they used to.
I can understand why younger energetic people aren't attracted to joining what must look like a bunch of grey headed old crocks. The backbone 30 years ago included several women, including my wife, who did not have full time or perhaps any job and were keen to get involved in things like pantomime costumes and scenery, or repainting the village hall. Now the younger folk are all working.
It's possible that if we were all to step down at once, it would galvanize people to step in, more likely I think that the village hall would soon close, the rec would be sold off for housing and that the village would become a simple dormitory. Otherwise I suspect it will just take a bit longer, as we fall by the wayside. I'm not sure I have another annual show in me.
Let's not do the ailments!
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>> We have the same problem here with the ever dwindling band of mostly pensioners who
>> keep the village show going
>> The clear up morning after the fireworks looked like a Dad's Army exercise.
When I was volunteering at a local motor museum with similar aged folk, SWMBO remarked it must have been like an episode from Dad's Army.
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>> When I was volunteering at a local motor museum with similar aged folk, SWMBO remarked
>> it must have been like an episode from Dad's Army.
I joined the Shuttleworth Veteran Aeroplane Society* a while back, the volunteers in their admin office must average about 80. Good on them of course, and I have no doubt that doing stuff keeps us going longer.
*One of our favourite coffee/breakfast stops. SVAS members get discount in the shop and cafe, and a bit off air show tickets. I shouldn't think I make a profit on it but I like to support them.
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>> I joined the Shuttleworth Veteran Aeroplane Society* a while back
Chap who lives further up the village from me used to be, maybe still is. I knew from the stickers on his car and the aerials on his roof that he was, like me, a plane person. However it was on one of my visits to Farnborough air show in the nineties that I spotted his car - distinctive cherished plate - on the flight line where some of Old Warden's finest were being shown.
The car was being used as a tug for moving aircraft on the ground.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Mon 27 Nov 23 at 16:57
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I think there have been two working parents for at least a generation more than the current one.
I commuted an hour plus each way before I became home based in 2000. Many more are wfh these days so I 'm not sure about that one either.
My feeling, seeing the pubs round here mostly only full with older people, is that many younger ones socialise in ways which don't involve actually going out and meeting real people. And that's not said in a curmudgeonly way, it's just how I see it.
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>> I think there have been two working parents for at least a generation more than
>> the current one.
>>
>> I commuted an hour plus each way before I became home based in 2000. Many
>> more are wfh these days so I 'm not sure about that one either.
Possibly, just from what i noticed. Both probably happened in the past but i suspect it's at a high right now that it wasn't in the past.
>> My feeling, seeing the pubs round here mostly only full with older people, is that
>> many younger ones socialise in ways which don't involve actually going out and meeting real
>> people. And that's not said in a curmudgeonly way, it's just how I see it.
>>
There's that as well.
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I once went mountaineering in Nottingham. Not as challenging as Sheffield.
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>> ........Nottingham. Not as challenging as Sheffield.
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...on many fronts..
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That which motivated pensioners in their younger years does not seem to to have passed to younger generations. No great surprise - the world in which we live has changed.
Car ownership massively reduced the perceived need for local community engagement - no longer is your "neighbour" the person 4 doors down the road but 5, 10 or 20 miles away.
Work is no longer local - lengthy car assisted commutes are the norm for many. Centralisation of infrastructure - hospitals, schools, police stations etc reduces interaction.
Support for the local football club, going to the local pub for a beer and chat, walking or catching a bus into town and meeting people happens less and less.
Other fundamentally less sociable activities have grown - internet distractions, online gaming etc
The final nail in the coffin of many of these groups was covid - many did not meet for a year or more - older members being particularly at risk.
Rather sad in my view but rather than bemoaning that lost, we should be embracing and improving things for the future.
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>> The final nail in the coffin of many of these groups was covid - many
>> did not meet for a year or more - older members being particularly at risk.
Covid certainly accelerated any number of changes that had been creeping around before.
Working from home is one.
I wonder whether the weekly fixture of 'club night' which had 40 or 50 of us in a school room for a couple of hours on Thursday would have returned even if Covid had been in the eighties.
When we were on the Western Isles in 2022 we had quite a long chat with lady running a tourist craft shop, incomer but respectful of tradition. She reckoned Covid had done in a year what would have taken ten in reducing the influence of the Free Churches and observation of the Sabbath. Not just tourists taking advantage of sun and blow on a Sunday and hanging their washing out.
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>> The final nail in the coffin of many of these groups was covid - many
>> did not meet for a year or more - older members being particularly at risk.
True. And I know it affected me, I felt less eager to engage with the "outside", as if my horizons had become more closed in. And I have seen it with people I know well.
>> Rather sad in my view but rather than bemoaning that lost, we should be embracing
>> and improving things for the future.
Of course. But how? And frankly it isn't the people who do get out and do stuff who are the problem. We are careful not to try and impose our way of doing things on potential new recruits, "we tried that one and it didn't work" is banned. But there really is no substitute for engaging with people. I've always believed that people are what matter most in life. Money matters only if you run out. Learning is important.
Not to say that one can't 'socialise' online, but the big platforms visibly do not work well for that. Although birds of a feather tend to flock together, FB/Instagram etc select and polarise to an extreme that many now think is at least potentially disastrous for society. A healthy scepticism for authority is distilled into the kind of lunacy we see in the US and increasingly here. There is no real learning in going down a conspiracist rabbit hole.
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Myself and Mrs FC have subscribed to HF holidays. Just a few shares.
Couple of short walking holidays a year. You can go guided or self guided as you wish.
Reasonable hotels. All the guest have one thing in common - a liking of walking. Met, walked with dined with people from many walks of life. Dinner dress is best walking gear and you eat (if you wish) with different people at each meal time.
3 X Guided walks per day dependent on what you consider yourself capable of.
We have done Malham twice, Derwent Water twice and Sedbergh once. Derbeyshire booked for next February.
Some are open for the festive season. Certainly Malham looked stunning when the Christmas decorations went up last year.
One Leader commented with a smile that HF stood for 'husband finder' :)
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Nostalgia aint what it used to be - legacylad
