Racism is entirely beyond me. I have no understanding why the colour of someone's skin could possibly make a difference about how you feel about someone. I am not, and never have been, someone affected by the colour of another person.
Nonetheless it is clear that, for many people, colour is a matter of value. You know you're s***, right?
Below is a Shearer/Wright video from the BBC.
And I realise from this video, that if you're white, you don't even necessarily hear it or realise it's going on. Or you dismiss it and ignore how wrong it is. And it does make my toes curl thinking of stuff I might have ignored on the terraces in the 70s & 80s.
Wright says that what helps is white people paying attention and talking about it. So I am.
And as an obvious note, if any of my friends or associates are racist, or for some reason you don't think this is subject is important, then just go away, because I don't want you around. You have nothing to say that could interest me, and I doubt you'd have the balls to say it anyway. Because you are lowlife scum.
My main takeaway; accept nothing racist from anybody about anything. Don't ignore it, don't dismiss it, pull that person up on it and tell them that you don't want it around you.
I think I do that. I think I've always done that. But we all need to do it all the time.
www.bbc.com/sport/av/football/56949360
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Heard something similar yesterday. A black footballer being interviewed by Adrian Chiles on R5 live. Don't think it was Ian Wright but I missed the intro so didn't catch the name.
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Racism, religious and sexual orientation intolerance. Never understood it never will. The same goes for people that mock or abuse the infirm and disabled.
And I have dropped people because of it.
Last edited by: zippy on Sat 1 May 21 at 17:20
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Missed the edit.
Having just spent two weeks in hospital, some NHS and some BUPA, I can say, the teams that looked after me included members of the team who were not white or not Christian or not heterosexual.
All of those people got me well again - not just the white, Christian, heterosexual ones.
Last edited by: zippy on Sat 1 May 21 at 17:41
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>>All of those people got me well again
Aside from how repulsive and abhorrent it is, whoever thought that using the colour of someone's skin (etc.) was even an effective way of judging people?
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Miss Z puts it well.
"When I use a scalpel to cut a patients skin, it is abundantly clear how we are all the same."
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I think that racism must be related to feelings of inadequacy in the racist. In some way that they cannot pull themselves up so they must pull others down.
In others, they're abusive, not racist - though using racist comments. They just want to hate and will use any convenient insult that they think will hurt - from colour to weight and everything in between.
And then there are those who are fundamentally scared and afraid of anything different. Anything from language to colour to religion.
All of it is based on ignorance of course. And all of them rely on the internet to give them critical mass so that they can reassure and comfort each other.
I realise I may be in a different position, my family is not wholly white, Christian or straight, and I have worked in so many different cultures.
But I swear I have never found a trait, a value, or a quality that can be traced to colour of skin.
People are just people. Good, bad and indifferent.
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>>But I swear I have never found a trait, a value, or a quality that can be traced to colour of skin.
Exactly.
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>..whoever thought that using the colour of someone's skin (etc.) was even an effective way of judging people?
Hendrik Verwoerd?
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And the membership of the Ku Klux Klan and many other similar delightful groups and individuals.
Doesn't legitimise it or make it right though.
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>> And the membership of the Ku Klux Klan and many other similar delightful groups and
>> individuals.
>>
>> Doesn't legitimise it or make it right though.
>>
Have you seen the film "The Blackkklansman".
It is a humorous take on a very serious issue and the end is so very moving. Based on a true story.
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I haven't, no. As it happens we're in lockdown at the weeknds and I am at a loose end so I'll give it a go this afternoon.
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Thank you Zippy, I had not seen that film and I have now watched it. I think it is awful that a film can be both like that and realistic.
It is quite clear what a large sector of society is entirely beyond anything I can understand or work out how to deal with. How can you deal with such hatred, deep-seated, vicious, self-righteous hatred from people who want to be that way and simply invent a reality that justifies it.
Whatever their colour, race, religion, orientation, preferences etc. etc.
What do these people see in the mirror?
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The last 5 minutes really brings it home and to be honest is very frightening.
It is comforting to know there are good people and that people can and do learn from their misconceptions. (The film being loosely based on a true story.)
I hope things can get better but the world is not a fair place. I had to stop reading a news report about a rape in India where the police are not doing anything because the victim was of such a low caste that she wasn't seen as human. I then made sure I finished the article as the only act of solidarity that I could offer.
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 3 May 21 at 03:15
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You re exactly correct; frightening.
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>And the membership of the Ku Klux Klan and many other similar delightful groups and individuals.
The KKK are/were primitive roughnecks. The South African Govt. during apartheid were much more sophisticated and dangerous. There were rumours floating around when I lived in South West that the SADF were even conducting research into racially targetted biological weapons. Witnesses at the TRC confirmed the existence of crude birth control weapons but the full extent of SADF research was never covered, at least in the public hearings.
I'd hazard a guess that similar research still exists in certain countries.
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>>All of those people got me well again
By the way, you've had a bit of a rough year. I hope you are actually well again and moving in the right direction.
Sincere wishes and good luck.
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>And I have dropped people because of it.
Me too. Recently had a long term friend that went all conspiracy / anti-vax / deep state / anti muslim / anti - non white / Trump. I dropped him, though with a heavy and regretful heart I must say.
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I went to Ghana for a two week holiday many years ago to visit a friend who was doing VSO as a science teacher.
I was fairly used to wandering around Manchester and London anonymously. I wear a skullcap but given the preponderance of Jews in those cities, I rarely get strange looks or feel out of place.
But going to Ghana was different, especially away from Accra. Kids really would touch us to 'feel the difference'.
What brought it into some form of context was the humble orange. Ripe oranges in Ghana are rarely orange, but a yellowly green. But inside, just the same as ripe oranges from anywhere in the world.....
Try teaching chemistry to Ghanaian students and saying 'now look as I add this liquid to this liquid and the salt that precipitates out is orange....' Cue confusion all round...
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My niece went to India and Nepal as part of her training as a Doctor. She has long blonde hair....she was forever being approached and touched in the same way.
Interestingly the word "orange" didn't exist in the English language and only became a word when the fruit first arrived in the country, the word "bled" in from various other languages.
Vietnam have a an "orange" type fruit that was white. It tasted somewhere between a sweet grapefruit and and orange and was very refreshing - quite expensive (relatively) compared to other fruits sold at the roadside, but for me was always the go-to for me for a Dollar or so. Sweet. One of my favourite roadside snacks.
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I want to add (not being the slightest interested in soccer) that I have only just caught up with the awful stuff that's being hurled at some individuals on social media. Overtly racist much of it is, but there is also an undercurrent of sheer hatred which I suspect goes beyond it. The people who write this stuff (which it seems to me the "tribal" aspect of soccer support encourages) are consumed with a nastiness for anything which offends them and if they can find a racist peg to hang their nastiness on they will do just that.
Which doesn't make it any less racist.
Like others here, I have had good reason recently to thank the many health care professionals who have helped me over the last few years, the vast majority of whom have been non-white (am I allowed to put it like that?), from the consultant who broke some bad news to me and later operated on me, to the nurse whose face was the first I saw when I came round from the anaesthetic... and so it goes on, too many to list.
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Indeed. My wife broke her ankle a few weeks ago.
The surgeon and all the doctors she saw were of Indian extraction I think, and many of the nurses were certainly 'of some colour' and their spoken English was not perfect.
However my wife can point to excellent care, clear explanations of the treatment and the follow up has been very positive; all at a time of Covid when I was not permitted to see her until the time I brought her home after 12 days.
Anyone who perceives someone with less than perfect English or less than white skin as less intelligent is certainly less than intelligent themselves.
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The last two posts reminded me of when I took Mrs Z to hospital (NHS) for a very delicate eye operation to be done under full anaesthetic.
We were sitting in the waiting room and Mrs Z told me not to worry - because I was looking very nervous and she was the patient!
The consultant, came to the reception room and asked for her and saw I was with her.
He saw I was very worried and very kindly said, "Do not worry Mr Z, we will take the utmost care of her".
I just thought it a nice touch.
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My brother (Scottish) has lived in England for double the amount of years that he lived in Scotland. Has been a member of his local running club for last 25 years.
We often discuss the difference in politics between Scotland and England. He was saying that around Brexit time there were a good few members who , especially on the whatsapp chats, were starting to bung in the jokes that were bordering on the racist as the talk of Brexit had seemed to open the normality of racist talk and jokes whereas before it just wasnt mentioned. He felt very uncomfortable that people he had been friends with for years were now comfortable showing their racist side.
These folk have been his pals for years, running club meets twice a week, travels to events together etc and suddenly he is feeling uncomfortable. Then last week he was telling me that a few of them have been asking him about the Scottish elections and why the support in Scotland is so strong for independence and he was trying to explain to them how Westminster and the like are perceived from a Scottish point of view. It then moved on to well what are YOUR thoughts on it and then followed up by comments around "well I suppose if you ddon't like it down here you could just go HOME in a casual way but the same way that the racist comments were dropped in to the chats.
Racism etc is not a football issue, its not a social media issue, its a society issue. One thing I would say though is due to social media, if you have a friend on twitter / facebook etc, it doesnt take too long to find out their feelings and beliefs on a whole load of subjects. I can only speak for myself, but if I go back 20 years I probably could not tell you the political views of any of my friends and family. I could probably list them all now.
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>> Then last week he was
>> telling me that a few of them have been asking him about the Scottish elections
>> and why the support in Scotland is so strong for independence and he was trying
>> to explain to them how Westminster and the like are perceived from a Scottish point
>> of view. It then moved on to well what are YOUR thoughts on it
O.K. why is the support in Scotland so strong for independence? What are YOUR thoughts on it. Because I don't understand it.
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>> Because I don't understand it.
Primarily because you are not Scottish.
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>> O.K. why is the support in Scotland so strong for independence? What are YOUR thoughts
>> on it. Because I don't understand it.
Interesting article from the New Yorker:
www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/05/10/nicola-sturgeons-quest-for-scottish-independence?
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That’s a good article Brompt.
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Maybe coz I have no subscription I didn't see it all, but what I saw it wasn't very long and didn't say very much of significance.
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>> Maybe coz I have no subscription I didn't see it all, but what I saw
>> it wasn't very long and didn't say very much of significance.
I don't think you need to be a subscriber but you may need to register.
I did subscribe at one stage but I think it fell over after I had to replace a lost card. I can still see plenty of articles but I think there's a limit.
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Scotland Independence = Greece without the sunshine (at best)
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Racism - Bromptonaut
