I've got to go to London again tomorrow. Getting to be a regular thing. Normally I take the car but I'm going to try the train tomorrow.
Upsides are it'll take less time and presumably be less tiring. Downsides are it's quite a bit more expensive on the face of it and there'll be other people to contend with and be forced to be next to.
Round trip is 364 miles. Can take 3.5 hours or it can take 5 hours in either direction depending on traffic. To drive it currently costs more or less £60 in diesel, £10 concharge, £10.60 M6 toll fees and about £20 to park in the West End for 3 or 4 hours. Not worried about the "wear and tear" costs as it's a company car. So all up around £100 in "cash on the day" costs.
Just booked a return train journey including a ticket for the underground bit and it comes to £128 and that's using off-peak times. Will still spend a couple of quid on diesel to get to the station and back and a tenner or so to park there. So all up about £140. Each leg will only take a couple of hours though. Still £40 down. Doesn't seem right does it? I know there are hidden costs in the mileage by driving but even so.
And then there's the other people. Might have to talk to one of them or at the very least sit next to one. Oh dear....
Still I'll give it a go. I'll report back on whether it was bearable...
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I live just outside Bristol - the train to paddington takes 1hr 20 and is a nice trip. Only do it a few times a year, but much easier than the drive.
Dont forget to factor in that you can be productive during the time you are sat there - blackberry, laptop (ipod) etc.
On first great western most seats have access to a 3 pin socket so free electric to!
Took a colleague with me in December and he was a train phobe - he was plesantly surprised
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I know this is in danger of being a silly question but is there WiFi on trains as a rule?
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depends on the service, and how much you pay.
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FGW also sometimes offer to upgrade you to first for a tenner - worth it as you get free tea/coffee, newspapers and bigger seats.....also less of the lower classes
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>> FGW also sometimes offer to upgrade you to first for a tenner - worth it
>> as you get free tea/coffee, newspapers and bigger seats.....also less of the lower classes
I used to treat myself to 1st class on Fridays on my commute back from Bath to Reading as it was only an extra 50p on those days (advance tickets).
It's a bit more now, and I had to get out at Didcot and move to standard class because I split the journey and couldn't afford the 1st class standard return between Didcot and Reading.
So I don't bother now - it's not that great :)
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>> I know this is in danger of being a silly question but is there WiFi on trains as a rule?
Not on the First Great Western trains I use -
www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=81
Do you know which operator you are using - their website might have similar info.
Last edited by: Focus on Wed 25 May 11 at 20:51
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Virgin. I'll have a look thanks.
Edit - Tee Hee "less of the lower classes" I haven't the faintest concept of where I fit on that nominal scale. Can't imagine it's very high up the pecking order in the end. In mitigation my wife often says I have "no class" so....
:-)
Last edited by: Humph D'Bout on Wed 25 May 11 at 21:00
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Being on the train will save you getting drawn in down there.
"Must go old chap, train to catch, long journey and all that."
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Aye true, and I can do a Perrinesque "seven minutes late, sheep on the line in Northamptonshire" or something.
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Me and 'er will be going to stay with friends in the Eden Valley soon. Our normal route is M61/M6 to the Carnforth gate then up the A6 to Shap. We stop for lunch in Milnthorpe.
Turn right in Shap village and it's amother ten miles..
I really don't want to drive that far until after my cataract op so we've opted for the train.
We could go to Penrith but this time we've settled on Appleby, via Leeds.
Not been on the old S & C for some years.
Cheapest I can get is off-peak return £37 each. Free bus and tram at this end and picked up at Appleby. Would cost about £40 in DERV but what the hell. We usually take the makings of a meal and some bottles but we can get round that when we're there.
Quite looking forward to it. I have rellys in a village near Rugby and we may ' train ' it there.
We never really use our car at either place.
Ted
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From the rumours I have heard if you're making the journey from late July expect to be able to get to the station much much quicker :).
I must say I am very very excited to get my first ride, but so many people are now moaning about it already :(.
My only gripe is the station at Morrison's should be called Chorlton Cum Hardy and not Chorlton, we wouldn't want tourists confusing it with Chorlton on Medlock would we?
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>>
>> I must say I am very very excited to get my first ride,
>>
You really HAVE lived a sheltered life thus far haven't you? ;-)
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>> should be called Chorlton Cum Hardy and not Chorlton, we wouldn't want tourists confusing it with Chorlton on Medlock
Chorlton on Medlock doesn't really exist anymore though does it. Only a few buildings left. That's where the Victoria University of Manchester was built. Now merged with UMIST and now just the University of Manchester.
When I lived in Chorlton Cum Hardy (BBD might have a comment on that name) a friend got mail delivered to him at Chortlon and the Wheelies. Post office will have known Cosgrove and Hall were in Chorlton though. No postcode was used. Just name, house number, road and Chorlton and the Wheelies. :-)
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I was being a little bit sarcastic about Chorlton on Medlock :). 130 years ago that was locally known as Chorlton and the Chorlton we know today was Chorlton Cum Hardy.
Back then Chorlton was just a tiny village where as Chorlton on Medlock was already very populated.
It is a shame Cosgrove Hall has closed down. When I was a small boy I would always call it Robin and Rosie's house and every time my mum took me to that brand new Safeway which had just opened we walked past it and I got would excited about it.
I might try addressing something to Chorlton and the Wheelies and see if it works, the problem is if I post it locally it will work, I will do it when I am in London, that will really really confuse the sorting office :D
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>> Not been on the old S & C for some years.
We still have the Settle Carlisle rail journey to do. Would do a day trip so drive somewhere like Skipton I guess. Think it calls there. Enjoy the break.
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Virgin has free wifi in first class , and PAYG wifi in cattle class
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The last time I was on a Virgin train I used their wifi in standard class. I think at the time access using iPass was an option so I personally didn't pay anything.
Depending on train and the route, mobile data access over GPRS or 3G can be hit and miss. And if you don't have tethering with a smartphone you might not be able to use your data allowance with a laptop anyway (standard/inclusive feature on Android phones but not iPhones).
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Why are you paying so much? I thought even the walk in fair from say Manchester was only �70 return now off peak. I assume you're travelling from Crewe or Wilmslow?
I usually pay around �22-�30 return but then I am very flexible and book in advance.
Another tip is not to use the trainline.com as they charge a booking fee, book through any of the TOCs websites instead including Virgin Trains.
I also find more often or not the trains arrive into Euston about 5-6 minutes earlier than schedules.
Most people I know who live in Manchester which need to go to London use the train because it is far cheaper and quicker. You just need to know the tricks to get the best prices.
Another trick is to get a quiet coach, so much more relaxing :)
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 26 Oct 17 at 02:12
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>> Another trick is to get a quiet coach, so much more relaxing :)
I much prefer the constant noise of an ordinary coach - I'm very intolerant when it comes to occasional irregular noises in a 'quiet' environment. One of my Asbergers tendencies.
Last edited by: Focus on Wed 25 May 11 at 22:03
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I know what you mean, in the day time I always take the normal ones for that reason, I can use my headphones to block out the people speaking in Mandarin but at night I find the silent coaches are just that.
I do sometimes take the Megabus down to London but since the last one was a P reg Volvo with Plaxton bodywork which had no toilets I avoid it. However although the coach takes two and a half hours longer than the train it seems to go quicker. I suppose on the Pendolino at 125mph there is no opportunity to look out of the window and spot things, on the coach there is always the hobby of truck spotting.
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About £90 for the morning trip, £30 ish for the afternoon return. £8 for the tube.
Actually it's worth it just to avoid that mess on the M1 near Luton. I know I could have gone down the M40 but it takes an age from Heathrow-ish onwards.
No, train it is. Do they still do the curly sandwiches or should I dry out my own?
:-)
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And no ogling of nicely dressed totty young man..:-)
note..take sunglasses.
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Here now there's a thought...
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Argh off peak in Virgin talk seems to be around 1pm now! That will be why the ticket was so expensive.
It can sometimes work out cheaper to stay the night in a hotel in the right circumstances.
They are comfortable, I don't really bother with the onboard food as I am always on a strict budget when ever I am on the Pendolino.
I also find that nobody ever sits next to me, even if they are reserved unless it is very busy, e.g from Manchester to Stockport (you're not supposed to be able to do that journey but people do) as I think so many people who get the very cheap tickets don't end up showing up..
Last edited by: RattleandSmoke on Wed 25 May 11 at 22:14
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>> Do they still do the curly sandwiches or should I dry out my own?
Too late for tomorrow but if you're going to be doing it regularly:
www.bitecard.co.uk/getacard.asp?r=nc
(although I would make my own)
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Anyone been on the Orient Express?
Euro Disney looks favorite for 3x nights should be able to get a pass for 75% discount in France on the Railways & should be able to get to St Pancras for nowt with a bit of luck from Leeds.
The Orient Express id like to give it a go but it seems more of a old mans type of travel, ( no offence).
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>> Anyone been on the Orient Express?
Yes down to Venice for a holiday.
A thoroughly marvellous experience, varying age groups but mostly over 45's.
We enjoyed ourselves, met some really nice people from all walks of life, people with a sense of humour and able to enjoy the company and trip without the need to get drunk...does that sound pompous, i hope not.
The ladies enjoyed being feminine, they thoroughly enjoyed dressing glamorously and of course us chaps enjoyed being properly attentive gentlemen, a most memorable turning back of the clock to a time of good manners and decent behaviour.
Tiring trip, not easy to sleep with the noise and constant rocking, these beautiful carriages do not ride or have the soundproofing of modern rolling stock, but you'd doubtless know that.
Fantastic scenery through the mountains especially.
We would take the trip again with enthusiasm.
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>> >> Anyone been on the Orient Express?
>>
>> Yes down to Venice for a holiday.
>>
>> A thoroughly marvellous experience, varying age groups but mostly over 45's.
Thats only way to arrive in Venice, on the VSOE across the causeway. Step off the train onto a vaporetto to your hotel.
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Ratso, I was talking to a foreman at our station last week who thought it might start in early June.
I was actually on the platform at Chorlton station yesterday while wife was in Morrisons. Easy to access via a ramp in the car park. I asked a worker, there were only two there, about opening and he ignored me.
All the facilities are in place at all the stations.
Here's a test tram City bound at ' our ' station, having run round the end of the platform onto the Northbound track
www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTyVp7vOgds
I think our station will be ' Chorlton High ' because of the school.
Ted
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It is to be called St Werbourgh's Road, just seen pictures of it tonight :) Chorlton High was a working title from a year or so back. All the sign-age is now complete, it was done today apparently, if you have time tomorrow have a wonder.
I will go down there myself and take some pictures of it tomorrow :).
I asked a worker last week who said it will open late August, the truth is none of the labourers working on site for MPT really have a clue. I actually doubt Metrolink and TFGM have a clue when it will open too.
I have a friend which lives on Nell lane next to the Southern and she has been moaning about the trees which have just been cut down to make way for the Airport line.
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I'm glad about the name change, Ratushka. There was a lot of local pressure around here...seems like they won.
There's a lot of work goimg on on the traffic light junctions on Mauldeth Road West.
I'll be iterested to see how they get the airport branch onto Mauldeth Road riund the back of the new school.....might be a bit of a climb involved.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=34WgQR4EKoc
The same tram coming imto the station earlier. Note the public crossing place. This is where the Sustrans trail crosses to access the ramp. I don't know if there will be any warning lights for walkers and cyclists but trams won't be at full speed there.
Ted Towers is on the right a hundred yards or so down.
Might get the pushbike and camera out tomorrow once I've re-potted me tomatoes.
Ted
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I think you will be very pleased how much it is has come on, I tend to walk down the path every week or so to get a very good view of it at eye level. The Chorlton stop looks rather bland in comparison but there will be a level crossing there just next to Morrisson's car park too.
It has also worked very at Old Trafford.
There will be quite a big climb involved to get the tram up there. I have pictures of that some where.
I was in Didsbury today and good progress is being made there as well. The problem is by far my most common journey I make is Chorlton to Didsbury so I think I am going to be stuck in a lot of traffic for the next couple of years :(
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I don't see the benefit of using the tram from East Didsbury to Manchester. Close by is the railway. The train will go:
- East Didsbury to Manchester via Burnage and Mauldeth Road
Tram will go:
- East Didsbury to Manchester via Chorlton and Trafford....
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There isn't really much benefit BUT the idea is that it will get people from say East Didsbury to Chorlton or maybe Cornbrook where you could get a tram to say Ashton.
For example East Didsbury to West Didsbury would take less than 4 minutes on the tram. And with frequency of every 6 minutes you can see how that is far better than the bus.
It is like the 22 bus route, nobody ever goes from Stockport to Bolton on it, but it is a great connecting survive.
It is the same with the Airport line, nobody will really use it get from the airport to the city centre as the train would be far quicker but it will connect people on the way. Again from Chorlton there is no direct public transport to the airport at the moment.
East Didsbury is just the terminus really but I think there really needs to be a shuttle bus from there to Stockport. Apart from Wigan, Stockport will be the only place in Greater Manchester not to have a Metrolink service.
Last edited by: RattleandSmoke on Thu 26 May 11 at 00:07
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>> Anyone been on the Orient Express?
>> The Orient Express id like to give it a go but it seems more of
>> a old mans type of travel, ( no offence).
Its not for kids for sure, you need to be comfortable meeting strangers and being with them in close proximity for a couple of days.
There is however, nothing better than a kipper served fro brealkfast from a silver platter eaten in a Wagon Lit coach as the train potters along. I wish iot still went to Istanbull tho!
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 25 May 11 at 23:39
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Since opting out of a company car I'm more conscious of driving everywhere and use the Trainline.com for much cheaper tickets partucularly if you book several weeks ahead. If you can go slightly off peak I can get to London from Bristol for about £16.00 sometimes less for the return if you come back after 7pm. My regular business commute to Birmingham from Somerset was a gruelling 2½ hour drag up the M5 with finding a parking space another nightmare. Going by train is just as cheap and far less tiring.
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>> the Trainline.com for much cheaper tickets
>> I can get to London from Bristol for about £16.00
...or £15 if you book via FGW and avoid Trainline's booking fee
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Trainline no cheaper for me than the booking office at Stockport.
Added advantage of a nice, friendly chap to serve me.
Ted
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Regularly buying tickets for the kids travels. London Midland are also commission free. Order ticket at work and collect it from the station on my way home.
But it's the different rules for web, ticket vending machines that getting me ranting. Daughter needs off peak ticket to Liverpool for travel following day. If I buy it on the web I just tick the box for 'railcard', take the ticket and it's up to the conductor/RPI to make the railcard is there too.
Try to buy an off peak for tomorrow from the machine but it won't sell those until after 09:30 on the day of travel.
Ticket office will only sell one if the railcard holder and railcard are both present.
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>> Trainline no cheaper for me than the booking office at Stockport.
>>
>> Added advantage of a nice, friendly chap to serve me.
Most lugubrious bloke on the railway system works at Stockport.
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You can buy any of the prices you see on Trainline.com in the ticket offices, unless it is a special ticket.
Always avoid thetrainline.com because they charge a booking fee, the ticket offices and any of the TOCs don't.
In fact I find thetrainline.com adverts very misleading because they fail to point out that you can buy all the same tickets at any ticket office, or buy them from any of the TOCs direct for less than what the trainline charge.
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>> In fact I find thetrainline.com adverts very misleading because they fail to point out that
>> you can buy all the same tickets at any ticket office, or buy them from
>> any of the TOCs direct for less than what the trainline charge.
Trainline is there to sell tickets, not to advertise for the TOC's who at the end of the day pay them nothing for the advertising but only commision on tickets sold through the trainline web site.
Its a handy service, its the best way to get find out services and times for journeys from A to B across multiple TOC's timetables. Its a tidy and well run website and service.
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>> Its a handy service, its the best way to get find out services and times
>> for journeys from A to B across multiple TOC's timetables. Its a tidy and well
>> run website and service.
National Rail does that for me then refers me on to a ticket vendor, either Trainline or one of the TOCs.
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I don't expect the Trainline to advertise other TOCs but they make out they are cheapest way to book tickets but word it in such a way to get round ASA guidlines.
I wonder how many people on this realise that the TOC sites are £1.50 cheaper?
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Just caught "Sally Traffic" on the short journey from the local station to home. Apparently the M1 northbound has been shut for most of the afternoon around about Northampton. Hope no one too badly hurt or whatever.
Feeling extra smug now though.
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"Feeling extra smug now though."
Smugness will soon disappear when you get stuck on a broken down train for two hours with no refreshment car as I did last week. :-(
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>> Just caught "Sally Traffic" on the short journey from the local station to home. Apparently
>> the M1 northbound has been shut for most of the afternoon around about Northampton.
Ahhh, that explains the jam below coming into Northampton station tonight. Flowing OK between 15A & 16 a few minutes later though.
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>>
>> Its a handy service, its the best way to get find out services and times
>> for journeys from A to B across multiple TOC's timetables. Its a tidy and well
>> run website and service.
>>
I agree; thetrainline.com is great for finding prices and routes. If that costs a few quid then that's fine by me. I, along with many people I suspect, just don't have the time (or the inclination...) to search across multiple website for the best route/price
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>> I agree; thetrainline.com is great for finding prices and routes. If that costs a few
>> quid then that's fine by me. I, along with many people I suspect, just don't
>> have the time (or the inclination...) to search across multiple website for the best route/price
So what does the Trainline do that National Rail (or TOC websites) does not? National Rail must by definition be TOC blind. Do some TOC sites favour their own services - thinking particulalry where open access operators such as Gt Central or Hull trains operate?
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>> >> I agree; thetrainline.com is great for finding prices and routes. If that costs a
>> few
>> >> quid then that's fine by me. I, along with many people I suspect, just
>> don't
>> >> have the time (or the inclination...) to search across multiple website for the best
>> route/price
>>
>> So what does the Trainline do that National Rail (or TOC websites) does not?
Doesent have an Iphone or Android app for a start.,
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>> Doesent have an Iphone or Android app for a start.,
Ahhh. I'm a luddite with just a desktop or netbook.
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National Rail is the only sensible alternative IMO, since I neither know nor care who the operator of the train is and I'm certainly not going to look for their website. Unfortunately while its good for checking times/routes I find it cumbersome (and flakey) to use when buying tickets
Indeed I've just tried it now, and got the following message "We are sorry, but we cannot contact the carrier you selected. Please try later or choose a different carrier" when trying to buy a ticket to London Victoria...
thetrainline also has a good mobile site which is very useful for checking train times when out and about (beaten to it by Zero on that point!)
Last edited by: PeterS on Thu 26 May 11 at 20:37
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As far as I can see the FGW and Trainline website ticket booking system are basically the same, just different front ends (and different booking fees). Don't they all access the same database of routes/prices?
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Yep same database, when it goes down it is impossible to book any ticket on any website.
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>> Yep same database, when it goes down it is impossible to book any ticket on
>> any website.
Not sure about that, sometimes different sites give different results.
London Midland's site has a problem at the moment. If you try and book a ticket from Chester to Northampton it suggests, logically, using the hourly non stop Virgin service from Chester to Milton Keynes and changing into a London Midland service for Northampton. That however is not a 'permitted route' as it involves doubling back so the website offers you an array of services but with no available fares.
National rail identifies the same services but points out you need two tickets. Chester to MK then MK to Northampton. Mixing an advance ticket on Virgin with a single this is both fast and cheap.
Other sites don't offer the MK option at all but try and route you via either Birmingham or Stafford/Rugby to approach Northampton from the north via Long Buckby. Slower and more expensive!!
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...sometimes different sites give different results....
Complicated, innit?
I think Bromptonaut should consider offering a rail fair finding service.
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I thought about that too, but I can't imagine there would be much margin in it. Oh I've just found a way you can get to Bristol £7 cheaper, but you have to change trains at Wolverhampton at 5:00am in the morning. Oh btw that is a £15 finders fee please.....
On the other hand I can get people from Manchester to Newquay for less than £120 walk up, e.g on the day, the ticket office would try and sell you a ticket which costs well above £300.
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>>
>> On the other hand I can get people from Manchester to Newquay for less than
>> £120 walk up, e.g on the day,
But todays walk up price for a BMI flight manchester/Newquay was only £103....
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>> >> Yep same database, when it goes down it is impossible to book any ticket
>> on
>> >> any website.
>>
>> Not sure about that, sometimes different sites give different results.
It is the same database, but being a database it can be interogated with different search arguments.
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I'm planning a trip to visit my son & heir in Helensburgh mid-September; why is it that I can book plane tickets now, but neither Trainline nor National Rail go more than three months ahead?
Can't be the timetable change, that's not usually till end of September at least, and is in any case makes little difference today compared to the old BR timetables when summer excursions and holiday trains made up so much of the traffic.
I'd love to do the journey by train, never travelled the WCML; sadly the trip by train to Cardiff, flight to Glasgow then train onwards is not only at least £40 cheaper but considerably quicker. I've worked out the cost by car and that's cheaper still, but wifey needs it for work that week and i10 seats are not good for very long journeys.
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Harley,
I think the answer is engineering work. Thirteen weeks is the notice/planning time Network Rail isl obliged to give the TOCs
Runways don't need constant fettling.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sat 28 May 11 at 12:08
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Went from Exeter to Manchester yesterday (first class); pleasantly surprised. £74 for the ticket, bought same day.
Only two people in the carriage, comfy seat, free food (though no free paper which is disappointing, but other chap left his Times behind), quiet, and faster than driving.
Disadvantages - fairly rubbish sandwich selection. I get the impression that they don't have many on board and run out quickly. If they do then you're out of luck, as you won't get anything free from the normal trolley. Crisps are only ready salted. Carriage needs private bog. WiFi would be nice. Perhaps a little more fawning from the train staff, after all, it is first class.
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I assume it was a Cross Country Voyager service? They are possibly the worst long distance trains, cramped, smelly, noisy and not really fit for the purpose. I would rather travel on a Class 43 with MK3s anyday.
When going on my South West tour (Bristol, Minehead, Plymouth, Newquay, Torquay) I had to get the Voyager to Bristol and that was long enough!.
Cross Country also need to improve their offering, e.g WIFI etc.
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I would rather travel on a Class 43 with MK3s anyday.
Be honest have you got a train set in your bedroom?
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I do have a trainset, but I have not used it for 13 years or so.
Some people like myself would much rather get the train than fly. If I had to go to any where in Germany for example I would take the train.
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I would fly, its cheaper and faster.
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But you don't have a fear of flying :)
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>> Runways don't need constant fettling.
>>
They do; it's ruining my evenings flying into Manchester as we wait on the naughty step for 20 minutes before getting to the gate.
Last edited by: VxFan on Sat 28 May 11 at 21:14
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Well try landing a little softer and not leaving nuts, bolts, bits of flap, and tyre marbles on the runway then.
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>> Well try landing a little softer and not leaving nuts, bolts, bits of flap, and
>> tyre marbles on the runway then.
>>
Listen, no one is more surprised than me to survive the day.
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@ Bromptonaut re. engineering works.
Thanks, hadn't considered that.
Last edited by: Harleyman on Mon 30 May 11 at 20:03
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>> Its a handy service, its the best way to get find out services and times
>> for journeys from A to B across multiple TOC's timetables. Its a tidy and well
>> run website and service.
Exactly, and for a staggering £1.00 booking fee quite a useful service as you can print your own tickets at home and not waste petrol driving to the station to chat to nice guys behind the desk. If you'd seen the queues at Bristol Temple Meads you wouldn't try that on the day you want to travel.
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Let the train take the strain - mikeyb
