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IMPORTANT - PLEASE READ
Before discussions start in this thread, I would like to point out that any petty arguments, personal attacks, or any other infringement of house rules, etc. will be deleted where we feel fit from now on.
We will not give notice that we have deleted something. Nor will we enter into discussion why something was deleted. That will also be deleted.
It seems that discussion about Brexit brings out the worst in some people.
Be nice, Play nice, and control your temper. Your co-operation would be appreciated.
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 4 Feb 19 at 10:12
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BBC News - Brexit uncertainty is a disgrace, says Airbus
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 10:55
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>> Brexit uncertainty is a disgrace, says Airbus www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46984229
I'll see your Brexit uncertainty is a disgrace with my: www.westmonster.com/kent-council-given-29m-to-get-roads-ready-for-no-deal-brexit/
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 10:55
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A previous Govt was slated for not having plans ready in case of a Leave vote. So this seems sensible planning really, given where we are.
It wouldn't be wasted anyway as the benefit would remain whether or not there is a deal.
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 10:55
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Surely all that says is that we should avoid a “No Deal”. Unless of course the inevitable disruption it acknowledges is all part of the “Price worth Paying” argument. If you can let me know what we would be paying for in that case I should be much obliged if you coulld spell it out.
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 10:58
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I don't want him to spell it out, I want him to pay my share he lumped me with
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>>If you can let me know what we would be paying for in that case I should be much obliged if you coulld spell it out.
INDEPENDENCE
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What does that mean? Independence from what?
You didn't vote for independence. You voted to leave the EU. That's it, nothing more. And I have yet to meet anybody who supports leave to be able to explain to me what that would bring, what they want from it and how it will work.
Because it's not the same thing as independence. However many times you underline it.
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It's quite simple really, and you know it .. independence to import goods from outside the EU without having to charge, usually poor countries, tariffs, which we then pass on to the EU.
Independence to be able to strike trade deals with any country, independent of the EU.
Independence to make or own laws.
I could go on, but I'm taking the dogs out - in the rain again but, at least it's 9° out there.
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Utter nonsense. And if you reread what has been written over the last 2 or 3 years you should know that.
The situation we are in is that many people have made an emotional discussion on something they don't really understand seeking an alternative that nobody can define.
But it isn't going to change. At least karma will ensure that for the most part those who voted for it will suffer most from it. Other than people like Dyson, Bamford, Rees-Mogg, Lawson, Farage, Johnson etc. etc.
But the much trumpeted "ordinary man in the street"? Screwed.
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>>the much trumpeted "ordinary man in the street"? Screwed.
Nothing new there then.
>>The situation we are in is that many people have made an emotional discussion on something they don't really understand seeking an alternative that nobody can define.
You're not wrong. Woman in the street being interviewed by a journo from BBC Radio Cornwall, said she voted Leave and wanted to leave. When questioned whether she knew what the backstop was, or the single market/customs union and WTO, she replied I haven't a clue I just want to leave.
I must admit I was the same back in 23-06-16. I thought the single market was to do with singles meeting like-minded folk and PLEASE don't ask me what I thought the backstop was.
But ya know what, I loathe and despise the European Union/Junker/Barnier/Tusk so much (and I'm not alone) so will be prepared to take a financial hit to escape from their bonds, although I haven't got a lot of financials to lose tbh. The likes of you will be okay of course ... unless you've recently thrown £50.000 away on a jamjar.
:o}
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>> so will be prepared to take a financial hit to escape from their bonds, although I haven't got a lot of financials to lose tbh
So someone else can pay. Yup Just about sums the situation up.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 25 Jan 19 at 02:01
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>>So someone else can pay. Yup Just about sums the situation up.
Almost everybody looks after their own ass, but sure, people are worried about their jobs, especially if they have kids and/or a mortgage. Been there gorn through that, and got on with it - in my own way.
I voted Leave not for any personal reasons, but for Great Britain to make its own way in the world, not to be told what I can and can't do by some unelected bureaucrat in Brussels.
Thinking about it ya know, I reckon it's about the British don't like being told what to do.
I honestly don't see the British as being Europeans. Europe was always, to me, 'over there', and well, they even speak some foreign language/s and eat funny food.
In the final analysis. I said back in 2016 that although we 'won', we wouldn't be allowed to leave- too much green folding stuff at stake, see. Que sera sera.
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,>>t for Great Britain to make its own way in the world,
But that's what you're damaging. This behaviour and hatred of all things foreign is driving us towards isolationism with no place in the world.
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>>This behaviour and hatred of all things foreign is driving us towards isolationism with no place in the world.
You musta gorn to the same skool as that toff from Norwich - I loathe and despise the EU, not all things foreign.
Why, I even own a foreign car, washing machine, TV, computer, two guitars, 4 x cameras, a mini Hi-Fi, etc. etc. even a *French* Shepherd dog.
I've also visited 8 European countries at one time or another, and lived surrounded by, um, foreigners, when we lived in Spain.
Basically, you Remoaners/traitors/German car owners, which this forum is infested with, talk a lot of tosh most of the time IMO, and quite frankly I've got better things to do with my precious time.
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>> and quite frankly I've got better things to do
>> with my precious time.......
>>
...I think they would agree with you...... ;-)
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Not a remainer, not a traitor, don't own a German car. I understand the issues, know both the people and the institutions and am informed by material and information from all sides of the discussion.
You, however, are a jingoistic, bigoted fool who understands none of the issues, is incapable of reading, or perhaps understanding, anything challenging or difficult or of listening to different opinions, who panics over how many non-white people live in one borough or another and is comfortable in that ignorance.
You call me a traitor you worthless anti-British know-nothing? You are a disgrace to our country and in the future will be reviled for your stupidity.
>>quite frankly I've got better things to do with my precious time.
Prove it.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 22:35
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>>when we lived in Spain.
You sanctimonious hypocrite.
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>> >>when we lived in Spain.
>>
>> You sanctimonious hypocrite.
>>
>>
There's a lot of this. Some British seem to want all the benefits and none of the responsibilities.
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>> I loathe and despise the EU.......
>>
...which, if those feelings have solid and understandable foundations, is patently sufficient incentive to vote out.
But.......though I hear a significant number of people voicing the same sentiments, I can't really get any solid feel for what underpins them.
Usually, if you dig deeper, what you get in return is signs that people have been inculcated by the long-term bleatings of the Eurosceptic press, the owners of which have there own (and differing) reasons for supporting out, which have little or nothing to do with the best interests of their readership, or the UK.
So, I hear mumblings about "faceless, unelected bureaucrats", "no ability to make our own laws", etc. etc. claims that, if one takes the time to understand both the workings of the EU, and the real facts that surround them, largely fail to stand up. (I use the word 'largely', since working in such a large organisation implies a certain amount of transfer of powers away from the state, but the vast majority of the practical effects of that are greatly exaggerated - in fact, as is becoming increasingly obvious, if we wish to continue trading with our largest partner, then Brexit will mean even less control over those things that really matter than we have now).
Unfortunately, Dog, without expanding on the statement at the top of this post, in an understandable and logical way, you appear to many (including, I admit, me) to be one of those simply parroting the meanderings of the Eurosceptic media (the various media links you post simply compound that).
You have every right to vote whichever way you wish, though if you post your views you must also be prepared to take the criticism of those that disagree (I wish it would remain reasonably civil, though!).
Your reasons, however, remain an enigma to me, and I'd like to understand them.
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I've long given up trying to find any sensible, coherent reasoning as to why anyone voted Leave.
I'm sure there are those who do have more considered approach, but I think I said here months ago, probably repeatedly, something along the lines of I see it as an anti vote against the status quo (or maybe the Establishment) rather than for anything at all. Or "sticking one up 'em".
To be fair, I doubt many Remain voters (maybe me included up to a point) could give many really positive reasons why we should remain, other than the fact that leaving is hard work/detrimental, and we like being part of Europe. I know you will be able to take issue with this as only I know what I mean :-)
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"...... and we like being part of Europe"
Yep - if we leave the EU, then we are in danger of floating off into outer space.
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I think tyred makes a good point. "Europe" never meant anything much or was talked about in my career or personal life, so my only real exposure to the British point of view since the early seventies was via the media. That seems in my recollection to have been portrayed largely, though not exclusively, as an endless battle, us against them, whether Mrs T "winning ground", or David Cameron "being snubbed" and everything in various shades of negative in between.
I used to think how interesting it might have been if there were news stories about rural French life or Spanish village problems, but it was always Big Boring Stuff about how we were fighting again about rebates or fishing rights, and "they" were always the bad guys. There was a paper we took for a while called The European, which was a little better, but there wasn't much positive being thrust in front of me. You had to really search it out. Of course it was there, but it's only since this Brexit stuff that we (maybe just me) learned much about shared programmes for academics, science, and all those positive things we will sorely miss, never mind arcane airline regulations and so on.
When we had the referendum it took me about a nano-second to decide, though, and I'll now go on the record to say I was and still would be a remainer, if it were magically undone. At the very least a group of nations torn apart historically, repeatedly and bloodily, seem to me to be better acting together in a common cause, even if that cause is fluid.
We are, however, here. I hold no anger against leavers. We must do the best we can with what we have.
Last edited by: Crankcase on Fri 25 Jan 19 at 16:28
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>> (I wish it would remain reasonably civil, though!).
I don't think anybody has the right to expect that if they call others "traitors".
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>> >> (I wish it would remain reasonably civil, though!).
>>
>> I don't think anybody has the right to expect that if they call others "traitors".
>>
...oh, I know I was wishing in vain, but it still doesn't stop me wishing....... ;-)
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Lets face it Dog you just dislike foreigners as do majority who voted leave. There is no other other logical and rational argument that has been put forward for leaving the EU.
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And you reckon you went to grammar school - Thank the lord I'm just an uneducated thicko:
blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/01/how-germany-helped-shape-the-conditions-for-brexit/
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>> And you reckon you went to grammar school - Thank the lord I'm just an
>> uneducated thicko:
>>
>> blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/01/how-germany-helped-shape-the-conditions-for-brexit/
Where do you find all this carp?
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>> And you reckon you went to grammar school - Thank the lord I'm just an
>> uneducated thicko:
>>
>> blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/01/how-germany-helped-shape-the-conditions-for-brexit/
Oh, so I WASNT some unelected bureaucrat in Brussels.
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>> >>
>> >> blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/01/how-germany-helped-shape-the-conditions-for-brexit/
>>
>> Oh, so I WASNT some unelected bureaucrat in Brussels.
>>
...beware stories that are headed by a deliberately unflattering picture of a subject of the text.
If the words are meaningful enough to be taken seriously, they don't need such embellishment (which when it is there, is plainly intended to divert one from the absolute carp contained below).
cf. sub-editors bible, page 3.
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>>Thank the lord I'm just an uneducated thicko:
What a strange thing to be proud. Still, take it where you can get it, I guess.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 22:36
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>> But ya know what, I loathe and despise the European Union/Junker/Barnier/Tusk so much (and I'm
>> not alone) so will be prepared to take a financial hit to escape from their
>> bonds, although I haven't got a lot of financials to lose tbh.
Yes, you loath them, as do many others, and that was why you voted leave.
You've never met the people, you don't understand the institution, the implications or mechanics of international trade, international finance or any of the rest of it.
So many industry and business people, so many companies have warned against it and tries to explain the difficulties and dangers.
But because you loath it you are happy to damage the country to get away from it.
Genius
Last edited by: No FM2R on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 21:03
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>> Independence to make or own laws.
We can make our own laws and stay in EU, see any recent Queen's Speech.
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The way Leave people talk about the Govt failings, I'm surprised they have any desire to be "ruled over" by our current crop of MPs. Better the devil you know maybe... :-)
btw I'm having a change of heart over a 2nd referendum. I was anti partly because I saw it as undermining democracy.
However we do get to vote for things every so often, which often results in change (e.g. of government or local council). No reason why we ought't vote again on the EU really from that point of view. but really I think we ought to go ahead with it now- we've come too far already.
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Dog,
Thirty three poor African countries trade with the EU on an absolutely tarif free basis. The arrangement is not reciprocal. Those countries are entitled to set their own tarrifs on imports from the EU.
Will the UK arrange similarly favourable terms for these poor countries or will we be applying WTO terms?
Last edited by: CGNorwich on Thu 24 Jan 19 at 16:01
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>>Will the UK arrange similarly favourable terms for these poor countries or will we be applying WTO terms?
Yes, if they agree to buy some of our nice attack aircraft and missiles.
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Independence to reduce worker's rights, independence to turn us into a insular, bankrupt, inward looking race. Independence to risk allowing one of our nations slipping into civil war...going well isn't it.
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www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46987529
It appears that at least one group of politicians have admitted they don't have the numbers.
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>> www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46987529
>>
>> It appears that at least one group of politicians have admitted they don't have the
>> numbers.
Keeping their powder dry?
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>> Keeping their powder dry?
Possibly but I doubt it, I can't see enough MPs getting behind it. The government are also against, despite the goings on in the last couple of weeks, that counts for something.
On a simple practical level, I think anyway, there isn't enough time left even with an extension to have another referendum.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 25 Jan 19 at 02:03
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I was, wrongly, under the impression that €/£ exchange rates were worsening but I’ve just changed £ into € today on my Revolut card and got €1.156 which is an improvement on a few weeks ago.
I’ll check out my online statement and see what the exchange rate was last February when I withdrew euros from a Santander ATM.
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Saw it yesterday. It's obviously written from an anti-Brexit standpoint and should be read as such.
There's plenty of other commentary though that says WTO terms are not the easy solution the snake oil merchants would have us believe.
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Enjoyable watching (if you like that kind of thing) on the Beeb Parliament channel right now, where they are discussing the amendments. Also available on the Beeb website.
Teresa has been trying to put over her arguments but has been continual interruption from all sides, to which she's been "giving way". It makes me think of the whole process which it feels to me has been stymied by the politicians of all parties.
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Unfortunately they have now moved to studio discussion.
I enjoy watching Parliament for the tradition, protocol etc but get frustrated with the MPs!!
EDIT only BBC News has moved away, still watchable on Parliament channel.
Last edited by: smokie on Tue 29 Jan 19 at 15:35
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>> I enjoy watching Parliament for the tradition, protocol etc but get frustrated with the MPs!!
Quite interesting to watch the votes going on.
Those to extend article 50 and to put conduct of business in hands of house have been lost but the (non binding) amendment in name of Caroline Spellman to block 'no deal' was passed. Currently voting on Graham Brady's amendment mandating PM to renegotiate the NI backstop.
That may well pass too.
So our hapless PM is now supposed to go to EU for negotiations they say won't happen and to revise a deal that until today she's insisted is final.
You couldn't make it up.
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...but having rearranged the deckchairs (yet again) they can all go home happy......
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>> ...but having rearranged the deckchairs (yet again) they can all go home happy......
If there was any rearrangement it was a very minor one. More like Groundhog day.
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>> >> I enjoy watching Parliament for the tradition, protocol etc
All designed to ensure that nothing can happen, and disguise the sheer incompetence of those within.
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....I understand they're going to suggest the leprechauns police the (soft) Irish border......
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Life after Brexit - How the yanks plan to screw us
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47036119
Note the demand to remove price capping on NHS drugs. That 300 million won't go far.
Last edited by: Zero on Tue 29 Jan 19 at 22:40
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Brexit: 'Extra time' may be needed, says Jeremy Hunt
D'ya think? If you lot hadn't been dickin' around for the last 2 years it wouldn't.
www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-47069433
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>> D'ya think? If you lot hadn't been dickin' around for the last 2 years it
>> wouldn't.
Do you not think that for years to come this will be an example of how not to run a project.
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It's got stiff competition from everything else they've ever done.
But it is pitiful.
And whilst they may well be inept, they are not that stupid. They know exactly what they are doing. It is just that even given all the different motivations flying around in their head, the good of the country is not one of their concerns.
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Someone on the Beeb HYS said he thought it might go to penalties.
Made me chuckle...
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>> Someone on the Beeb HYS said he thought it might go to penalties.
>>
>> Made me chuckle...
>>
No, Our Theresa is going to score in Extra Time. Not the world’s most exiting player but a fantastic work rate. Will surely get the Golden Boot though.
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>>>No, Our Theresa is going to score in Extra Time. Not the world’s most exiting player but a fantastic work rate. Will surely get the Golden Boot though.<<<
Remember it is a Government software project that will be used to count the goals - you will probably find that Golden Boot algorithm does not disallow 'own goals'. :)
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More by default (a standing order) than anything else, our memberships of the Conservative Party have been renewed for another 12 months.
Our local Association is strongly pro-Brexit, but with the party hierarchy so unresponsive to the views of the grass-roots members, we wonder "what is the point?"
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Genuine question, what would have had to happen for you not to renew?
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>> Genuine question, what would have had to happen for you not to renew?
>
May's awful "deal" in any of its iterations delivering BRINO (Brexit In Name Only).
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> May's awful "deal" in any of its iterations delivering BRINO (Brexit In Name Only).
>>
I guess you'll be leaving in the next few weeks then? I can't see anything other than the WA or a version of it. Can you see anything else realistically passing?
Last edited by: sooty123 on Sat 2 Feb 19 at 17:45
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>> More by default (a standing order) than anything else, our memberships of the Conservative Party
>> have been renewed for another 12 months.
One of the leaders of the Conservative Woman blog you seem to favour was on Thursday's Question Time.
Did you wath?
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I decided not to watch QT this week. They clearly wind up the dimmer elements of the audience who just heckle rather than listening to any thoughtful answers, and seem also set up the panellists as Aunt Sallys. It has a lot in common with Jeremy Kyle.
Any Questions on the wireless with Jonathan Dimblebore is more measured and polite, and much more interesting for that.
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>> Any Questions on the wireless with Jonathan Dimblebore is more measured and polite, and much
>> more interesting for that.
Agree with that.
I tend though to listen to neither as there's always at least one panellist talking ill-informed utter nonsense (and it's not always the Tory) that I have to turn off to preserve my sanity.
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Well, some good news now we just need another 40-something
www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-and-chile-sign-continuity-agreement
Last edited by: No FM2R on Sat 2 Feb 19 at 15:19
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I t will be interesting to see if we get a trade deal with Japan post Brexit anywhere near as favourable as that agreed between the EU and Japan that came into force yesterday. I somehow doubt it.
ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/in-focus/eu-japan-economic-partnership-agreement/
Mind you the way it is going I think we could sell end up agreeing to stay in a Customs Union. At least that will save Roger the cost of his membership to the Conservative Party
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www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-47102708
Of course Brexit is worth it. It doesn't impact the retired. Perhaps it should.
No pay rises this year at work for most middle managers because of the impact of Brexit and a number of staff redundancies to boot.
It's all very good news.
On a personal note, my laptop went to Germany yesterday to be fixed. The tech guy told me the part can take up to 8 weeks to be sourced (graphics card usually seen in powerful desktop computers) . Who knows if it will be back before 29th March!?
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>> On a personal note, my laptop went to Germany yesterday to be fixed. The tech
>> guy told me the part can take up to 8 weeks to be sourced (graphics
>> card usually seen in powerful desktop computers) . Who knows if it will be back
>> before 29th March!?
I have no idea why, your graphics card wasn't made in Germany, and I doubt your laptop was either.
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>> I have no idea why, your graphics card wasn't made in Germany, and I doubt
>> your laptop was either.
>>
I guess it was made in Taiwan, Korea or China but the manufacturer's servicing centre is in Germany.
I guess it really needs a new motherboard but as it's a few years old and still under warranty they will need to source the parts (or replace it with something newer).
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www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-47102708
Hey Roger, one of your prices worth paying?
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....though, as Theresa saddles up her unicorn once again, and rides off to Brussels in search of Schrödinger's Irish border, rumours are now circulating that serious research has been commenced into the impact of staying in the Custom's Union!
You really couldn't make it up.
Frankly, however, it all still looks like diversionary tactics whilst the same old "rinse and repeat and run down the clock" strategy is still in play.
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>>
>> I guess it was made in Taiwan, Korea or China but the manufacturer's servicing centre
>> is in Germany.
>>
...not at all out of the ordinary. A lot of computer componentry has its European warranty support in Germany or The Netherlands.
My lad's MSI graphics card went off just before its warranty expiry, and had to go back to the Netherlands. (It could have been sent by the retailer, but given that it was bought online it would have had to have gone there by post, and then been forwarded, it was easier to get them to endorse the warranty claim and send back to MSI ourselves).
At least he got a new one by return, that is itself now on its way out after a further three years.
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Zippy said
>> Of course Brexit is worth it. It doesn't impact the retired. Perhaps it should.
Uncharacteristically bitter-sounding comment there Zippy! I think you'll find BREXIT will affect the retired. Retired people buy goods just the same as work people don't they? Probably travel more. Not all have regular or substantial incomes. Some have dependencies on medications which seem potentially threatened. And are bigger users of the NHS, which may lose staff. And probably loads more stuff. Not least if the economy tanks there will be some impact on savings.
He also said
>> No pay rises this year at work for most middle managers because of the impact
>> of Brexit and a number of staff redundancies to boot.
I went for many years without any substantial pay rises, and under continual threats of redundancy, way before BREXIT had even been thought of. I also remember when stuff which is thought of as necessity today was totally out of reach of the common man. And I'm nowhere near as old as many here. I'm not advocating a return to those days and I don't support BREXIT but I'm sure we'll get by somehow..
And btw graphics cards from powerful desktops don't usually fit in laptops. I'm surprised your organisation doesn't just issue you with another and yours can go back on the shelf when it's fixed. Are you having to live without one??
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>> Uncharacteristically bitter-sounding comment there Zippy! I think you'll find BREXIT will affect the retired. Retired
>> people buy goods just the same as work people don't they? Probably travel more. Not
>> all have regular or substantial incomes. Some have dependencies on medications which seem potentially threatened.
>> And are bigger users of the NHS, which may lose staff. And probably loads more
>> stuff. Not least if the economy tanks there will be some impact on savings.
>>
I see a lot of retirees supporting Brexit and they will be impacted by rising prices but their pensions are usually protected and the state element has a triple lock which allows a reasonable increase with inflation.
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I am also moody because I was looking forward to seeing my kids home this weekend but told them not to risk travelling because of the weather.
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>>
>> I see a lot of retirees supporting Brexit and they will be impacted by rising
>> prices but their pensions are usually protected and the state element has a triple lock
>> which allows a reasonable increase with inflation.
>>
I see a lot of retirees that don't support Brexit (quite often those that have a decent occupational pension). I'm a retiree, and it (particularly if it's a hard Brexit) will affect me.
...and if the economy does tank after Brexit, how long do you think the triple-lock will last?
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...and if the economy does tank after Brexit, how long do you think the triple-lock
>> will last?
>>
As long as they keep turning out to voting in large numbers.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 19:41
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Pensioners should have been disallowed the vote. They have no skin in the future of the country.
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>> Pensioners should have been disallowed the vote. They have no skin in the future of
>> the country.
I suppose if you're going down that line, you could add in the terminally ill?
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>> >> Pensioners should have been disallowed the vote. They have no skin in the future
>> of
>> >> the country.
>>
>> I suppose if you're going down that line, you could add in the terminally ill?
Tick yes, good idea. Best tell them they are terminally ill first, could be a nasty shock to find out that way.
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>> >> Pensioners should have been disallowed the vote. They have no skin in the future
>> of
>> >> the country.
>>
Apart from assuming that all pensioners voted leave, which they didn’t that is plain wrong. A man of 70 has a a life expectancy well into their eighties and a women can expect to live even longer so pensioners like everyone else have a considerable interest in the future of the U.K. It is also not impossible to imagine that leaving the EU could in the long term be economically beneficial to th country. Difficult to accept I know but who can predict the future?
It also assumes that we should also always vote for what we see as is the economic interest of the country which is debatable at best. It is a perfectly respectable to believe that there are other thing that matter rather than national or individual wealth.
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>> Apart from assuming that all pensioners voted leave, which they didn’t
Most did
>> A man of 70 has a a life expectancy well into their eighties
wrong - 79
>> and a women can expect to live even longer
Not much - 82.9
>>so pensioners like everyone else have a considerable
>> interest in the future of the U.K.
Considerable? No clearly not about 15-18 years
It is also not impossible to imagine that
>> leaving the EU could in the long term be economically beneficial to th country. Difficult
>> to accept I know but who can predict the future?
Its not going to be better in 15 years. Not only will the state be poorer during that period, those pensioners who voted to put it their will be an increasing burden - one we can not afford.
>>It is a perfectly
>> respectable to believe that there are other thing that matter rather than national or individual
>> wealth.
Indeed it is, specially when you voted to decrease the national wealth, during the period your burden upon it increases. No sorry we cant afford their ideals, in fact compulsory euthanasia might be the next good thing.
being serious tho, a lot of pensioners voted for Brexit, in the knowledge they would decrease their children and grandchildrens opportunities not caring they would need to work harder just for xenophobic ideals.
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 11:08
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>>
>> No sorry we cant afford their ideals, in fact compulsory
>> euthanasia might be the next good thing.
>>
At long last, we are getting some common sense views from Zero.
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>> >>
>> >> No sorry we cant afford their ideals, in fact compulsory
>> >> euthanasia might be the next good thing.
>> >>
>>
>> At long last, we are getting some common sense views from Zero.
I'd like to put you in charge, but alas you might be - errr - indisposed
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 11:15
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>>compulsory euthanasia might be the next good thing.
>> >> At long last, we are getting some common sense views from Zero.
>>
....in alphabetical order, by forum name.....?
;-)
Last edited by: tyrednemotional on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 11:22
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>> ....in alphabetical order, by forum name.....?
>>
>> ;-)
You can take over from Duncan, he wont be around long
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>> A man of 70 has a a life expectancy well into their eighties
>> wrong - 79
Wrong.
Is 84.
By getting to 70 they have already dodged the events that cause death before 70 that bring the population average down.
www.riskprediction.org.uk/index_lifeexp.php
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man of 70 has a a life expectancy well into their eighties
wrong - 79
>> and a women can expect to live even longer
Not much - 82.9
You are wrong I’m afraid. You are making the common mistake that a man of 70 has the same life expectancy as some one born this year.
The life expectancy of a male born in 2019 is indeed around 79 years. The life expectancy of a man who has already attained the age of 70 in 2019 is considerably greater. Around. 85 actually. Life expectancy rises throughout your life, quite steeply after the first year which is the most dangerous.
If you don’t believe me there are plenty of life expectancy calculators on line
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>> You are wrong I’m afraid.
No I am not wrong, its the average age of death NOW. IE men born 79 years ago, and they are the ones we are talking about. No idea why you are burbling on about the life expectancy of someone born now, they have nothing to do with the vote. They didn't have one.
You just got bumped up the euthanasia queue.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 19:42
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>>You just got bumped up the euthanasia queue.
Ask them to check you for brain mets Z.
The point being made was whether those voting for Brexit wouldn't live to see its consequences.
So the relevant stat is how long would a 70 yr old voter in 2016 have been expected to live.
The answer is 84.64 for men, and 86.78 for women.
Not 79.
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weel hopefully they will get an extra 5 years in the care home that has no staff because of brexit.
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>>weel hopefully they will get an extra 5 years in the care home that has no staff because of brexit.
Or maybe even having their undercarriages soaped by the Indian/Phillipino male nurses after the good looking Polish women go home.
Might be right up Rog's alley of course...
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Please re- what I wrote. Lygonos also gave you the same information. It really isn’t difficult.
The life expectancy of a man alive and now aged 70 is 86 years The life expectancy of a male baby born today is 79 years.
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You are still in the queue
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I suppose if that's what you believe then there is a related argument that if the people to whom the future of the country mattered bothered themselves to get out of bed, engage and turn up to vote, the wrinklies may have had a fight on their hands. :-)
There are many many retired people who do not benefit from such pensions btw.
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>> There are many many retired people who do not benefit from such pensions btw.
Any retired person* who does not have an occupational pension, or the full State Pension/New Retirement Person, will get Pension Credit. That will boost their income to £163 for a single person or £248.80 for couples. More (potentially) if they also receive qualifying disability benefits such as Attendance Allowance. The Pension Credit figure is subject to the triple lock and Attendance Allowance rises in accordance with the prices index.
Compare and contrast with the £73.10 and £114.20, frozen since 2015, paid to singles/couples on working age disability benefits who are found capable of 'Work Related Activity'.
Pensioners, often the most egregious under occupiers, are also exempt the bedroom tax and, if on the PC rates above get 100% Council Tax Reduction. For the working age sick it can be as low as 50%; very few Councils still allow 100%.
*As I posted in the Food Bank thread this may change in May if one of a couple is below Pension age.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 09:53
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Egregious is not a word I would apply to to a pensioner for having more than one bedroom.
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>> Egregious is not a word I would apply to to a pensioner for having more
>> than one bedroom.
Egregious: Outstandingly bad, flagrant
The stated policy objective of the 'under occupancy charge' was to ensure that the nation's limited stock of social housing was used more efficiently. It's therefore ironic that one of the largest and most flagrant groups of under occupiers, older people who's offspring have flown the nest, are exempted.
The 'bedroom tax' has all manner of deficiencies of logic/consequence as well but that's one of bigger ones.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 10:21
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>> Mind you the way it is going I think we could sell end up agreeing
>> to stay in a Customs Union. At least that will save Roger the cost of
>> his membership to the Conservative Party
Does he not think its a price worth paying?
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>>And btw graphics cards from powerful desktops don't usually fit in laptops. I'm surprised
>>your organisation doesn't just issue you with another and yours can go back on the shelf
>>when it's fixed. Are you having to live without one??
It's a personal one purchased for me as a gift a couple of years ago.
It has a mobile version of a Nvidia GTX graphics set which has a reputation for getting too hot and damaging the motherboard.
The laptop is quite a beast. Weighs 7KG. 17 inch LCD, black aluminium construction and came with a 3 year warranty and died just before the warranty expired. Shame it wasn't an on-site one.
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7kg??
That's the same as a small car tyre.
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I take less than 7Kg when I go on holiday ( to warmer climes) for several weeks.
I’m about to move my life to the Costa Blanca for 8 weeks and I have to fill my allowable 10Kg hand luggage allowance with books just to make up the weight.
Last edited by: legacylad on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 10:19
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>> I take less than 7Kg when I go on holiday ( to warmer climes) for
>> several weeks.
>> I’m about to move my life to the Costa Blanca for 8 weeks and I
>> have to fill my allowable 10Kg hand luggage allowance with books just to make up
>> the weight.
>>
Perhaps you could post the legacylad packing list? I struggle to get the suitcase shut if I am going for a night away in Weybridge!
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going on a weeks cruise on Thursday. A week ok. Ihave had to increase MY luggage allowance becuase hers wont fit. She has 20, I have 25, 10kg of her will go in mine giving her 30.
30kg, For a week.
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Where are going? With whom? From where?
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>> Where are going?
Carribean
>>With whom?
A Woman
>>From where?
Bridgetown Barbados
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>> >>With whom?
>>
>> A Woman
I meant which cruise line.
I expect you knew that. Awkward so and so.
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>>
>> >> >>With whom?
>> >>
>> >> A Woman
>>
>> I meant which cruise line.
Marrella Celebration. A small boat, and an old boat, but one we like. Its not a floating Las Vegas, its doesn't have 10thousand souls on board, but its big enough and occupied enough to not sit with the same people at dinner, and the ability to avoid them. The food is good, the crew is good, the cabins are comfortable, its pretty stable for its size and it doesn't vibrate much. The evening show is good, the bars are cozy, all in all its a very pleasant floating hotel with a new port of call every day.
This is probably its last year, its sister was broken up late last year.
We have a day trip to Mustique booked, to look at the more hedonistic side of life.
Upon return I am probably off for my surgery, so its the perfect timing.
Last edited by: Zero on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 13:00
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I went on teh Celebration a couple of times when it was Thomson. Enjoyed it, and their cruises are really good value in my opinion, mostly without the fish and chip brigade, and (for me) the undesirable pretentiousness of some other cruise lines.
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>> Marrella Celebration.
>>
You are going to have so much fun with your dinner companions discussing Brexit and Expectation of Life
"Keep walking. It's that couple from Tunbridge Wells. Pretend you haven't seen them".
I am going at the end of May, by which time there will be feral packs of council house tenants roaming the streets scavenging for food.
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I travel a lot, always have. Down to a sort of fine art with packing.
I wear my faithful old Barbour jacket ( actually I have 3 FOBJs but only take one at a time ) an RL polo shirt, Replay jeans and a pair of Timberland boots. Add a scarf and gloves if winter. I pack, two more polos, one more pair of jeans, underwear and socks for 3 days and a pair of Crockett and Jones suede chelsea boots to alternate with the Timbies.
If away for more than 3 days, I get the hotel to launder the stuff I've worn.
Very much of the mindset that if you buy good you only have to buy occasionally, the kit will take abuse and I can operate on a "capsule" wardrobe.
Last edited by: Runfer D'Hills on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 11:35
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Mother in law went on a cruise recently and I’m not saying she has a big behind but when examining her luggage and finding her underwear, the customs offices exclaimed that she didn’t need to bring her own sail!
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>
>> take one at a time ) an RL polo shirt, Replay jeans and a pair
>> of Timberland boots.
I guess the yellow boots means you don't need to pack the hi-viz.
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I imagine LL alternates between a Borat mankini and budgie smugglers when he's away.
Which was an unfortunate thought i can't now erase, because I've imagined what an old bloke might look like in such garments.
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Some French(?) swimming pools won't allow you in if you are wearing swimming shorts. you have to wear BS's.
Last edited by: Duncan on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 11:46
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>> Some French(?) swimming pools won't allow you in if you are wearing swimming shorts. you
>> have to wear BS's.
Pretty common 'par measure de hygiene'.
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Talking of BS’s....they seem more commonplace in the Canaries ( honestly, no pun intended) than mainland Spain. Especially amongst the older Germans and Spanish. And no, I dont think I’ve ever worn a pair on the beach. Or in the local swimming pool for a few decades.
For your future delectation, LLs ‘warm weather’ packing list....I travel with a good quality waterproof insulated jacket, either Phd or Salomon, fleece, a smart pair of walking trousers ( Haglofs) and decent tan leather Loakes shoes suitable for any occasion. I wouldnt dream of flying to warmer climes in trainer type things or sandals.
In my Jet2 10Kg cabin bag are one pair crusties, 1 pr socks, iPad & charger, Aquapac waterproof wallet large enough for my mobile and Anker battery pack, sunglasses, binoculars, Sealskinz waterproof gloves, wool beanie, sun hat, gym vest, gym shoes, trail shoes ( Hoka OneOnes) with 1 pr merino socks, 1x merino t, 1 x cotton t, 2 polo shirts, 2 s/s shirts, 1 l/s shirt, 1x swim shorts (Go Lite) 2x Walking shorts ( Haglofs) small umbrella, flip flops, Chaco walking/kayak/ rafting sandals, small rucsac, windproof Patagonia jacket which rolls up into the size of a small fist. 3 section Black Diamond trekking poles which fit diagonally across my hand baggage. Toiletries include lots of paracetamol & ibuprofen which are only available at great expense in pharmacies in Spain. Razor, savlon, plasters, micropore tape, Dr Bronners pure - Castile soap ( for washing clothes in sink) lip salve.
Shampoo, suncream, aftersun & toothpaste I buy airside at Boots LBA ( their Soltan brand has better uva protection than many of the more expensive brands).
If I need any more clothing I patronise a local animal charity shop...decent quality white M & S s/s shirts for special occasions can be picked up for a pittance. I often wonder how they got there...probably part of a deceased’s estate clearance.
That always weighs much less than 10Kg, especially if I stuff some of it in my jacket pockets.
Last edited by: legacylad on Sun 3 Feb 19 at 13:06
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I think last time I flew I managed 40odd kg, best I managed once was just short of 60kg.
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>lots of paracetamol & ibuprofen which are only available at great expense
>in pharmacies in Spain.
I bought some Ibuprofen at a pharmacy in Calpe a few months ago after I twisted my knee.
40 x 600mg tabs for about 3€
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Brexit Discussion - CGNorwich
