Continuing debate.
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491220
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 4 Apr 16 at 12:47
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Nothing to do, directly, with UKIP, but a more general example of the MSM writing the story to suit their own agenda, rather than the facts.
www.breitbart.com/london/2016/04/04/mainstream-media-spread-another-faux-islamophobia-story/
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Breitbart London
............Regular contributors include Nigel Farage and Gerald Warner. Previous and occasional columnists have included Mary Ellen Synon,[35] Jonathan Foreman[36] and Katie Hopkins.[37]
And there was me thinking it was biased.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breitbart_News_Network
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Its the irony of the islamaphobic press and commentators arguing over giving islamaphobia a bad name that gets me.
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I believe the vast majority of Muslims are honest and hard working people.
It is UKIP that is on the far right. Anywhere else they would be called fascist.
If I had to choose between the Conservatives or UKIP it would not be UKIP.
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>> I believe the vast majority of Muslims are honest and hard working people.
Obvs.
>> It is UKIP that is on the far right. Anywhere else they would be called
>> fascist.
Even I, as the site's representative of the left and perceived by some here as extreme, don't see it in that light.
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>> Even I, as the site's representative of the left and perceived by some here as
>> extreme, don't see it in that light.
>>
Green thumb for that.
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You're a reasonable cat fluffy. The only thing I wd take issue with is the idea that they would be called fascist 'anywhere else'. A lot of people call them fascist here.
I don't think they are fascist myself. More sort of Chestertonian rolling-English-drunkard sort of thing and not entirely distasteful. But yes, pretty far to the right, filling an available slot. We're an old enough democracy to take it and worse, much worse, in our stride. I was there for the fifties-to-seventies Oswald Mosley-led fascist comeback remember, jaw dropping further by the day.
Mosley had these East End supporters from pre-war times in dirty cloth caps, caricatures they were. They looked well up for a rumble and were certainly discreetly tooled up. I couldn't believe my eyes.
Mosley oddly enough was a real gent. He treated a blue-stocking lefty friend of mine who embarrassingly piped up in a meeting in the Latymer Road Baths very gently.
Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Tue 5 Apr 16 at 19:23
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UKIP won seven seats for the Welsh Assembly.
To me that is astonishing.
What do other forum members think.
I do wish people would use the appropriate thread to discuss things ----> kick
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:08
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>>What do other forum members think.
I think it's just grrreat.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:09
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>> UKIP won seven seats for the Welsh Assembly.
>>
>> To me that is astonishing.
Not really, it's a PR election. If UKIP got n% of the votes then they're entitled to n% of the seats. Preferable to first past the post.
Issue being discussed here:
www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?t=22415&m=497221&v=e
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:09
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>>If UKIP got n% of the votes then they're entitled to n% of the seats. Preferable to first past the post.
Unless of course you disagree with the party's choice of list members, in which case it's a disgrace ;-)
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:09
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Would any forum members in Wales voted for Neil Hamilton.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:09
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>> Would any forum members in Wales voted for Neil Hamilton.
AFAIK nobody voted for Neil Hamilton (or Mark Reckless). They're additional 'top up' members taken from the party list as part of the proportional representation element in the Welsh Assembly election system.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additional_Member_System
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:09
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>> AFAIK nobody voted for Neil Hamilton (or Mark Reckless).
Apologies. About 3500 voted for Hamilton.
Further research reveals that he stood in Carmarthen East and Dinefwr. Beaten into fourth place behind the Plaid victor, Labour and Conservative.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carmarthen_East_and_Dinefwr_(Assembly_constituency)#Elections_in_the_2010s
And duly elected......
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:10
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>> www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3578279/Benefits-cap-slashed-26-000-20-000-family-Claimants-told-jobs-handouts-cut.html
What a load of sdgstgrwegrwegrs!!
The bit that had me rolling in the floor was about Jeremy Corbyn's advocacy of rent regulation:
Instead, he said government should impose 'rent regulation', a policy last used in this country 30 years ago and associated with hard-Left governments around the world
That would be off scale left administrations like like Angela Merkel's Germany, Provinces in Canada and even some US States.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 7 May 16 at 17:09
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>> That would be off scale left administrations like like Angela Merkel's Germany, Provinces in Canada
>> and even some US States.
Merkel does generally seem to know which way is up, disregarding her blip on the no-quibble refugee policy.
The Germans are trying to block letting through airbnb in Berlin, to avoid house price rising too much. Trying to stop the tide coming in possibly, but she can see the problem that Osborne seemingly can't, or won't.
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The bit that had me rolling in the floor was about Jeremy Corbyn's advocacy of
>> rent regulation:
>>
>> Instead, he said government should impose 'rent regulation', a policy last used in this country
>> 30 years ago and associated with hard-Left governments around the world
In fairness to many reading that, it's two main points are true it's associated with the 'hard' left and it was used about 30 years.
What happens in other countries is neither here nor there to them.
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It might not be but the private house rental market in this country is not serving its purpose which is to provide secure accommodation at a fair price for those unable to buy.
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I don't disagree, I'm just saying that from the readership it's a perfectly reasonable arguement.
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>>the private house rental market in this country is not serving its purpose which is to provide secure accommodation at a fair price for those unable to buy.
Is that it's purpose? I thought the purpose of the private rental market was to make the landlords money.
Isn't the purpose you state the idea behind public housing?
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It might have been once but for most people in this country there is no such thing as public housing. They are excluded from it. A large proportion of the popuLation rely on private housing an quite frankly they are being explored. It is clearly wrong that the sole purpose of private housing is to make money for landlords. It would be as absurd to state that the sole purpose of supermarkets it to make money for their owners. If a commercial operation is so rigged in one party's favour then ther is clearly something wrong with it.
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>> It would be as absurd to state that the sole purpose of supermarkets it to make money for their owners
Well what in God's name do you think its purpose is then? That is its sole purpose. It might not be its sole value of effect, but that is its purpose.
It is there to make money. Of course to make money it must supply a service and that must be a valued and desired service.
But its purpose is to make money.
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No, the purpose of supermarkets as far as the general public is concerned is to supply them with food. That we have a capitalist system providing those supermarkets is irrelevant to their purpose. If we had non profit making charities running them or socialist command economy running them the purpose of a supermarket would still be providing people with food.
You are confusing the method of providing a service with the purpose of that service.
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Bless, I didn't think it was that complex a distinction. Never mind, I can see what you're trying to say.
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You might also say that for the employees its purpose is to provide a job. But its there because somebody wants to make a profit.
The purpose is the make a profit by fulfilling the needs of customers. Or if you like, the purpose is to fulfil the needs of customers, at a profit. Semantics.
Now what about the Coop?
(Don't answer that).
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>> Bless, I didn't think it was that complex a distinction. Never mind, I can see
>> what you're trying to say.
>>
Is your condescending mode off now?
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If you were to cut out the sarcasm you might find effective communication a little easier.
So now you understand my point that in our system we chose to use the private sector to supply us with food you will understand my point that in the absence of availability of social housing for q large proportion of the population we have de facto, chosen the private sector to do the job of providing housing.
Unlike in the food industry the housing industry does not do the job very well and its customers are treated very unfairly. It is in urgent need of regulation and reform if we are going to rely on it as a replacement to social housing.
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>> In fairness to many reading that, it's two main points are true it's associated with
>> the 'hard' left and it was used about 30 years.
When exactly right to register a 'fair rent' was stopped is an academic point. It wasn't though a 'far left' thing but part of of the post war consensus.
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It
>> wasn't though a 'far left' thing but part of of the post war consensus.
>>
Like I said those that the article is aimed at it's price control the same as the gov telling people how much bog roll should be.
The fact it was agreed in 1953 or whatever is neither here nor there to the aimed readership.
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If we Vote Leave on 23rd June 2016 will there be any need for UKIP to exist.
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UKIP -one single vote away from full control of Thurrock council, after three recounts in one ward, which by that vote was awarded to a Conservative.
To answer he question about UKIP if there is Brexit vote: yes we'll be around to pressure the Tories into accepting that OUT mean OUT.
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UKIP is all about immigration the same mantra over and over.
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A dark day for Wales indeed.
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Their election leaflet was certainly short on detail - You opened it up and inside it had two word (well one acronym)....makes you honestly wonder why people were voting for them - lots of European money comes into Wales - bit like turkeys voting for Christmas really.
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The turkeys voted for Christmas well before last Thursday.
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They may well have fluff. It's more real here now...for goodness sake they voted for Neil Hamilton !!
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Neil Hamilton was Conservative M.P. for Tatton until he was defeated in the 1997 General Election.
To me Neil Hamilton is a turncoat.
What for him is after UKIP.
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For geographical - and I suppose social - reasons, I once met the Hamiltons (although Herself says she didn't). Corsham is in what used to be my part of the country.
I thought they were more or less OK, amusing almost. One of the cousins says that Ms Hamilton is quite a naughty old thing (don't ask for details).
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>>makes you honestly wonder why people were voting for them - lots of European money comes into Wales - bit like turkeys voting for Christmas really.
It's not European money, it's our money that we've paid into the European Union.
It's like you given me £1 and me given you back 15p - Fools and their money are easily parted.
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Its our money we are getting back.
Its not a free lunch.
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Oh, Perro, you are SO right.
Same with the CAP. It is NOT E.U. money that is coming back (shambolically, as it happens) but OUR money being re-cycled after hefty deductions to subsidise inefficient, small hectarage farmers in other countries. Farmers have LOTS of votes in many continental countries!
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>> A dark day for Wales indeed.
>>
A dark day for London, too.
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Our farmers tend to vote Conservative.
How many rural and farming seats vote other than Conservative.
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Too many - they are brainwashed into thinking the CAP i good for them, so they support the status quo, which they think the Tory nobs represent.
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>> A dark day for London, too.
Londoners saw through the racist campaign run by Goldsmith's handlers and elected the right man for the job.
What's not to like?
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But a moderate Conservative in Scotland won 31 seats and came second in the Scottish vote.
She won seats in Edinburgh and Glasgow that would have been unthinkable under Tony Blairs premiership.
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How many seats does UKIP have in the House of Commons?
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One. Douglas Carswell MP for Clacton.
Absolutely not my cup of tea in most aspects but I've a sneaking respect for his libertarianism.
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That's why they've invaded Wales.
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That's why they've invaded Wales.
Singing this?
Tramp up Snowdon with our woad on:
Never mind if we get rained or blowed on.
Never want a button sewed on.
Go it, Ancient B's.
last verse of National Anthem of the Ancient Britons
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...That brings back memories of my Dad....... (No, he wasn't an ancient Briton..)
...Woad's the stuff to show men
Woad to scare your foemen
Boil it to a brilliant hue
And rub it on your back and your abdomen......
Last edited by: tyrednemotional on Mon 9 May 16 at 07:40
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>> That's why they've invaded Wales.
>>
Bit unfair. Hamilton is a born and bred Valley boy when all's said and done, and despite his past trials and tribulations there's no doubting that he's a capable and experienced politician, something of a rarity in UKIP. The rest of the Assembly will underestimate him at their own risk.
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The candidates for UKIP are, as far as I know, selected by the local membership. TBH, I do not think Neil Hamilton would have been Nigel's choice as he has just been shifted out of the Deputy Party Chairmanship.
Mark Reckless has been involved in the Welshry for some time and both he and Nathan Gill, the UK Welsh leader have been working hard to put the message across in Wales.
As far as the new A.Ms not living in the area which they are representing, may I mention that many, many, MPs do not come from, or live (other than temporarily) in the constituencies which elected them.
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>> The candidates for UKIP are, as far as I know, selected by the local membership.
>> TBH, I do not think Neil Hamilton would have been Nigel's choice as he has
>> just been shifted out of the Deputy Party Chairmanship.
Do you mean the candidates who stood for election were selected by the membership or those appointed to office from the party list?
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I noticed UKIP have been quiet today.
Thank God.
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Maybe God is a Kipper - could explain why Christians use the fish (ichthys) symbol.
(*_*)
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UKIP cohort in Welsh Assembly have elected Neil Hamilton as their leader.
order-order.com/2016/05/10/neil-hamilton-deposes-welsh-ukip-leader/
Nathan Gill still leader of party in Wales as that post is in leader's gift.
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Why would anyone vote for a person like Neil Hamilton.
I must be in the wrong job.
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>>I must be in the wrong job.
Which is?
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I am at college studying maths.
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What do you plan to do after?
Economics, banking?
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I am hoping to work in retail.
My hero is Sam Walton founder of Wal-Mart.
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He had an economics degree if I remember correctly - is that the master plan?
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The masterplan is just to do something simple and enjoy whatever I decide to do.
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Hull Poly again? Not that it ever existed as Hull Polytechnic.
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UKIP debate - Volume 28 - Roger.
