A tale reaches me of a gentleman who turned up with 68k cash for his new Range Rover.
He paid and drove it away.
The garage called the police under the money laundering regs.
The chap couldn't prove how he had come by the money legally, so they took his car away.
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"The chap couldn't prove how he had come by the money legally, so they took his car away. "
Sounds fair but I wonder if they took the cash from the garage too?
I thought there were limits on how much cash you could use in a transaction. Anyone know?
John
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Bought two cars in the last year or so, both over 5 grand, both sellers would not take cash.
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>> I thought there were limits on how much cash you could use in a transaction.
I don't think there are. However, banks etc. are supposed to inform "someone" of transfers above £10,000 AFAIR.
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Thanks FT, I found;
"Businesses that receive cash payments worth 15,000 euros or more in exchange for goods are known as 'High Value Dealers'. Money Laundering Regulations require High Value Dealers to register with HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC)."
at www.hmrc.gov.uk/mlr/getstarted/register/hvd.htm
Euros indeed!
John
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Are you saying that the garage accepted 68k in cash, gave the gentleman the keys, let him drive off, and then called the police?
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He's being tactful and avoiding a Daily Mail link ;-)
John
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More info in due course...
Last edited by: Clk Sec on Tue 1 Mar 11 at 16:50
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I'm sure PU can tell us how much potential aggro the money laundering regs had for the legal profession. How to manage the risks concerned certainly seems to be a regular theme inthe various legal mags that cross my desk.
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My brother-in-law accepted £40,000+ for a second hand car-took it straight to his bank and there was no problem.As long as it can be shown to be legitimate.
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How did he show it was legitimate?
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That raises an interesting point.
Presumably the M L regulations do not apply to a private seller, i.e his acceptance of the cash from a buyer of his car.
When he appeared at the bank, cash in hand, he had a valid reason for having the cash i.e the selling of his personal car.
Can one of the banking - insurance- legal experts confirm this?
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I had a bit of an odd experience when I bought my wife's car last December. The balance due was £9000 odds after trade in and whatnot. I paid with a debit card thinking that would be the simplest method. Now, that account used to be my business account so sums far in excess of that went in and out of it on a regular basis and were never questioned and there was more than plenty in it to cover the transaction at the time.
Nonetheless, the transaction was refused and the garage were invited by their card reading device to call my bank for authorisation. Even that stumbled and the bank asked to speak to me for a verification and security check. Of course that cured it but the garage themselves were puzzled and claimed they had never seen that before.
A bit embarrassing really but I suppose it was also in another way, reassuring.
Strange one though.
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>> the garage themselves were puzzled
Both times i've done it they've asked to speak to me for the security check. Kind of reassuring though, i like it. I'll wear my Sunday best this time and see if i can avoid one this week :-)
Buying 2nd hand i've never had it, but none of my 2nd hand cars have been that expensive.
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Weh hey Skoda, new car coming this week then !?
This the white one with the black ears ? ( sorry mirrors )
:-)
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>> Of course that cured it but the
>> garage themselves were puzzled and claimed they had never seen that before.
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Hmm..I've bought several cars using a debit card and they always want to speak to me and I get a grilling - even when I've called the bank to advise them in advance. Garages say some do just go straight through with an authorisation code, but most get the 3rd degree.
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You'll know the garage I mean Bill. The indy on the hill just next to the "Grensons" roundabout.
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"Members of the public
If you're a member of the public and have seen some activity that you think is suspicious and may be to do with money laundering, you should telephone your local police station."
www.hmrc.gov.uk/mlr/reportsuspicion.htm
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'Er indoors once inadvertently laundered some money that I'd left in a trouser pocket.
;-)
Last edited by: L'escargot on Tue 1 Mar 11 at 18:22
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Try transferring, for example, more than £15k out of a Halifax current account (even into a savings account with it) on-line and it is refused. You can transfer up to that amount though on a daily basis if you could afford to do so...:-)
A pal tried to withdraw a large sum from a LloydsTSB bank last year and was refused, even though he has held an account there for many years.
After some considerable argument (i.e. it was his money and not that of LloydsTSB), he switched all his accounts to Santander who, it seems, have no such restrictions. LloydsTSB lost a very good customer through sheer "rules are rules" mentality.
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He has no chance of getting it out of Santander.
Computer problems!
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Santander seem royally stuffed by system problems for the past year or 2.
It's almost enough to dust off the CV :-) Canny beat a good crisis.
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>>He has no chance of getting it out of Santander. >>
I was referring to a day about four months ago...:-)
He hasn't had any difficulties with Santander in the meantime.
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People seem to be suggesting that it is unwise to pay for anything really expensive with a carrier bag full of cash, like a heroic lovable-rogue cocaine dealer in a movie.
As an old person I find this depressing. There are many reasons why a person might have a carrier bag full of pesos, many of them morally legitimate. How dare that ass the law invent crimes that complicate the issue for morally more-or-less-OK cash holders.
Almost makes one happy not to be in that class if you see what I mean. Almost, but not quite somehow.
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>> He hasn't had any difficulties with Santander in the meantime.
He's lucky.
Their .co.uk site was down for the thick end of 24 hours the other day.
Not helpful.
Not confidence inspiring.
And Do Not mention the migration from Alliance and Leicester to Satan nerd.
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>>He's lucky.>>
He's just two minutes from a branch, as was the case with the offending bank.
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>> And Do Not mention the migration from Alliance and Leicester to Satan nerd.
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>>>>>>. i will because i am part of that poor set of people who has been moved :-(
to be quite frank the standard of staff in my santander bank would put a car salesman to shame who was boasting on doubling up on a £14000 car sale------
and we all know how big their porkies are when they need to wind someone up big time.....
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"He has no chance of getting it out of Santander. "
He's right. They have a shocking reputation. It is some years ago but I closed an account with them and it took them weeks. I eventually rang and a helpful and sensible lady transferred the balance out but had to let the actual closure take it's course. I couldn't give a stuff about that part.
So the moral is, don't close an account, just take all of the money out. Then close it.
John
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In July last year, I couldn't pay any in! They couldn't accept my payment into my mortgage account "due to computer integration problems"
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the police wouldnt take his car away
i suspect there might be an investigation by the inland revenue or any other official body but i cant imagine the car would be confiscated unless good reason could be shown that it was purchased with ill gotten lolly ie it had numbered numbers from the great train robbery on all the notes
of course the garage would lose the car too as it would be held as evidence
so come on original poster give all the facts but please dont give misinformation as it is one of my big pet hates
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This money laundering stuff was discussed on another car forum recently.
Many people said they'd been quizzed at banks when paying in cash and had had even fairly small amounts of cash refused when trying to buy cars.
People who seemed familiar with the process said that what's supposed to happen is the bank or garage should accept the transaction but then report it as suspicious - what they're not supposed to do (whch makes sense) is simply refuse the transaction although in practice this seems to often happen.
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I had no problem paying for my car towards the end of last year at a major city dealership, splitting the payment between two debit cards.
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>> People who seemed familiar with the process said that what's supposed to happen is the
>> bank or garage should accept the transaction but then report it as suspicious - what
>> they're not supposed to do (whch makes sense) is simply refuse the transaction although
Yes, the "guidance" set in tablets of stone is that you must not let the "suspect" know that he/she is a suspect.
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You would think, that crims would know that large cash deposits was suspicious.
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>> You would think, that crims would know that large cash deposits was suspicious.
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The smart crims know it all. If a crim wants to churn money using cars as a commodity, he just goes and buys a 2nd hand car from a private punter, then sells it on to a geezer and asks for a bankers draft payment, deposits the draft, and avoids the regs.
If the crim wants to transfer money abroad, he just goes to the appropriate ethnic area where the money can be exchanged readily; pay in pounds here and an amount at a better rate than the official rate is paid in cash delivered to your contact abroad.
As always, it is the honest man in the street who gets caught out and inconvenienced by these regs. Incidentally, the regs were drafted yonks ago when the limit was set at Euro 15k.
After all the years that have passed, the limit remains and some "authorities" use the original conversion £:Euro rate equivalent at £10k for the UK. Others use a figure converted on a daily or weekly or monthly average basis. How daft can one get.
Last edited by: John H on Tue 1 Mar 11 at 23:50
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Humph, where is this Grensons roundabout? Is it named after the factory that once made my lovely shoes?
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>> Humph, where is this Grensons roundabout?
No - it's where Grensons' garage(s) are. Spit.
It's on the outskirts of Crewe.
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I daren't go into Crewe. It's almost impossible to find your way out again. Signposts? Nope. Just keep driving on a steady bearing until you reach something familiar.
John
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Because....
Crewe is a figment of traveller's brains.
Born of the night, of Bradshaw and of trains.
Ted
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I think you're right Ted. They only expect visitors by train.
John
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>> No - it's where Grensons' garage(s) are. Spit.
Take it you have some "history" with said vendors of motor carriages Bill?
:-)
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Don't pay for your car with cash... - Tooslow
