This is a repost from the esteemed Mary in Malaga on the Spain expat forum, it made me smile :)
"Don't buy this hateful rag!!
When I make my rare forays into areas with a larger Brit population I find that the Daily Mail is often the only paper to be found in petrol stations and supermarkets. It is obviously very popular amongst immigrants in Spain.
The Mail is notorious for its skewed reporting, its smears on any politician to the left of Nick Griffin, its anti-Europeanism, its obsession with immigrants, benefit cheats, sex crimes especially those involving underage girls, teachers and lesbians with no salacious detail spared...but it has now surely gone way beyond the boundaries of taste and decency in its attack on Ralph Miliband.
Miliband pere was an unreconstructed old Marxist whose relevance to real, practical politics was nil. He was an academic, a theoretician of socialism more revered in Hampstead than Huddersfield. He came to the UK as a refugee from the Nazis and volunteered - yes, volunteered - to fight in the Royal Navy in the War for the country that became his adopted home.
Yet the Nazi-supporting Daily Mail has dared to label this man as 'hating' Britain.
Why? On the grounds of his Marxism...a belief often adopted by idealistic young people such as myself, a CPGB member in my youth and also taken up by such as the son of the one-time Head of the CBI, Adair Turner and also by Mail rabid right-wing columnist Peter Hitchens, once a rabid Trotskyite.
The Mail's 'evidence' for this 'hatred' includes Miliband's criticisms of some British values such as excessive patriotism, the established church and the monarchy, amongst other things. Well, I must by their definition also hate Britain as although I reject Miliband's Marxism I too have little respect for some of our British 'values'.
I would NEVER pay money for this rag. I wouldn't use it to wrap up the dog's crap. I read it online so I can post replies under some of the more ludicrous pieces...I use the names MarbellaMary or PraguePix. Sometimes my posts get to see print, mostly they don't.
I would really love to start some kind of 'Dacre Must Go' petition plus a boycott of the Daily Heil. But I'm in Spain ....I'm tempted to write 'Danger: fascist propaganda' on sheets of A4 to leave on the piles of DMs when I see them...or accidently spill cooking oil on them..I'm getting old and clumsy, after all....
At least Cameron, Clegg and Heseltine have voiced their objections to this disgusting character assassination. Alistair Campbell said it all last night on 'Newsnight' when he said The Mail purported to stand for the best of British values when it actually exemplified and promoted the worst. He also called Dacre a coward for sending his deputy Steafel to defend the indefensible.
I would urge everyone to spread the word 'Danger: this newspaper contains poison. Do not buy".
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Whilst agreeing wholeheartedly with the lady, it needs pointing out that the Wail is really just a massive, professional trolling operation. The lady would be best advised not increasing its sellability to advertisers by constantly clicking on its website and contributing to the comments. She has been fished. Clicking on the website in this day and age is as bad as buying the paper version.
As with all trolls, the best advice is ignore, ignore, ignore. One thing that irritates me about this (C4P) website and its contributors' use of tinyurls is the occasional accidental click on to their website which I make. I don't buy the rubbish, I don't want to make it seem popular by clicking on its website, I won't even pick up a copy in the barber's for fear of contributing to the illusion of its acceptability as a reasonable and valid publication merely by being seen reading it.
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The Mail is one of this country's two joke newspapers - the Daily Mirror being the other.
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Have you forgotten the Express, a shadow of its old Beaverbrook self?
But they're all a bit of a joke these days here and there, when you read them. They always were in a way. Horror comics for adults.
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What I find perturbing is that this disgrace of a newspaper has a sixth-monthly circulation of around 1.8 million - second in the league table*. A worryingly large number of people thus feed their ill-informed, distorted picture of the world - and are prepared to pay for the privilege.
*The Sun: 2.3 million
The Mail: 1.8 million
The Mirror: 1 million
The Express: 0.5 million
The Times: 0.4 million
The Telegraph: 0.4 million
The Guardian: 0.2 million
source - tinyurl.com/nqsx3og
Last edited by: FocalPoint on Wed 2 Oct 13 at 14:50
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I wondered how long it would be before this came up on here. It'll be no surprise that I agree with every word quoted in the OP.
As Tory MP Zac Goldsmith has pointed out yesterday the Mail is the paper that published the headline 'Hurrrah for the Blackshirts' and supported appeasement right up to the appointment of Churchill as PM.
Rather good pic elesewhere on the net with Ralph Miliband in uniform on one side and Harmsworth/Rothermere with Hitler on the other. Caption reads 'Who did more to defeat Fascism'?
One other point. There's a distinction between political revolutionary 'Marxism' as hi-jacked by Lenin, Stalin etc and an academic sociologist or historian who sees the world in the Marxist paradigm of the struggle between Capital and Labour. Professor Miliband was of the latter group.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Wed 2 Oct 13 at 14:43
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>> Professor Miliband was of the latter group.
Indeed. POLITICS IS COMPLICATED! (he bawled, not for the first time).
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I've just read up about him on Wikipedia. He sounds a decent, fair-minded, patriotic yet critical kind of bloke, exactly the sort of civilisation we were fighting for.
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I think anyone in politics should expect and be ready to defend themselves, it is the nature of the beast.
I thought the story was pretty harsh but being in UKIP I am used to the concept of the media taking idiots views and applying it 30,000 people, guilt by association.
Ed might not like it when it happens to him ( guilt by association ) but he is slow to complain when it is about anyone else, he has made such a point of referencing his father in regards to his own politics, it was bound to happen when he declared a return to Socialism - I am suprised that he is suprised, it is like he has never been in politics before.
I have had my first taste of dealing with the negative side of being in UKIP, it is far from easy to deal with, but I realised it would be hard and I take on the challenge, even if it means stepping on people who are supposedly on my side. I wouldnt go on TV and ask for pity though, I knew what I was getting into and so did Ed.
Last edited by: FoR on Wed 2 Oct 13 at 14:59
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It's not so much harsh, as a blatant lie and smear. Harshness can be tolerated. Cold and bare faced lying should not be. The fallout even has Millibands opponents onside!
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I agree the left are normally not slow to brand their opponents by reference to the alleged shortcomings of their class and their ancestors, but I don't think they sink to the level of personal abuse of individuals.
It is a bit nauseating sometimes when public figures resort to emotional appeals to the memory of their dear old dad, but I don't think they deserve vitriol in return.
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>>I agree the left are normally not slow to brand their opponents by reference to the alleged shortcomings of their class and their ancestors, but I don't think they sink to the level of personal abuse of individuals<<
I didn't see anyone on the Right suggesting they have a party when Ralph died but the Left thought it was good fun for Thatcher so they have the capacity, don't worry, the Left is fuelled by hate.
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>>the Left is fuelled by hate
Outrageous! - what on earth gave you that idea?
order-order.com/2011/05/03/red-ed-hugs-thatcher-grave-dancer/
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Don't think Ralph Milliband was quite as prominent as Mrs T. Nor did he do anything untoward SFAIK. As for hatred, the Tories were none too backward with the stiletto when Mrs T. became a liability. Well characterised as the "nasty party"?
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From the missus:
"I find it a bit rich that Alistair Campbell has the audacity to criticise anyone or any organisation for character assassinations. If my memory serves me well he and in his role as a labour spin doctor has done some of that himself (big time) and aided Blair in the Weapons of Mass Destruction lies".
Nasty party politicians?
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>> From the missus:
>>
>> "I find it a bit rich that Alistair Campbell has the audacity to criticise anyone
>> or any organisation for character assassinations. If my memory serves me well he and in
>> his role as a labour spin doctor has done some of that himself (big time)
>> and aided Blair in the Weapons of Mass Destruction lies".
>>
>> Nasty party politicians?
I can see where she's coming from Fido. Anyone who's read accounts of the Blair years whether Andrew Rawnsley, Cherie or Tom Bower's biog of Brown can see how Campbell managed the media.
But that begs the question of why the parties need Campbell, Coulson et al. And part of the reason is the extent to which Murdoch, the Rothermere Press and before it fell on it's arxe the Express came to dominate HOW items were covered. Always about the men and not about what Tony Benn called 'the ishoos'.
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I admit, I sometimes buy the Wail when I have a flight to catch - it's the only one that I can just about find arm-room for.
I check out a number of papers on-line, but don't subscribe to any of them; the only publication that I subscribe to is Private Eye.
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A good number of DM readers are UKIP supporters.
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>> A good number of DM readers are UKIP supporters.
>>
And in other shock horror newspaper bias revelations a significant number of Mirror readers think Miliband would make a good PM and most car haters read the Guardian.
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It appears that no-one on this forum likes the DM or admits to reading it.
Why the do so many links to reports on it appear here?
Likewise The Sun, Mirror etc.
Where do you find them all?
Pat
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I think it's usually me who posts DM links - I assumed people would guess (correctly) that I read at least parts of it, the online version anyway.
I don't disagree with the anti-DM sentiments posted above, and I do feel a bit guilty reading it. But some of the non-political items are quite interesting, with excellent photos. So I can only apologise to Alanovic, Dog and others for my lack of willpower.
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>> ... I read at least parts of it, the online version anyway.
..often on a smartphone - their app works very well, and is free.
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>>But some of the non-political items are quite interesting, with excellent photos.
>> So I can only apologise to Alanovic, Dog and others for my lack of willpower.
>>
Well the bit about photos may be true, I did look at their website to see the pictures they had of the Reading Festival site after the event this year, but whilst the photos were good, the accompanying verbiage was written with an obvious slant, kids these days, world's gone to pot, declining standards, terrible imposition in the inhabitants of neighbouring multi-million pound properties etc etc ad nauseam. No attempt to find out the whys and wherefores, no mention of the mitigations and safeguards in place, no mention that most of the locals are quite happy to put up with it for a few days once a year, and many actually enjoy the event and spectacle.
No need of the apology though, just because it irritates me doesn't mean you shouldn't do it. But sentiment appreciated nonetheless!
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>>So I can only apologise to Alanovic, Dog and others for my lack of willpower.
Eh, what you on about Focusloss, my wife and I read the DM almost every day, on line, and back in the days when we bought a newspaper, it used to be The Daily Mail.
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Not just UKIP has fruitcakes! Some very frothy comments.
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Liddle never could resist jumping on a bandwagon.
AS for the Mail I'd never buy it but finding a copy left on a train I'd always read it. Tend to look at it's website most days too. Partly for entertainment but 35 years of public service also tells me that it informs and or reflects the views of a significant part of the populace.
It also picked up stuff relevant to my work in Quangoland that might not make the pages of the Times or Guardian. I might then have to sniff out a less slanted report or a real decision/judgement on BAILII or Judiciary.gov but at least it flagged a case for me.
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I would also suggest that their circulation is helped by Waitrose giving it away free to customers.
I often take a free one, but wouldn't pay for it
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>> I would also suggest that their circulation is helped by Waitrose giving it away free
>> to customers.
...although the Telegraph and Guardian are also available (I'd go for the former).
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>> I would also suggest that their circulation is helped by Waitrose giving it away free
>> to customers.
Pretty well all the papers boost their circulation with freebies and/or bargain subscriptions.
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Bought a copy of the Sun a while back and one of my children gave me some sort of snobbish cheek about it although she's a clever girl and knows perfectly well that I used to be a hack.
I'd quite like to be rich and have them all delivered daily. Certainly wouldn't mind Le Monde and the IHT to supplement my usual comic.
Even the tabloids in this country are put in the shade by the wall-to-wall cloud cuckoo land projected by some of the far-foreign comics it's been my pleasure to read. Never seen one, there or here, that didn't disgust me sometimes though.
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>> toys.usvsth3m.com/are-you-hated-by-the-daily-mail/
>>
>>
>> I'm detested - made my day.
>
Clearly not as liberal as me, I am HATED It was the pre marital sex that tipped it over the edge.
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Hated
It was No to Michael Gove wot did it.
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I am proud to be hated and detested. Depending on which way I answered. I'll accept both.
Last edited by: NIL on Wed 2 Oct 13 at 21:16
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>> Do not buy.
I've never bought the Daily Mail, or considered buying it.
But then again, it is must be about 10 years since I cancelled my order for the Press & Journal, and since that time, I have not bought a newspaper (other than the local weekly) of any description.
I rely on the internet for news of the outside world these days. (And no, I don't make a habit of visiting the Mail web site.)
Does anyone here actually buy a daily paper?
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>> Does anyone here actually buy a daily paper?
take "I" daily, and the Saturday and Sunday Times.
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>> Does anyone here actually buy a daily paper?
On the days I'm working in London I still buy a Guardian at the station bookstall, as I have for last 35 years.
Weekend papers were stopped a couple of years ago. Need to decide whether to go on buying a daily after I leave the Civil Service on 30 November. Guardian on line will probably suffice subject to work I take on after redundancy.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Wed 2 Oct 13 at 21:36
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>>
>> Does anyone here actually buy a daily paper?
>>
Daily Telegraph, daily.
I spread it on my desk at work over lunch (I mean, the lunch goes over it) and read up to the letters page, then I save the obituaries and the editorials etc until just before dinner when I generally spill a glass of wine over it.
That's unless one of the family gets to my case first. They have all been avid readers since small.
Doing the crossword is generally a team effort.
Backnumbers that don't get used for lighting the fire go back to work and are used as wrapping paper.
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>> Does anyone here actually buy a daily paper?
Yep, The Daily Star.
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Hated. The rose tinted, good old days question started me on the slippery slope.
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We take the North Wales edition of the Daily Post - a Trinity rag - it is a good reportage of local small town stuff. We went paperless last month. Gets delivered to an iPad - half the price of the paper edition and no recycling required. That, hopefully, browns off the local shop which is crap and the council in selling on paper waste without rewarding me !
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>> We take the North Wales edition of the Daily Post - a Trinity rag -
>> it is a good reportage of local small town stuff. We went paperless last month.
>> Gets delivered to an iPad - half the price of the paper edition and no
>> recycling required. That, hopefully, browns off the local shop which is CRAP and the council
>> in selling on paper waste without rewarding me !
>>
Due member the old daze wen Crap was Carp or else we'd get brollocked?
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That was in another country a long time ago Martin !
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I admit I read DM (online only). Their text only version is very good for reading in small mobile screen.
I know often their news is rubbish (and headlines can be seriously misleading) however, the key is to read the readers' comments (usually the top five) - then you can get the summary pretty well.
They often print articles which are not covered in other newspapers (ok, some of articles are just rubbish but some are quite interesting).
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And yet what was the paper that printed the headline "Murderers", which accused five men of killing teenager Stephen Lawrence, and invited them to sue the paper if it was wrong.
And what was the paper that campaigned strongly to prevent the deportation of the Asperger's sufferer Gary Mckinnon to the US for hacking the Pentagon computers.
Why the much maligned Daily Mail.
Don't much like it myself but sometimes, just sometimes it's right.
I read quite a few papers. I buy the i every day and the Times and Telegraph at weekends. I regularly read the Guardian in the cafe and pick up whatever is available in places like the pub or down the barber's. They all contain a fair amount of tosh of one description or other but they all contain something worth reading too.
What does amuse me though are those who think the press is totally biased and distorted but the stuff they read on internet blogs is the absolute truth
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We get a daily paper delivered and we get the Manchester Evening News 6 days a week. It's a very informative city paper. A good historical section on Saturdays and lots of local goings-on.
I like to look through the obits 'cos I often see names I recognize.....cold weather coming so more and more !
We get a more local paper weekly, delivered for free but it's just a re-hash of the week's MEN stories with loads of estate agent ads...usually chuck it
Ted
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Loathed.
Haven't bought a newspaper for well over 25 years, will never buy another.
Might glance at a freebie at a roadside burger van, only confirms my decision by being the same drivel they always were, online Wail good for a belly laugh, it replaced the Sport.
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I'm hated too, but I can't think why. I'm a married man just for a start.
The question about the old days was a poser. I would have liked to answer yes and no. Some things were better in the old days, just not everything.
I must say hated is a bit mild-sounding really. Surely there should be further categories of disapproval - execrated for example. Bête noire is good too. Haram. A temptation to commit the sin of murder. That sort of thing.
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If they had asked a few pointed questions about some of our institutions - the monarchy for example, or parliament, or the armed forces - quite a few people here would probably come under official surveillance straight away. Rightly so in some cases I feel.
Where your parents were born, or what you look like, have nothing to do with it. It's your real attitudes that count. Perhaps a bit difficult for the DM though.
:o}
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The questions were rubbish really. For example, I work but I haven't got a 'job'. And why don't they ask one's age?
Or does the Mail hate those of retirement age? 7 questions, five categories of approval.... nah, kid stuff.
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>> Or does the Mail hate those of retirement age?
My father-in-law is retired. Buys the Mail every day and has done since way back when. He genuinely believes everything written in it, and is one of these ever cheery people who tells anyone who'll listen that the country has gone completely to pot since "the blacks came over in the 50s", and we're all going to die tomorrow of cancer/immigration/falling house prices / homosexuality/the EU.
I do pick it up sometimes when visiting, and flick through it but struggle to read it. The deliberately inflammatory tone of most of the articles, and the barely disguised hostility towards entire groups of society and entire races of people frankly beggars belief. It would be hilarious but for the fact that so many people take its warped view of life seriously, and will happily regurgitate it to anyone within earshot at any opportunity.
I can't see its circulation figures holding up in 20 years time when a certain generation has passed on. Nobody of my age that I know would ever buy it.
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"What does amuse me though are those who think the press is totally biased and distorted but the stuff they read on internet blogs is the absolute truth"
And for a good example of stuff you will read on the internet that people love but which don't seem to contain a huge amount of truth . . .
toys.usvsth3m.com/are-you-hated-by-the-daily-mail/
Or do I need to read the Mail more often?
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>> And yet what was the paper that printed the headline "Murderers", which accused five men
>> of killing teenager Stephen Lawrence, and invited them to sue the paper if it was
>> wrong.
>>
>> And what was the paper that campaigned strongly to prevent the deportation of the Asperger's
>> sufferer Gary Mckinnon to the US for hacking the Pentagon computers.
>>
>> Why the much maligned Daily Mail.
Lawrence was interesting. There was some connection with a member of Steven's family having worked for one of the Mail's high command. He was therefore (rightly) seen to come from a decent family. Were it not for that I suspect the Mail would have lumped it with other similar killings including innuendo about immigrant families, crime, drugs etc.
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Were it not for that I suspect the Mail would have lumped
>> it with other similar killings including innuendo about immigrant families, crime, drugs etc.
>>
expected better from you Bromp.
I don't like the Wail, but thats hardly a fair assumption.
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The circumstantial evidence to support Bromp's assumption is pretty strong, GB.
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>> expected better from you Bromp.
>>
>> I don't like the Wail, but thats hardly a fair assumption.
It wasn't an assumption GB. The fact of the employment link between the Lawrence family and a senior staff member at the Mail was repeated during coverage of recentish court cases/appeals by Dobson and his sidekick. As a result of that link the Mail took on board the wholly justified complaints of the family about the adequacy of the Police inquiry and the attitudes and assumptions the Lawrence family were encountering.
That the Mail then took it up and ran with it is to their credit but the idea that they saw an injustice and exposed it out of conscience doesn't quite wash.
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>> That the Mail then took it up and ran with it is to their credit
>> but the idea that they saw an injustice and exposed it out of conscience doesn't
>> quite wash.
I think you're being unfair there, now i'm no apologist for the rag and i only glance at the online version once in a while when bored because i don't get enough soft upskirt porn now the Sports gone..;)...BUT, i have seen many cases where they have in their indignant way been scathing at the treatment of ethnic minority individuals* and groups, they can't All be family favours called in.
*yes i know these could well be used a stick to beat someone they don't like with, b ut then i'm aware that there are vested interests behind and inside all media sources, including the state broadcaster.
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I don't buy a newspaper these days, but if I did it would be the Daily Telegraph, mainly for its cryptic crossword.
That used to be about the right level for me - a bit more thought needed than the majority, but not so difficult as, say, The Times.
Sadly, most reasonable dead tree press papers are just too expensive now.
I have to say that I do look at the Daily Telegraph on-line (it's my home page), although I find the paper has dumbed down and is also sadly lacking in its grammar for a "quality" paper.
I also look at the Daily Mail on-line. I despair at its constant "celebrity" coverage, but find some of the rest interesting.
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>> Sadly, most reasonable dead tree press papers are just too expensive now.
i is 20p. It's tree-mendous.
:-)
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Further news emerging. Seems Mail's Sunday stablemate send a reporter, uninvited, to a memorial service this week for Ed Miliband's Uncle. Intention was to gather material so as to 'further on' the man who hated Britain theme.
MoS has apologised.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24379322
Reports suggest Rothermere is fuming, staff suspended and possibly Dacre's job on the line.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Thu 3 Oct 13 at 13:21
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>> Reports suggest Rothermere is fuming, staff suspended and possibly Dacre's job on the line.
I think Dacre must have a black book somewhere with a lot of secrets in it.
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>>
>> >> Sadly, most reasonable dead tree press papers are just too expensive now.
>>
>> i is 20p. It's tree-mendous.
>>
>> :-)
Must be losing a fortune! (Just like the Guardian!)
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Well Rodge, it's a "reasonable dead tree press paper", the type you bemoan the price of, at a reasonable price. Why not buy it and give it a try? Might help make it profitable and encourage other publications to take a "reasonable" approach", instead of all the others trying to copy the Wail and profit from the masses of curtain twitchers in the country.
Are you alarmed at its perceived position on the political spectrum or something? A bit of a read might disabuse you of that prejudice if that's the case.
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I might well take you up on that suggestion, at only 20p a copy.
Seriously - how can they make money at that price?
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>>
>> >> Sadly, most reasonable dead tree press papers are just too expensive now.
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>> i is 20p. It's tree-mendous.
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>> :-)
The Torygraph is costing me a fortune. An i voucher sub is £45 a year. Does it have the cryptic crossword in it?
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Dunno, Zero might. I don't do crosswords.
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>> Dunno, Zero might. I don't do crosswords.
Nor do I. I'm a Suduku man.
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Sudoku is for girls. Times Killer Sudoku is the way forward.
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>> Daily Telegraph on-line (it's my home page), although I find the paper has dumbed down and is also sadly lacking in its grammar for a "quality" paper.
Yes Rastaman, full of grammatical howlers and silly typos since the Barclays took over and outsourced the subbing to some bunch of Australian schoolchildren. They are astonishingly ignorant too. For example the size of a Chinese cavern is given in square feet in a caption in today's number. Tchah!
Still, I was enthralled by the piece about the Farrow/Sinatra/Previn/Allen entanglements. What a bunch of goddam baboons.
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Well..I get the Telegraph every day, paper copy as I prefer to read paper copy. Wifey has The Mail on a Saturday, largely, but not solely, for the week's T.V. section.
I've always ripped the 'p' out of my father in law for having The Mail...as IMO it rabble rouses just that too much.
However, after some of the carp written above, I think I might buy The Mail as well.
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Before I gave up the sport I found The Sun had the best racing page.
Do they still have those nice young women on Page 3?
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>>The Torygraph is costing me a fortune. An i voucher sub is £45 a year. Does it have the cryptic crossword in it?
Yes but it is too hard for me and I only do the easy version. On the other hand, my brother could only do the cryptic one. An interesting study in contrary imaginations I think: my vocabulary and grasp of synonyms is better, his logic was.
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Is it just me, or do you find the Barclay bros. somewhat sinister?
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>> Is it just me,
I don't think you are alone Rastaman. They're originally from Shepherd's Bush, the back end of my old manor (with a huge and horrible new shopping mall too).
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Their dad was a tobacco rep. They did well in property, renting out rundown houses. You might say as slum landlords. That's all I know, and best check it if you are going to cross swords with them.
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In the body copy of a piece denouncing the Chinese plan to build a pastiche of the old Crystal Palace in Penge, the comic today again gave the volume of air the new building might contain in 'feet'.
I'm sure some of you will say it doesn't matter but to me it looks pathetic. Worrying too. What else has been got wrong that I haven't noticed?
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The Daily Wail - Alanovich
