Following last week's Volvo adventure and much discussion here, I thought I'd better put my feet, head and behind where my mouth was and try a Mondeo for size. I was in town having new tyres put on the S60 so I walked along the high street, met a friendly, chatty salesman and had a sit in this:
www.platts.co.uk/usedcars/usedcar-13U33766.asp
Three year old 2.0 petrol Titanium X estate with a gloomy all-black interior. Ample space for me in front with enough behind for another me not to feel too aggrieved, and room at the back for three cricket bags side by side.
So it works dimensionally but would I want one? I'd have to drive it, but static impressions are of a comfortable seat in a well-made interior that still manages to look low-rent because of some dubious design decisions. The V70 was all-black too, but managed to seem more John Lewis than World of Leather and Dixons. Curiously I don't remember being struck that way by the S-Max I tried in 2007, but the Mondeo's fussy vertical-semicircle tachometer and overdone graphics would take some getting used to.
So what's happening? Have I become an insufferable car snob? I've owned a Ford and driven lots more and been impressed by their functional, unfussy interiors but this one just seems to try too hard. And the new Focus I looked at the showroom was worse - three different colours on the speedometer alone. Whatever happened to less is more?
I do want to investigate the Mondeo further. There are lots about and there must be some choice of interiors. And it's hard to argue with all that space. What do the Mondeo aficionados here make of theirs?
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I've not had a go in the Mondeo but I'm with you on the newer Focuses. Work have provided me with a Focus and a Fiesta, both 59 or 60 plates, in the past year. I used to have a 52 plate Focus and I never felt it was naff, just tidy and neat. The new one feels cheap inside, but the materials can't be that much different. The Fiesta is fussy; too many little dials; 'blobby' bits.
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The principle problem with that interior IMHO is the centre console, and particularly the shiny 'plastic metal' surround. If that were finished in matt, or even piano black with the odd touch of chrome or ally around some of the buttons or detail items to lift it up a little, the effect would be cleaner and more 'classy'. Audi do this kind of thing very well, and on cars of comparable price to this Mondeo when new.
The problem with big expanses of eye catching brightwork or other standout material like this, is that it focuses the eye on that material. If it's not top notch, it tends to look slightly naff. Peugeot used to replace some of the matt black plastics on the high end 306 models with a fake wood, which actually looked cheaper and nastier than the standard matt black item which, frankly, the eye didn't even notice.
The rest of the interior looks upmarket and elegant to my eyes, and a world apart from the shiny, hard plastics of the mk2 I used to own. They just need to cut down on the bling, and keep it simple.
Last edited by: DP on Fri 24 Jun 11 at 16:51
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I find the new 'mobile phone' design cues used by Ford for the Focus and Fiesta a little ironic. Most top end mobile phones these days have few buttons because they have touch screens. I know the sat nav system on the Mondeo is touch screen and can control the heating/ventilation etc. too.
I think the inside of the Mondeo is very dated now - it was when it was new in 2007.
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The problem with in car touchscreens is they are hard to operate by touch, while keeping ones eyes on the road. Even if all the buttons in a car feel similar, with a little familiarity one can can count your way round them without looking.
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Most cars also let you control the interface from the steering wheel. I must admit I like the dash on my Mazda6 with simple (and not too many) big buttons. The Focus/Fiesta design has too many buttons.
Now the Passat I will get has a touch screen satnav. Everything else including aircon is controlled via proper controls though (heating info displayed on screen but not controlled by it).
I think the reason for controls like MMI is to let you control a complex system with a simple control when driving. But I don't think you should be doing it at all when driving. And when stationary they are a little slow and cumbersome. Try entering an address and see if it's quicker with a touchscreen or an MMI interface from Audi.
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Haven't tried iDrive or MMI but I imagine it's similar to controlling the Playstation 3 browser with a twiddly-stick games controller - perfectly possible but fiddly and slow, and certainly not to be attempted while driving. I even find working the click wheel of my iPod Classic tricky with only my left hand, so I'd far rather have positive, analogue controls for everything. (Cameras are the same - to change mode or ISO setting, I want a button or a dial, not a three-layer menu. Panasonic take note!)
Back to the Mondeo. I spent some time yesterday scanning Autotrader for a cheese-free interior and got quite despondent. Silver paint everywhere, except in the rare, early Ghia - which has orange fake wood instead.
Then I remembered Avant's advice and did the same for the Superb. Wow! Why have I not looked at this before? Will investigate further and report back.
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...and did the same for the Superb. Wow!...
Wow?
I've just had a look at a couple of Superbs on autotrader.
Isn't the interior just the same acres of different shades of grey plastic?
Superbs seem to fetch a lot of money, too.
Last edited by: Iffy on Sat 25 Jun 11 at 11:25
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Even this one, Iffy?
tinyurl.com/Autotrader-Superb2009
It may just photograph well but it looks (to me) more appealing than any of those cheesy Mondeos. Even the bits of tree don't jar, which is quite an admission from an automotive xylophobe like me.
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>> It may just photograph well but it looks (to me) more appealing than any o
>> those cheesy Mondeos. Even the bits of tree don't jar, which is quite an admission
>> from an automotive xylophobe like me.
Black with chrome highlights, as per my earlier comment. Looks so much better and more understated than acres of shiny stuff. I suspect the black plastic on the console is no more expensive than Ford's silver, but the eye isn't drawn to it.
I also like the use of different colours for the top and bottom halves of the dash. It gives a more airy feel, and breaks up the dash quite nicely.
That is a nice interior, IMHO. I could spend a lot of time in there happily, assuming seating position was OK.
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...from an automotive xylophobe like me...
Hold on while I look that up.
www.odford.co.uk/Pages/Definition/Word/Xylophobe/
Mmm, 'dislike of Xylophones', I'm sure that's not what you meant. :)
Back to the cars, I agree the Superb interior in your link looks smart.
Even as a Ford fan, I concede Ford interiors are something and nothing.
I suspect in the last few years they have gone backwards a little in terms of quality, if not design.
NB: 'xylophobe' doesn't appear in any proper dictionary I've been able to find.
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Gr. xylon: wood. I made the word up but my etymology is legitimate, I think.
Fear of wooden percussion instruments would be xylophonophobia. I'm not afraid of wood per se - quite the opposite, in fact - but it doesn't often enhance the interior of a car. This may be an exception.
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...Gr. xylon: wood. I made the word up but my etymology is legitimate, I think...
Agreed, there's some talk on the 'net of xylophobia being fear of wood, so a sufferer must be a xylophobe.
The more traditional dictionaries - Cambridge, for example - don't recognise it, but that doesn't mean it does not exist.
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Since I dislike it rather than being irrationally afraid of it, perhaps it's more misoxyly than xylophobia. Enough!
}:---)
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Xylophobia is fear of wood. Dendrophobia is fear of trees.
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The superb's Skoda's flagship interior, as good as it's allowed to get under Skoda. It's pretty clever because it's not expensive to produce, certainly cheaper than the comparable VW interior costs, but still just as good end result i'd say.
I like their cleverness, the Yeti for example is much cheaper to produce than the Tiguan - instead of using the (expensive) Tiguan platform, it uses the Octavia platform, although they had to pinch the Tiguan rear subframe for the 4x4 models.
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>> I think the reason for controls like MMI is to let you control a complex
>> system with a simple control when driving. But I don't think you should be doing
>> it at all when driving. And when stationary they are a little slow and cumbersome.
>> Try entering an address and see if it's quicker with a touchscreen or an MMI
>> interface from Audi.
>>
IME the easiest way of entering an address on the Nav set-up in a Audi (albeit in a B7 A4 rather than one fitted with the latest MMI kit) is to use the voice recognition. One button (on the steering wheel) to press, a couple of voice commands - "navigation", then "specific destination", and the enter the address by reading it out letter by letter. You can speak at a normal pace and it'll pick it up just fine.
Politeness is unhelpful though; when its asks "would you like to specify a building name or number" saying yes please or no thank you really confuses it ;-)
In comparison the voice recognition on a previous BMW (E61 5 series) was nowhere near as good, though I liked the I-Drive concept
Peter
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>> Try entering an address and see if it's quicker with a touchscreen or an MMI
>> interface from Audi.
>>
My money is on the voice control in the Audi - it's remarkably good, even in my convertible with the roof down - as long as you're not going silly speeds!!
Press one button on the steering wheel; say "specific destination". The car asks you to spell the town name, which, for me, hasn't gone wrong so far, then street then number. Car asks if you'd like to navigate to the specified destination, driver says yes and off you go. I think I've mentioned somewhere that's my main doubt/concern about my new car - no voice control at all :-(
Peter
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That sounds like Platts of Marlow, WdB. Unlike most chain-owned, don't care Ford dealers, this one is family-owned and I've heard good things about them.
I suppose interiors are largely a matter of taste, but Ford do seem to be trying too hard with their current models. Some of them try to look like the facia of a mobile phone - I can't think why anyone would want to do that.
VAG dashboards are dull to some eyes but nicely understated to others, including mine. The 'sweep' of the Superb's is a bit like a Volvo V70's, quite pleasing to most eyes.
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>> VAG dashboards are dull to some eyes but nicely understated to others, including mine.
One of the best things about the mk4 Golf. The older of mine celebrates its 12th birthday in a few months. Still feels expensive and modern from behind the wheel. Well chosen materials, simple, logical layout (Climatronic aside), and no strong design cues to age it. Just clean, elegant and functional. If a little "black".
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>> Ample space
>> for me in front with enough behind for another me not to feel too aggrieved,
>> and room at the back for three cricket bags side by side.
I would hope so, the damn ting is HUGE, and looks it from the outside too.
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The Mondeo is the same length overall as the Volvo 240 once it had gained rectangular lights and lost the bumpers you could rest a teapot on. Probably not so much usable space inside as a 240, but undoubtably a better place to be in a crash. The Superb in hatch or estate form is near enough the same length - 4.8m or a touch short of sixteen medieval feet.
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The face-lifted S-Maxes have had the dash-board materials upgraded, does the same apply to the newly-facelifted Mondeos? e.g. the strip of metal and stereo surrounds on some models is now black rather than metal. Incidentally the brochure for the trim strips on teh Titanium says it is 'titanium'. I find this hard to believe, but it certainly is metal and not plastic (it dents). Door trims also upgraded.
But whilst piano black may look nice, it is a hell of a dust trap - shows every little fleck.
You really need to drive the cars, if how the cars drive is important to you. The Superb dash may be classier but if I didn't like the way the car drove, that would be more important to me than dash materials.
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>>So what's happening? Have I become an insufferable car snob?<<
Car snobs don't HAVE to be insufferable...
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You're absolutely right, BxB, and I do intend to drive them both - and to further my acquaintance with the V70, which may well be sufficient in terms of space for the next five years, and which ticks all my other boxes on drivability and ambiance.
Your point about shiny surfaces and dust is a good one, but I think DP hit the bullseye earlier: why decorate this panel at all? Back in the 1990s I had two Saabs, a 900 and a 9-3. Mine were S models, with the minor control panel surfaced in matt dark grey - not flashy but smart and unobtrusive. There was also an SE version (I think these things were applied by the UK importer as my 9-3 S had the S badges on the wings stuck on upside down) where the panel had a woodgrain finish quite out of keeping with the rest of the interior, but also making it harder to pick out individual buttons. That mattered less in a 90s car that still had some rotary controls, but now that everything has a button it can be seriously confusing.
Our competent but unlovable Verso has a silver centre panel. Quality isn't a concern - it still looks pristine after three years - but with a couple of dozen identical silver buttons on a silver background, usability certainly is.
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I've got one of these on hire at the moment, never having been in the current Mondeo before.
Lots of space, it's a big car inside.
Never feels as though it really gets going contrary to what the speedo is telling you. The car I have is a diesel, haven't had the bonnet up yet so no idea what engine is lurking, definitely not the 163PS 2.0 or 200PS 2.2, suspect 140PS.
I have never driven a car where the cruise control switches are split over both hands. In the Mondeo, the left hand selects whether you want to use the cruise control or speed limiter and Cancel while the right hand increases or reduces the speed and has the Resume button. All feels a bit over complicated for what should be a straight forward function.
The seats feel comfortable enough for the short journey I've made in it so far but very easy to get in the wrong position with the electric control on the base.
The black paint of the car is very easily marked and this '11 plate model is already carrying chips and scratches, OK this could be down to careless renters however the front seems to have a lot of gravel rash for a car which can only be 7 months old at most.
The real surprise for me is the handling. It manages to combine direct steering with soggy body control. Turn the steering wheel and it darts off in the required direction feeling very Alfa like but then the size of the car gets the better of the body control and feels wallowy.
Very strange.
I'm sure it would be a great car to cover distance in but not something I'd bond with. The kind of car you get out, press the lock button and walk away without taking that glance back.
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Soft paint is a problem on many makes nowadays. Blame eco-friendly water based paints.
My 3-series has done 46,000 miles and the front half of the bonnet looks like someone's had a go at it with a shot blaster.
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Anti-tailgating paint. Sit far enough back from the vehicle in front and it's not a problem. Previous driver to you DP clearly had spacial awareness issues or a small...never mind...
:-)
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The previous driver couldn't park without kerbing the wheels, but I couldn't comment on their spacial awareness ;-)
The chipping has got noticeably worse in the 4000 miles I've covered. Thing is, I genuinely don't tailgate. It's one of my pet hates.
I suspect given its relatively low mileage (I've added nearly 10% to its total in just 2.5 months), it didn't do much motorway work before.
Last edited by: DP on Sat 29 Oct 11 at 23:06
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>> The chipping has got noticeably worse in the 4000 miles I've covered. Thing is, I
>> genuinely don't tailgate. It's one of my pet hates.
My old BMW had a shotblasted front when I bought it at 114000 miles. No doubt it had done plenty of motorway work. It certainly didn't seem to get much worse by the time I sold it (I used it for mainly local stuff and a few long journeys), but I did notice that the shape attracted stones - I got a few loud cracks as I was driving, and actually saw a stone whip off a lorry tyre and hit the bottom of my windscreen. Maybe the new shape isn't much better. The front of my Avensis is surprisingly good considering it's done 80000 miles in four years, and objects tend to flow over the body work and over the windscreen without hitting anything - much better aerodynamics. The front spoiler is peppered, but not particularly noticeable.
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My Qashqai had 87,000 on it when it went but it didn't have a mark on it. Mind you it couldn't keep up with BMWs !
:-)
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>> The real surprise for me is the handling. It manages to combine direct steering with
>> soggy body control. Turn the steering wheel and it darts off in the required direction
>> feeling very Alfa like but then the size of the car gets the better of
>> the body control and feels wallowy.
>> Very strange.
Souonds like the rear tyres were down on pressure.
I had one 18 months ago and the handling was fine, tyre pressures make a big difference to handling on a large car.
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Funny you should mention that Kithmo I just got out the car before and thought the fronts looked a bit down. Hire co. claim to have set them at 32 all round. I run my Volvo at 36 front, 34 rear so would have expected similar in the Mondeo.
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'Wallowy' is not a description I would apply to a modern Ford.
The ones I've been in have very little suspension travel and a hardish ride.
I wish mine would wallow a bit.
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It's only my impression Iffy, I'm not familiar with Ford's really and my experience is coming from a 7 year old Volvo on 70,000mile old shocks and springs.
As previously mentioned probably a tyre pressure thing.
I have driven about 100 miles in it today around north Northumberland and one thing that really stood out for me in daylight is the fact the centre console is actually angled away from the driver in RHD form. Quite an odd sensation seeing the radio and heater controls setup for the front seat passengers convenience.
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Ford Mondeo IV - Hmmm...static impressions - Bobbin Threadbare
