***** This thread is now closed, please CLICK HERE to go to Volume 4 *****
Continued political chat.
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 23 Jan 14 at 10:40
|
Bet the Tories are rubbing their hands with glee at getting rid of this one..
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-25793358
|
|
Supposing he's right, and the storms and floods are God's displeasure at Cameron for supporting gay marriage, why was it visited on the rest of us and not just on Cameron?
|
As a practising Christian and an active member of the Church of England, Cameron would be aware that it clearly states in Leviticus 18:22 “‘Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable"
The weather has certainly taken a turn for the worst since Cameron and Clegg agreed to fast-track legislation for introducing same-sex marriage, so maybe David Silvester is on the right track.
|
>> As a practising Christian and an active member of the Church of England, Cameron would
>> be aware that it clearly states in Leviticus 18:22 “‘Do not have sexual relations with
>> a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable"
I'm struggling with the 'as with a woman' bit.........
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sat 18 Jan 14 at 19:56
|
|
I wonder then what Christ would have said....he seemed to be a far more enlightened guy than many in the old Testament.
|
>>I wonder then what Christ would have said....he seemed to be a far more enlightened guy than many in the old Testament.
You've got the disease, pestilence and war to come yet, oh ye of little faith.
|
>> >>I wonder then what Christ would have said....he seemed to be a far more enlightened
>> guy than many in the old Testament.
>>
>> You've got the disease, pestilence and war to come yet, oh ye of little faith.
Too late, had them all recently.
|
>> I wonder then what Christ would have said
>>
If such a person ever existed...
|
"Neither fornicators nor idolaters nor adulterers: Nor the effeminate, nor liers with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor railers, nor extortioners, shall possess the kingdom of God.
Corinthians 6.9 - 10
Rules out most in the financial sector I guess
Last edited by: CGNorwich on Sat 18 Jan 14 at 20:11
|
>> "Neither fornicators nor idolaters nor adulterers: Nor the effeminate, nor liers with mankind, nor thieves,
>> nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor railers, nor extortioners, shall possess the kingdom of God.
>>
>> Corinthians 6.9 - 10
>>
>> Rules out most in the financial sector I guess
and is 'railers' biblical language for trainspotters?
|
>> As a practising Christian
when do you become qualified?
|
>> >> As a practising Christian
>>
>> when do you become qualified?
Well, that's yer grammer, see.
If Doggo had written
Cameron, as a practising Christian and an active member of the Church of England...
instead of
As a practising Christian and an active member of the Church of England, Cameron ...
you wouldn't have been able to misconstrue his post :)
|
|
I can misconstrue even the grammatically perfect at will for effect.
|
Ah the good old free speech bit. About time we had a bit of fire and brimstone brought back to politics, if only for a laugh, Ian Paisely, Henley style.
I made the point quite recently that supporting a persons right to free speech didnt mean we had to shelter them within the party, they can equally be crackers on their own time. Westboro Baptish Church has vacancies I expect.
Last edited by: Esse quam haberi on Sat 18 Jan 14 at 20:43
|
"Judge not lest ye should be judged"..
Sums it up for me...
why complain about sexual pecadilloes between consenting adults? Lots of worse things in the world.. like starting wars based on lies and then claiming to be a good Catholic...
|
>> As a practising Christian and an active member of the Church of England, Cameron would
>> be aware that it clearly states in Leviticus 18:22 “‘Do not have sexual relations with
>> a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable"
>>
>> The weather has certainly taken a turn for the worst since Cameron and Clegg agreed
>> to fast-track legislation for introducing same-sex marriage, so maybe David Silvester is on the right
>> track.
>>
Fortunately David's read a few more books than just the bible :-) And since religion is neither compulsory in this country, or a prequiisite for marriage, I'm not quite sure what the point is in using excerpts from it as a reason for continuing to discriminate against gay people who do want to get married.
While the weather might have got worse, I'm pleased that the general climate has, on the whole, become more tolerant...in most cases ;-)
|
Pretty sure the old testicle also advises against eating bacon and black pudding, etc etc etc etc.
Book of bumwipe more like.
|
And the wearing of mixed fibres!
If you quote and expect folk to stick to a bit of the Old Testament, you'd best be sticking to all of it.
Last edited by: Slidingpillar on Sun 19 Jan 14 at 10:15
|
>> And the wearing of mixed fibres!
>>
>> If you quote and expect folk to stick to a bit of the Old Testament,
>> you'd best be sticking to all of it.
Not possible - too much contradiction.
Do you stone an adulterer, or do you spend your entire life looking for someone without sin to do it?
If you engage in this argument with fundamentalist types, they tell you that you are taking things out of context or misunderstanding a metaphor - but it doesn't stop them selectively quoting verses to justify more or less anything.
Last edited by: Manatee on Sun 19 Jan 14 at 12:12
|
I was only posting one point. I'm well aware there are both loads - and many contradict each other. Absolutely no point in ever having an argument with a religious fundamentalist as you'll never win.
The book, "A year of living biblically" by AJ Jacobs is an interesting read.
|
>> The book, "A year of living biblically" by AJ Jacobs is an interesting read.
Sounds funny too. But stoning an adulterer with a pebble is a cop out. I'm sure death comes into it somewhere. Not forgetting "Thou shalt not kill".
Some say that a lot of the biblical exhortations are really just practical advice for the times.
If I lived in a hot climate without fridges or oven thermostats, I might avoid pork too.
And if cyclists and pedestrians followed Ecclesiastes's advice to let their clothing be white at all times, it might improve the accident statistics.
|
>>Supposing he's right, and the storms and floods are God's displeasure at Cameron for supporting gay marriage, why was it visited on the rest of us and not just on Cameron?
It was, perhaps for allowing gay marriage. That was also probably the reason for our floods and that trick with the spark in Rio.
I think we should sympathise with *all* party leaders and not having any proper statesmen to back them.
|
This idiot has been suspended by the party, today.
Not for his weird views, but for using his official position as a UKIP councillor to publicise them.
We have a problem in some cases with people joining the party just to embarrass us - we nearly fell for it in our local branch, when a new potential recruit stated in his first meeting that UKIP was now "Old Labour". We later found out that he was a militant ex-miner, a reject from the local Labour Party, who had been thrown out of council meetings for disrupting them!
We have declined his membership!
Last edited by: Roger on Sun 19 Jan 14 at 15:38
|
It's amazing how these bible-wielding people have the nerve to get in under the radar - Paul Flowers is another example. Don't they say something like' religion is the last refuge for a scoundrel'?
Scoundrels are still present in all political parties - and it can take years before they are winkled out. Here's another - sorry, it's the D Wail. Normal human beings would simply crawl away under the nearest stone if we felt our public hated us, but not this creep ……...
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2541950/Fury-Tory-faithful-MP-Tim-Yeo-dodges-axe.html#comments
|
>> This idiot has been suspended by the party, today.
>> Not for his weird views
Heh heh... of course not, perish the thought!
I do sympathize a bit Rastaman. I know some of you kippers aim to be rational. Bringing the Old Testament to bear reduces everything to the level of robust knockabout comedy.
On a related matter, is it true that some schools are teaching 'creationism' in science classes without distinguishing it fundamentally from scientific thought? It's hard to imagine anything more perverse and intellectually destructive. But it sounds all too likely.
|
BBC report that Nigel has had his knife out an culled several European or Local Election candidates with views that might embarrass the party.
Which reminds me of a story told by a work colleague.
A candidate for high judicial office was being grilled by the Lord Chancellor's senior advisers. A final question was asked - Is there anything in your past or personal life that might embarrass the Lord Chancellor?
Candidate replies 'How easily is the Lord Chancellor embarrassed?'
|
>>BBC report that Nigel has had his knife out an culled several European or Local Election candidates with views that might embarrass the party. <<
Extremely old news and the BBC know it since the Euro candidates were put through the initial selection process in the middle of last year which was when sitting MEPs would have lost out due to new measures - no new news at all, knife has long since been put down. Members then had their vote which culled a few more from the chance of standing.
|
As long as he is suspended Roger, that is what counts. I complained last week to someone higher up the tree than me that they need to crack the whip and stop being so reluctant to impose their will on idiots, there is no point having a management structure if they dont manage anyone, look like that is changing.
|
www.trendingcentral.com/labour-mp-claims-israeli-flag-flown-nazis/
Look like it is the week for idiots. Proud day for all Labour members no doubt.
|
|
Technically offensive, but not barking mad like Silvester.
|
>>Technically offensive, but not barking mad like Silvester.<<
So anti-semitism is more acceptable if you are sane?
|
>> anti-semitism is more acceptable if you are sane?
I doubt if the man Morris intended to be anti-Semitic. He thought he was supporting Palestinian rights but was being quite stupid for an MP. No doubt he will get a going-over from the executive.
It is offensive to call Israeli foreign policy 'nazi' or fascist because Israel is not a fascist state (although many think it is a racist one), and because Israelis and Jews in general object to being likened to the Nazis who murdered and robbed their relations. One can hardly blame them for that and it is a position to be respected.
I'm afraid your man Silvester is a swivel-eyed loon though Eqh.
|
>>I'm afraid your man Silvester is a swivel-eyed loon though Eqh.<<
Firstly he isnt 'our man' anymore and secondly, while I respect that people have religious beliefs, on the face of it most religions require faith in things that they can neither see or prove, the fact that Silvester believes what he does isnt really exceptional in the general sphere of religion, it only sounds odd in a generally faithless country.
I spent alot of time around Mormons and new age Baptists in my younger years and I heard far more outlandish things than what he said, I have no doubt a number of people of faith were nodding their heads in agreement across the country.
Last edited by: Esse quam haberi on Sun 19 Jan 14 at 18:08
|
>> I spent alot of time around Mormons and new age Baptists in my younger years and I heard far more outlandish things than what he said, I have no doubt a number of people of faith were nodding their heads in agreement across the country.
Well, tell me about it... I was friendly with a family of Jehovah's witnesses in the early fifties and had myself a haphazard Catholic upbringing that included a couple of years at a Jesuit public school. One of my children was at school with a new age Baptist kid in the grove. Outlandish is the new normal innit...
|
>>Well, tell me about it... I was friendly with a family of Jehovah's witnesses in the early fifties and had myself a haphazard Catholic upbringing that included a couple of years at a Jesuit public school. One of my children was at school with a new age Baptist kid in the grove. Outlandish is the new normal innit... <<
I went to 'Faith Camp' at Peterborough once, that was an experience. Despite the weirdness they were all extremely kind and generous. Pretty girls and good food can excuse a great deal of weirdness when you are a teenager I found.
|
>> So anti-semitism is more acceptable if you are sane?
Anti Israeli sentiment is not of itself anti-Semitic.
While not directly comparable to the Nazis the Israeli state makes no attempt to treat Palestinians equally. It has a long record of outrages of its own against Palestinian civilians and complicity in worse by others (as last week's obits for Sharon reminded us.
|
>> Anti Israeli sentiment is not of itself anti-Semitic.
>>
>> While not directly comparable to the Nazis the Israeli state makes no attempt to treat
>> Palestinians equally. It has a long record of outrages of its own against Palestinian civilians
>> and complicity in worse by others (as last week's obits for Sharon reminded us.
>>
Good Lord B, put an entry in your diary...you and I agree on something!
|
|
there is a problem there tho. Th state of Israel creates ghettoes for those it does not like, but to compare this action to that same one of the Nazis is supposedly anti Semitic!
|
The state of Israel has many faults and many objectionable policies. Its spokesmen and foreign supporters often display the most shameless effrontery along with squirming dishonesty.
However on questions of what constitutes anti-Semitism it seems best to let Jews and Israelis set the terms. That may sound sententious but who can do it better and more authentically?
|
>> However on questions of what constitutes anti-Semitism it seems best to let Jews and Israelis
>> set the terms. That may sound sententious but who can do it better and more
>> authentically?
>>
Up to a point Lord Copper.
If use of term X, Y or Z offends those to whom it refers then there are compelling reasons to regard them as racist (or anti-Semitic). OTOH Israel is a nation with, for some of its citizens, an expansionist/Zionist agenda.
If expansionist Israelis dictate the terms of debate it's even easier for the 'anti-Semitic card' to be played against those whose issue is Zionism and not Judaism.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sun 19 Jan 14 at 20:21
|
For heaven's sake Bromptonaut, how can you imagine I wouldn't know all that? Indeed some time back someone did a flounce when I pinned him to the wall for doing just that, playing the ant-Semitic card in defence of Zionist misbehaviour, snivelling stuff.
The same holocaust that serves thuggish expansionist Zionists as a pretext and excuse is the actual reason why Jews see it as anti-Semitic to call Israel nazi. There's a difference.
|
>> For heaven's sake Bromptonaut, how can you imagine I wouldn't know all that?
I didn't suppose for a minute you didn't know it but it seemed worthwhile expanding the point. The word sententious caught be out. I took it to be similar to contentious or tendentious. I've now found my dictionary.
The thesaurus suggests pompous as an alternative ;-P
|
>> The thesaurus suggests pompous as an alternative ;-P
Oh dear... not too wide of the mark either on reflection. Sorry.
All I can say in explanation is that it puts me in a bit of a state to be trying to describe Jewish sensibilities, given that I am not Jewish and don't have them myself. I expect to be accused of false indignation any minute. Perhaps I should mind my own business.
|
|
Ha ha - very topical, going by the sign off - "...and now over to Ambridge, where Bridge Farm is still knee deep in water, and the village is counting the cost of Ian and Adams civil partnership..."
|
|
"Concern this morning about the river Ouse breaking its bank after two men at a York gym exchanged lingering looks..."
|
I suppose last year's winter - long and frozen - was an advance warning to us all if civil partnerships were legalised
As was the hurricane of 1987 and the floods of 2006 etc...
These nutters forget history...
|
|
This nutter was previously a Conservative - I assume he held nutty views then, too!
|
>> This nutter was previously a Conservative - I assume he held nutty views then, too!
>>
No. He joined UKIP AFTER he went bonkers.
There are no loonies in the Conservative Party. Official.
|
>> This nutter was previously a Conservative - I assume he held nutty views then, too!
Indeed. His move to the kippers was over DC's gay marriage legislation.
|
All parties have them.
The Greens had someone who claimed to be the son of God.
Last edited by: Robin O'Reliant on Mon 20 Jan 14 at 19:31
|
|
David icke. He makes swivel headed loons look like the sane and sensible.
Last edited by: Zero on Mon 20 Jan 14 at 19:36
|
>> Where are the national headlines screaming "Outrage"?
>>
>> www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/news/10950551._/?ref=twtrec
The original story about the 'joke' on Facebook (an unfunny comparison of burqas and bin bags) was reported in the Guardian.
In reality this this is a local storm over immature behaviour by an immature local Councillor and thus his suitability for party 'whip' or office.
Contrast with the kipper making pronouncements on national policy.
|
>>Where are the national headlines screaming "Outrage"?
www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/news/10950551._/?ref=twtrec
Fat chance of that - in the Zionist controlled media but, t'wood be a tad different if he was a Kipper of course.
|
|
Last I heard Murdoch was a Christian.
|
>>Last I heard Murdoch was a Christian.
Same difference ;)
But seriously, this is not the place to discuss the fact that Murdoch is the son of Elizabeth Green who was the daughter of a wealthy Jewish family.
His rise up the greasy pole of media business has been due to the financial support of Jews Oppenheimer, Bronfman, Armand Hammer and the Jewish Rothschild empire, erm, I could go on (and on and on) but, what's the point, they've got it sewn (sown?) up good and proper, like.
|
>>Where are the national headlines screaming "Outrage"?<<
In the pile marked 'what is in it for us'.
|
Meanwhile Nigel himself has been displaying his up to date attitude to women at work. Here's the ever brilliant Steve Bell's take:
www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/cartoon/2014/jan/20/ukip-nigel-farage-steve-bell
|
>> by insisting that women who took time off work to have children were “worth less” to City employers than men.
Financially, they are a higher expense and have less time - that's pretty much "worth less" in purely financial terms. This is physics, not politics.
>>that banks and financial firms do not discriminate against working mums.
They don't. Its against the law.
>>that female employees must sacrifice a family life if they wanted to compete with their male counterparts
Since anyone who wishes to succeed will spend much of their waking time at work, and anyone who wishes to be a "perfect" parent will spend most of their time at home, its seems inevitable that a sacrifice is going to be necessary.
>>“In many cases, women make different choices in life to the ones that men make simply for biological reasons.
Men cannot have a child, if a couple want a child then it is a biologically necessary that the woman will make those choices.
>>“If a woman with a client base has a child and takes two or three years off work, she is worth far less to the employer when she comes back than when she goes away because her client base cannot be stuck rigidly to her.
As with anyone who takes two to three years out, one's network drops off and loses value.
>>Young, able women who are prepared to sacrifice a family life and stick with their careers do as well, if not better, than men.
So, if both sexes make the same sacrifices then women will do as well, if nto better.
etc. etc. etc. etc.
All in all, where exactly is the issue? I don't support Farage, but these idiots in the media who write such rubbish, and the idiots who read it and worry about it, do themselves more harm than they do Farage.
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 19 May 14 at 02:14
|
From a female point of view...absolutely spot on FM2R.
Pat
|
>> From a female point of view...absolutely spot on FM2R.
>>
>> Pat
Might be your view Pat but my daughter and any of the young women I've worked with would regard such views as antediluvian.
Women have to bear the children and it's remarkable that anyone still appears to argue against work making 'reasonable adaptations' for that fact.
The idea that finance and banking doesn't discriminate against women barbecue it's illegal is laughable. They do it regularly and with apparent impunity as the (many) cases that go to Tribunal can only be the tip of an iceberg.
|
Bromp, he didn't argue against it.
Don't get sidetracked by what you think banks do or do not do. And my wife, my sister and my mother are or were all professionals.
Your barbecue to one side, of course there is discrimination, do you know why?
Because being a parent;
takes time
takes commitment
involves time away from the office / job / role
involves choices
involves women differently to how it involves women.
Those are facts.
So rather than pretending that those differences are not real life, lets admit that they are and then deal with it anyway.
Farage makes basically valid statements that the other leaders cannot make because of the balance between what he has to lose, the thought process of his supporters, and the totally ridiculous behaviour of the media and its readers.
What did he say that you believe is not correct and real?
For goodness sakes, there's enough real stuff to knock about the bloke without hysterically making stuff up.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Tue 21 Jan 14 at 17:41
|
>>Might be your view Pat but my daughter and any of the young women I've worked with would regard such views as antediluvian.
<<
Funnily enough I believe that, sadly many young women have a job facing the real facts of women in business and the responsibility to their family needs.
As Mark says, the reality is the two rarely mix well for any party.
Pat
|
Small businesses, and I mean those with half a dozen or fewer employees, generally avoid employing women of childbearing age.
This DT article is years old but I don't think anything has changed.
goo.gl/QRzvTI
|
>> All in all, where exactly is the issue? I don't support Farage, but these idiots
>> in the media who write such rubbish, and the idiots who read it and worry
>> about it, do themselves more harm than they do Farage.
Couldn't agree more
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 19 May 14 at 02:13
|
>> Meanwhile Nigel himself has been displaying his up to date attitude to women at work.
>> Here's the ever brilliant Steve Bell's take:
>>
>> www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/cartoon/2014/jan/20/ukip-nigel-farage-steve-bell
>>
Not brilliant, not accurate!
|
Steve Bell does reach pinnacles of near-psychotic brilliance sometimes, but this is a lousy example. I don't get any part of it and the drawing doesn't look like Farage.
Has anyone ever seen Nigel Farage finish his pint and hold his glass out for another? I can't remember him doing that. But I have to say that the pint and fag as props seem to me endearing rather than repellent and ridiculous. You can see why the kippers love his smiling face.
Perro, were I Jewish I would take grave exception to the wording of your post above, quite apart from its broad hint of widespread Jewish conspiracies. "Jews A, B and C, etc....' is reminiscent of a particularly distasteful Nazi film or tract... no doubt you are aware of some of this and are doing it by way of joshing provocation, since it's unlikely a cultivated South London boy like you would really be an anti-Semite. A critical attitude to Zionism in Israel/Palestine is laudable, even if one doesn't have to see absolutely everything as being part of a Zionist agenda, but far-right rhetoric has to be used with care if at all. I enjoy a bit of bad taste but, er...
|
>>Has anyone ever seen Nigel Farage finish his pint and hold his glass out for another? I can't remember him doing that. But I have to say that the pint and fag as props seem to me endearing rather than repellent and ridiculous. You can see why the kippers love his smiling face.<<
From what I can tell anyone who has been in the party for long ends up having a half with him at some point so I presume he finishes a pint from time to time. It is the time he takes with members that seems to keep the adoration alive, somehow almost all activists I have come across have had a picture taken with him and he apparently makes time to chat to everyone too. His comfort in spending time with the grassroots counts for a great deal.
Actually alot of the party officers make time to chat to you, sometimes approaching you and asking your thoughts on the party.
|
Nigel's response to recent critics!
tinyurl.com/monnax6
|
Although the Express is owned by the Zionist Richard Desmond, I may well have to ditch the esteemed Daily Wail and start checking out the Daily Express (after I've read Lud's comic)
:}
|
Doug, do you obsess a bit much about this Zionist stuff?
All a bit OTT and "conspiracy theory" isn't it?
|
Maybe so but, it passes the time until the sun comes around again, I've just worked out that from November 'til the end of March I will have started 150 fires - no wonder they call me a maniac!
But seriously No Manual Man, I can't say too much because Steel Spark will accuse me of being anti-Semitic, he's another one who has gorn AWOL, along with gb, corax, L'escargot, the Dutchman etc. etc.
|
>> Maybe so but, it passes the time until the sun comes around again, I've just
>> worked out that from November 'til the end of March I will have started 150
>> fires - no wonder they call me a maniac!
>>
>> But seriously No Manual Man, I can't say too much because Steel Spark will accuse
>> me of being anti-Semitic, he's another one who has gorn AWOL, along with gb, corax,
>> L'escargot, the Dutchman etc. etc.
>
If you talk about Zionism and its part in the Middle East conflict that's one thing. When we get onto Jewish bankers and stuff that implies conspiracy my, admittedly sensitive, alarm bell for racism etc starts to ring.
GB is still active over in HJ's place. Dutchie was but isn't now. No idea about Corax or Snaily.
|
>
>> GB is still active over in HJ's place. Dutchie was but isn't now. No idea
>> about Corax or Snaily.
>>
Update,
Corax was on HJ ten minutes ago posting on DPFs in Mondeos.
|
>>Corax was on HJ ten minutes ago posting on DPFs in Mondeos.
Ah, interesting ... he's obviously given us the el bow then.
|
|
Have barely looked at HJ since jamie et al started treating it like Pistonheads.
|
>> Have barely looked at HJ since jamie et al started treating it like Pistonheads.
Jamie seems to be giving it a rest ATM, maybe he's been sectioned again ;-)
Still far more opinionated than here and too many one time posters who get short shrift.
|
|
Meanwhile, in LibDem Land .....tinyurl.com/ma9q8p8
|
Unemployment down.
Housing market buoyant
Interest rates low
Inflation low
Stock market rising
Government borrowing falling
Anyone seriously think that the Tories won't win the next election?
At the end of the day people don't really care too much about immigration, the EU or sexual shenanigans if they've got a job and a few pounds in their pocket.
It's the economy, Stupid!
|
>> It's the economy, Stupid!
>>
I notice we don't hear much from Ed Balls anymore.
Last edited by: VxFan on Wed 22 Jan 14 at 19:09
|
>> I notice we don't hear much from Ed Balls anymore.
>>
I firmly believe that Ed Balls is a recruiting sergeant for the Tories.
|
>> >> I notice we don't hear much from Ed Balls anymore.
>> >>
>>
>> I firmly believe that Ed Balls is a recruiting sergeant for the Tories.
>>
............yes, but so are Cameron & Clegg for UKIP!
|
>>At the end of the day people don't really care too much about immigration, the EU or sexual shenanigans if they've got a job and a few pounds in their pocket.
Funnily enough, the Scots (many of) echo similar sentiments regarding independence as in if they end up with a few more (handfuls) of Shekels in their pockets, they're more likely to vote aye.
|
>>At the end of the day people don't really care too much about immigration, the EU or sexual shenanigans if they've got a job and a few pounds in their pocket.
But many people do care about immigration, the EU, and same sex marriage, and we will be voting UKIP.
|
>> >>At the end of the day people don't really care too much about immigration, the
>> EU or sexual shenanigans if they've got a job and a few pounds in their
>> pocket.
>>
>> But many people do care about immigration, the EU, and same sex marriage, and we
>> will be voting UKIP.
So what are you going to do about all those existing same sex marriages? I guess they will be part of the final solution that you seem to support.
I'm sure you'll blame the Jews.
|
>>I guess they will be part of the final solution that you seem to support.
I've never ever said that.
>>I'm sure you'll blame the Jews.
I'm anti-Zionist, not anti-Semitic.
|
>> I'm anti-Zionist, not anti-Semitic.
Don't think so my old fruit.
|
>> I'm anti-Zionist, not anti-Semitic.
Don't think so my old fruit.
My wife is 1/4 Jewish ... and I'm 1/2 Vulcan.
|
>> Unemployment down.
>>
>> Housing market buoyant
>>
>> Interest rates low
>>
>> Inflation low
>>
>> Stock market rising
>>
>> Government borrowing falling
>>
>> Anyone seriously think that the Tories won't win the next election?
Me. Labour are ahead in polls and Tories failed to adjust electoral system so it favoured them.
My guess is a Lab/Lib/Nationalist coalition after 2015, possibly with Ed Balls or Alastair Darling as leader.
|
|
Ed Balls is a spent force. Expect him sidelined or ejected from the front bench before the next election.
|
>> Anyone seriously think that the Tories won't win the next election?
>>
>>
>> Me. Labour are ahead in polls and Tories failed to adjust electoral system so it
>> favoured them.
>>
Would you like to bet me a shilling on that?
|
>>At the end of the day people don't really care too much about immigration, the EU or sexual shenanigans if they've got a job and a few pounds in their pocket.<<
Depends entirely on the individual, unless it actually touches their pocket it is meaningless and many I speak to see the recovery as a London/South East recovery, unlikely to reach them.
The Tories have an electoral mountain to climb for 2015 and I seriously doubt they will get the credit for the recovery that they would hope. The maths suggest Labour are still in a strong position and we may still have Clegg as DPM in 2015. It is still a very open contest.
|
>> >>At the end of the day people don't really care too much about immigration, the
>> EU or sexual shenanigans if they've got a job and a few pounds in their
>> pocket.<<
>>
>> Depends entirely on the individual, unless it actually touches their pocket it is meaningless and
>> many I speak to see the recovery as a London/South East recovery, unlikely to reach
>> them.
>
7.1% fall in unemployment says otherwise. (London and the South East was mostly fully employed and could not be part of that fall)
|
>>7.1% fall in unemployment says otherwise. (London and the South East was mostly fully employed and could not be part of that fall)<<
Cant win an election on the newly employed alone. What region did the fall come from then? How many marginal Tory seats are in that area?
The Tories are very worried, they tend to do the maths and not get the results they would like, they need to be on 40% + in the polls to get a majority. Doesnt seem likely atm.
|
>> >>7.1% fall in unemployment says otherwise. (London and the South East was mostly fully employed
>> and could not be part of that fall)<<
>>
>> Cant win an election on the newly employed alone. What region did the fall come
>> from then? How many marginal Tory seats are in that area?
Merely saying it wasn't London & The South East. You can't dispute there is a growing feel good factor despite the labour party trying to dis it and destroy confidence.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 22 Jan 14 at 21:53
|
>>Merely saying it wasn't London & The South East. You can't dispute there is a growing feel good factor despite the labour party trying to dis it and destroy confidence.<<
I think if like me you have your own business then perhaps you notice the difference, I have certainly sensed a little improvement, but if you are in a job already you are not likely to detect it unless you buy into the media narrative.
Just on a factual note, the unemployment rate didnt fall 7.1%, 7.1% is the unemployment figure.
You are also wrong about the SE as 29k came off the unemployment figure ( full employment a myth ) there whereas 15k were added to the SW unemployment numbers. Midlands did well, NE was fairly static, London shaved 18k off and Wales went down 12k.
So you were wrong about London and the SE but right that it wasnt exclusive. Gotta love having the figures to hand :-)
|
I personally find the Tories a party with economic credentials but with many individuals who make Ed Balls appealing - see Pattinson/Hague/many backbenchers.
And frankly as a party they have no USP which has common appeal.
I expect a Labour Government (which is likely to be an economic shambles) And a wealth tax. And a mansion tax and raised income tax. etc..
|
"Nigel's response to recent critics!"
That's it then, Nigel has definitely got my vote. During the past several elections, the Lib/Lab/Cons have been searching their souls for an election motto and usually come up with something inane like "Making progress together", "working for a positive future" etc. Every time I've growled at the telly "The answer is obvious ………………….. when is somebody going to talk about COMMON SENSE".
And Nigel has done it; congratulations, Nige!
|
"The answer is obvious ………………….. when is somebody going to talk
>> about COMMON SENSE".
>>
>> And Nigel has done it; congratulations, Nige!
Isn't being in favour of common sense just as much motherhood and apple pie as all the other guff?
|
>>Isn't being in favour of common sense just as much motherhood and apple pie as all the other guff?<<
Sometimes even the most basic expectations can be selling points if the opposition often fail on the basics. If Cameron had pledged to stop talking in PR driven riddles he would have got more credit than he did for the Big Society or Milliband for his One Nation rubbish. Speaking to several ex-Labour voters they hold Milliband in the same contempt as they do Cameron, they called him a posh sell-out who has no connection with working people.
|
"Isn't being in favour of common sense just as much motherhood and apple pie as all the other guff?"
An interesting comment - as I suspected, folks have lost sight of the concept of 'common sense' amongst the forest of political claptrap.
|
UKIP - Westpig
