Motoring Discussion > SORN Problem Buying / Selling
Thread Author: teabelly Replies: 11
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 12:52 
 SORN Problem - teabelly
I think I'm in the middle of a kafka-esque nightmare. I have sold a car. It was SORNED but apparently in the DVLA wisdom SORN seems to be cancelled when you sell a car. I have had the SORN reminder but cannot re-sorn it as it claims vehicle details cannot be found! This means either the new keeper or myself will be screwed over with no tax and no insurance fines as the car is no longer insured ( I don't own it any more and it was SORN'd anyway ).

Turn around for change of keeper is 4 to 6 weeks! I notice on the vehicle check the date of licence due has changed to the first of the month of when I sold it rather than being the 1st of August so a lack of SORN and lack of insurance is likely to be triggered before the change of keeper is processed.

What am I supposed to do about it?? It seems to be engineered deliberately to generate fines.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 8 Jul 11 at 12:58
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:01 
 SORN Problem - SteelSpark
When you say "it claims the vehicle details cannot be found", are you talking about the DVLA website?

Have you tried calling the DVLA? This kind of thing must happen all the time.
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:14 
 SORN Problem - teabelly
That's how I know the registration change takes 4 to 6 weeks. Got fed up of hanging on for a person!

Continuous insurance only started recently so that is the added complication. A no tax/sorn fine wouldn't matter but being accused of having no insurance to me is quite serious and has serious consequences.

The whole system puts people in impossible positions as the only way out is to re-declare SORN which is the one thing you cannot do!
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:17 
 SORN Problem - sherlock47
It is not upto you to reSORN - all liability has passed to the new owner on the date he took it.

I assume that as it was SORNed and that he had no insurance in place before removing it that he took it on a trailer? Did you check that he had insurance before you let him drive it away? Worse still, did you let him test drive it before it changed hands? I suppose that if you let him test drive (with insurance) you would be guilty of allowing a SORNed vehicle on the road - but the V5 only asks for a date of transfer, not a time. So there is some scope for blurring the time of the change of ownership.

Selling a SORNed car is a potential nightmare.
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:20 
 SORN Problem - Zero
Not your problem. You Sorned the car, you sold it.

I assume you have dated your bit of the V5. Forget it. Any jobsworth comes back after you you get the delight of telling them to sod off and see you in court. And you will expect costs when you win.
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:24 
 SORN Problem - teabelly
Wrong! All liability remains with me until the DVLA pull their finger out and tell me that liability has passed! It says quite clearly on the V5 basically if they screw up I get done and guilty of everything as they never screw up.

Car was none runner and taken on a trailer. DVLA have changed the date of liability. It was 1st august ie after my SORN runs out. Now it is 1st of June as change of keeper was a few weeks ago in June. Their system cannot deal with part months. This has made a bad situation even worse.

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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:28 
 SORN Problem - Zero
Nope, once you have sold the car and filled out your part of the form and given it to the new owner there is nothing you can do, its not your responsibility.

I would be happy for them to try and do me for that.

Not your problem ignore it.
Last edited by: Zero on Fri 8 Jul 11 at 13:28
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:28 
 SORN Problem - sherlock47
Did the new owner sign the V5 with correct date on it? Your responsibility to make sure that he did! Your reponsibility to post it. Did you keep a copy and send it by recorded (or with proof of posting) to DVLA promptly?
Off the hook.

SNAP
Last edited by: pmh on Fri 8 Jul 11 at 13:29
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 13:41 
 SORN Problem - teabelly
I sent it the next day. As they have changed the date of sorn liability they must have received something. I've just not had the letter telling me the car's nothing to do with me which is the only defence they accept to the no sorn/no insurance.

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New Fri 8 Jul 11 14:00 
 SORN Problem - Bromptonaut
SORN can only be made by the registered keeper. It is cancelled on transfer of the vehicle. That approach makes sense in the context of the stutory intention of the SORN scheme. The transferor (seller) has committed to keep the car off the road. His signature does not bind the trasferee (purchaser) who must decide for himself whether to tax/insure or give his own SORN.

Reminders are probably generated automatically and the fact that the liabiltiy date has changed implies some awareness of the change of keeper. Consequently you've got a reminder even though paperwork iro your sale is being processed.

Fines for tax & insurance don't just arrive out of the blue. DVLA & MIB issue warnings first. If you get one of those before confiramtion of transfer its time to start worrying a little bit but the form will give you instructions for what to do if you've transferred the vehicle.

Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Fri 8 Jul 11 at 14:02
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 14:18 
 SORN Problem - teabelly
I think it is off to cancel the SORN to be honest. A new keeper that is keeping the vehicle off the road may assume (as I did) that if the vehicle was SORN'd by the previous owner then that SORN would at least continue for the initial SORN period. It has opened up a can of worms for them too as how are they going to know to declare SORN for time preceding their ownership?! They're now going to have to faff around declaring SORN on a car that they though was SORN'd for another month and face potential 'no insurance' alerts too. They probably won't even have the v5 through and is it likely to have something in there declaring the vehicle is currently not taxed or SORN'd??

The whole system is a total mess.

The SORN should not be cancelled. The tax disc isn't cancelled on a change of owner so SORN shouldn't be either. It is illogical.
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New Fri 8 Jul 11 14:23 
 SORN Problem - CGNorwich
Doesn't seem illogical to me. You made the Statutory Off Road Declaration, not the purchaser. He cannot be held to a declaration you made. He must decide for himself as to whether he want to use the vehicle on the road. As has been said its really not your problem.
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