What is it with stupid idiotic stupid people that negotiate the sale with me, reach an agreement, start the ball rolling then pull out? It's driving me nuts!
1st cash buyer pulls out as he felt offended when requested by the EA to prove he has funds in place. haha
Reduced price
2nd cash buyer, new to the country (investment banker) wasn't aware of stamp duty and found out he couldn't get a mortgage due to not registering himself on the electoral roll, wanted to write me a cheque for £380k and give him a personal mortgage for £60k.
Sacked agent. Reduced price further.
3rd Buyer, after weeks of negotiating, including everything to be included in the sale, right down to the tv in the kitchen and me giving them 10k back on completion to enable them to make certain changes, have pulled out.
What a bunch of Idiots.
It's driving us insane. There should be a financial penalty to prevent people from throwing out offers on properties.
There. That feels better.
Last edited by: VxFan on Mon 9 Dec 13 at 10:13
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Works both ways.
I know a potential seller who let the buyer go through all the stages before pulling out at the last moment because they decided they liked the house. The buyer had even paid for a full structural survey. It cost them hundreds.
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I know BT, just miffed that i've been done three times. Doesn't Scotland have a better system?
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>> I know BT, just miffed that i've been done three times. Doesn't Scotland have a
>> better system?
no, 50 people pay for a survey, put in sealed bids, and 49 people have wasted survey money.
Last edited by: Zero on Fri 6 Dec 13 at 16:22
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Works both ways. Sold mine to first time buyer for 98% of the asking price within 3 days.
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Lucky you! Admittedly my previous houses all went to plan but I'm hoping I've now used up all the timewasters in that area.
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>>1st cash buyer pulls out as he felt offended when..............
I don't really understand this. Surely it would have become obvious at the point he actually had to pay for it, so what was the "early proof" about? Sounds like he might not have bought it anyway, but equally sounds like someone officious involved.
>>2nd cash buyer, new to the country...........
I would have accepted the cheque, upped the price by £30k and stood as guarantor for a £90k mortgage retaining an interest on the property.
>>3rd Buyer, after weeks of negotiating..........
In my experience you have to make them want it. You do that by making it aspirational, not by trying to meet their every demand.
>>It's driving us insane.
I mean no offence, but are you sure you are managing the sale in an objective and emotionless manner? Reducing price, agreeing to conditions, changing agents etc. etc makes me wonder if you're being a bit too compliant.
Compliant sellers worry me, they make me feel I'm missing something.
I'd rather buy from someone who is a little bit arrogant over what he's got. Who tries to make me feel clever when I get his price down a bit and represents his asset as something I should be determined to get.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Fri 6 Dec 13 at 17:16
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You have a point about the 2nd buyer, but I just wanted to sell the house and use the funds for another project.
I fully agree with you about maybe I'm being too compliant. However part of the negotiations were myself not accepting their original offer and terms. I got rid of the first agent due to them not verifying the buyers financial position before an offer was made then removing the property from the market until they had. The property is not local to me and on separate occasions the agent did viewings they left taps running (metered water), couldn't open the gate so had to get the potential buyers to climb over a wall and left all the lights on. Had to let them go.
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I remove the details from the market when contracts are exchanged, not before.
When I last had this conversation and the buyer wanted me to do so, he was unable to explain why I should need to, especially if he was going to move as fast as he said he would.
Also, I clearly stated that not only would I not remove it from the market, I may well accept a better offer or faster exchange if it happened before he was able to exchange, although I would do him the courtesy of allowing him to improve his offer if such a thing should happen.
He moved very quickly and bought the house with no issue, argument, difficulty or discount.
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>> separate occasions the agent did viewings they left taps running
>> (metered water), couldn't open the gate so had to get the potential buyers to climb
>> over a wall and left all the lights on. Had to let them go.
They've not improved since 96/7 then.
I left keys to house we were selling with agent so they could do accompanied viewings at viewers convenience while we holidayed in a remote corner of the Outer Hebrides.
A few days into holiday I use call box in Tarbert (no mobile signal on Harris back then) to check home answer machine; five calls from agent asking if time x is convenient for them to bring viewers round!!!
He was still arrogant when I got home, challenged him and advised I was going multi-agency.
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I had this from an estate agent as well - whether I was funded or not. Not really any of their business..On the whole I found them ill-educated chancers (the ones I dealt with of course) with little in the way of imagination. I ended up selling my house to a guy I knew, dealing directly with him to settle a price and keeping the estate agents in the dark until I was ready to disclose.
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>> I had this from an estate agent as well - whether I was funded or
>> not. Not really any of their business..On the whole I found them ill-educated chancers (the
>> ones I dealt with of course) with little in the way of imagination.
Wasn't impressed with the set up when I sold my London house a couple of years back and we had two withdrawn offers.
I managed to get one to admit they deliberately pitch in with too high a price to start with just to get your business..great...so that was 6 weeks wasted.
They were most reluctant to talk sense to me about price, I had to work it out myself, (via the internet and especially the Rightmove site). Presumably this is why so many sellers have hopeless expectations, these tits are fuelling it and not having the proper conversation to get the price right.
It's only worth what someone else will pay for it, after all.
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Most, but not all Estate Agents. Several Accountants that I know that 'work' for our Sub-Contractors advising them and getting it stupidly wrong and nearly all Solicitors that I have had to deal with should be put in a Hessian sack and thrown in the nearest canal.
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>>Doesn't Scotland have a better system?
>>>>no, 50 people pay for a survey, put in sealed bids, and 49 people have wasted survey money.
Not any more.
Now every seller needs a survey when the property is put on the market, freely available to anyone interested in the property.
If a buyer wants to do their own that's up to them but isn't strictly necessary.
The days of 'offers over' leading to mass sealed bids are largely gone with the collapse and settlement of the housing market.
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>> >>Doesn't Scotland have a better system?
>> Not any more.
You should have left Zero in his delusional Surrey bubble. :-)
Last edited by: Old Navy on Fri 6 Dec 13 at 19:47
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Bought 'n sold 9 owses over the years, never had a buyer pull out (threatening to duff 'em up if they do helps)
I always think along the lines of it'll never reach completion , and well, it's not the end of the world if we stay here anyway.
Had some near noyvous breakdowns a few times though I might add - all part of the fun :(
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What is the difference between an Estate Agent and a trampoline?
You should take your boots off *before* you jump on a trampoline.
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Enoughalready, your house should be in London.
It's crazy here and nobody pulls out. Recently, a family member offered full asking price a couple of times and was outbid. We soon learned the game, cuddled up to the agents and viewed the first day the properties were being marketed. Even then, they paid the best part of £10k over the asking price and didn't quibble over the condition or fixtures.
Now, two months later, those properties have an asking price £30k higher - goodness knows what they are actually selling for. In many places it's down to 30 people viewing on a Saturday and sealed bids asked by noon on Monday.
It'll all end in tears of course.
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I wish. This ones in Reading. Not my area to be honest. Auction buy but it came with land that I've separated to enable me to put two semi's up later. The problem is, is that this house is top end for that area and has fewer bites and I need the money from that sale to build the others.
I did try to bid on a few in maida vale but they went for beyond my budget. Maybe next time.
Reading is proving a learning curve..,
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Well round here, in North Surrey, there is nothing on the market. I am planning to sell up my mums house and move her into a bungalow - but its a no-no at the moment.
Fully expect the market to burst open in Feb/March
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Maybe it's a good time to sell her pad then Zero? I'm not so sure about it bursting, been there, done that etc.. More careful lending. It might stagnate but I wouldn't bet on a burst.
I'd recommend an Estate Agent but I can't because they're all idiots. Do you know that the last valuations I had between 4 different EA's there was £130,000 difference between the highest and lowest on a £450k property? Complete joke.
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As a matter of interest EA was there an even spread of valuations or cluster plus outlier?
Valuing identikit properties in a steady market is a cinch. Less so when the market is slow or volatile and/or the property is in some way different. The fact that you've severed land may make it 'different'.
OTOH 30% is a massive variation. If that's a low outlier I might think the estate agent even more of a crook then the rest of them.
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No, they were all over the place. Admittedly this is quite a unique property so it would be hard to do a comparison. However, I had an idea how much it was worth which was pretty much middle and I didn't go with the highest EA. I was astonished at the lack of knowledge they all had in their own trade though.
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>> Maybe it's a good time to sell her pad then Zero?
No can't do that there is nothing to buy she would be homeless
>>I'm not so sure
>> about it bursting, been there, done that etc..
It will round here. Lending is not a problem here market here held up all through the crash
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>> came with land that I've separated to enable me to put two semi's up later.
You sure that's not the reason it isn't selling?
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>>>You sure that's not the reason it isn't selling?
Crossed my mind. I've rejected many houses over the years where such a split has been made with the unkempt empty plot next door. Far rather buy where the new build has been there a while so you know what you're getting.
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The land doesn't really effect the property and has never come up in conversation. Additionally, there's no planning permission applied for yet so that wouldn't show up in any searches, not that we've ever got that far yet.
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I hate it when people renege on a deal of any kind. I try to avoid doing business with those who have a reputation for it and pride myself that no one could accuse me of ever having done it.
If I shake someone's hand on a deal, from my side it's done. In my view that should apply to all. Sadly, experience has taught me that it doesn't.
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The handshake is always the sealer.
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>> The handshake is always the sealer.
Only if someone gobbed on it first.
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>> What is the difference between an Estate Agent and a trampoline?
>>
>> You should take your boots off *before* you jump on a trampoline.
>>
'sigh' what a terribly immature thing to say!
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Mention of estate agents always brings up vitriol.
Last house I sold (central London, 2007), I had valuations 33% below what I marketed it (and sold it) for, plus up to 13% over what I marketed it (and sold it) for. A complete range between the two extremes; I think I got ten different agents in owing to the diverse range. No crooks, just struggling to keep up with the local market.
OP, I'm with NoFM2R; I'd have upped the price on the second one and guaranteed the mortgage. And offered him 10k back if he cleared the mortgage within 12 months (which he would have done, being on the electoral roll by then).
RP - I don't get why you think it's not the agent's business to know if you have the cash ready. He's managing the sale; he cannot do this unless he knows there's a sale going to happen.
Scotland - Would *you* buy the house on the basis of a survey commissioned by a third party, the vendor? I certainly wouldn't.
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When we bought our present house after coming back from foreign parts, we certainly had to prove our ability to purchase before we made an offer.
IIRC, I actually took a bank statement into the agent to prove we were cash purchasers.
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>>Scotland - Would *you* buy the house on the basis of a survey commissioned by a third party, the vendor? I certainly wouldn't.
Indeed, but you can 'buy' the property on the proviso that your own survey doesn't bring up anything new, rather than the old state of not making an offer until you had done the survey.
Having been looking at a few properties in 2012 I found it very useful to have a survey available before viewing without needing to pay for it.
My solicitor said that if the survey was over 3 months old he would usually advise making a re-survey a condition of the sales process.
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Complete on new house tomorrow. Only half packed. Beginning to panic. Probably shouldn't be on here.
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Been there, done that AND worn the t shirt ... it'll be alright on the night day.
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This flat rabbit hutch has just gorn for nigh-on the fool asking price:
www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-40952338.html
We all said she was asking too much for it but, newly weds have bought it.
2nd 'bedroom' is 6' x 9' :(
She's done it up nice though ... catchy eye takey money ;-)
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Jeebus - location really is everything.
Same money, and it's even nearly in England...
www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-25450380.html
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If I wanted a flat for that sort of money, i'd have this one
www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-40280938.html
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My recently deceased Mothers house is now on the market. Its pitched at £139.950 for starters. A law firm which is tied in with the estate agents has contacted me and has a fixed fee of £475 all in for the work. Obviously there is no purchase just the sale. Does this sound a reasonable fee?
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If you are just selling, and you have all the matters of ownership sorted (and simple - i.e. in one persons name), and thats up round your way, that price is over the top.
Get some quotes.
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It's about the going rate.
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Up there, 350 - 375 would be the going rate. Been quoted 425 / 425 down here in expensive Surrey (thats buy / sell) On a considerably more expensive house purchase/sale as well.
Last edited by: Zero on Tue 10 Dec 13 at 19:50
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Paid £600 for my solicitor to buy a house last year (£140k) - was a fair amount of work as the cottage was part of a large farm being split up and needed some clarification of boundaries, services, etc.
Seemed a fair price to me.
For selling I'd expect the legal fees to be around £400ish, not including agency costs which are usually around 0.5-0.75%.
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>>Same money, and it's even nearly in England...
Funnily enough I've just been looking on Rightmove for properties in the Argyll and Bute area, after watching:
www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01qbgw0/Escape_to_the_Country_Series_13_West_of_Scotland/
Are the midges really THAT bad though?
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>>>Are the midges really THAT bad though?
Some years in some parts after 30mins outside in the evening trying to get a job done you would happily sell the house for half what you paid and move out that night.
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No good then Fl, I could stand it but the missus couldn't.
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Yep, they are. The midges are bad but the cleggs are worse. You do develop an immunity in time though.
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Cleggs are termites I take it, oh well, it's back to the Canaries then (or Cyprus)
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Myself and daughters seem particularly attractive to insect bites (spouses claim they never get bitten when any of us are around).
Summer months I use coal tar soap and 'deet' insect repellent when I go out.
Eldest daughter was diagnosed with measles on a holiday to western isles, turned out to be midge bites!
Got caught out a few weeks ago. Went in a Wetherspoons and found several bites on my lower legs next day. Cat got treated, although it wasn't due for a couple of weeks. Back in Wetherspoons a week later and got bitten again - won't be back there for a while!
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>>'deet'
Good stuff I hear, the expats in Cyprus use it for the mozzies.
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We've taken a holiday in Scotland once or twice a year for much of the past 30yrs. I have no idea how but we were lucky for the first 20yrs and not unduly troubled. Then over the past 10yrs we've had a few really bad years.
We go boating and out on the water at speed you are not troubled but arrive back at dusk with the boat to pull up the beach, outboard to dismount and car to pack... well they make life hell for 20mins. We started to wear midge hoods in the end but they still get everywhere else unless you wear clothing over everything.
In the wrong area eating outdoors in the evening is unbearable.
Last edited by: Fenlander on Tue 10 Dec 13 at 20:28
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In all seriousness it is a truly superb boating location for smallcraft... and been going there so long we feel at home as soon as we cross the border..
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>>and been going
>> there so long we feel at home as soon as we cross the border..
Don't tell me, you have given each midge a name.
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We do have names for them at times!
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>> Don't tell me, you have given each midge a name.
There's Mary. And Mungo. And....
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I recently offered £250k on a house. Seller rejected the offer. She wants £260k.
I thought all houses in the £250-£270k zone sell for £250k by default. Stamp duty threshold creates a big barrier in this range.
Last edited by: movilogo on Wed 11 Dec 13 at 14:09
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Different threshold, but my next door neighbour has just pulled exactly the same nonsense. Asking 525k and rejected £500k, holding out for 20k more. No-one's biting.
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Bought our cottage 2.5 years ago for £250k from an asking price of £260k.
I wouldn't have paid a penny over the £250k because of the stamp duty.
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Neighbour sold his house for 510,000.
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My nephew just sold a semi in Sevenoaks for over half a million. (All paid for, too - but he wants to buy in Brighton, if his Irish missus can settle in the UK!)
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It takes HOW LONG for fibre broadband to be installed!? Moved in, currently incommunicado unless I can claim C4P is essential business use on the company iPad.
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Have a look at Tooway for full satellite broadband. OK it will cost you for start up, but I installed for a friend in S of France during the summer and (thunderstorms apart) it has been reliable. Surprisingly Skype works well, with the latency being hardly noticeable. Dish provided is about 85cm and built to commercial standards. Not really suitable for on line action gaming but wil do everything else. sat.tooway.co.uk/
For a reviews just google.
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When we moved to this house, I think it took a couple of weeks to get BT fibre broadband installed (might have been a bit less). You first need to get the phone line working for you and then need to sort out Internet. And remember an Openreach engineer will need to be booked in.
Whilst we were waiting I used a USB dongle in the back of the Mac for Internet access. Worked well enough.
We did initially want to keep our previous BT number but that would have delayed things. First you'd need the line working, then switch the phone number to the old one and only then could you request Internet. The Internet connection is linked to phone number and we were told this was the order things had to be done.
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We accepted a 4th offer on Friday evening. Hurrah.
They withdrew it by Monday morning. Grrrr
They decided that it was out of their budget!
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Sounds like you need a USP.
Like "if you complete by such and such a date, we will throw in free a complete set of garden tools, a billiard table " or whatever the purchaser has hinted they might like.
After all, you want to SELL it. So use some marketing..
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I'd make them an offer they can't refuse. They don't have a horse by any chance?
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>> We accepted a 4th offer on Friday evening. Hurrah.
>>
>> They withdrew it by Monday morning. Grrrr
>>
>> They decided that it was out of their budget!
>>
Idiots! It took us 18 months to move last time because of similar issues. Not doing it again until retirement if I can help it.
Interested to see your place is in Reading, EA. That's my manor. Whereabouts is it and which agent is handling it for you, if you don't mind my asking?
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 27 Dec 13 at 00:54
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I'd show you Alanović via pm if I could. Is that facility not available on this here forum?
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No I don't think so, but I'd be happy for a mod to provide you with my email address. I doubt I can be of any help but you never know. I'm fairly au fait with the market in the town and know a few decentish estate agents (yes, they do exist).
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Rant alert...
How hard is it to Hoover a carpet once every so often? Even once a year would do. Presently have got about half the carpets cleaned. Turned out they're quite nice under the layer of black grime.
First Rug Doctor committed suicide after being shown the state of the living room carpet. Went back to B&Q and returned with a sturdier model. This was after discovering that they'd wired the washing machine, unfused, directly into the ring main...
Phone call from previous owners this morning: "Are you forwarding on our mail?"
No, I'm not. It's in a box here for you to come over and collect it. If you can't be bothered to pay for the redirection it's not my problem.
Good news though, BT finally plugged the broadband in. Have gone from 2mbps to 74. Went out and bought a FreeSat box to celebrate.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 27 Dec 13 at 00:53
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>> they'd wired the washing machine, unfused, directly into the ring main...
>>
Do let us know what other "gems" you find :-(
Our neighbour at our previous house was intentoin DIY to save money but had little skill.
When house was sold the new neighbour called me in to look at some bodges.
Cable from the fuse box with a PLUG on it which then went to a socket. The cable then went along the top of the kitchen sink, through the external wall, under the paving and into a leaky sort shed/garage.
The old guy polished his Rover so much it was through the top coat in places.
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So it wasn't sold with an EICR certificate?
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Wouldn't have been picked up unless the inspector removed every socket in the kitchen, even then wouldn't be obvious.
They'd bypassed the fuse on the spur than runs to an unfused faceplate behind the washing machine. Effectively, they simply connected the washing machine to the supply terminals and the ring to the load side. So if you switched it off you broke the ring but didn't realise. It's kind of a moot point because the fuse had gone anyway.
The only giveaway is that the washing machine wouldn't turn off with that switch. But in a kitchen of all places, where it's not uncommon to have a kettle / toaster / coffee machine / dishwasher / fridge etc running simultaneously.
Took me a long time to track down. Come to think of it, it could be the contractor who did the electrical install in the first place.
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>> Wouldn't have been picked up unless the inspector removed every socket in the kitchen, even
>> then wouldn't be obvious.
>>
>>
Wouldn't the supply in the shed attract attention?
I know our ramshackle set-up wouldn't pass any inspection so I can't talk, but I thought outside supplies had to have some kind of fused outlet with a trip?
I'd have thought a wire just running through the kitchen and then disappearing would be suspicious?
On the other hand, if that kind of thing is undetectable by an electrician than I'm in the clear. :)
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Cliff
It was a long time ago so IIRC only the Electricity Board around to do formal checks.
I have just installed/ replaced an electric oven.
1.The oven installation instructions talk about a plug but oven is rated at 16 A.
2. The fuse box in the flat has 2 x 5A and 2 x 30A ( now MCBs but was fuses)
So surprise surprise the cooker outlet,( used for oven only ) is on one of the ring circuits !
No spare slots in the fuse box and it will be pain to run a new cable.
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>> Cliff
>> It was a long time ago so IIRC only the Electricity Board around to do
>> formal checks.
>>
>> I have just installed/ replaced an electric oven.
>> 1.The oven installation instructions talk about a plug but oven is rated at 16 A.
>> 2. The fuse box in the flat has 2 x 5A and 2 x 30A
>> ( now MCBs but was fuses)
>> So surprise surprise the cooker outlet,( used for oven only ) is on one of
>> the ring circuits !
>> No spare slots in the fuse box and it will be pain to run a
>> new cable.
>>
Have done exactly the same in the past. Didn't encounter any problems.
Thanks to the nature of fuses you can get quite a bit more than 13A through most of them...
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>> This was after discovering that they'd wired the washing machine, unfused, directly into the ring main...
I assume your consumer unit has MCB fuses? Given that the washing machine is probably rated at 13amp, the ring main MCB would trip long before it would take out the washing machine fuse if anything untoward were to happen to it.
EDIT - the only danger would be an unsuspecting engineer working on the appliance thinking he'd isolated it at the plug top/fused spur, but actually hadn't. The MCB would still kick in though, minimising any potential electric shock.
Last edited by: VxFan on Tue 17 Dec 13 at 21:28
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Wot, a 32A MCB trip before the (non-existent) fuse? Having said that, I'm pretty sure there's another fuse inside the washing machine, but still...
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Not cleaning one's home before moving shows a lack of pride in oneself!
I reckon when we moved out of our Spanish apartment we spent two full days cleaning it, while squatting - with permission - in a friend's empty flat next door!
Similarly when we moved into our present house it was sparklingly clean.
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>>Not cleaning one's home before moving shows a lack of pride in oneself!
S'right! - swmbi always cleans the place from top-to-bottom whenever we've moved owse, while I help load/unload the van/lorry.
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>> I help load/unload the van/lorry.
>>
Don't you have, er, people for that sort of thing?
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>>Don't you have, er, people for that sort of thing?
Werkin class mate, ain I, used to drive a lorry delivering paper (printing) to London/home counties, and that.
Had 5 BIG conifers cut down here recently ... I worked as hard as them who cut 'em down, like.
:}
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>>The MCB would still kick in though, minimising any potential electric shock<<<
Dangerous misconception.
Did you just mis-spell RCD ?
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>> >>The MCB would still kick in though, minimising any potential electric shock<<<
>>
>> Dangerous misconception. Did you just mis-spell RCD ?
I was thinking that some MCBs also have inbuilt RCD protection. Not all apparantely though.
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>> >> >>The MCB would still kick in though, minimising any potential electric shock<<<
>> >>
>> >> Dangerous misconception. Did you just mis-spell RCD ?
>>
>> I was thinking that some MCBs also have inbuilt RCD protection. Not all apparantely though.
>>
They are then called RCBOs. (And are a rather expensive solution).
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House sale. 3rd time unlucky - bathtub tom
