A while ago I was talking here about the price of central heating service contracts and saying that after a couple of years with Homeserve, I'd swapped to British Gas, as Homeserve's prices had increased so much.
I've paid the first debit to BG, but not had their first service and inspection yet.
Sod's Law applied very quickly, as we had a problem with the hot water function of our combi boiler - an Ideal Isar 24, which is almost certainly over ten years old. Most of its internals have corroded due to a leak from the flue, letting the condensed water vapour drain back down into the boiler.
The BG technician who called to fix the problem, showed us the damage, said that had the initial service and inspection been done, cover would have been refused and finally to add injury to the situation declared the boiler dangerous, cut it off from the gas supply and left us with a prohibition notice.(No hot water and no heating!)
A new boiler is needed, so thus started the miserable process of getting quote for a like for like swap (combi to combi and in the same location).
Naturally we have had a quote from BG, along with a local plumber, HelpLink, and on-line from Hassle Free Boilers and Boxt (awaiting confirmation from Boxt due to a non-standard flue run).
The prices are on the whole within a two to three hundred quid, although Hassle Free are quoting for a slightly higher output unit and Boxt are supplying a smart thermostat.
The price bracket is from £2125 to £2450,v EXCEPT for British Gas who want over £4000 for the same job. They are even proposing to charge over £500 for scaffolding, as the flue outlet is at upstairs ceiling level on the gable end of the house. All the other contractors are happy to use a ladder!
How do B.G. EVER get any jobs?
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With those price differentials I guess BG is just who some people go to without seeking other quotes.
At least it's warmed up so heating not so urgent a problem. But no hot water will be an issue.
Did you know the old boiler internals were corroded before this BG engineer arrived out of interest?
Hope you have it sorted soon.
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We went with No Hassle Boilers. They delivered as promised. We had a problem with the boiler last week. The installer turned up the next day and sorted it. For oil boilers they only install Grant. Know nothing about their gas boilers. The other factor, which may be of interest to you was that they turned the order round very quickly.
Last edited by: R.P. on Sat 7 Apr 18 at 21:10
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I'm told BG no longer have their own installers and that they pass each job out to the lowest quote. I've witnessed a result of that. The customer had to go to court to get the job done properly.
It's also alleged they pay their 'inspectors' a premium to condemn gas installations so new have to be fitted.
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Avoid BG at all costs (pardon the pun). It’s been a year or two since we’ve been involved in supplying a combi to a customer, but £1500.00 would sound enough to me.
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Think 'Large pole used to propel a barge'.
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I have the same boiler you have Roger.Ours must be about 9 years old.
These boilers must be regularly serviced they won't survive long without it.A lot of muck and corrosion builds up inside.
A lot of these providers regarding maintenance contracts it is hit and miss.We used to be with British Gas not anymore.Service intervals became longer and a lot of jokers end up at your house who couldn't care less.We are with Corgi home Plan Cover.I can't make up my mind yet to stay or not with them.We pay over twenty quid a month.
One of there contractors fixed our toilet.The syphon went faulty.The bit he forgot was to put a new seal when putting the top half back. Seal cost about 50 pence.Water leaking I got him back and end up telling him off and showed him the door.Rang the company and next day a young lad with all the gear in his van did a proper job.
Don't be ripped off Roger and don't pay 4 grand for a boiler.1500 to two thousand maximum.
I
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Hassle Free use Bosch Worcester for Gas. Their service contracts were very good when I had one.
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Standard on-line quotes assume that the boiler is on an outside wall with the flue exiting straight through the wall. Regrettably, our boiler is in an airing cupboard on our inside party wall. This means the flue disappears vertically into the loft space, runs across the width of the house for about 5 meters before exiting on the gable end of the house.
Hassle Free are quoting for a Veissmann 50W 29 KW boiler, including supplying and fitting the extra flue run. Included is a new Magna Clean filter (we already have one!), plus a Drayton Wiser Smart Control. Their price is a fixed and confirmed £2353.40
Help Link, after a survey on site are quoting £2453 for an Ideal 24 KW boiler. (not sure of the exact model)
Our local plumber is quoting £2410 for an Ideal Vogue 24 KW and £2840 for a Worcester Bosch Greenstar Classic. He does not take credit cards which is a negative as I want the flexibility of managing my finances for this unexpected outlay.
Boxt's automated on-line pricing, with no allowance for the extra flue run, is quoting a fixed £1870 for a Worcester Bosch Greenstar 30i., including a Honeywell Smart controller and a filter. I had a quick guesstimate from them on Friday of around £250 for the extra flue run, which ties in well with the Hassle Free costs for that part of the installation. I am phoning tomorrow to see if they can provide a fixed all-in price for the total installation.
Last edited by: Roger. on Sun 8 Apr 18 at 13:25
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I got a quote from Help Link. Unimpressed by the "surveyor"'s lack of knowledge (I'll have to e-mail a photo to the tech guys) when he called they wanted a massive 6.5k for an external boiler in lieu of the inside boiler. Hassle free were 2k lower.
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We've just had a Ferroli combi installed (£1600) , it's a 32kw model and "A" rated, but it's not a patch on the 30yr old Myson Midas B (25kw) that it replaced!
The Myson came on at 6 and off at 10, and could heat our living room to 25c, reaching a pleasant 22c about 8, the Ferroli comes on at the same time but by 10 has only reached 20-21, still an uncomfortable 17c at 8, and needing the fire to back it up! - progress bah!
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The Myson came on at 6 and off at 10, and could heat our living
>> room to 25c, reaching a pleasant 22c about 8,
if I had mine set that high I'd be in shorts with a cold drink trying to stay cool!
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Had a new W-B 18kW system boiler fitted just after Christmas - Cost £2050 all in, including a filter (that is totally not required on our system - as it's just a short loop to the Thermal Store which has a coil in it, so no iron parts, except in the boiler!). That ties in well with your cost given that we only needed a 1m straight flue extension - flue parts are ridiculously dear! If you get a W-B fitted by an approved agent, with a filter, it comes with a 10 year guarantee.
Look on the bright side - it's much cheaper than a car to buy, run and repair!!
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"Avoid BG at all costs....."
Alas, I have to concur with that advice. Our house was newly built in '98 and fitted with a much vaunted 'condensing' gas boiler. It proved pretty unreliable, however, and after breaking down over Christmas in its 3rd or 4th year, we took out a BG contract. The engineers seemed very good and able to respond quickly to any problems - but we noticed the price going up and up.
The boiler definitely needed its annual service to clean out all the muck produced by the burner otherwise, it would refuse to ignite. The service intervals seemed to be lengthening and then one year, the chap just gave the boiler a cursory wipe, checked the exhaust gases with some sort of analyser and tested the CO alarm. When I asked him why he hadn't done a proper service, he said that it was now policy to simply do a quick safety check and wait until the boiler broke down. I was livid and rang BG to find out what was going on; I explained that when I take my car in for a 'service', I expect the technician to do more than just flick a duster over the bonnet and sound the hooter.
While I was contemplating my next move, the boiler broke down again during a period when we were having the kitchen completely re-vamped ....... just what we didn't need. The BG chap came out and, as the kitchen-fitters had temporarily disconnected the condensation tube under the sink, the boiler was condemned. We decided to replace the boiler, and sought quotes from 3 possible suppliers.........
A local chap, recommended by a friend quoted £1600 for a new 'Ideal' boiler, magnetic filter, and a 'power flush'. Our old boiler was also an Ideal, but I was assured that the new ones were fine - I could have paid more and chosen something else if I preferred. Both my wife and I took an instant dislike to the second chap; he'd done the 'official' connecting up of the gas hobs in the kitchen, but he seemed a bit too full of himself* - we fought shy of even asking for a quote.
And then, the BG chap came ...... even after the '£400 scrappage' discount plus another £400(?) for having a service contract, it still came to £3000+ for the same as the first chap - apart from a slightly higher priced boiler. We mentioned that we'd already had a quote (but didn't say what it was), and the BG chap looked crestfallen; he seemed to know that if anyone else had quoted, then he wouldn't stand a chance.
So we went with the local chap who did a first-rate job. I knew that the water in the system would have been pretty clear as we'd had a power-flush a few years earlier and when I asked, he said that he had already seen that, and he wouldn't need to do the power-flush. In the end, it came to about £1350. I wonder if the BG machine would have responded similarly if they'd encountered a system that didn't need flushing. *What is more, the chap who did the job identified a gas-leak in the area of the gas hob ...... mmm!
If you find a good boilerman/plumber, treat him like gold dust!
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So what was the point of paying £20 plus a month for your boler to be serviced by Homeserve and to cover you in the event of greakdown if at the end of the day they seem to have done neither. Had you put that money away for ten years you would have had enough to buy a replacement boiler.
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In case anyone wonders, we sought quotes from numerous local companies. Only one responded asking for photos of the pipework, no further response from them. At least Hassle Free used a localish installer.
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"in the event of greakdown"
Spare-time ventriloquist? Gottle o' geer, gottle o' geer.
;-)
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...it's when his goiler goes gelly-up.....
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what a load of old gollocks.
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>> ...it's when his goiler goes gelly-up.....
>> That's easy for you to say.
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Our 20 year old Potterton boiler went TU on the morning that the Beast from the East arrived. It had warmed up the house and water and then quit. I tried ringing round local CH engineers but only one of approx half a dozen I called actually answered the phone. They quoted an earliest visit in about a week. I sat down and Googled boiler repairs.
I found a guy called 'Mike the Boiler Man' who lives in Reading and specialises in repairing boilers rather than installing new ones. He also carries spares that other boiler outfits will claim are no longer available. He promised to be here the following afternoon and managed to fix it in about an hour. Total cost £500 (he charges for travel time) including a new control board and a replacement spark unit.
I asked about new boilers and he told me that new boilers have a typical lifespan of 10 to 15 years and that he gets the least callouts for Vaillant.
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Our boiler is built into a gas Rayburn. It's 21 years old, not sure who made the boiler but the man who services it says to keep it, as the "new ones" don't last.
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I went with BOXT, who are fitting a Worcester Bosch Greenstar 30i for an all-in cost of £2020, to include the extra flue run (£150) which as it's 5 m. needs a slightly larger diameter pipe.
Best of all, I ordered today and it's being fitted tomorrow at sparrow fart,
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Good choice Roger.Hope all goes well with installation.
I looked at your list above and my decision would have
been the same as yours, Boxt trust pilot ratings are excellent and the price is right.
I had a WB Greenstar condensing boiler fitted a couple of years ago . It brought our heating costs down by 25 percent so will pay for itself in another couple of years.Also a lot quieter than our old boiler
Fitting was by a plumber who is used regularly as a sub contractor by my nephew who is a builder.Only problem was when the plumbers mate accidently drilled through a cable taking out the lights. An electrician was called by the plumber and the problem repaired the same day at no cost to me.
Last edited by: helicopter on Mon 9 Apr 18 at 13:32
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Plus, subject to confirmation,, there's £42.42 to come from Top Cashback :-)
And ............we have had, two minutes ago, a phone call from their installer to confirm his appointment tomorrow!
Last edited by: Roger. on Mon 9 Apr 18 at 17:59
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I nearly forgot - I paid for it with my M & S interest free (for about 7 or 8 more months) credit card, thereby earning M & S points vouchers!
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>> I nearly forgot - I paid for it with my M & S interest free
>> (for about 7 or 8 more months) credit card, thereby earning M & S points
>> vouchers!
So it's not real money!
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My boiler is 34 yrs old - living on borrowed time as the maker went out of business a few years back. Parts were available from a few sources - now very limited - 5 yrs back Fan was £35, then about £60 & 6 mths ago £146.
A bit like the calipers for my late Xedos - they were typically about £80.00 - no longer made & the last one - a refurbed one was £140.
I sold it 3+ years ago for £500 - it would have been 19 year old BUT the beggar that bought it ran it for 20K miles & never looked at it - it blew up lack of water/oil I am led to believe - it did not leak or burn oil her in the 15 years I had it.
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There must be an economic case for replacement by now !
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Mine isn't quite that old, nearly 30 years and it's a Potterton I think. We used to have BG annual plan and every year they'd say they can't get parts for it any more, but it never needed any parts.
Since then my neighbour has trained as a Corgi (now Gas Safe?) plumber and does my servicing etc. He had the same boiler put in at about the same time but has since replaced it, probably more due to a complete re-design of his kitchen - and also because he can do it himself!
He says to allow maybe £2.5k for a replacement, without a major relocation but it would need some flue work. But he's also convinced me that the newer boilers really only have a life expectancy of around 10 years so I should leave changing mine will it is beyond economic repair, even though it is considerably less efficient to run. I'm happy with that advice...
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The boiler we had before this combi boiler was a small Gloworm Boiler for over twenty years.The thermal coupling needed replacing every four years not a big job.
We had a tank in the loft and an emergen heater in the cupboard upstairs.
There was a scheme where the boiler was replaced for free for a combi boiler.We used it about seven years ago.
You could make a combi boiler last longer than ten years.Regular service and replace parts when needed.I still put a anti corrosion agen through the boiler into the central heating system.I do this once a year.Our radiators are getting on now 34 years still give off a good heat.Probably more luck than anything else tough wood.
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IIRC he thought the condensing unit would almost inevitably degrade (rust?) at around 10 years.
No evidence to say he's right though. But it meant I haven't rushed into it.
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I know loads of 10 year old condensing boilers still going strong. My own for example. Its broken once when it burned up its igniter.
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The one in our old house was 10 year old Grant. Serviced every year it was in first class condition/
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Bit like yer self guvnor?
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I have a potential customer at the mo who WILL NOT be swayed from using BG for a boiler replacement. I give up..
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This is my BG story...
Been a BG customer for years (not a great one for shopping around for energy), last month received a letter from BG (not a bill) nearly just threw it in the bin, then I read it..
BG had signed me up for their Homecare service and that I should book my 'free' boiler service asap.
They didn't know that I had not long had my boiler replaced by a local recommended fitter (W-B Greenstar).
So I rang BG and spoke to them....apparently as I'm classed as a loyal customer they've given me Homecare for 'free'... I asked them to remove it, I didn't ask for it or want it (no such thing as a free lunch).
CS really didn't want to take it off, they kept saying 'but it's free!'... yeah right! I bet in a years time it will suddenly become chargeable.
I had already arranged for the fitter to do a yearly service.
Confirmed it had been removed with a letter.
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I signed up for something like Homecare earlier in the year. It was £1.xx a month for 12 months. Made sure I diarised the date by which I need to cancel it...
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Boxt's fitters (from Wakefield) arrived at 08.00 yesterday and worked without a break until about 16.00.
They did a very tidy job.
I have an issue with the programming and Wi-Fi access of the included Honeywell wireless thermostat to enable use of the Android "Lyric" app for remote control.
I dropped an email yesterday evening to Boxt and had a phone call this morning at 09.00 ,promising a phone call from their electronics expert, which was received about a couple of hours later.
The upshot is that said electronic engineer is visiting us tomorrow morning, to either fix the problem, or install a new thermostat.
So far it's been truly 5* service from Boxt, who were the most competitive too.
If they do sort the thermostat as promised, I shall not hesitate to give them a glowing review on Trust Pilot.
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The BOXT electrical specialist visited us this morning and set up both the thermostat and the Honeywell Lyric phone app.
He was so knowledgeable and patient, too.
Great service and a great price: I could not ask for more.
Highly recommended.
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Very useful bit of kit Roger. We have a NEST thermostat - this allows you to control the boiler from the App. We used this feature travelling home from a gig, turn heating from the phone It can be set to "learn" your habits, ideal - it comes on at 830am on a Sunday without asking ! - Useful feature it "knows" when you're out (via our phones) so won't come on unbidden. We used it for 77 hours last month. Roughly 20 hours a week. Backed up with a roaring log fire it is great.
Last edited by: R.P. on Thu 12 Apr 18 at 12:38
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Looks like you made a good choice Roger this company is based in Leeds and the prices are fair.
I was at the plumbers yesterday had a look at Ariston boilers Top of the Range a thousand pounds with a twelve- year quarantee.Heat exchanger stainless steel.
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Boiler woes :=/ - rtj70
