www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13356057?site=general+stuff
How is this going to work? Are police cars going to have chip & pin machines? How long will it take to process an offending driver? There are very few traffic cars now and some police services don't even have dedicated traffic sections.
I am sure existing laws could be properly enforced, rather than briniging in new ones. It is suggested that the number of convictions has fallen so people must be going unprosecuted. It doesn't seem to occur to the authorities that perhaps people are driving better as a result of the Government's road safety policy? We are drifting closer to living in a police state but luckily with not enough police to run it!
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Qwestion
Considering cut backs on Police establishments (numbers) and the fact over the past years they have decimated Road Traffic Units where are they going to get the manpower to enforce this.
Simples:
More cameras and HATO's powers.
dvd
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 12 May 11 at 00:56
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It really makes sense for coppers to be able to fine on the spot. Technology has advanced to the stage where roadside chip and pin payment is practical and reliable, and its a way of punishing non UK license holders. I assume the option to refuse and face court will still be there.
Re
"The Department for Transport (DfT) said it would also include a crackdown on drug-driving and the closing of loopholes that allow people to escape drink-driving charges."
What loopholes? Drink Driving must be one of the best tied down pieces of legislation going, the number of people who slip through must be minute. As for drugs, surely, by now, we must have the technology to do an initial roadside check, and equipment back at the nick.
But yeah, with less coppers on the road we are stuck with cameras, and they have no nose.
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Don't see any mention there anywhere of actually processing credit cards - isn't it just an extension of the current fixed penalty scheme ?
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Then how does it vary from normal Fixed Penalty notice?
Edit
Ah I see, it just drags more offences into the FPN scheme.
Still think CC payment at the scene is a good thing tho, for the reasons I gave, plus it provides a chance to snoop further. I wonder how many iffy cards they would get.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 11 May 11 at 09:05
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That's what I was wondering. Report is a bit vague.
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...I wonder how many iffy cards they would get...
Cash says more about me than cards ever could.
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A more comprehensive report in the forum's favourite newspaper:
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1385702/Aggressive-idiot-drivers-face-100-fines-road-safety-law-shake-up.html
Looks as if the drink/drive loophole is the right to request a blood test.
I don't think the coppers will be taking money, just issuing fixed penalty tickets.
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The media, possibly mislead by press notices, conflate on the spot fines and the issuing of fixed penalty notices. The UK has no tradition of police taknig money 'on the spot' and I don't believe either Cheif Constables or the officers on the beat want such a power. Too much complication, too much scope for aggro & allegations. Although C&P is universla for those of us who use debit cards there's still a fair chunk of society who don't. Otheres have only the 'basic' bank accounts.
No reason why fixed panalties wouldn't work though porvided the manpower is there to do the job.
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I read the DM report and it seems to be rather more detailed. I believe that there is/was a trial whereby Roads Policing Officers have been given powers in some areas to take CCs from foreign truck drivers.
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You are correct PU but it is mainly used by VOSA when finding infringements on foreign lorries.
They demand a deposit payment equal to the fixed penalty sum, payable by chip and pin at the roadside to anyone without a fixed UK address.
If this isn't forthcoming the vehicle is totally immobilised until it is.
Any fixed penalty gives you 28 days to pay or choose to go to court to defend it, for a UK resident.
Very welcome and succesful they have been too.
Pat
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If you drive a car, you have sufficient money in an account that carries a debit card. Only a small percentage (I wont say who they are but drive transits with tow hooks) live in a cash society.
Those who dont have bank accounts are those who are not licensed or insured anyway.
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"If you drive a car, you have sufficient money in an account that carries a debit card. "
A lot of people running a car have no money left in their account or are overdrawn at the end of the month. I used to be one of them when the children were small
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so how did you fill it with petrol?
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Used to budget carefully so I had enough in the tank to last me until pay day. Really Zero strange as it might seem to you there are loads of people out there who have very little or no money in their bank account at the end of the month.
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So how do you expect to pay the fine if it comes through the post? what happens if your car breaks down and it needs to be towed?
Most people with a bank account have an overdraft facility.
Anyway its not a problem, you can say "cant pay" and face going to court and pay costs.
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On the spot fine really means you have 7 or even 14 days to pay. Many public transport companies offer reduced on the spot fines, but in reality they give you 7 days to pay the fine.
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I watched that story on the news as well.
then I went off to work and within 5 minutes had seen a Range Rover driver in the slow lane on the motorway on his mobile phone chatting away quite happily.
As a matter of fact, I had noticed him as I was joining the motorway and had to accelerate to get on the motorway as he had not moved or changed speed.
Basically he was in his own little world while on the phone completely oblivious to anything around him.
His lane discipline was also questionable.
Fines will not affect people who have money.
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>> slow lane
Driving lane! Grrrr :-)
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>> If you drive a car, you have sufficient money in an account that carries a
>> debit card. Only a small percentage (I wont say who they are but drive transits
>> with tow hooks) live in a cash society.
>>
>> Those who dont have bank accounts are those who are not licensed or insured anyway.
>>
Not the case Zero.
I work cash on delivery and the number of people without a bank account would surprise you, we're not talking about sink estate chavs either.
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>> Not the case Zero.
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>> I work cash on delivery and the number of people without a bank account would
>> surprise you, we're not talking about sink estate chavs either.
The number that tell you they have no bank account you mean.
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>> More ... HATO's powers
Don't think the HA Traffic Officers would be too keen on that! It still surprises me how many drivers automatically brake on the motorway when they see a womble 4x4.
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One of the reports mentiones being able to issue FPNs based on CCTV footage.
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>> One of the reports mentiones being able to issue FPNs based on CCTV footage.
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... which I thought already happens on London roads.
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Nice idea in theory, but seems a bit pointless to me in reality.
In the last 3 years of commuting I can count the number of plod on the roads on one hand.
And you can bet we'll have a vast variation on how plod define 'dangerous driving' which could alienate the majority of motorists or lead them to believe its another cash collector.
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The only change is that today, if someone is deemed to have been careless driving, then they will go to court.
Soon, if they commit that same careless driving offence, then they will have the OPTION of accepting a fixed penalty ticket. They can CHOOSE to go to court if they wish.
We currently have a system of conditional FPNs for people with no UK address. Under this system, we provide a 24hr telephone number where they can pay by credit card. There is a process for accepting cash, but it is very complicated and time consuming (for the officer)
In the two and half years (ish) it's been active, I can count on one hand the number of tickets that have been issued.
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There is only one protocol in UK to take spot fines. That is when dealing with offences committed by non residents (speeding etc) when certain monies are taken there and then.
I would gather in this case it is an extension of the Fixed Penalty scheme.
Problems I see that due care is a subjective offence and open to interpretation by the drivers involved unlike no insurance - you either have it or not. Consequently this suggestion could get the boot by drivers refusing to accept the FPN and electing a Court case, Justice will not be served because if the case is proved then a higher sentence will be passed than the FPN.
Bring back the black rats in numbers...
Totty lady from Brake on TV news dropped a clanger. Said dropping litter led to a £1000 fine whereas this only£100. Thats a max at a Court where Due care max £2,500.
dvd
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New Police Powers - Dwight Van Driver
