Non-motoring > Dog and Baby Miscellaneous
Thread Author: Bromptonaut Replies: 71

 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
Our Grandson is now a week old, home and thriving.

Daughter and SiL have a four year old neutered male Show Cocker.

The dog's obviously discombobulated by the hooman pup and prone to settling on the sofa and looking a little sorry for himself. He was initially wary of the noisy mite but baby is now settleing into an eat/sleep routine. Dog has sniffed at the babyand licked it but seems unbothered by it of itself - not the slightest hint of aggression to it.

Previously I'd guess he saw SiL as the pack Alpha and he's defensive of my daughter. In the past he's got growly and snappy with The Lad. He and his sis still play slightly rough with each other but there's no aggression; they're very supportive of each other. My late Mother said they were like fox cubs together in their teens and there's still an element of that now 10+ years later.

When SiL comes into the house the dog's all over him tail wagging and on hind legs greeting andhe gets a bit of fuss. When Sil is attending to his son the dog gets very barky. Stops when baby is handed to D or to me/Mrs B.

What's bothering me is that D seems to ignore the dog.

When we arrived yesterday the dog approached me as he usually does, friendly and wagging his tail. Made to make a fuss of him as normal but D asked me not to 'cos he's had a rag on'. I'm also not to sit by him on the sofa - he was grumbling(?) a bit though I'm not sure it was a warning growl. She's bothered about Mrs B and I being in the house on our own with him tomorrow. I don't think it's a problem Even if he went for me, and I don't think he would, he's small enough that I can kick him out of the back door without risking a limb - not like he's an Alsation or Doberman.

How should he be treated so he comes to terms with the change in the pack?

 Dog and Baby - bathtub tom
KEEP THE DOG AND CHILD SEPARATETD!

>>but D asked me not to 'cos he's had a rag on'>>

The dog's had four years to be top dog and now this young person has appeared to take all that away from it (is it an un-casrtated male?).
 Dog and Baby - Ted

Keep them well apart ! Any dog can seriously damage or kill.a baby. The child has no defence or escape ! Nobody can read a dog's mind !

Ted
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> Nobody can read a dog's mind !
>>

Rubbish, of course you can, they are communicating all the time.

However, what you can't do is determine whats happening from someone else's description, specially when it gets third hand.
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 16 Oct 21 at 23:34
 Dog and Baby - Zero
~ sigh ~
Last edited by: Zero on Sat 16 Oct 21 at 23:34
 Dog and Baby - Manatee
>>is it an un-casrtated male?)

"Neutered".

I know nowt about dogs but I wouldn't trust any, or any cat, with a baby.

D sounds as if she needs a bit of guidance on dog behaviour. As I say I know nowt, but I doubt if the dog will be able to work out why it has been sent to Coventry or know how it is supposed to react.
 Dog and Baby - sooty123
I'm struggling to understand the problem, your post isn't clear. Is the problem with the dog , your daughter or both?
Last edited by: sooty123 on Sun 17 Oct 21 at 08:15
 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
>> I'm struggling to understand the problem, your post isn't clear. Is the problem with the
>> dog , your daughter or both?

For clarity I was asking the panel's view, and perhaps Z's in particular on (a) dogs and babies in general and (b) comment on my own view, albeit from zilch experience of dogs, that ignoring the poor lad wasn't the way forward.
 Dog and Baby - Falkirk Bairn
Our Cairn terrier was 9 when our first granddaughter was born.
the dog showed little interest in the child during visits.

When the son, DiL & baby left we were showered with attention from the dog and likewise we made a fuss of the dog.

Our Cairn was a really well behaved dog but at no time was the child and the dog in a room on their own. When the baby could sit up you could see the "fear in her eyes" when the dog walked past her as she sat on the floor.

Never any incidents and she grew to love the dog especially when she got to take the lead when out for walkies. We lost the dog aged 13, my granddaughter was 4. Apart from photos of the dog & herself she remembers little of the dog.
 Dog and Baby - bathtub tom
It sounds like it's had four years of being spoilt (it's allowed on the furniture). You say it's a show dog, so I presume it's been inbred with all the disadvantages that leads to. Now it's had its nose put out of joint by a new favourite being brought into its territory.

I wouldn't trust it an inch and if it were me, probably re-home it.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> It sounds like it's had four years of being spoilt (it's allowed on the furniture).
>> You say it's a show dog, so I presume it's been inbred with all the
>> disadvantages that leads to. Now it's had its nose put out of joint by a
>> new favourite being brought into its territory.
>>
>> I wouldn't trust it an inch and if it were me, probably re-home it.

What a load of old drivel. Seriously its probably the most misinformed ignorant knee jerk load of crap I have ever seen on here since the demise of Pat.
 Dog and Baby - Ted

>> What a load of old drivel. Seriously its probably the most misinformed ignorant knee jerk
>> load of crap I have ever seen on here since the demise of Pat.


Apart from your own posts, of course !

Ted
 Dog and Baby - Zero
whatever.
 Dog and Baby - Dog
>>You say it's a show dog, so I presume it's been inbred with all the disadvantages that leads to

Indeed. My English Pointer came from show stock, but after having lived with my working/guard breed bred Beauceron for 6 years, he knows his place!!!
 Dog and Baby - sooty123
>> It sounds like it's had four years of being spoilt (it's allowed on the furniture).
>> You say it's a show dog, so I presume it's been inbred with all the
>> disadvantages that leads to. Now it's had its nose put out of joint by a
>> new favourite being brought into its territory.
>>
>> I wouldn't trust it an inch and if it were me, probably re-home it.
>>

I'm wondering if you've had dogs before?
 Dog and Baby - bathtub tom
>>I'm wondering if you've had dogs before?

A few.
 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
>> It sounds like it's had four years of being spoilt (it's allowed on the furniture).
>> You say it's a show dog, so I presume it's been inbred with all the
>> disadvantages that leads to. Now it's had its nose put out of joint by a
>> new favourite being brought into its territory.
>>
>> I wouldn't trust it an inch and if it were me, probably re-home it.

Whole host of incorrect assumptions there.

It's allowed on one piece of furniture which is covered with a blanket where he can sit with the humans. There are strict boundaries on where he can go otherwise.

He's from a reputable breeder. They chose the Show Cocker, which is slightly different to the working variety, because they wanted a mid sized dog and the SiL's family have an older one from the same breeder. He's not a show dog himself.

I'm sure he'll adapt, it's just a question of handling the transition.
 Dog and Baby - Robbie34
There are working and show type Cockers. Nothing to do with being inbred for show purposes. Workers tend to be hyper and show type not quite as hyper.

I have two show type Cockers who are very affectionate and have never shown any form of aggression, but I would not leave them alone with a baby or young child.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
There is absolutely no foundation in the pack mentality theories when you have a dog at home with a family. A dog does not think you are another dog, its just not possible on a species level.

However. If you have more than one dog, you may well end up with a mini pack with all the numerous possibilities that can bring, and its has to be recognised, managed and mitigated appropriately.

Knowing one dog well, I would happily leave a baby alone with it. Knowing two dogs just as well, No chance.
 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
>> There is absolutely no foundation in the pack mentality theories when you have a dog
>> at home with a family. A dog does not think you are another dog, its
>> just not possible on a species level.

I bow to your knowledge but find that quite surprising. They may not think we're dogs but do they practice their own brand of anthropomorphism and apply dog standards to their relationship with us?
 Dog and Baby - Zero

>> I bow to your knowledge but find that quite surprising. They may not think we're
>> dogs but do they practice their own brand of anthropomorphism and apply dog standards to
>> their relationship with us?

No, they are smart enough to realise we are not dogs, so go out of their way to manipulate us in the best way they can. The misconception arises in that they can only communicate in dog body language ways* that are to be seen in pack behaviour so this is jumped on by humans only too delighted to think and need their dogs subservience.

*some breeds have developed newer and different body language to manipulate us.
 Dog and Baby - Manatee
Is "The Lad" your son-in law (assume this is what SiL is) or your son? Who are the two teenagers who still play rough, the dog and one of his siblings, or your son and daughter? Does your son come into this at all?

I'm always a bit slow with descriptions of family relationships. I never know what my wife is on about when she talks about her 3 sisters, their husbands, children, children's boyfriends/girlfriends etc.

 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
>> Is "The Lad" your son-in law (assume this is what SiL is) or your son?
>> Who are the two teenagers who still play rough, the dog and one of his
>> siblings, or your son and daughter? Does your son come into this at all?

The Lad is my son.

Doggo has in the past been snappy with him. We think this is because he and his sis are still prone to a bit of teen type horseplay and the dog sees this as threatening to one of his pack and comes to her defence.

Daughter is worried that becuase he's discombobulated by the baby he might snap at me or otherwise get fierce. My view is that it's highly unlikely and there'd be enough warning from growls, bared teeth and such like that I can beat a retreat.

Prevoiously he was warmly responsive to me making a fuss of him giving tummy tickles etc.
 Dog and Baby - No FM2R
>>Doggo has in the past been snappy with him. We think this is because he and his sis are still prone to a bit of teen type horseplay and the dog sees this as threatening to one of his pack and comes to her defence.

Not sure about this pack stuff, always seems like easy rationalisation to me.

That said I would not have a snappy dog in the house never mind near a baby. I'd seriously consider rehousing. It only has to snap at a baby's face once.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Sun 17 Oct 21 at 11:52
 Dog and Baby - sooty123
Daughter is worried that becuase he's discombobulated by the baby he might snap at me
>> or otherwise get fierce. My view is that it's highly unlikely and there'd be enough
>> warning from growls, bared teeth and such like that I can beat a retreat.
>>
>> Prevoiously he was warmly responsive to me making a fuss of him giving tummy tickles
>> etc.
>>

I think, with respect, it's perhaps your daughter that's modified/changed her behavoir and the dog has picked up on that?
 Dog and Baby - smokie
Yep I'm the same. I had SiL as sister in law until I re-read it.

Some dogs are nice but I have quite a dislike for them after a number of experiences and wouldn't trust them either.

Obviously a properly trained dog may be a different proposition but I'll never forget my mate's two Rottweilers who "wouldn't hurt a fly", that one day absolutely put the fear of God into me by persistently barking at me from close distance because I'd arrived via the back door apparently. He was amused, no apology. He lost a friend that day.

There seems to be an assumption among dog people that everyone should love their dog, despite it slobbering all over you, or barking at you, or coming in for the all-too-personal sniff. I'm afraid I don't, and people should respect that.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> Obviously a properly trained dog may be a different proposition but I'll never forget my
>> mate's two Rottweilers who "wouldn't hurt a fly", that one day absolutely put the fear
>> of God into me by persistently barking at me from close distance because I'd arrived
>> via the back door apparently. He was amused, no apology. He lost a friend that
>> day.

There is much truth in the view that dogs and owners match, specially with "reputation" dogs, like Rotties, Staffies, Dobermans, etc etc. Its a kind of self fulfilling prophecy. pretty sure that on reflection your ex mate had other traits that you were not keen on.

edit, The fact he decided a pair would be good, speaks volumes.
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 17 Oct 21 at 11:59
 Dog and Baby - Zero

>> There seems to be an assumption among dog people that everyone should love their dog,
>> despite it slobbering all over you, or barking at you, or coming in for the
>> all-too-personal sniff. I'm afraid I don't, and people should respect that.

yes most dog owners are guilty as charged.

>absolutely put the fear of God into me

Dogs read that like a book, and it makes them bolder, for some of them its a great game, very fulfilling.

When my dogs are off lead, they read people, scan their faces and read their body language. If they figure a friendly reception, they will greet enthusiastically. When my dog are off lead, I too am constantly scanning and assessing people, dogs or people with dogs ahead. I can then adjust the unfolding scenario and outcome appropriately.
 Dog and Baby - smokie
I previously related here my story of coming across a loose dog when n a walk in Portugal, and being really frightened by it. I'm still not sure what the proper thing to do is, I was going to carry some Bonios but I've gone for the walking stick. It's very much last resort and I just hope the situation never arises again.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
Afraid you project "dog victim" on a canine level Smokie me ole son.
 Dog and Baby - Dog
>> I was going to carry some Bonios but I've gone for the walking stick. It's very much last resort and I just hope the situation never arises again.

Believe me my friend, a stick wouldn't stop a dog *like* my Beauceron. What I would do in a similar situation is keep my hands in my pockets and don't look 'im in the eyes.
 Dog and Baby - smokie
Would it just lose interest and wander off then Dog?

What if it is standing two feet in front of you barking and snarling? Where do I go? Backwards? When I tried that I tripped over a branch and fell, and thought the end was nigh...

Luckily the owners meandered around the corner and, with no acknowledgment of my physical or mental state, accused me of causing the their dog to get over-excited.

So that was a tame dog. In Portugal countryside there are quite a few loose wild dogs. Would hands in pockets and look away work with them?

I related the tale to some other dog owner further down the road who said I should have put the back of my hand in front of the animals gob to let him sniff me and realise I wasn't threatening. Yeah, right, I was about to do that wasn't I!!

I like seeing well trained and obedient dogs but I'd never trust one of them after that.
 Dog and Baby - Bobby
>> said I should have put the back of my hand in front of the animals gob to let him sniff me and realise I wasn't threatening

That’s what I usually do with any strange dogs when I’m out with my dog and they are doing that first checking each other out thing.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> >> said I should have put the back of my hand in front of the
>> animals gob to let him sniff me and realise I wasn't threatening
>>
>> That’s what I usually do with any strange dogs when I’m out with my dog
>> and they are doing that first checking each other out thing.

Yeah but you don't go thrusting your hand into the dogs space, let alone in front of the dogs gob.

Back of the hand towards dog, fingers *gently* tucked into your palm, and slowly extend your hand to the halfway point between you and the dog. Dont stare into the dogs eyes, in dog world thats aggression, head tucked slightly to one side in a quizzical kinda way eyeline to the dogs back.
 Dog and Baby - No FM2R
,>> accused me of causing the their dog to get over-excited.

No offence, but maybe you did?
 Dog and Baby - Dog
I've had Doberman, All Stations, and now a French Shepherd, so I have a modicum of knowledge about 'these types' of dogs.

I have also been terrified of the same types of dog in my mobile car tuning days, going to some awful areas (back then) of sowf lunden.

The only time I have ever been bitten by a dog, was from one of my own, a mongrel from Battersea c1980.

I can quite understand howl you feel, smokie, but I still stand by what I said:

Stand still, keep your hands in your pockets, and don'teyeball him/her/it.
 Dog and Baby - No FM2R
>. I'm still not sure what the proper thing to do is,

I don't think there is a proper or right thing, though there are a fair few wrong things.

Don't threaten, don't startle, don't look scared or intimidated, not even worried. Don't shout, don't raise your arms, don't flap about, don't run.

Consider what the problem is. It's possible it wants food, but more likely it is being defensive in some way so don't simply continue doing whatever is bothering the dog.

Consider calmly, and confidently, withdrawing, it's the best way IMO.

If it comes to a fight you are going to get hurt, so avoid confrontation. It is unlikely that you are the sort of person who could deliberately seriously injure a dog and little else will stop it.

Carrying food is likely to attract more dogs, and if you're not confident around them then that will be bad.

If you really think it might come to it, then carry pepper spray. But you run a fairly real risk of pssing the dog off which will make things worse.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Sun 17 Oct 21 at 20:50
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> >. I'm still not sure what the proper thing to do is,

Try smiling, you may not realise it, but body language wise it changes your threat level to Cool and Safe.
 Dog and Baby - smokie
Maybe I did cause it as I did shout and flap my arms a bit but I've not been trained in dog calming, and I had no idea the owners were just round the corner, having already been past villas with ferocious looking animals in the yard.

It's not often I'm that scared and I'd find it difficult not to show it.

I also found it quite difficult remaining calm when I had a e***** great dog two feet from me barking and snarling at me. I didn't feel much like smiling at it, or putting any of my appendages near its teeth. I know the stick isn't the answer but ISTR it was the best the collective brains came up with when I previously raised it (or maybe the one I found most sensible, or made up afterwards)

Dogs that behave like that ought not be allowed to be loose in public these days, though you can't legislate for the wild ones here.


On another note, a mate bought a dog during lockdown. It came from Portugal and I honestly believe it could just have been one of the strays which they rounded up and took. Cost enough mind! And even tough it looks old to me, it's apparently quite young and they are taking it to training.
 Dog and Baby - bathtub tom
>>Try smiling,

I was told that baring your teeth was an aggressive act towards a dog?
 Dog and Baby - Lygonos
>>If you really think it might come to it, then carry pepper spray

When I worked as a summer postie in the 1990s one of my colleagues had a small can of Ralgex spray for 'dog control'.

Apparently a toot in the face subdues the angriest mutt.

I just walked past houses with dogs in the garden - and you are trained from the start to never put fingers into the letterbox as so e dogs sit quietly behind the door ready to yank the mail as it pokes through.
 Dog and Baby - Ted
>> When I worked as a summer postie in the 1990s one of my colleagues had
>> a small can of Ralgex spray for 'dog control'.

I have a couple of aerosol cans of carpet glue, I bought it for doing the carpets and trim in the old car. I tested the spray pattern outside before I used it. It didn't spray ! It simply shot a stream of glue about 15ft across the drive and hit the fence. I thought it might be of use against muggers...hit them in the face with it before they get near enough to knife you !
I went to buy a motor bike some years ago and the dealer had a GSD chained up outside his garage on about 15ft of chain. As we walked to the house from the garage door, we passed within touching distance of the dog. It promptly took a bite at my inner thigh, not too far from the crown jewels. It was agony and gave me a large bruise. The owner didn't seem bothered...I think he did later when the dibble turned up ! I had the damage photographed but Cosmo magazine weren't interested !.....I didn't buy the bike !

Ted
Last edited by: Ted on Mon 18 Oct 21 at 16:13
 Dog and Baby - Zero

>> For clarity I was asking the panel's view, and perhaps Z's in particular on (a)
>> dogs and babies in general and (b) comment on my own view, albeit from zilch
>> experience of dogs, that ignoring the poor lad wasn't the way forward.

As a general principle dogs at home require and thrive on consistency. Be it meal times, boundaries in behaviour , areas they can and cant go to, when, where and how they play, etc etc. all of that is put into place as a pup, or when the dog arrives at your home. Break it, and the dog becomes unsure and anxious.

Ok Baby arrives.

Its very easy to add things if the rest is consistent. Baby is just another single addition, if you maintain consistency in the rest, its easy to add something new. Change other stuff as well and the dog will, correctly, assume the addition is to blame.

You are right, ignoring the dog as punishment or to modify behaviour is most definitely the wrong thing to do, and will be creating issues, specially in a high drive dog like a spaniel.

 Dog and Baby - Bobby
>> Be it meal times

Think I have mentioned this before. My last lab got his dinner at 4.30pm and basically inhaled the lot there and then.
Current lab is complete opposite. I basically put his days dinner down in the morning and it can sometimes be there the next morning, sometimes he will eat it over the course of the day, sometimes he eats it during the night. I have tried only giving him his bowl at dinner time and taking it away if not eating it but that failed as he just wasn’t interested.

Not sure if it is “wrong” to leave the bowl down all day, if it’s doing any harm, although I realise that will now be his learned way.
 Dog and Baby - Zero

>> Not sure if it is “wrong” to leave the bowl down all day,

Nope, its not, and its causing no harm.
 Dog and Baby - sooty123

>> Current lab is complete opposite. I basically put his days dinner down in the morning
>> and it can sometimes be there the next morning, sometimes he will eat it over
>> the course of the day, sometimes he eats it during the night. I have tried
>> only giving him his bowl at dinner time and taking it away if not eating
>> it but that failed as he just wasn’t interested.
>>
>> Not sure if it is “wrong” to leave the bowl down all day, if it’s
>> doing any harm, although I realise that will now be his learned way.
>>


Mine's similar, very much a grazer. I've just left his food down until he's finished, some labs just inhale their food, most probably but not all. I wouldn't worry about it.
 Dog and Baby - DeeW
Agree totally Z.
Also applies to new adult joining one. When I finally met new man, he visited and paid no attention to dogs. They checked him over and left it at that. A year or so later the older collie expired with brain tumour and younger dog gradually moved onto more informal, enthusiastic relationship with man. Greeting him gently before he got out of his car and sitting by his feet once he was in house. Three granddaughters appeared over last seven years, each one has been sniffed and had a foot licked, then just accepted. ‘Leave’ and ‘away’ are useful commands when baby on floor or leaving snacks or toys in reach.
He loved having balls thrown for him and they were very gently returned to small, just sitting, babies. Training paid off in spades when small girls took the lead and when their friends visited. He was a real ambassador for a well trained and well adjusted dog, being particularly good for anyone frightened of dogs. As the girls got older, he also was spoilt by being giving snacks. Fortunately the children had only seen him being given dog food and biscuits, so that’s what they gave him. The eldest child loved his bed, which he was happy to share, starting when he stayed with them while I was in hospital and rehab.
You may not remember, Z, but you gave me good advice when he first arrived from Battersea. I thank you.
He gave us a wonderful 15 years, until this August. Ps I didn’t leave him alone with any of the babies, despite trusting him.. not my babies to risk.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>
>> You may not remember, Z, but you gave me good advice when he first arrived
>> from Battersea. I thank you.


Didn't realise Battersea was rehoming men now, but pleased you got him trained and adjusted.
 Dog and Baby - tyrednemotional
...I was worried about "He loved having balls thrown for him".... :-O
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> ...I was worried about "He loved having balls thrown for him".... :-O

Girls always say we are obsessed about our balls.
 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
>> Girls always say we are obsessed about our balls.

Are golf balls more trouble than tennis elbow?
 Dog and Baby - DeeW
Z, this made me spill my coffee!
Collie trainable… man not at all and neither would I want to. I like him exactly as he is and have the very best of him… long visits, no shared finance, and you have never seen anyone put clothes away so quickly when he asked if I would wash them … my reply was along the lines of ‘do you want a lover or skivvy’ (was actually joking, but not been asked again).
On balls, he has no interest in golf balls, let alone chasing them.
 Dog and Baby - sooty123
For clarity I was asking the panel's view, and perhaps Z's in particular on (a)
>> dogs and babies in general and (b) comment on my own view, albeit from zilch
>> experience of dogs, that ignoring the poor lad wasn't the way forward.
>>

That's better thanks, having had babies and dogs mixing we by and large carried on as normal.The more you make a fuss and change things the more dogs will pick up on it.

We never had a minutes bother with dogs/kids mixing.


Last edited by: sooty123 on Sun 17 Oct 21 at 11:46
 Dog and Baby - No FM2R
I had two retrievers when the girls were born.

Ignoring the dog to teach it a lesson because it had been sulking sounds utterly ridiculous.

We made sure the dogs were included and didn't feel neglected while still being careful of any possible dodgy reaction.

We had no issues and ultimately the dogs and girls became inseparable to the significant benefit of all, imo.

Perhaps we were lucky.
 Dog and Baby - Ambo
Surely there are enough reports in the press of horrific dog attacks on babies and children to show that the dog should be re-housed forthwith?
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> Surely there are enough reports in the press of horrific dog attacks on babies and
>> children to show that the dog should be re-housed forthwith?

Nope. Given the number of families with dogs and babies, and the very small percentage of tragic outcomes thats an unfounded conclusion.
 Dog and Baby - Ted
When our first born was crawling, my in law's small poodle bit her quite aggressively.. fortunately, it was shielded by her Terry nappy and pants. The dog sadly had to cross the Rainbow Bridge a few days later. Too risky and too old to re-home. Daughter now 50 and a dog lover !

Ted
 Dog and Baby - Lygonos
I'd have the dog put down: it's not like it's a cat.

Anyhoos, jocularity aside I would never allow a child to be anywhere near a dog's feeding area - seen a few toddler face injuries after they tried sharing/getting too close the dog's dinner.

Never sustained attacks, but a single bite can still scar.
 Dog and Baby - bathtub tom
Having seen my MIL's dog that would growl and snap as soon as you put its food down, I trained my dogs such that I could pick up their food shortly after putting it down. The spaniel would bring tears to your eyes with its mournful look, but at least I (think) knew my children would never be threatened.
 Dog and Baby - Robin O'Reliant
Dog attacks are rare in comparison to their numbers, but this one happened not far from me a couple of months ago. From what has been learned since, this report in the Mail is factually correct. Fortunately for the poor woman concerned she died without coming out of the induced coma she was in as by then it was fairly certain both legs would have had to be amputated along with the arm she had already lost.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9899083/Grandmother-72-faces-losing-legs-family-dog-launched-horrific-hour-long-attack.html

The scene was said to be like a horror film with chunks of flesh strewn all over the garden and the two paramedics who were first to the scene have had to have councilling since.

I myself am minus a fingertip thanks to a dog, and anyone who has worked door to door will have a tale or three about dog bites. I still have a couple of dogs of my own, though.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> Dog attacks are rare in comparison to their numbers, but this one happened not far
>> from me a couple of months ago.

Absolutely no reason why anyone in the UK should think about having an American Bulldog other than the obvious non pet agenda.
 Dog and Baby - sooty123
>> I'd have the dog put down: it's not like it's a cat.
>>
>> Anyhoos, jocularity aside I would never allow a child to be anywhere near a dog's
>> feeding area - seen a few toddler face injuries after they tried sharing/getting too close
>> the dog's dinner.
>>
>> Never sustained attacks, but a single bite can still scar.
>>

Our kids, nieces and nephews seemed to enjoy playing with dog food, especially putting dried food in their water bowls. Dog watched on in mild interest, but that was it. Perhaps we were lucky.
 Dog and Baby - No FM2R
>>Our kids, nieces and nephews seemed to enjoy playing with dog food

We had very strong rules about that. The dogs had two bowls each and they were total out of bounds for kids. Unless the kids were feeding them, of course.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Mon 18 Oct 21 at 09:07
 Dog and Baby - tyrednemotional
.....From the title, I thought this was going to be a thread about Duncan's favourite 'Spoons....
 Dog and Baby - MD
APART.

Some friends had a cocker spaniel. Perfect pet no problems. However one day whilst perched on the back of the sofa it took my friends Mum's face off. LITERALLY. Mother didn't ever recover well.
 Dog and Baby - Bromptonaut
Doggo now seems much more chilled with the baby. No longer so barky and excited when my Son in Law is handling his little boy. Daughter has now made an effort to fuss the dog which has also settled him a bit.

I guess we are all at fingers and thumbs when the first child comes home and pre-eclampsia/induction and forceps birth are not making it any easier. Not surprising the dog, who'd seen D disappear and then get himself moved to in laws home was confused.

It seems there were facts I was not aware of at first post. Pandemic etc means we've not been there since Xmas 19 and the playful puppy has since finished growing up.

Doggo seems to like being fussed but only on his own time/terms. He's snapped at Son in Law's parents and sister and a tradesman working at Daughter's house. Snapped at Mrs B yesterday but she'd been told to be careful and still tried to stroke his ears without approaching him cautiously and giving him the space to reject her 'advances'.

Son in Law recognises that if he snapped at a stranger in the park in that fashion he's at risk of a death sentence.

They're desperate to train it out of him but short of advice on how. What does Z think about how to achieve that?

Well aware that once baby starts crawling it's decision time and Doggo may have to be re-homed.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Mon 18 Oct 21 at 23:57
 Dog and Baby - No FM2R
Maybe Zero can help you since "snapping" has become a habit. It's not only the new baby that is at risk, any child or other person is similarly in danger.

For me the dog needs to go. Now.
 Dog and Baby - Kevin
>Maybe Zero can help you since "snapping" has become a habit.

It's only to be expected. He's getting old and a bit grumpy.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
>> >Maybe Zero can help you since "snapping" has become a habit.
>>
>> It's only to be expected. He's getting old and a bit grumpy.

I am a pensioner, it's part of the job spec. I get paid, by the government no less, so I am a professional.

I'll take your comments as a PBC 1, thanks, see you next year.
 Dog and Baby - Kevin
>I'll take your comments as a PBC 1, thanks, see you next year.

This year PBC has been combined with Profit Share. As one of 17.68M pensioners and Govt employees your Profit Share this year is: -£124,434,389,140 and 27p

Regards, Rishi.
 Dog and Baby - Zero
Would I be right to assume that snappy spaniel was snappy well before arrival of baby? Sounds that way and it sounds like anyone is a target. Certainly sounds much more frequent than you at first indicated. It's the range of targets that is concerning.

*IF* that is the case, and we are past the puppy playbiting stage, then I am afraid they have passed the point where it's fixable at home by pet owners.

There are only three courses of action.

1/ Behaviourist. Not a pet dog trainer, but a a qualified professional. Home visit kinda thing.

2/ Rehoming. Cockers relatively easy to rehome, might even be a spaniel rescue somewhere.

3/ Muzzle, a good solution if its a dog on dog issue, or dog on strangers out walking, much less practical and fair on the dog if it needs extensive use at home.

Re 1/ If you want I can ask for recommendations in the dog world if you indicate the area they live.

Generally cockers are high drive, have an insatiable need to work and be busy. Its achievable in an active home where the owners go running, fresh water swimming, chose a dog sport for their dog or have a garden and are creative with things to do.

Afraid, given the missed opportunities and signals, 2 is likely.





 Dog and Baby - hawkeye
I've read this thread with keen interest and some alarm.
The H grandson is now 14 weeks old having arrived in a household of younger daughter, SiL, 7-year-old neutered male King Charles and an older fluffy moggie. The dog is unquestionably my daughter's, but is friendly enough to others. He comes to stay with us from time to time and gets bossed around by our cats. He shows limited agression by showing his teeth and emitting a faint growl if anyone comes near him while he's enjoying a treat. We respect his right to have a treat in peace and daughter is unlikely to allow baby to try and nab the dog's Bonio.
Dog and grandson seem to rub along together OK. Daughter is to be seen stroking dog while feeding the baby. Daughter's cat, when he's in residence, seems to have appointed itself the baby's guardian, swiping the dog's face with claws retracted if dog approaches baby too quickly. From her own experience with her younger brothers, daughter is well aware of the risks of unattended cats and babies together.
We have just done 10 days of dog-sitting and noticed the dog seemed more friendly and much less energetic, but that could be age or any number of other things. It's a long ramble to record a series of non-events but it looks like there's no need to re-home her dog.
My parents always had a dog when I was growing up. All was well until I came back from my first term at boarding school and approached the family sheepdog for the customary face-lick greeting. Instead, she took a chunk out of my lip. Thinking about it I'm not sure that dog and I had been separated for so long before.
We are looking forward to having the grandson to stay when he's old enough to do the washing up but not so old that he cheeks us all the time!
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