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It's very difficult to get the earth pin of a 13 amp plug into one of our sockets. I assume that the shutter mechanism is very stiff. Would it be OK to try a small squirt of silicone lubricant into the earth pin hole in the socket?
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its possibly worn, or a bad profile, or faulty. I wouldnt spray anything in there.
Change it, they cost peanuts and its easy to do.
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Beat me to it, not worth it, a good quality replacement is the fix.
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>> Beat me to it, not worth it, a good quality replacement is the fix.
Same here.
Go to B&Q and obtain replecement. Mains off & secured, unscrew faceplate and disconnect. Connect new fsceplate remaking connections if necessary secure check and refit.
Mains on & test
Job done.
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>> Go to B&Q and obtain replecement. ............
The nearest B&Q is 15 miles away. Silicone spray I've already got.
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Even if there is no B and Q surely someone sells basic electrical components less than 15 miles away. Where on earth do you live?
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>> >> Go to B&Q and obtain replecement. ............
>>
>> The nearest B&Q is 15 miles away. Silicone spray I've already got.
Maybe you have, but its not the answer. You don't spray anything into mains sockets.
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As Zero says. The earth pin shutter is a safety feature that saves lives.
In my town we have a proper electrical supplier. Quality products, ie M&K at the same or better prices than own brands at the sheds.
Turn off power, wield screwdriver, Bobs your mother's brother.
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In support for the sheds B&Q do in fact sell MK products as well as Volex and other brands including their own.
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It could just be that the brass shaped grips have got a bit bent from someone forcing the plug in carelessly or not quite straight.
When you look into the earth slot you should see two brass guides, shaped at the end to guide the pin in. If they are off-centre try easing them over with a small screwdriver.
Or it could be the fault of a cheap and nasty plug, that has insufficient angle on the end of the prong to spread the guides properly.
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>> It could just be that the brass shaped grips have got a bit bent from
>> someone forcing the plug in carelessly or not quite straight.
>> When you look into the earth slot you should see two brass guides, shaped at
>> the end to guide the pin in. If they are off-centre try easing them over
>> with a small screwdriver.
Thanks, I'll try that.
>> Or it could be the fault of a cheap and nasty plug, that has insufficient
>> angle on the end of the prong to spread the guides properly.
All the sockets and plugs in our house are good quality.
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>> All the sockets and plugs in our house are good quality.
Sounds like a mission statement!
Given that appliances have come with plugs fitted for years, then you have no control over the plug quality unless you are in the habit of cutting them off and fitting your own?
Anyway, I'm sure it's very wrong to go spraying things into sockets. Though in your position I probably couldn't have resisted a minor application just to see - that's not advice BTW :-)
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>>If they are off-centre try easing them over
>> with a small screwdriver.
DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES POKE ANYTHING INTO A SOCKET!
please.
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Fired snail smells good. Swith the leccy off !
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I you cant get a replacement just yet, swap it for the socket you use least in the house till you can!
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>> >>If they are off-centre try easing them over
>> >> with a small screwdriver.
>>
>> DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES POKE ANYTHING INTO A SOCKET!
>>
>> please.
>>
Sensible advice, but:
1) It's the Earth
2) Turn off at the fuse box first
3) It's only doing what the Earth prong itself does
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>> As Zero says. The earth pin shutter is a safety feature that saves lives.
>>
Yes. Living in Europe I am always amazed at the thousands of people experiencing electrical death every day.......oh.......wait.........sorry, that must have been on some other planet.
I'm rather taken with the far simpler European approach.
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On the Continong they don't even distinguish between live and neutral, they connect them any wat round. Presumably they fuse both sides of the circuit, or you could blow a fuse and find an appliance still connected to the live side? I believe they do use dual pole breakers/switches as opposed to the single pole ones used in UK.
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In a system protected by circuit breakers are fused plugs and earthed sockets necessary?
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>> In a system protected by circuit breakers are fused plugs and earthed sockets necessary?
I'm no electrician, but provided that the 'circuit breaker' is triggered by current leakage and/or overload then I can't see why not. But I'm sure I must be missing something.
An RCD alone should protect against electrocution but it wouldn't stop overload like a fuse, so wouldn't protect the wiring and the internals of the appliance.
I don't do mains voltage electrics beyond simple substitution.
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>> In a system protected by circuit breakers are fused plugs and earthed sockets necessary
Fused plugs are to protect the appliance not the mains wiring. Other than kettles and electric fires, few things actually take 13 amps and for example, even a one amp fuse will be enough for a lamp in these days of low energy bulbs.
Earthing is getting a bit redundant due to many things being double insulated, but the aforementioned kettle is better earthed - especially if it's metal construction.
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>> Fused plugs are to protect the appliance not the mains wiring.
AND the wiring, and the Appliance wiring. They were never there to protect against shock, merely over current and hence fire.
I had a fire in my meter box, the main house fuse (hundred amps) went high resistance at one of the terminals, heated up the wooden back board and set it on fire.
Other than kettles and
>> electric fires, few things actually take 13 amps
Few plugs have 13 amp fuses. I only have two, The kettle and the vacuum cleaner.
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I've solved the problem by spraying the silicone lubricant onto a cotton bud and then inserting the cotton bud into the earth hole of the socket. It worked a treat. Plugs now go in easily.
Then, rather than just throw the cotton bud straight into the bin I twizzled it around in my ears to remove the wax. Again, it worked a treat. :-)
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>> Then, rather than just throw the cotton bud straight into the bin I twizzled it
>> around in my ears to remove the wax.
You're living life on the edge L'Es...
www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/3606894/Listen-to-me-dont-put-cotton-buds-in-your-ears.html
Last edited by: Focus on Thu 24 May 12 at 16:20
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>>You're living life on the edge L'Es...
www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/3606894/Listen-to-me-dont-put-cotton-buds-in-your-ears.html
>>
However if you are due for a proper ear clean out at the docs, it is best to prepare with with aptly named "Earol" ( yes the correct spelling), a small olive oil spray designed for the task.
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B & Q fittings may pass standards criteria but are not at all durable. Go for old favourites like Crabtree and MK.
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>> >>You're living life on the edge L'Es...
>> www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/3606894/Listen-to-me-dont-put-cotton-buds-in-your-ears.html
>> >>
I like to live dangerously!
:-)
>> However if you are due for a proper ear clean out at the docs, it
>> is best to prepare with with aptly named "Earol" ( yes the correct spelling), a
>> small olive oil spray designed for the task.
>>
I prefer silicone lubricant!
:-)
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>> >> Then, rather than just throw the cotton bud straight into the bin I twizzled
>> it
>> >> around in my ears to remove the wax.
>>
>> You're living life on the edge L'Es...
>> www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/3606894/Listen-to-me-dont-put-cotton-buds-in-your-ears.html
>>
It was just a joke ~ barely just apparently! Nobody's twigged the silicone lubricant on the cotton bud that I implied I was using to soften the earwax!
Last edited by: L'escargot on Fri 25 May 12 at 07:48
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>>Nobody's twigged the silicone lubricant on the cotton bud that I implied I was using to soften the earwax!
I thought it was a trial silicone implant and you wanted fatter ears.
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If you cant get out or supplier to far, order part over internet. Gets posted to you within days.
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>> If you cant get out or supplier to far, order part over internet. Gets posted
>> to you within days.
>>
No point. The silicone lubricant on cotton bud method worked ~ on both the socket and my ears.
Last edited by: L'escargot on Fri 25 May 12 at 12:50
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I think that you took the correct approach. Statistically therisk of you making an error in replacing the socket, (eg like inadvertently breaking the ring, or breaking the earth on reassembly, and not being aware (or understanding) of the outcome and danger), exceeds the risk of carefully lubricating the earth pin/shutters with WD40 with the power off.
Last edited by: pmh on Fri 25 May 12 at 21:53
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Any one on here ever of heard of live neutral?
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Look in sparks tool box... you will find screwdrivers that look like welding rods
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>> Any one on here ever of heard of live neutral?
No. But a while back when I changed them, there was about 50V on the neutral of my wall lights (no load). No idea how usual that is.
The house was owned by an electrician for years, so it's probably a death trap.
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live neutrals are caused by feed back through devices, usually incandescent bulbs. If your main breaker is not off, you always assume any wire could be live so you check first.
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Isn't there always a volt or two on the neutral?
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At our last house, built about 1982, the earth and neutral were linked together. There was a notice in the meter box stating this. I think this explains it ........ tinyurl.com/br33p3e
Last edited by: L'escargot on Sat 26 May 12 at 09:09
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"Anyone heard of a live neutral"
The voltage you measure on the neutral, with respect to ground, is usually just the voltage loss caused by current passing along the neutral wire. Nothing to do with feedback from lamps. Any wire supplying appreciable current will have a measurable voltage loss along the wire. By measuring from an outside earth to the neutral, you have access to the other end of the neutral wire. A good earth will not be raised up so it should be much the same voltage as the neutral at the power source.
In a balanced mains system, using only resistive loads, lamps, fires etc., the neutral voltage will tend to be a local voltage drop, and the current going back to the power source (transformer) would be small. Balance means each of the 3 phase wires is supplying substantially the same current.
The three phases are star connected (like the manx legs) with each leg in turn supplying a row of houses, with leg1 to house 1, leg2 to house2, leg3 to house 3, leg1 to house4 etc. and the neutrals returning current to the centre of the legs. If you make your own star centre with all the house neutrals, and all currents were equal, the centre would be at the same voltage as the centre of the Manx star, therefore there would be little, or no, voltage between the two centres.
Because all leg1 houses will not, by nature, take the same amount of current as the leg2 ones or the leg3s (we call them phase 1 and phase2 etc) the individual houses will exhibit different neutral voltages. And also because each current must flow down the local neutral before getting to the bigger picture.
Over and above that, there is phase shift of currents, as caused by inductive loads, such as coils, tranformers, flourescent lighting circuits, capacitors, even before mentioning pulsing light dimmers and the energy saving lamp currents. So it gets complicated if you want to understand the detail, rather than just the broad overview I have painted.
I have seen 15 volts locally here at times. 50V sounds a lot and suggests the neutral wiring needs to be looked at. A local electrician can probably acquaint you with what is normal.
It shows why you can get a spark off the neutral wire, or a tripping of the breaker, if you touch the neutral on an earth.
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Read the WD-40 tin-there are NO silicones in WD-40!!!
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>> Read the WD-40 tin-there are NO silicones in WD-40!!!
?
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>> >> Read the WD-40 tin-there are NO silicones in WD-40!!!
>>
>> ?
"What does WD-40 contain?
While the ingredients in WD-40 are secret, we can tell you what WD-40 does NOT contain. WD-40 does not contain silicone, kerosene, water, wax, graphite, chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs), or any known cancer-causing agents."
www.wd40.com/faqs/#a92
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For practical purposes, it's paraffin.
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>> I think that you took the correct approach. Statistically therisk of you making an error
>> in replacing the socket, (eg like inadvertently breaking the ring, or breaking the earth on
>> reassembly, and not being aware (or understanding) of the outcome and danger), exceeds the risk
>> of carefully lubricating the earth pin/shutters with WD40 with the power off.
>>
As it happens, the socket was one I fitted myself, spurred off a convenient existing junction box in the loft. For testing purposes I have a doofrey which you plug into a socket and which tells you whether everything is wired OK or, if there is a fault, what the fault is. Brilliant piece of kit. In case anyone is interested it's a Rapitest 13 amp Socket Tester. tinyurl.com/7dmh2gy
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>>>Brilliant piece of kit. tells you whether everything is wired OK<<<
It still will not detect a broken ring , L N or E! or probably not a highish resistance joint.
Last edited by: pmh on Mon 4 Jun 12 at 13:00
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Water Dispersant...Experiment No. 40. For space programme in US.
WD40 is fish oil based.......I have a long list of everything it claims to do, including bringing some relief to arthritis.
If you're not careful, I'll scan and post it !
Ted
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Lights up a treat sprayed into a lit match....
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>> Lights up a treat sprayed into a lit match....
Or onto a coke fire!!
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>> Or onto a coke fire!!
Who burns coke? I snort it!
:-)
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13 amp socket problem - Zero
