Motoring Discussion > I was nearly murdered the other day Miscellaneous
Thread Author: Enoughalready Replies: 22
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:03 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Enoughalready
Ok, murdered might be a little ott but I'm still annoyed 5 days later.

Scenario: Me in an estate with fragile load in the back. I normally am quite a swift (ehem) driver but on this occasion I drove a smoothly as possible because of my load. Always aware of my surroundings I approach a r/bout noting the traffic behind me are a few cars and a truck, in front there is a horsebox pulling a caravan which I pull in behind & wait until the lights change so we can move off onto the M4. Truck is now behind me.

Joining the M4 the traffic is very heavy but fast so I just follow the horsebox intending to wait until things smooth out and everyone behind me has joined the motorway and overtaken.
Truck behind me is now no more than 1.5 metres behind me and moving in closer, speed is around 50mph and slowly increasing. I still can't pull out to overtake the horsebox as there's so much fast moving traffic and neither can the truck behind me for the same reason.

Truck now is really close so I automatically gesture a wave back motion with my hand out of the gap at the top of the window - nothing offensive but he obviously took it as such and moved up closer than I would reverse up to a wall. He then backs off a little and draws up alongside and proceeds to force me to drive onto the hard shoulder. I decelerated to stop him and he overtook the horsebox. Now I can overtake and when I pass the truck driver he gestures for me to pull off at the next junction presumably for a fight (ha). I wanted that exit anyway. He wasn't a spring chicken and obviously saw me and decided against the idea because when I did pull off the m/w he carried straight on.

I spent the rest of my journey thinking about the situation.
He was probably an experienced driver & I find it strange that he would tailgate a car so closely as part of his regular days driving.
Maybe I had annoyed him earlier on? I can't see why because I passed him as he was high up on the slip road coming to join the A404 that leads upto the M4 -he was always behind me and there are average speed cameras which everyone stuck to the max 40 limit for the duration.
The main thing that riled him was my 'move back' hand gesture. That was the only option I had and in hindsight I should have probably just sat it out but I couldn't move and was stuck and I'm not going be a victim of bullying by some idiot.

My question is: what would you do in my situation? Would you have just sat there and accepted or (truthfully) would you offer a hand gesture or worse?
Last edited by: VxFan on Wed 15 Sep 10 at 12:45
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:31 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Old Navy
>> Truck now is really close so I automatically gesture a wave back motion with my
>> hand out of the gap at the top of the window - nothing offencive but
>> he obviously took it as such >>

You provoked what was a stressed out driver, what do you expect. It doesn't excuse his actions though. My response, look for a safe way to get out of the situation without annoying anyone.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Wed 15 Sep 10 at 11:33
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:39 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Enoughalready

>> You provoked what was a stressed out driver, what do you expect. It doesn't excuse
>> his actions though. My response, look for a safe way to get out of the
>> situation without annoying anyone.
>>

I appreciate that my gesture did provoke him and if I could have accelerated away I would have. That option was not available to me.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:42 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - R40

........"You provoked what was a stressed out driver, what do you expect"

a truck driver to be capable of doing his job perhaps, and not driving within a few feet of another vehicle, nor using his own as a weapon?

By the sounds of it he was probably too old/incapable and best bet would be a report and hopefully get his licence removed:)

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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:55 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - FotheringtonTomas
>> By the sounds of it he was probably too old/incapable

That *could* be said of most people who psot here.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:46 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Dog
>>My question is: what would you do in my situation? Would you have just sat there and accepted or (truthfully) would you offer a hand gesture or worse? <<

I would have totally ignored him/her and if he/she really got up my nose I would have gradually slowed down.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 11:58 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Iffy
...I was nearly murdered the other day...

A charge of murder, though not unknown, is most unlikely in this circumstance.

The problem is the prosecution would have to prove the driver set out - intended - to cause you serious harm, which is difficult.

Causing death by careless or dangerous driving is much easier to prove.

The prosecution only has to satisfy the court the standard of driving was far below that of a careful or competent driver.

Or in the case of careless, the driver was guilty of a momentary lack of attention.

So the thread title should be: "My death was nearly caused by careless or dangerous driving the other day." :)





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New Wed 15 Sep 10 12:01 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - J Bonington Jagworth
I don't do it very often, but if I get intimidated like that, I dab the brake pedal with my left foot, just enough to activate the lights. It usually works.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 12:36 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Enoughalready
He was so close the only brake light he would have seen would be the high one - it was an estate car I was driving. I normally put my washers on for a prolonged period, I should have remembered to do that.



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New Wed 15 Sep 10 12:42 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Woodster
Slow down (enough to annoy him) create a gap and let him overtake. Would I honestly do this? I have, but I've also done the braking, sometimes to the point of stopping and had a 'discussion'. Not on a motorway, obviously.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 12:47 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Bellboy
i had the same happen to me on the m62
i still dont know if that lorry driver was intent on killing someone that day
oh and i had trade plates on the car so any professional driver would know the driver in the car would be usually driving it cautiously because they are not familiar with it or it may have a problem you are checking out
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 12:44 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Enoughalready
He was so close the only brake light he would have seen would be the high one - it was an estate car I was driving. I normally put my washers on for a prolonged period, I should have remembered to do that but even then I wouldn't want to reduce his visibility. Even though I kept a decent distance between myself & the horsebox in front if there were to be any sharp braking there's a reasonable chance that I wouldn't remember anything after that.

EDIT apologies about the double post - dunno what happened!
Last edited by: Enoughalready on Wed 15 Sep 10 at 12:45
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 13:40 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Zero
The trouble is, they see right over the top of a car, can see the road ahead and think its safe to tailgate.
Dab your brakes and you will have 35 tons of steel round your ears. Lorries dont stop well.


I am well prepared to shout abuse at the driver to make my displeasure known and if they want I will pull in and have it out. They are very vunerable just at the point of climbing out the cab.

Dont try it with tipper lorries, gravel lories, or lorries carrying scrap steel. You will be talking to an iron bar with a junkyard dog hanging on your testements.






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New Wed 15 Sep 10 14:09 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - rtj70
>> Lorries dont stop well.

The one that ran into the back of the hire car we had in Italy certainly didn't managed to stop before shortening the Fiesta by a fair amount. Luck for the driver he didn't quite manage to kill us but it came close enough.

So if I was the original poster, don't mess with trucks just in case. Mistakes/accidents do happen.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 13:59 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - TheManWithNoName
Its a nasty situation to be in and often difficult to remain calm, afterall you're thinking about what could happen and the consequences of being a 'car sandwich'. I get more annoyed especially if my wife and kids are in the car. Parental instincts take over I guess.

That said I would have either slowed down then sped up to create a safety zone behind me but failing that I may have simply ignored the truck. Bottom line is if he had smashed into you your insurance would cover it and it would clearly be his fault.

If you spend time wondering what the idiot behind is doing, you may well have ended up rear-ending a horse box - not a pretty sight.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 14:16 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Cliff Pope
I think the safest thing to do is to drop back very gradually, not touching the brakes because he will see that as provocation. Then when you have created a larger safety zone ahead, and he has been forced to drop down a gear, accelerate hard into a gap and pull away.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 14:30 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Ted

I agree with Cliff. I tend to slow down without brakes to give myself space.
I'm of the opinion that if someone is going to give my car a smack up the chuff then let's have it done at walking pace.

I posted last year about the artic that tailgated me for miles across the High Peak on a ( mostly ) 50 mph single carriageway, bendy A road. What would I have given to have spotted a patrol car tucked away in a side road, I would have gone past with my horn blaring away.
Sadly, not to be and I vented my ire on his transport manager when I got home !
Never got a feedback, but never expected to.

Incidentally, the handle of my smaller trolley jack has a convenient place between the drivers seat and the door.........2 feet of steel with a rubber handle on the end. Handy!

Ted

Tede
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 16:43 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - henry k
>> I agree with Cliff. I tend to slow down without brakes to give myself space.
>>
I would do the same.

>>...... and I vented my ire on his transport manager when I got home !
>>
A couple of years ago I was overtaken at a stupid speed by a small truck ( later saw it at a buttie van so it was rushing to lunch break )
I noted the company and after much googling tracked down a phone number of an international company.
I too had words with their transport manager who really did seem concerned.
He impressed my so I said I would leave him to have words with the driver and I did not need any feedback.
I suggested they made their company a little more obvious than a pretty image and suggested a telephone number was displayed.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 16:50 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - henry k
>>Incidentally, the handle of my smaller trolley jack has a convenient place between the drivers seat and the door.........2 feet of steel with a rubber handle on the end. Handy!
>>
I am told it is difficult to "handle" in a confined space :-(
An your explaination to the BiBs when stopped is ? ( I am searching for the other part of it ??:-))

>>
I carry a can of fly squash remover in the summer and a can of deicer in the winter. I do like to have something handy to ensure that I can see well but it might impare others view of things.
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New Wed 15 Sep 10 18:05 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Manatee
If he won't adjust his distance to your speed, you have to adjust your speed to his distance.

Thats means you have to lift off and slow down. That has the immediate benefit of creating a gap in front of you as suggested by others, but you still don't want him close at speed lest you have to brake for any other reason.
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New Thu 16 Sep 10 06:20 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Pat
I certainly don't condone tailgating but as a lorry driver I can probably guess at the thought process of this incident.
The OP was between the lorry and a slow horsebox and as he says decided to wait and let others behind him overtake first because of his fragile load. I assume this was the case on the slip road and after joining the busy motorway in that order, the lorry driver would have expected and waited for the OP to pull out before him and get away.
We usually try and keep well to the left to allow the car in between to get better vision of the traffic approaching in the middle lane, to help with this.

He wouldn't be aware of your decision to wait, and on seeing your gesture through the sunroof he would indeed be frustated.
He would be expecting you to be watching your mirrors for a gap to pull out and not watching what was going on behind you.

As I say, not right but easy to see how the misunderstanding would arise.

Pat
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New Thu 16 Sep 10 10:19 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Enoughalready
Pat,

I do appreciate that lorry drivers would prefer cars to clear to enable them to pull out as the last thing they want is to pull out to overtake a car that also pulls out leaving them overtaking nothing. I've always been aware of this and when I join a motorway and another vehicle has pulled over into another lane allowing me to join I always hold back to enable them to complete the overtake - for lorries I give a little flash to let them know they're clear to pull back in.

My gesture was submitted after 1/3rd of a mile already on the motorway with a truck right up my jacksey - seriously close.

The horsebox in front was a 7.5 tonne pulling a caravan so my tailgater didn't have clear vision over me. Him not being aware of my decision to wait doesn't give him the right to try to bully me away.

He wasn't driving an arctic - it was a fixed slightly bigger than a 7.5t
Last edited by: Enoughalready on Thu 16 Sep 10 at 10:21
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New Thu 16 Sep 10 11:09 
 I was nearly murdered the other day - Badwolf
I know that Pat will, quite rightly, defend (or at least explain) a lorry driver's actions just as I would for a bus driver's.

However, Enoughalready seemed to be happy following the horsebox and was willing to let the lorry overtake (after you, if you will). I really do not see why the lorry driver intimidated Enoughalready in such a manner. It was clear that neither vehicle could get into lane two due to the traffic, so why attempt to park in E's boot? And as for attempting to force E onto the hard shoulder, well that is just inexcusable.

It comes to something when one can't express dismay at another driver's actions without running the risk of serious harm. This 'professional' driver should have his licence suspended immediately pending psychological test.
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