I didn't like them and I don't have high cholesterol. So I told the doctor I didn't like them and he said, stop taking them then. So I did, a year or two back.
Still have all the symptoms of course but that's ageing for you innit? So far so good, fingers crossed and so on...
There are a couple of people here older than me so I can't talk really. Are Roger and Slidingpillar among them? Great motor that Sp.
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I had a heart attack in 1990 and triple bypass surgery a few weeks later.
I have/had high cholesterol and have been taking statins ever since.
Side effects? I am not sure - depressive? I don't think so, although I have just started a World Cup - Shut Up thread.
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I had the dreaded phone interview with my doc's practice nurse described in this thread
www.car4play.com/forum/post/index.htm?t=16787&m=375233&v=e
I declined and immediately was met by many good reasons why I should agree to them. I was also told that my plan of trying to lower my cholesterol by lifestyle changes was seriously flawed so I suggested I have a go at doing it my way and have another cholesterol test in six months.
That was met with 'Oh no, you can't have another test for a year, we only do them annually'
Must be cheaper to prescribe statins for life than take a cholesterol test then I presume.
I stuck to my guns and will resist them for another year.
Pat
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Dinnae worry Pat - while you still smoke any other lifestyle changes will have only a marginal effect on heart disease risk so you might as well not bother at all.
- I think that paraphrases my reply in the earlier thread ;-)
Last edited by: Lygonos on Thu 12 Jun 14 at 14:47
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It did Lygonos.....and gave me the courage to stand up to the practice nurse who we al know are dragons:)
I want to die at work with a ciggie in my hand.....now't wrong with that!
Pat
EDIT TO ADD: In a NO SMOKING AREA OF THE YARD, to add the final insult to H&S and red tape!
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And you'll be the one who's dead. Strange to see any kind of victory in that. Especially one you'll never be able to celebrate.
Oh well, if it makes you happy. :-)
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Every one of us will be dead at some point Alanovic, so what's your point?
I'm not looking for victory or to celebrate, there are others who can do that! (Mark, Zero possibly you?) Joke!
It's a better way to go than spending years unable to look after myself in a care home or hospital ward.
I shall go to the crematorium on the back of Brett's Transport vintage Bedford, they will play Highway to Hell by AC/DC and Angels by Robbie Williams and then Ian will take a trip around the back of Looe Island and throw my ashes in the sea at a particular point where no houses or people can be seen....just the birds, waves and coastline. Perfect peace forever.
Pat
Last edited by: Pat on Thu 12 Jun 14 at 16:20
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>> Every one of us will be dead at some point Alanovic, so what's your point?
Well, you seem to see some point yourself in the Pyrrhic victory of dying with a fag in your hand somewhere that you're not supposed to be smoking. My point is that I don't really see your point.
Dying young (if you're working you're still young) seems to be a very poor way of making an anti H&S point. Surely you're confirming your error.
But, like I said, if it makes you happy. :-)
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>> take a trip around the back of Looe Island and throw my ashes in
>> the sea at a particular
That reminds me, the Mother out Law's ashes are still at home. Need to get them, the rest of family and the Bro out law out to west Wales during summer to scatter near Aberporth.
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>> so what's your point?
That phrase seem to become quite popular on here recently.
>> It's a better way to go than spending years unable to look after myself in
>> a care home or hospital ward.
There is another way, where one grows old while still retaining health and fitness.
>> I shall go to the crematorium on the back of Brett's Transport vintage Bedford, they
>> will play Highway to Hell by AC/DC and Angels by Robbie Williams and then Ian
>> will take a trip around the back of Looe Island and throw my ashes in
>> the sea at a particular point where no houses or people can be seen....just the
>> birds, waves and coastline. Perfect peace forever.
And if it doesn't happen like that, you will neither know, nor be able to do anything about it.
I am desperately trying not to be pompous - and failing, I suspect - but I can see absolutely no point in taking pride in continuing to smoke cigarettes.
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Duncan (and Alanovic)
I'm taking pride in ding what makes me happy after a lifetime of working hard. I'm not whingeing about the consequences just stating that I'm prepared for them but maybe the reason I pronounce it proudly, is that I just knew that someone would try and rain on my parade....even in death:)
Pat
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100% with you Pat! Almost every medicine has some beneficial effects and not so good counteracting effects. If I don't need to take one for an existing condition as opposed to a precaution, then I shan't bother.
The well known philosopher, J Clarkson, wrote earlier this year that one had lifestyle choices; At one end of the scale were pies, beer, wine and bacon butties and die in your 80s or abstinence, worrying about cholesterol etc and finishing up in a laughingly named care home having your bits washed by a foreigner on the state minimum wage. I am 75 now, and I worked until I was 72, and 85 and will be enough for me I think.
Last edited by: Meldrew on Thu 12 Jun 14 at 17:21
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One doesn't feel comfortable giving oneself less than a comfortable decade of future, so I am happy at present with the thought of 86 maybe. Fingers crossed of course because everything can always just change overnight from cool to desperate, from joy to bleak suffering.
If I outlive Pat I won't rain on her parade. Indeed I would be happy to bop along behind her coffin near the Dixieland band or Ska combo on a lorry, puffing on a theatrically huge marijuana reefer. And if, as seems probable, she outlives me I hope she'll do the same.
YEEE-hah!
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>>puffing on a theatrically huge marijuana reefer
Traffic cone, or ragdoll?
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The day I start accepting health/lifestyle or basically any type of advice from Jezza will be the day I also run off and join the Moonies.
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Thanks Meldrew, jezza's my kind of bloke Lygonos:)
I think he may have to take second place to AC now though!
You'll be very welcome Lud, and I will certainly do the same for you:)
Pat
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Pat's ciggies are my lard.
I know I could do with getting rid of some ... and having young kids highlights the issue, because you want to be there for them... but .. it's easier said than done. If it was easy, i'd have done it.
Why do people smoke, drink, gamble, get depressed, be fat, be obnoxious, have OCD, etc?
... allegedly, Bernard Manning was told if he cut back on the booze and fags he could live for another 5 years ....and his response was "Yes, but it would be the last 5 years".
Which has a warped point.
If Clarkson has said that bit about nursing homes and having your bits washed, then I'd 100% agree.
If someone said to me, slim down a bit and you've got 25 years extra ..then maybe I'd try to eat muesli (which to me tastes like what I'd imagine is the bottom of a budgies cage).. but if my gain is 5 years at 92.. then Fu** It, i'll go at 87.
IMO most of it is what your genes are ..and my gran was a big old bird who died at 96.. and if I'm wrong, who cares I'm gone anyway, as long as the kids are adults and on their way in life, 'such is life'.
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>> ... allegedly, Bernard Manning was told if he cut back on the booze and fags he could live for another 5 years ....and his response was "Yes, but it would be the last 5 years".
>>
I like this one.... (author unknown.)
A man was told by his doctor he had a year to live.
He asked 'Is there anything I can do ?'
To which the doctor replied 'Well, you can give up the booze, fags, and women...'
The man asked, ' and I will live longer??'
'no. but it will feel like it!'
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It wasn't advice in any way shape or form - it was an opinion/observation with which I broadly agree. I want quality of life not necessarily longevity for its own sake. We have a very chipper 104 year old man in our village but he is the exception
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>> run off and join the Moonies.
I met a Moonie once Lygonos. He was a black American, sent to Africa to spread the word but hopelessly out of his depth, hardly ten words of French even let alone real local stuff. I sometimes wonder what became of him. He wasn't brilliant at explaining his faith.
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"85 and will be enough for me I think"
You might want to review that that when you're 84
Not looking after your health doesn't avoid the risk of ending your life in a care home. It just means that you're likely to need that care 10 years earlier. Walk down any high street and you will find waddling obese people often smoking and unable to walk up a modest incline without getting out of breath or confine to an electric scooter even though they haven't reached 60 .
Don't think they seem to be enjoying life very much but I guess it's their choice
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>> You might want to review that that when you're 84
Heh heh... I should have said that as one's last decade runs out one is obviously going to bump up one's life expectancy... but with a bit of realism, when you hit 90 down to five years, when you hit 99 just a year...
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>> Almost every medicine has some beneficial effects and not so good counteracting effects. If I don't need to take one for an existing condition as opposed to a precaution, then I shan't bother.
I rarely take anything.
I was even off painkillers the day (or so.. anyway as soon as I was compos mentis) after major surgery - when my family was told I wasn't expect to live past 24 hours.
I also stick a finger up at death, it will get me when its ready to, I will have little say in the matter, which is why I live for today.
As an aside, next week I have a funeral to go to.
That of my grandchild, who was stillborn. Now that will be the hardest day of my entire life.
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>> That of my grandchild, who was stillborn. Now that will be the hardest day of
>> my entire life.
>>
Puts it in perspective, deepest sympathies
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>> The well known philosopher, J Clarkson, wrote earlier this year that one had lifestyle choices;
>> At one end of the scale were pies, beer, wine and bacon butties and die
>> in your 80s
The problem with that load of old rubbish is that most people with those lifestyles go in their 50s, not their 80s. Wouldn't seem so clever if he'd told the truth, would he?
I do enjoy all of the things he lists, but in moderation (mostly). Those for whom that is a daily menu will be hard pushed to go beyond 60. I know, I've seen my grandparents all do it (life spans between 45 - 67, all smokers, salt shaker addicts and daily lard eaters - none what you'd call too much overweight though).
My target is indeed somewhere in the 80s, that will do. I'd feel lucky and privileged to have lived so long. I'd feel a bit cheated with less. But as someone said, if I can see my children to adulthood and on their own two feet, then all well and good.
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>> I can see absolutely no point in taking pride in continuing to smoke cigarettes.
And I can see no point in the obsessive objection many non/ex smokers have to smokers. Even extending it to electronic cigarettes.
Can't say it bothers me whether someone smokes or not. And as a form of pollution, it is some way behind cars.
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I no longer smoke but I can't really say I feel any fitter. Luckily I've never been especially unfit though. I used to smoke while riding my bike up mountain tracks and indeed while skiing in a kilt.
Not quite sure why I'm sharing that with you.
Doesn't bother me if anyone else sparks up in my vicinity. It'd be a bit hypocritical to object given the amount of the things I used to get through.
Last edited by: Runfer D'Hills on Thu 12 Jun 14 at 22:29
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I am now taking them having suffered an MI two weeks ago!
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Ski in a kilt....doesn't it get a bit icy around the Trossachs ?
I had my first MI 20 yrs ago next Thursday. I've been on statins since then. I had another one in Feb 13 which resulted, like Dunc, in a triple by-pass. I've been on 1 gram Atorvastatin a day since.
I do get a lot of leg pain and weakness...I'm a bit wobbly when standing but a stick helps, converting me into a tripod !
The op, the first I've had under a general, made me look at death somewhat differently. I used to think there might be something in this re-incarnation caper but now, I've experienced being, effectively, dead for four or five hours....I think that's all folks ! Nothing, no sound, smells, thoughts or sensations of any kind. Not even dreams. Just a case of disposing of the packaging and that's yer lot !
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>> I am now taking them having suffered an MI two weeks ago!
Sorry to hear that! I hope you're getting better and it was a mild MI. Maybe you're an example of why people ought to be on them earlier.
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I took them for years and suffered well-known side effects; more frequent and more intense cramps and muscle weakness. The latter meant I had insufficient leverage in my arms to get out of the (admittedly very deep, 1920s) bath. I chopped and changed types for a bit longer, then stopped. I feel better and the cramps have gone but the weakness remains and I guess always will.
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Side effects.... gone.
Old age.... continues ;-)
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They keep telling me to take them but they can't explain why my blood pressure was down last year nor can they explain what the difference between good and bad cholesterol (same chemical) is so why should I trust their opinion. They fall back on NICE says you should.
Father took them for several years and experienced muscle wastage, shoulder pain etc. and cholesterol level didn't drop Stopped and all the symptoms cleared. He still enjoys his fried breakfast (using lard) and has just returned from Venice (trip by road with caravan). He is 85 so can't be doing much wrong.
Read "The Great Cholesterol Con" and ask yourselves why Inuit with an almost total fat diet do not have heart problems until they start eating a western diet and why vegetarians from the subcontinent have similar issues.
I think it is all about keeping the cost of the state pension down.
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I asked my GP about cholesterol last week. I have a very low count, despite being a bit overweight and not really watching what I eat too much - I reckon I eat pretty healthily as it goes though. He was surprised I have such a low count, being, to look at, obviously north European (ginger hair/blue skin). He said north Europeans have a genetic predisposition to high cholesterol, hence his surprise. I told him my mother's family are partly Maltese and he said, ah, that explains it. Mediterraneans have the opposite tendency.
No idea if he's right or not, but hey. My cholesterol seems fine. And I have the blood pressure of a teenager, apparently.
So I don't think I'm too inclined to get too concerned about the few extra kilos I'm carrying. Ze dicky ticker seems to be OK so far too, that'll be down to never having smoked I expect.
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To a very great extent your cholesterol levels are determined by your parents.
Diet has a modest effect on it.
I have almost never seen anyone fail to get a lower cholesterol when taking a reasonable dose of statin, so much so that I can confidently predict who is or isn't taking it.
The benefit of statins on risk of heart disease/heart attack is more than just a lowering of cholesterol - it appears statins also stabilise the fatty plaques already present in our arteries, reducing the chance of them rupturing and causing a sudden heart attack.
In a simplistic fashion LDL cholesterol ('low density' or 'bad') transports fat to your arteries increasing the risk of plaques, and HDL cholesterol ('high density' or 'good') takes it away.
Statins reduce LDL and some raise HDL also.
There is no conspiracy at play here: we know statins reduce the risk fo cardiovascular disease and death. They do not make you feel better, however, and sometimes give you side-effects. It doesn't bother me an iota if someone wishes not to take a statin but I like them to make that decision based on facts rather than dogma.
Saves me money in the end if people don't need too much of their pension.
Placebos cause muscle pain too, almost as much as statins - go figure ;-)
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"Placebos cause muscle pain too, almost as much as statins - go figure"
Easy ;-)
Statins are generally given to older/ageing patients - who will get achier anyway, as part of growing old. I noticed that I was getting achier, so came off the statin for a trial couple of months; and behold - there was no noticeable change.
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Said it before but a period on statins threatened to ruin my lifetime pleasure in cycling so as I was just taking them for very marginal reasons I sopped and Doc said he would have done in the same circumstances.
But he then did his duty in advising of the practice and local hospital pro-active stance on bowel cancer for the over 55s and punished me with an appointment to visit the metal snake!
They always get the last laugh.
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Statin for me.
I listened with interest to a cardiologist discussing the benefits of certain people taking statins, regardless of cholesterol levels (on a Jimmy Young radio programme about a decade or so ago, I think), but having low cholesterol myself, it took me several attempts during my annual medical MOTs before they were finally prescribed.
Been taking them now for about 7 years. Last year I left them off for about 6 weeks to see if I would notice any difference, but I didn't, so I've continued with them ever since.
Twitch...
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Fri 13 Jun 14 at 15:32
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To statin or to statout? - Armel Coussine
