Not sure if this is the first time somebody has uncovered a situation in which the same people are staging the crashes and handling the claims.
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8597452.stm
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There are quite a few of these Claim Companies in our area and they all have expensive cars parked outside and they are all run by young Asians.
Now before the PC brigade jump on this and cry foul, I am only stating facts.
Mr Tee - I can't dispute your statement as I don't know the facts, but what is the point of your statement if not potentially racist? (Which you appear to recognise by the "disclaimer" you added).
Last edited by: smokie on Fri 2 Apr 10 at 00:15
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Don't worry MrTee, if you take the risk of setting up a business and work hard at it, one day you might be able to buy an expensive car too.
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tinyurl.com/ye6n7g4
As you can see this is big business and the advice from Truckpol is that the car will contain 3 people, usually Asians.
Pat
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The BBC story is not about a deliberately caused collision on the roads.
The fraudsters smash the car up 'in the yard' and then deliver it to the scene.
Quoting the report: "He told us that two cars, one of them ours, would be smashed up in his yard.
"He paid us £500 to take part in the scam and admit liability. We would take the blame and the other driver could cash in.
"A full 24 hours later and our car was delivered back to us, dropped off around the corner from the so-called accident site."
So it's a variation on a theme.
The costs to our premiums are the same, but there are no innocent motorists directly involved.
I imagine the claim is easier when all parties are in on it and prepared to act dishonestly.
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>>>but there are no innocent motorists directly involved<<<
Try telling that to the lorry driver who has to explain why he ran into the car in front of him.
Hence the warning from Truckpol............a much respected division of the Police dedicated to fighting truck crime.
Pat
((Touche))
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...Try telling that to the lorry driver who has to explain why he ran into the car in front of him...
Pat,
The way the scam in the BBC story works is two cars are smashed up in the fraudster's yard and delivered to the scene - everyone is in on it.
There is no 'accident' staged or otherwise, on the road.
So as I said, there are no innocent drivers, truck or otherwise, involved.
The scam to which you refer operates in a different way.
I'll coin a new acronym - RTFSP - read the flippin' story properly. :)
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I did:)
The link, and relevence, for me was in the way it increases our insurance premiums.
As you pointed out........so I think that makes it worth posting!
I would have run away and hid for 48 hrs by now if this was HJ:)
Pat
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"Mr Tee - I can't dispute your statement as I don't know the facts, but what is the point of your statement if not potentially racist? (Which you appear to recognise by the "disclaimer" you added)."
I don't consider my post as racist and would ask why anyone would.
The "disclaimer" was there to emphasise that very fact, as it seems that to mention Asians in a post gets the heckles up of many posters.
It is almost developing into a taboo subject.
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I have read a few court cases and associated stories involving fake crash insurance scams.
All have involved Asian defendants.
All have come from areas with a large Asian population.
These are facts.
Having said that, I suppose it matters little to the victims of this or any crime who the perpetrators are.
I despise all criminals, from the litterbug to the murderer, so I will happily admit to being a criminalist. :)
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There aren't many Asian sounding names here:
tinyurl.com/ya5rjjm
Anyway, there is a big difference between saying that all people that stage crashes are Asians (which I am sure is not true anyway), and suggesting that all Asian's running Claim firms are criminals. Which, let's face it, is what MrTee is suggesting.
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...Which, let's face it, is what MrTee is suggesting...
SS,
That is an inference which you are perfectly entitled to draw.
I didn't draw that inference from Mr Tee's post.
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>> ...Which let's face it is what MrTee is suggesting...
>>
>> SS
>>
>> That is an inference which you are perfectly entitled to draw.
>>
>> I didn't draw that inference from Mr Tee's post.
Fair enough, but I am personally very suspicious of MrTee's motives. He has put forward a very selective set of "facts" that I believe he intends to suggest that there is something dodgy going on at these firms, and that only Asians are involved.
I suppose he could also be inferring that he is very pleased to see that there are a lot of upwardly mobile young Asians, working hard and making a success of themselves in these hard times.
That is the problem when people hide behind saying that they are only "stating the facts", because they know that the facts they select, and the context that they present them (in a thread about criminal behaviour) will suggest something that they are not prepared to say outright.
It is exactly the same as me starting a thread about a spate of muggings in area X, and then somebody replying with a single fact that there are a large number of young black men in area X. That might be a fact, but the underlying assertion is clear to see.
The fact that MrTee put his disclaimer about it not been racist, just reinforces the opinion that he knew full well what he was suggesting.
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You cant argue the fact that the case in point, in the very first post, is about a young guy of asian heritage who set this claims handling company up and ran this scam.
You also cant argue the fact that the majority of thses scams do involve males of asian heritage.
In the wider scheme of reporting race and crime, there is a deep fear of attributing certain type of crime to certain racial groups.
It is a fact that most muggings and street robbery in large UK cities are by non ethnic britsh boys. Ie Black. It is also a fact that most fraud, theft from companies, insider dealing is performed by those of native british heritage ie White.
The simple fact is that those who wish to comit crimes of any kind will comit the crimes that
a: they are best equiped to comit
and
b: have the opportunity to comit.
Race has nothing to do with, but alas because of a and b above, race and crime patterns do match.
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Oh and to put another swing on this, nearly all drunken drivers are white.
So to prevent crime you have to target those who comit it. Alas that means stopping and searching young black males on the street (responsible for most gun and knife crime) and stopping and breathalising middle age white males.
Last edited by: Zero on Fri 2 Apr 10 at 12:37
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>> Oh and to put another swing on this nearly all drunken drivers are white.
>>
>> So to prevent crime you have to target those who comit it. Alas that means
>> stopping and searching young black males on the street (responsible for most gun and knife
>> crime) and stopping and breathalising middle age white males.
That's all fine Zero and I don't disagree on the whole.
What I do disagree with is suggesting that just because somebody is young and Asian, with an expensive car, that they are likely involved in crime.
Let's say, for argument sake, that every single crash faker was Asian, that obviously doesn't mean that a large proportion of Asian businessmen in the claims business are criminals. Which I still maintain is what MrTee is alluding to, with his selection of facts.
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Ok, take out the word Asian and replace it with Scottish, European or Irish.
Would you have been making the same posts?
Pat
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>> Ok take out the word Asian and replace it with Scottish European or Irish.
>>
>> Would you have been making the same posts?
>>
>> Pat
Yes, but what difference does that make?
Also, if MrTee just had the nuts to say "there are loads of these claim firms around, they are all run by young Asians, who seem to have loads of money and, because they are Asian and have loads of money, I reckon that most if not all of them are involved in these crimes" - then OK, he would likely be considered a racist, but at least he would be honest about what he meant.
What I can't stand seeing is innuendo about those Asians and the fact that they have money, and that suggesting that they are into something illegal, all covered up by this "just reporting the facts" nonsense.
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>> It is a fact that most muggings and street robbery in large UK cities are
>> by non ethnic britsh boys. Ie Black. It is also a fact that most fraud
>> theft from companies insider dealing is performed by those of native british heritage ie White.
>>
>> The simple fact is that those who wish to comit crimes of any kind will
>> comit the crimes that
>>
>> a: they are best equiped to comit
>> and
>> b: have the opportunity to comit.
>>
>> Race has nothing to do with but alas because of a and b above race
>> and crime patterns do match.
>>
Listen to this man. He is CORRECT.
MD
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>> tinyurl.com/ye6n7g4
>> the car will contain 3 people usually Asians.
"The criminals may be of Asian extraction."
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>> >> the car will contain 3 people usually Asians.
>>
>> "The criminals may be of Asian extraction."
>>
Kent Police Officers are now being asked to be more specific when describing people as Asian, African or African-Caribbean.
The term "Asian" is far too broad, and academic reasearch has shown that crimes attributed to "Asian" people are committed in the overwhelming vast majority by a particular small ethnic group within Asians. Put another way, if it was known that majority of crime was committed by a particular White community from a part of the North of England or from a part of Romania or old Yugoslavia, then would it be right or wrong to label that group as White Europeans? Would it be right or wrong to refer to "Nigerain 419 scam" as African 419 scam?
Last edited by: John H on Fri 2 Apr 10 at 16:49
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pda Pat
can you tell us which ethnic group is responsible for the crimes listed by truckpol here
www.truckpol.com/alerts.htm
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John H, I don't really see your point as your link lists ALL of the crimes on the Truckpol website from all over the country.
What I can tell you is that lorry insurance is soaring mainly due to unreported crime ( because it doesn't count in the statistics) and also because of the type of case that I listed above.
It is not uncommon for people to take a lorry registration number and report a ficticious collision which we then have to prove never happened.
In view of this is it is a major help to us to have Truckpol telling us the facts as they are, and not as hindered by the PC brigade who want to call it racial.
Having read that report, any lorry driver will be instantly alert after a bump of this kind when 3 coloured people step out of the car, and that has to be a good thing, doesn't it?
I still can't understand the reason for your very obtuse question, unless it's a poor attempt at sarcasm?
Pat
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Unlike the "other place" this thread has been allowed to run pretty unhindered, and it is mostly lively debate which is to be encouraged. But please don't let's drag ourselves down to personal baiting which happened so much elsewhere - it got tedious there and it will do the same here. Everyone is entitled to their view, which we will happily host here until it gets personal or extreme.
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John H,
Anyone who challenges Pat on matters trucking is likely to come off second best.
As indeed you have. :)
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>> John H
>>
>> Anyone who challenges Pat on matters trucking is likely to come off second best.
>>
>> As indeed you have. :)
>>
ifithelps I am certain you are the most helpful and friendly person on this blog and you can rest assured that I will never challenge you for that position.
BTW I have no intention of challenging or confronting anyone else nor do I consider myself to be in any sort of competetion. I am merely stating my opinion and do not care if it means I come first or last. My thanks to car4play and the mods.
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...ifithelps I am certain...
John H,
Steady on, my post was meant to be light-hearted and certainly not meant to offend.
I don't seriously suggest you are challenging/competing/confronting anyone.
As regards your suggestion of me being 'the most helpful and friendly person', well, strike out 'the most' and I could go along with what's left.
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I don't know about other areas of the country but our excellent evening paper reports all sorts of crimes every day. I'm sorry to note that you can almost guarantee that ,upon reading a report mentioning a Doctor interfering with patients , stealing from the NHS or fiddling money, then usually an Asian name follows.
I'm afraid it's a fact here, virtually every few days.
Nothing racist there, Most of our reported gun and knife crime is black on black
All types seem to drink and drive....including Chinese.
Young whites of both sexes burgle, assault and commit drink offences in the street.
It may just be that certain areas have more of one racial type over another. We have a large middle class Asian population around us and just a mile away is an area favoured by West Indians.
I go in our little Post Office and I'm often the only Anglo in there...I tell them it's like the Punjab in here and we all have a laugh with each other. I get a cuppa and sometimes I'm sent home carrying a curry and some chapatis..........long may it last. I love it !
It's just the way that things seem to be turning out.
Ted
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In the North East we get a lot of cannabis farms - small houses packed with hundreds of the plants in grow-bags, often with lighting and watering systems.
The area is chosen, we think, because of cheap property to rent or buy.
A common feature is the resident farmer is often a hapless Vietnamese illegal immigrant who speaks no English - just lives in one room looking after the plants.
Another crime with with a strong link to a nationality is 'shoulder surfing' bank card details and associated scams at cash machines.
The perpetrators are often Romanian.
A detective told me they commonly aim to steal about £25-£30,000 before going back home.
Apparently that sum is sufficient to set yourself up for life in Romania.
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Here are 24 others caught in this scam
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1263105/Cash-crash-Fraudster-convinces-24-office-workers-171-000-scam.html
They are from the Liverpool area, and all bar one of the names appear to of English men and women.
The one Indian name is that of Mihir Pandya, head inestigator of fraud at Allianz.
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I dislike scouse accents.
I like geordie accents.
Make something out of that !
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Enormous amount of work putting 26 people though crown court.
So well done to Merseyside Police and the Crown Prosecution Service for getting the job done.
I imagine the insurance company helped quite a bit, too.
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>> I imagine the insurance company helped quite a bit too.
they had to, the old bill would have done damn all. Probably claiming "its a civil issue"
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> then usually an Asian name follows
The word "Asian" is very misleading in UK. It consists of - Indian Hindu, Indian Muslim, Indian Sikh, Pakistani Muslim, Bangladeshi Muslim and some other South Asian backgrounds.
Most crimes are caused by just one or two subgroups in above category. Some other groups in same category are among the richest and most educated people in UK.
There are exceptions but overall this is the truth.
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Claims company involved in fake crashes - MrTee43
