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-“We don't have a share buying thread.†(Duncan)
Maybe this one will serve.
-“ >> I only invest what I can afford to lose
->> without materially affecting my lifestyle.
-Are you sure you aren't talking about gambling? (Manatee)â€
All investing is a gamble in that losses can always happen.
Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 23 May 17 at 10:15
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You've lost me already.
I thought someone was buying a whole bank the other day......I didn't realise I was in company with such rich people.
*walks away whistling*
Pat
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I was thinking about investing in some banks because the potential rise in interest rates is usually good for them. Energy companies are similar in my opinion but do not invest on my advise - do your own research - as I have lost a small fortune recently!
Work have just switch us to a new division and now we now need permission from our boss and the securities team before buying, selling or transferring any securities including shares and if permission is given then you have only 24 hours to execute the transaction.
The ban extends to all family / partners in the household.
Right pain in the proverbial as I don't want my boss knowing what holdings I have and they can actually refuse permission (a colleague wanted to sell some shares a while back and was banned from doing so and lost several thousand pounds).
Unfortunately breaking terms of employment can result in the authorities actually marking my file for 7 years and presenting the info to prospective employers meaning it would be impossible for me to get another job in the industry.
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I take it you work in the financial industry zippy?
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>> I take it you work in the financial industry zippy?
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Yes, B2B and wouldn't dream of investing in a company that I knew inside information on. It is just not worth it. Existing laws are tough enough but most financial institutions have to "gold plate" them to protect themselves!
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I have a few GSK shares at the moment, I've had quite a few in the past as well, I've always found them to be quite a safe bet! but they've fallen a bit sharpish of late, since the Trump revelations I presume!
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I don't bother with picking individual shares but just go with funds instead. Up 18% this year after all charges and the such like deducted. Not bad.
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So how do you pick which funds, or even which sectors? No science in it for me, I pretty much just go with a gut feeling.
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An IFA takes care of that sort of thing.
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Ah my best mate was one of them and I am not convinced it was much more than guesswork from him, but he dressed it up nicely :-) I suppose he had years of experience which helps...
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Well he does right by me, and I'm pretty sure i wouldn't have found the funds that he did and I'm sure i wouldn't have made the profit on my own that he did, plus he charges mates rates. So I've got no complaints at all. 18% after charges isn't to be sniffed i don't think.
Last edited by: sooty123 on Thu 12 Jan 17 at 15:30
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18% growth is magnificent. I have got 17% in income after charges.
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That is an excellent increase, despite a toppy market.
My IFA pal retired, and the 'replacement' company want me to move my small private pension. The actual fund value ( bearing in mind it's not a lot) actually increased by 17% over 12 months according to a recent statement. It will be interesting to hear his reasoning when we meet next week.
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I wasn't having a pop at IFAs and I think they do a good job (as long as they are winning for you!) but I'm just not sure their forecasting skills far exceed those of the Fish man (or anyone else for that matter). I guess it's around knowing the fund market well.
LL there was something in the financial press a week or so back that talked about valuations for some pensions are going through the roof, up to 80x salary. Mate's wife (in banking) has just got a valuation of nearly 40x on a modest pension. Last time I checked mine was about 9x which isn't enough for me to consider cashing it in. 20x upwards would do it... but I doubt that will happen!!
IFA mate says it's likely to be because the rules for delivering a final salary pension are ever more complex and onerous, and therefore they are becoming more expensive to deliver therefore companies would prefer to buy you out. Dunno if he's right.
Industry advice always used to be (apparently) never ever ever move a pension as it's money in the bank. I got that advice from three independent sources when I was questioning it just before I stopped work. Subsequently one of them changed his mind for his own pension, and cashed it in!!
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>>Cashing in pensions...
An ex colleague with 30 years in a final salary scheme and on a high salary (over £80k) has just been offered £1.6m as a buy out.
He is very tempted. What would the tax implications be?
I am kicking myself I left the same company 15 years ago with a tiny final pension. Salaries there shot up after I left! ;-(
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My final salary pension which I no longer contribute to has quite a bit in there. Been looking at the estimate of the transfer out figure. I have colleagues who are approaching the £1m mark with theirs! It seems to have short up recently - maybe it is time to take it out.
So add my current pension pot (not final salary) to the other and it would soon approach an amount that might be worth having in one place. The final salary one is estimated to pay about £12k pa but not for a long time yet so maybe moving the lump sum makes sense to get it earlier.
Trouble is you need to seek financial advice before transferring out. And apparently that's not cheap.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Thu 12 Jan 17 at 17:13
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What would the tax implications be?
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>> 49 or 50
Never met the man or likely to.
But I feel I'd probably dislike him.
A lot.
;-)
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>> But I feel I'd probably dislike him.
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>> A lot.
He is annoyingly likable!
Appearance wise you would mistake him for a bricky and knows his stuff with numbers and financial performance. I think computers made him (would be illiterate without Word and Excel handles all of the complex maths).
He has a lovely house and very beautiful wife - ho hum!!!
What is really annoying is that I trained him!
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 13 Jan 17 at 01:38
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I suppose he drives a decent motor as well ?
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>> I suppose he drives a decent motor as well ?
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No, we have been told in another thread that rich people drive old wrecks because they don't mind them getting scratched, and have nothing to prove anyway.
It's only uncertain wannabes who drive decent motors.
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>>Never met the man or likely to.
Bumped in to an acquaintance at a finance seminar a couple of weeks back. He works with the other chap who got the £1.6m offer.
He is 50 and settled his pension. The employer fixed it a couple of years back and the final salary doesn't apply to new earnings.
The final offer was......£2.3m.
He has transferred it out to a reputable investment co that guarantees him the same pension or more and doubles the pay out to his missus should he die first.
He expects to take the maximum allowed out (25%?) out at 55 and retire.
Not fair!
Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 18 Apr 17 at 01:59
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I wouldn't take it out - I'd transfer it to another pension pot. I wouldn't take it out totally.
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For me it all depends on the multiples. As I said, mine was only about 9x last time I looked, payable fro 65. So if I live beyond 74 then I am quids in. As I have other pensions in funds I intend leaving my pension as a pension (at the moment), to give me a guaranteed basic income alongside the state pension.
For IHT planning, it is very efficient to have it in a SIPP or similar (not an annuity!).
Final salary pension will pay a reduced widows etc pension once the pension holder dies but once the widow croaks that's it, it disappears. If you have it in a SIPP (maybe wrong terminology) you can choose where it is invested, and once you croak whatever is left just becomes part of the estate. So my mate above took something like £800k which is currently earning him enough to not touch the capital (although the draw down attracts tax, not unreasonably - but there are ways to minimise this).
We were friends with a couple who had been BA cabin crew for most of their lives and had very good pensions. He retired around 60 and took his pension for 2 years then unfortunately died, and she has only lasted an additional couple of years. Those pensions are now gone - the kids get nothing.
There would normally be a fairly sizeable cost to transfer from an occupational scheme (related to size of transfer), and while it may seem a lot (I think they were talking about min £6k when I was looking at it) the benefits can easily pay for that. Depends on your circumstances really.
Regarding pots over £1m - there is a lifetime allowance but it's not something I know about. I believe the excess over a certain amount if taxed fairly heavily.
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I think the LTA is currently £1.25m - a few high earning GPs have retired sooner than they wanted to as they were about to breach the limit.
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>> mine was only about 9x last time I looked
9 x the salary you had then? Or worth 9 x the annual pension it is going to pay out?
>> For IHT planning, it is very efficient to have it in a SIPP
This is something I am aware of. My final salary pension would pay a 50% rate pension to my wife if I was drawing it down (what about before?). And then nothing. There's quite a lot of money in it. To my surprise.
I too think there's a percentage cost to transfer which when you're talking hundreds of thousands of pounds could be quite a bit.
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The lump sum in my pension pot is about 21 x the annual pension payment that they say I'd get (which is higher in one screen than I said above). And I'll not get any of it for nearly 20 years to get the sum they promise. You can see why I might want to move it.
Well I could take it when 55. But a bit less money per annum of course.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Thu 12 Jan 17 at 21:57
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I took my 25% tax free lump sum from my private pension when I was 54. Minimum age now increased to 55. Sold the old Mazda 626 to a friend for £950, and spent it all on a 6yo 330 for sub £10k, which I sold 6 years later to my nephew for £5k.
I'm no financial wizard but spending sensible money on something you really enjoy was a no brainer. Since then I've been drawing some down every year to maximise my single persons tax free allowance ( part time retail doesn't pay well). They can't take away great memories of money well spent!
Hope you make the right decision...
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If I leave it in a final salary pension then there's no option of draw down (I think). Cash lump sum possible at the start. Maybe a lot more flexible to take it to another pension fund?
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That sounds about right, but seeing as I only paid into my private pension for about 8 years before coming to my senses and deciding to have a larger mortgage instead, I couldn't say for definite. I know nothing.
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Rob, I guess you mean the transfer value of your final salary pension is about 21x your pension? In which case it would seem logical to me to move it but if you left it as a pension you can get 25% tax free lump sum plus a steady guaranteed annual income, which is also quite attractive, if you don't need the lump sum up front.
Moving it to your own fund does give you more flexibility about how it is invested and how you draw it down, and is usually better for IHT, but there could be some tax liabilities. That's why professional advice is good.
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>> I guess you mean the transfer value of your final salary pension is about 21x your pension?
Yes that's correct. But in one area (the transfer estimate) it says pension is one figure and another screen has it as more. Since I looked just before Christmas the pension transfer fund had gone down about £45k and now back up a bit.
I also have the other pension fund that gets about 25% salary equivalent paid into (I pay 5%).
One reason I intend looking into this is the IHT angle. Or to be more precise inheritance.
The fact I am 46 means I can't access the money for a while anyway.
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For the past six months I've had a substantial sum invested in KENV. The share had been going nowhere, so having bought at 4p I sold last month at 5p, and made 15% after spread prices & costs taken into account.
Today I had an email from a friend who enquired if I still held. Today they closed at 14p. That would have been a 300% gain! And just to add insult to injury, I decided to spread the risk with the available funds and bought four shares. Every one is down...RBG, DEB, BNN & FAM.
Would you believe it.....
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Re KENV. Have they found new deposits of Tantalite in South Africa? 14.75 at the close.
Last edited by: Duncan on Fri 20 Jan 17 at 05:42
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>>Would you believe it.....
You are refreshingly honest, LL.
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I have always thought that it's never wrong to take a profit, no matter how small. Within the past 12 months I've had two dabbles in KENV and made 15% net on both occasions, which in the normal run of things would be most satisfactory. But then to lose out on a 300% gain only weeks after disposal....
My other mining sector holdings are IRON & FAM. I bet they do nothing. Just like my long term holding in EDEN
Pah. At least I woke up so I'm fortunate. One musnt grumble, onwards and upwards
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Missed this thread re the chap with 1.8m pension.
It's not really a matter of 'taking it out'. It's a matter of locking it in by moving it to another pension fund.
The employer is trying to fix its liabilities, so they don't grow any further. Therefore they're offering him the current value of his pension fund. Presumably it is closed to new accruals, they mostly are. The company pension fund is probably mostly in gilts - in order to 'minimise' the risk. He can then put it into equities.
He should ask for 20% more, it's a negotiating position the company is offering.
And he should take their offer if they refuse to increase, and transfer it into an SIPP where he can invest in equities.
If interest rates go up then the amount he's being offered will go down. Colleague of mine retired and was given about £5m. Whilst he had worked here for about 30 years that was 30 years of his final salary.
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Makes my investments of £1k here, £2k there seem small! I've just cut my losses on one share and bought another... took me almost two hours deciding whether to stay in cash or invest elsewhere. The fun of the chase....
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My bank shares are doing rather well at the moment, and if they keep up the current momentum they'll soon be worth what I paid for them almost 3 years ago.
:-(
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Mine aren't worth what I paid for them in 2007 and they took another hit in June 2016!
Left them in because I don't need the money at the moment.
I know someone in a similar situation who keeps buying more to "average down the share price". I understand what he is doing but the logic is beyond me!
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And me. This "pound cost averaging" is often recommended by pundits but can as easily result in averaging up as down.
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I don't think "chasing the price downwards" is the same as "pound cost averaging".
The first is a gambling ploy - you have seen your punt misfire and drop rather than rise, but you still believe it will eventually turn and come up trumps, so you throw in some more money, arguing, perhaps misguidedly, that "when" it does you will make an even bigger gain than originally.
Pound cost averaging is a long term investment strategy where you pick a share or a fund that has a good history of steady growth performance, but its price naturally fluctuates around what you believe to be a prospective steady rise, over time.
So you invest a certain affordable sum per month, regardless of the price, and leave it for 5, 10 years. In that time, if your basic assumption is correct, then it doesn't matter if sometimes the price has dropped, because your £x goes further and you pick up more units per pound. If it's risen then you automatically buy fewer.
It's safer and less stressful process than constantly following the market and anxiously trying to guess when exactly to feed in some more money.
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I have some questions for share buying....
When buying shares via a registrar company, do they actually buy the shares or take a gamble - i.e. I don't want to have to check the credit worth of the registrar, I want to know the shares are real?
I buy shares monthly from work in two ways. The first is SAYE which gives a set buying price, a set monthly saving a set period and a set final number of shares. The value of shares at the end is not fixed but if they are lower than the set price you can get your money back. This is almost a non-losing proposition at the moment because interest rates are so low. The monthly payment is taken after tax.
The other method is SIP, a monthly saving taken from pay before tax so its quite efficient. The amount you can save is more limited but you have to keep the shares for 5 years or pay tax on them. When I get a report from a registrar on the number of shares purchased the rate seems quite poor based on the prices I see on line. The registrar reports that they don't buy all the shares at once so as not to create a spike in the market and allocate purchases at an averaged price. I am not convinced that they are not "skimming". How can I check this?
Last edited by: zippy on Sat 21 Jan 17 at 17:12
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>>Pound cost averaging is a long term investment strategy where you pick a share or a fund that has a good history of steady growth performance, but its price naturally fluctuates around what you believe to be a prospective steady rise, over time.
Very much the strategy that I have followed for a good few decades. It takes a lot of skill and time to judge when to buy and sell plus you've got to have the interest in doing it. There are those who treat it as a hobby. For the vast majority of private investors it's best to buy good quality equities that produce an acceptable yield and reinvest the dividends. My best strategy has been to ignore conventional instinct, for example after the Banking crisis in 2008 my missus and I filled our boots. When shares are cheap it's a good time to buy, same as we did with BP after the Mexico disaster, although those have taken longer to recover. Buy decent quality and hold. Trying to judge when to buy or sell is too tricky for the average investor.
Last edited by: The Melting Snowman on Sat 21 Jan 17 at 18:48
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Buy decent quality and hold. Trying to judge when to buy or sell is
>> too tricky for the average investor.
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I think that's a good plan, don't they say it's time in the market not timing the market that matters.
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>>they say it's time in the market not timing the market that matters.
So how much longer have I got to hold on to my Lloyd's bank shares?
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>> >>they say it's time in the market not timing the market that matters.
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>> So how much longer have I got to hold on to my Lloyd's bank shares?
Well, I may have kicked this off on the 10th Jan, with this:-
www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?t=23682&m=522470&v=e
How much did you pay for them, Tom?
Poisonally, I would, at this moment in time, after what you have been through, etc, etc, I would keep them
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>>How much did you pay for them, Tom?
I can't remember, I bought them when they were first released.
I fared a little better with BT shares that I bought when they were first privatised. Sold some when they hit £13, but then bought them back when they dropped to £9 and now...................
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>>I fared a little better with BT shares that I bought when they were first privatised. Sold some when they hit £13, but then bought them back when they dropped to £9 and now...................
Do not, repeat not, take investment advice from me.
Lloyds and BT....................................................................
..........................................
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>> So how much longer have I got to hold on to my Lloyd's bank shares?
>>
How about selling when you need the money, or swap now to something else if you can't tolerate the wait or the risk.
Below are some high yielding (based on last 12 months dividends) companies if you want to target good income rather than potential capital gain
Royal Dutch Shell B 6.57%
BP 6.49%
Capita 6.29%
Vodafone 6.11%
HSBC Holdings 6.08%
SSE 5.97%
Legal & General 5.85%
Last edited by: BrianByPass on Sun 22 Jan 17 at 19:03
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There would be a degree of risk in holding any single share just to benefit from the divvy, and also while you may "win" on the divvy the share price (i.e. your capital) may reduce in value. (Some of your examples have virtually doubled in value and others have virtually halved).
But I guess if your particular SIPP is geared up for share holdings then you could hold a basket of shares to spread the risk.
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> So how much longer have I got to hold on to my Lloyd's bank shares?
>>
Perhaps it doesn't work for individual shares, i don't invest in them they're not for me.
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>> So how much longer have I got to hold on to my Lloyd's bank shares?
>>
Motley Fool says:-
tinyurl.com/zfy8guv
I would have thought that you have now had the loss. If you sell now you will be selling near the bottom.
Buy, or Hold, not a Sell.
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Your link is somewhat historic, Duncan.
Do keep up.
;-)
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Bathtub tom asked a while back:-
>> So how much longer have I got to hold on to my Lloyd's bank shares?
>>
Have I related the story of an acquaintance of mine who is in the banking industry?
He said some years ago 'Lloyds Bank - yeah, worth a punt, they are about a quid now'.
uk.finance.yahoo.com/quote/LLOY.L?p=LLOY.L
What does he know?
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>> What does he know?
In my most humble opinion, the company seem to be doing rather better than that reflected in the price of their shares.
But what do know; I'm no expert...
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OK it's not many, I have a few shares in BT, inherited from my father who worked for them (and predecessors) for 50+ years. I have never sold them for sentimental reasons.
Looked at the value this morning out of curiosity and they are down nearly 20% because of some liability in Italy.
Complex thing international business.
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Hmmm I wonder if it's time for a quick dip in BT then. I have some Thomas Cook shares which aren't doing much...
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Sounds grim for BT, current share price down and they've warned that future profits look bad, seems well of customers have stopped buying BT products (heard this on R4 on drive home).
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BT are also putting up prices so some customers will leave. Even if in a contract you can move because of the price increases.
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I have a dividend reinvestment plan for Royal Mail.
Registrar says there is no tax credit certificate as dividends paid by DRIP are not taxable?
Is this true? I was convinced all dividends are taxable even if re-invested!
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>> Is this true?
I very much doubt it, unless it's in some kind of ISA package.
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It does sound very odd and worth checking with HMRC.
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>> Is this true? I was convinced all dividends are taxable even if re-invested!
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All dividends? Not true.
Changed in Osborne's summer July 2015 budget.
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Had an email from a bank this morning. Has anyone else heard about an increase in FSCS compensation levels for savers?
I can't find anything on the FSCS website to confirm this.
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Fri 27 Jan 17 at 12:06
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From 30th January 2017 it will be £85,000 according to my employer's website. Can't provide an internal link but the Guardian....
www.theguardian.com/money/2016/nov/21/fscs-protection-revised-back-to-85000-bank-of-england-brexit
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>> Had an email from a bank this morning. Has anyone else heard about an increase
>> in FSCS compensation levels for savers?
>>
>> I can't find anything on the FSCS website to confirm this.
>
Yes: due to fall in sterling (EU fixes amount in Euros..)
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The FSCS compensation levels may go back up because of the devaluation of the GBP post Brexit vote. It is set at €100k which was taken to be £85k. Then the £ strengthened and it dropped to £75k. It was announced last November the PRA was discussing it going back to £85k from the end of January 2017. Countries are meant to review the level every 5 years.
Maybe it's been agreed it will go back up then?
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Thanks for the info, chaps.
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I mentioned Serica Energy (SQZ) recently - it had jumped to 20p ish. It has now broken resistance and is now 22.5p as I write.
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Yep you mentioned it in the Lloyds thread, and I responded < 2hrs later to say they'd gone up 20% that very morning. Good result, well done.
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As predicted by Rob the savings guarantee limit has gone up to £85,000. www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-38770907
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Does anyone here pay money for any of the investment newsletter things, or supposed get-rich-quick schemes? I get offers from different sources and have sometimes been tempted but always hung onto my money, but I'm curious to know whether their advice, be it actual share tips or systems, is worth spending money on.
I'm also interested where or how some of you alight on non main-stream investments, particularly shocks, such as Madf's Serica Energy, as I'd never heard of them let alone thought of investing in them.
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I've subscribed to MichaelWalters.com for many years. Around £70pa, with a very active 'Bulletin Board'.
Also Paul Scotts stockopedia... free daily emails on wide ranging equities, or pay for full reports & analysis.
Anyone been brave enough to buy BT in the past few days? I've some spare cash in my ISA wrap having sold LAKE yesterday after holding for ten days and made 15% net. I dabble in small amounts so only a small gain, but hey!
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Ha, yep, I bought BT yesterday but I realise it could be for the long term...
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Plenty of advice in the weekend quality papers. I like the Telegraph best. The FT has rather too much information for a novice but is good for the advanced investor. Sites such as Morningstar, Digitallook and iii let you set up dummy portfolios, where you can try out your ideas in action but with nil risk, although you can trade cheaply with iii when y are ready and it has bulletin board and other useful stuff. There is plenty more on offer free from joining Motely Fool, but you have to pay a sub for detailed information.
In short, the familiar research problem: far from a shortage on information, there is usually far too much.
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<< Ha, yep, I bought BT yesterday but I realise it could be for the long term..>>
And I sold BT - last week!
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Just ditched the BT shares (@ £3.3592), managed exactly 8% net of costs. I was hoping for more but mustn't grumble :-) I think they will carry on generally upwards but too slow for my liking now, and I over-achieved on my target.
Last edited by: smokie on Fri 24 Feb 17 at 09:02
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>> Does anyone here pay money for any of the investment newsletter things, or supposed get-rich-quick
>> schemes? I get offers from different sources and have sometimes been tempted but always hung
>> onto my money, but I'm curious to know whether their advice, be it actual share
>> tips or systems, is worth spending money on.
>>
>> I'm also interested where or how some of you alight on non main-stream investments, particularly
>> shocks, such as Madf's Serica Energy, as I'd never heard of them let alone thought
>> of investing in them.
>>
Serica are invested in N Sea. They bought an interest from Shell who are selling more.. see today's DT Business News..
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Serica have now trebled from my purchase price.
Patience needed .. lots to come..
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I mentioned on here a year or two ago that my infrequent calls to HMRC have always been answered without delay. Well, yet another call was necessary just a few days ago, at a time of year when I would have expected them to be extremely busy, they're response was immediate and my somewhat detailed query was resolved there and then by a most courteous and knowledgeable advisor.
Credit where credit is due.
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>> Credit where credit is due.
>>
I decided that I was capable of filing Mrs B's accounts with HMRC and companies house, despite being told it was too difficult, and you really should pay an accountant £400+ to do it.
I'm glad I had a go - much easier than I was expecting, and found the HMRC website fairly easy to navigate and lots of good help.
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Sold all my Serica @22.4p..
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The bloke in the telegraph is plugging Lloyds Bank shares again:-
For those of a nervous disposition it's a link to an article in the Telegraph.
tinyurl.com/jlyazzw
I would be happier if I didn't feel that he was plugging shares that he already holds.
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FWIW, after holding LAKE for ten days and making a small profit, just before close of trading yesterday I reinvested in GATC.
Not a recommendation of course. I've bought some right dogs in the past 15 months!
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Bought them all back last week...
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Serica? You could almost day trade in them, they always seem to shoot up early in the day and fall back at the end. 7.something % up today.
Unfortunately the ISA fund which my share dealing money is in pretty much prevents day trading - although the sale of stocks is immediate, the funds aren't available for 2 - 3 days, and they also only list pretty much FTSE100 companies.
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>>Fortunately the ISA fund which my share dealing money is in pretty much prevents day trading
Fixed it for you!
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>> Fixed it for you!
>>
He doesn't want it fixed. Where is the gambler's buzz in that? ;-)
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Uh? What? How? Where? :-)
Yeah I do like a punt...
Last edited by: smokie on Tue 28 Feb 17 at 10:26
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>> Uh? What? How? Where? :-)
>>
"day trade in them, they always seem to shoot up early in the day and fall back at the end."
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All surprisingly quiet on the forum over an outrageous budget. How do posters intend to protect their savings, now that the £5000 dividend allowance has been slashed to £2000?
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Most people I guess don't have insufficient investments in shares that are not in ISAs to be affected.
Make sure that you are using your ISA allowance ( and that of your wife if appropriate ) in full.
Otherwise you just have to grin and bear it.
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MAking max use of ISAs is one suggestion.
OTOH £5k in dividends implies capital in region of say £150k. Any outrage at the budget proposal, voiced by those affected, will come from a tiny minority.
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Well this (like all previous) governments can foul up like the rest of them.
The £5,000 allowance was introduced last year and I made some investment decisions based on it.
To reduce the allowance to £2,000 instantly makes my tax go up by £1,200. Seems like a deliberate trap to me. Do that to a couple of 100 thousand people and its almost a quarter of a billion in extra tax revenue!
I am not self employed but I think the rise in NI for the self employed is totally unfair as they don't get all of the benefits that employed people do (like unemployment benefit).
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>> I am not self employed but I think the rise in NI for the self
>> employed is totally unfair as they don't get all of the benefits that employed people
>> do (like unemployment benefit).
>>
An equally compelling case can be made of course that employers make a huge contribution to NI payments - The total contribution by the self employed is far smaller.
Logically the self employed should be paying an equivalent contribution if they are to receive the same benefits as the employed.
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>> I am not self employed but I think the rise in NI for the self
>> employed is totally unfair as they don't get all of the benefits that employed people
>> do (like unemployment benefit).
Isn't there a two way adjustment in that while SE class 4 contsd are rising class 2 contributions on profit are being abolished?
I believe there is a review under way looking at self employed and benefits. In last 25 years, and under governments of both stripes, the scope and duration of contributory benefits, particularly for the long term sick, has been repeatedly cut back.
While self employed don't get contributory benefits they still get the Income Related/Income Based equivalents if they're without any income. Cont based Job Seekers only lasts six months and Cont Based Employment and Support Alowance 12 (except for those placed in the Support Group.
They still get Child Tax Credit and can also get Working TAx Credit if their SE earnings are low enough. HMRC though are tightening up on that one moving towards an assumption that, once out of the start up phase, SE earnings will be equal to at least minimum wage.
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>>To reduce the allowance to £2,000 instantly makes my tax go up by £1,200.
Really? Have you calculated it? And if you have, I think you should go back and re-do the sums.
And I wonder what investment decisions you could have made on the back of it - that would otherwise give you a better tax result if you had taken a different decision.
Last edited by: Mapmaker on Mon 13 Mar 17 at 10:04
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>> Really? Have you calculated it? And if you have, I think you should go back
>> and re-do the sums.
I assume it's 40% of the £3k by which the allowance has been reduced. Are dividends taxed at a lower rate?
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7.5% for basic rate taxpayers; 32.5% for higher rate and 38.1% upper rate. Applied to the £3,000 that amounts to: £225; £975; £1,143.
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I would think it was to reduce the amount of people setting themselves up as a one man band company and taking a dividend instead of a wage. As others have mentioned the ISA allows 20k plus that again if your married. If you can save that per year, plus use 5k divdend allowence then I'd say your doing very well indeed and are a high earner. As that is so, it's likely to get much traction in kicking up a ffuss about it.
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As an ex IT contractor for 3 years following a career as an employee, I can tell you that contractors who are their own limited company do extremely well tax-wise, even without any of the dodgy mechanisms used by quite a few.
For starters, you pay yourself a salary just under the threshold for tax and NI which was somewhere around £700 pm. So you never ever pay any income tax or NI on your salary. The remainder can be taken as a dividend which is taxed lower than income tax, and with no NI liability.
As a result I don't think it will make that much difference to IT contract people.
Also IT contractors are usually pretty well paid, which takes care of the absence of holiday/sick pay and other benefits. During a period of unemployment I did get job seekers allowance but not the income based one.
There is new legislation coming in in the public arena to combat IR35 abuse and I think this this will have the effect of pushing people towards umbrella companies where they will pay tax etc like the rest of the population.
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Speaking of ISAs, I didn't know until this morning that any funds withdrawn during the current financial year can be paid back within this year without counting as a subscription.
In addition, I understand that any management fees levied by an ISA provider can also be paid back.
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Hammond has dropped NI changes prposed in spring budget recognising they breach manifesto comittments:
www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/15/philip-hammond-ditches-national-insurance-rise-for-self-employed
An honest politician?
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More like the PM had a word, what with brexit coming up won't do to have the backbenchers too riled up.
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Surely May have been "in the know" before the announcement was made. More like a backtrack, or a climbdown if you prefer. Many would be critical of that and score political points when in my mind they are being pretty straight with the public and honest to their manifesto. Credit where it's due...
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I don't governments have had a problem breaking a manifesto. But maybe your right, i just think with all the problems with brexit legislation they've been having, that's what's looming large.
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>>More like the PM had a word
The media gave 'im a thorough beating 'bout the head and body [metaphorically speaking] more like.
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Reminiscent of Osbourne's "Pastygate"
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To be cynical I could say that there are quite a few self employed Scots, though in reality I reckon it's a case of responsive government which I applaud.
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What I cannot understand is why anyone, media or otherwise, expects manifesto pledges from 2015 to apply after the brexit result and the changes in the political and economic situation since June last year.
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Yeah, that's a good point.
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Investment Thread - Pat
