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Motoring Discussion > Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe	Car Deals
Thread Author: Lygonos	Replies: 10

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Thu 7 Sep 23 09:59

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Lygonos

Without any real point to make I thought this graph interesting: Tesla sales by month/year

www.speakev.com/attachments/img_2111-png.181178/

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Thu 7 Sep 23 10:49

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Terry

Last year BMW sold 646,000 cars in Europe. Tesla are on track to be close to or equal that this year, and likely overtake them next year.

Tesla have sold 182,000 EVs in Europe from Jan - Jun 2022. The next closest is VW with 76,000.

With cheaper imports from China anticipated what is the future for traditional European manufacturers - or will most disappear through failure or acquisition over the next decade.

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Thu 7 Sep 23 11:01

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Duncan

>> Without any real point to make I thought this graph interesting: Tesla sales by month/year
>>
>> www.speakev.com/attachments/img_2111-png.181178/

Those are cumulative totals, surely?

Otherwise, it would mean that every month of every year, sales figures improved - never once was a month's sales inferior to the previous month's?

tinyurl.com/3w4xntrf

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Thu 7 Sep 23 11:33

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Lygonos

Cumulative totals for each year, yes.

Resets each January.

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Thu 14 Sep 23 17:39

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Boxsterboy

I see the EU president Ursula von der Leyen has finally gone public on the risk of Chinese EVs being dumped on the EU market at low prices on the back of large subsidies to their manufacturers. Reminds me of the UK war against Japanese imports in the early 1970s and the cap on their market share (10% IIRC?).

On the one hand cheaper EVs are undoubtedly popular, but if that is by unfair competition and at the expense of EU car manufacturers, that is a bad thing. Although quite a few EU manufacturers are producing in China for the EU market - VW, BMW, Volvo, Smart, Citroen, Peugeot, etc. but selling at EU-made prices, possibly because they don't get the Chinese state subsidies?

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Thu 14 Sep 23 19:37

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Terry

Are Chinese EV sales really subsidised - or (in reality) are Chinese costs lower due to lower labour rates, lower energy costs, lower standards in H&S, lower quality, more efficient etc.

If they can simply make things (cars, TVs, washing machines etc etc) at lower costs we need to be honest about it - either accept the final decline of European high cost manufacturing, or erect tariff or other barriers.

Going back to the 1960s and 1970s the Japanese produced cars which were cheaper, better equipped, more reliable than European output. They have been followed by the eastern bloc (notably Skoda) and more recently Korea.

They started with questionable quality and low prices. All have improved to wholly competitive quality and price. MG have largely completed this transition. The Chinese may simply be the next players.

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Thu 14 Sep 23 21:52

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Rudedog

When one of the business guy's was talking about the EV market he mentioned that a large proportion of Teslas are built in China - didn't know that if true.

I guess some of it will be how the new generation of 'petrolheads' see EV's, many of my colleagues just see them as four wheels and the design of current EVs and SUV's are horrendous, Euro/US makers tended to be better at making a good looking and desirable car that would stand the test of time - maybe classics are being converted?

Apart from the Taycan or Audi e-tron GT can't say I'm impressed by the design of many EVs - although I've seen some of the early sketches of the electric VW GTI which look great if it stays the same.

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Fri 15 Sep 23 08:05

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Falkirk Bairn

DT today
France is urging import duties on UK cars/vans using Chinese batteries in 4 months time

However many leading makes - VW/Audi etc also use Chinese batteries and any threat to UK would likely see similar hike in duties VW cars /vans coming into UK

Currently no hikes on any cars crossing the channel

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Fri 15 Sep 23 07:48

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - smokie

I thought most of the manufacturers had a "follow the state subsidy" policy for their car/component manufacturiing these days. E.g. news.sky.com/story/ford-to-get-500m-of-taxpayer-backing-to-protect-jobs-12033627

And we are subsidising EV building here www.gov.uk/government/news/ford-accelerates-electric-car-production-with-uk-government-support

Although the consumer subsidy has now gone I think.

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Fri 15 Sep 23 09:46

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Bobby

If only the UK and EU could get together and agree a policy that covers them all on these sorts of things……

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Fri 15 Sep 23 10:09

Tesla - Tesla sales in Europe - Terry

A very plausible explanation for why China is dominant in in EV sales from MIT:

www.technologyreview.com/2023/02/21/1068880/how-did-china-dominate-electric-cars-policy/

In summary - China identified a strategic opportunity in the development of EVs 20 years ago, subsidised and legislated locally to encourage development. They claim to have recently ceased
subsidies having created the largest global market for EV vehicles in China of over 6m pa.

Quite simply they have the economies of scale which (if nothing else) will ensure they are the lowest cost producer. By comparison Tesla who currently dominate other markets globally are on course to sell ~2m units this year.

Shows what can be done in an economy which aligns its private sector efforts with clearly focussed government strategies.

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