I read that E10 petrol is to be introduced next year to replace the current E5, but super unleaded will still be available for another five years (currently 2-3% ethanol). Could cause major problems for owners of older vehicles.
I also read that trials are taking place with the intention of legalising e-scooters next year. Damn things are a menace already.
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You'd think we'd have sorted all this out by now. New Yorkers were complaining about little motorised scooters, including electric ones, over 100 years ago. Talk about ahead of their time.
I especially like the idea of the petrol ones having the fuel in the handlebar column. Genius.
Autoped, seems pretty similar to a Segway in terms of controls.
blog.eogn.com/2019/09/24/those-new-electric-scooters/
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> I also read that trials are taking place with the intention of legalising e-scooters next
>> year. Damn things are a menace already.
>>
I first saw one these e scooters the other day, they move a bit faster than I thought. Not too much of an issue around here the pavements are fairly quiet. I can see how it'd be an issue in busy places.
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>> Not too much of an issue around here the pavements are fairly quiet.
Same here ... there are no pavements, same where we're moving to too, only worse/better!
Last edited by: God on Sat 20 Jun 20 at 15:35
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Human nature I suppose, but people tend to dislike those who do things they don't do, or at least aren't currently doing themselves.
Walkers and horse riders dislike cyclists, until they get on a bike themselves, when they then begin to dislike car drivers, until they get in a car of their own, and then they start to disapprove of motorcyclists and lorry drivers. Lorry drivers dislike everyone, and van drivers seem intent on causing actual harm to anyone who crosses their path. Until of course they get on a bike to go home at the end of their shift, when they then feel persecuted, sometimes by other van drivers.
It's astonishingly hierarchical and transiently selective depending entirely on which "club" the individual is currently a "member" of.
Membership is of course fluid and transferable, but that simple little inconvenient fact does rather escape some in the moment when in one of the bubbles.
Scooter riders will indeed be hated by everyone, until of course the hater is on one.
;-)
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Exackly Runfer. This is why I am by default opposed to banning things. Nearly everything is a minority pastime when you think about it, even highly popular ones such as angling.
If banning started with things that do real harm, there'd be no online gambling. Legalised theft. I wouldn't mind that, if it were possible.
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>> Exackly Runfer. This is why I am by default opposed to banning things. Nearly everything
>> is a minority pastime when you think about it, even highly popular ones such as
>> angling.
On the contrary, I think as a general principle, things should be banned.
If in doubt, ban it.
Especially b***** fishing! If ever there was a pastime for people without the brains to be a half-wit, then it is fishing. They must have awful home lives to want to spend their free time holding a rod and staring at a river. Shudder!
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I was thinking of taking up fishing again. Not the obsessive tackle laden sort but just the minimum kit and sitting in a beautiful spot for an afternoon appeals to me a lot. I think I might just buy myself a new rod next week.
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>>I was thinking of taking up fishing again
I can't get into fishing, though #1 daughter loves it.
Sitting on the riverbank / lakeside with a book makes perfect sense to me, just not with a rod.
Whereas Daughter #1 will get up at 4:00am to go fishing. [shudder]
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Ah, you don't know what you're missing guvnor. I've gorn fishing since I was a schoolboy, used to go to Penton Hook in Staines, or Sunbury, Shepperton, Feltham gravel pits, Hampton Court etc. etc.
When we lived in Los Cristianos, I met Irish Tom the millionaire who made his Monet from plant hire, he used to spend 6 months there o'er the winter. We often had a 'session' with him and his wife Mary. He used to start drinking at 5:00pm every night (did I mention he was Irish)
He taught me how to catch sea fish (new to me) he used something akin to a paternoster rig, but with more hooks!
I've been fishing here in Cornwall, but not for about 17 years, although I've still got the rod etc. I bought in Tenerife.
Don't 'spose I'll ever use it again, not with 2 large dogs to take up my time. (poor excuse!)
I wonder if you enjoy a game of golf, Duncan - I prefer to go for a proper walk, but each to his own.
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>> I wonder if you enjoy a game of golf, Duncan - I prefer to go
>> for a proper walk, but each to his own.
Golf? No, I tried it, but not for me.
Played rugby for donkeys years, involved in running a rugby club - treasurer, fixture secretary, team secretary. Still involved. Volunteer at Twickenham Stadium.
A sprinter when I was young, long distance running when I was older.
Then walking
Now cycling.
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I used to play crazy golf quite regularly with about 4 others on Hastings/St Leonards sea front back in the day.
I also used to go to a small putting green with work colleagues back when I worked in Woolwich.
Do you suffer from any injuries through playing rugby, Duncan? I've heard some awful stories over the years of people suffering life-changing injuries while playing rugby.
I know it's a tough game, and you have to be tough to play it, think I'll stick with coarse fishing, knowlmean :)
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>>
>>
>> If banning started with things that do real harm, there'd be no online gambling. Legalised
>> theft. I wouldn't mind that, if it were possible.
>>
>>
A harmless past time for the vast majority of us who like a flutter. Just because a minority can't cope is no reason to ban it. You never see people on forums demanding an alcohol ban despite the enormous problems excessive drinking causes, and neither should you because again the vast majority of people drink sensibly.
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>> A harmless past time for the vast majority of us who like a flutter. Just
>> because a minority can't cope
or as Betfair/Paddy Power, Ladbrokes/Coral, Bet365, William Hill etc call them, "the target market".
The bookies' conduct is appalling.
I don't have a problem with a flutter either, if I am at the races (about a dozen times in 40 years) I'll have a few bets. But the range of events one can bet on now, and the unlikely combinations of outcomes you can bet on, are almost limitless. All from your armchair, and in seconds.
There would be problems banning gambling. It's impossible, for a start. But I'm sure it could be curtailed dramatically. Who would suffer? Denise Coates on her £323m a year, that's who. Much of it at the expense of the families of addicts.
>> should you because again the vast majority of people drink sensibly.
No I wouldn't ban drinking. That really is impossible. But you can't lose your house quite so quickly with drinking, and it's harder to keep secret. It takes much longer to self-destruct for the ones who are so inclined. You actually have to drink the stuff, whereas you can lose thousands in an evening gambling - as people do.
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>>Gambling.
Never been good at it myself. Enjoy the odd visit to a casino with a few £, no more spent than a night out elsewhere.
I have a mate who spends £50 to £100 a week and wins back about £50. He's happy and can easily afford that. He doesn't have a car or mortgage and works full time.
Where I see problems is where the bookies operate like drug suppliers, offering special deals to punters that have spent their last penny to encourage them back to the game or inviting them to special boxes at sporting events etc to make them feel special as long as they are gambling.
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i like a punt on the horses. Going to a race is a great day out. Budget £10 or so a race and expect to lose. You might just come back with more than went with. I never expect to win so if I do its a nice surprise.
Many years ago I used to like going to Greyhound Rading at Walthamsow Stadium. Marvellous seedy atmosphere with lost of dodgy characters carrying big rolls of cash. All gone now I suppose
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>> Many years ago I used to like going to Greyhound Rading at Walthamsow Stadium. Marvellous
>> seedy atmosphere with lost of dodgy characters carrying big rolls of cash. All gone now
>> I suppose
Always enjoyed the dogs, a good evenings entertainment, either trackside laying some bets with the bookies, or in the restaurant with the waitress taking your bets at the tote.
Betting is money you are prepared to lose as part of the evening, anything other than that is a bonus. Ditto trips to Vegas, you go prepared to spend/Lose money for the atmosphere anything else is a bonus.
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I’ve been to Vegas twice. Both times when staying with friends in the USA and a 3 night midweek trip....two full days with travel either side satiates my Vegas hunger. I’ve caught the bus from the top of the Strip down to Mandalay Bay and walked back through all the hotels. never spent a cent on any gambling machines. Not even tempted. People watching and soaking up the atmosphere, especially eating outside at StripBurger under a curtain of ice cold vapour, then a night on Fremont St was enough for me.
Loved the place but in no hurry to return. I’ve also stayed weekends in Reno....dirt cheap accommodation and skied on Mt Rose the nearest snow sports day resort.
It’s a strange ol place the US of A.
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I am a regular punter too, and like yourself I place pocket money bets with no expectation of a return. I've had a few decent amounts when a Yankee has come up, rare enough to make it all the sweeter when it does.
I knew a few people who owned greyhounds back in the seventies and the sport was as bent as a nine bob note with an agreed winner in a lot of races, the other dogs being over fed to make them uncompetitive. I expect they may have cleaned up their act by now, though.
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>> I knew a few people who owned greyhounds back in the seventies and the sport
>> was as bent as a nine bob note with an agreed winner in a lot
>> of races, the other dogs being over fed to make them uncompetitive. I expect they
>> may have cleaned up their act by now, though.
Blimey no chance. I was last at Peterborough dogs about 5 years ago, It quickly became apparent that your money needed to go on certain dogs. Mostly those who had never raced before, so no form, fresh over from Ireland. Ringers all of them.
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Never got the whole gambling thing, doesn't really do anything for me. Spent 20 dollars total in the god knows how many nights I've spent in Vegas, never floated my boat.
Although I did wonder when I saw people, who I worked with betting, on Bulgarian lower leagues as there wasn't any mainstream leagues playing. I think they are the sort of people with whom it could rapidly be a problem.
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I have been to Las Vegas a lot. A real lot.
And I can hang around watching people play for hours and hours, whatever the game I absolutely love it.
But in 30 years of going there I've not been tempted to play myself.
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>> A harmless past time for the vast majority of us who like a flutter. Just
>> because a minority can't cope
I'm not a fan of stopping everybody doing something because some can't cope.
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Is that really true? I don’t think I hate any road user per se . Just the ones that act with a lack of consideration and awareness of others. Cars speeding, cyclists over 16 on the pavement, motorcyclists with modified exhausts making as much noise as possible, skateboarders in the crowded city centre all show a certain contempt for others.
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>> Is that really true? I don’t think I hate any road user per se .
>> Just the ones that act with a lack of consideration and awareness of others. Cars
>> speeding, cyclists over 16 on the pavement, motorcyclists with modified exhausts making as much noise
>> as possible, skateboarders in the crowded city centre all show a certain contempt for others.
>>
>>
Yes, there are many drivers that go out of their way to annoy other road users. I have seen it when sharing a lift with colleagues driving to clients - its very embarrassing and dangerous.
With some it's closing the gap so an overtaking car has nowhere to pull in.
Moving out so a motorcycle can't filter, even had one open a door to stop a moped in stationary traffic.
Deliberately out breaking a cyclist.
Deliberately getting far too close to cyclists to scare them.
There are some fwits about.
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I've got an eScooter. I love it, and use it all the time. Well, when the world isn't falling apart, anyway.
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>>they move a bit faster than I thought
I think mine does about 15mph. Maybe a bit more.
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>>e-Scooters
Brilliant idea for a quick nip to the shops of cafe with friends. If they reduce car usage they can't be a bad thing.
Don't like the tiny hard wheels though. They're asking for trouble on the rough pavements and roads round here.
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>>Don't like the tiny hard wheels though.
They vary. My first, and short-lived, eScooter had small solid rubber wheels. If one hit the tiniest of holes/steps, say 1/2", it stops. Dead. And one face-plants.
My current scooter has much larger, fatter and inflatable tyres.
It also means you get to keep your teeth when you go over cobblestones.
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>> >>they move a bit faster than I thought
>>
>> I think mine does about 15mph. Maybe a bit more.
Fast enough for a blue light trip to A&E then
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Absolutely.
You do need to be paying attention when on unknown routes
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>> >>they move a bit faster than I thought
>>
>> I think mine does about 15mph. Maybe a bit more.
>>
Yes about that I would say, this chap was going at a fair rate of knots. Not sure how many places will cope with them here in the UK. Too many narrow, busy, broken pavements., might work in some place here though.
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Cycle paths seems to be the obvious place for them. And it'll help get cyclists off their entitled, smug pedestal as well.
Chilean cyclists of course, I'm sure that all cyclists in the UK are just cooperative sweetness and light.
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>> Cycle paths seems to be the obvious place for them. And it'll help get cyclists
>> off their entitled, smug pedestal as well.
>>
>> Chilean cyclists of course, I'm sure that all cyclists in the UK are just cooperative
>> sweetness and light.
>>
They could only be allowed there but I can't see, once thet are ok' d, that people will restrict them to there. They'll be used all over, whether allowed or not.
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>>They could only be allowed there but I can't see, once thet are ok' d, that people will restrict them to there. They'll be used all over, whether allowed or not.
Chile doesn't get much about law enforcement right, but they do well at this kind of thing.
To ride a scooter you must wear a helmet, hi-vis, cycle path or road, and have lights.
There's a gazillion wardens who all get a share of any fines that will give you a Fixed Penalty ticket for about £90 should they catch you breaking the rules.
And they don't wear uniforms, though they do have IDs and they can whistle up the police pretty damned fast.
Of course, it doesn't stop the determinedly lawless, they just run and try to escape. But it generally keeps things under control in the nicer areas.
In the less nice areas scooters are no issue anyway; Nobody can afford scooters but they'd be only too willing to steal yours. So the rental companies won't let them cross over (GPS controlled which switches them off if you try) and nobody who owns one would be stupid enough.
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>> >> >>they move a bit faster than I thought
>> >>
>> >> I think mine does about 15mph. Maybe a bit more.
>> >>
The one my son demoed went a lot faster than that.
No way whould I accept a test run on it.
Our road surface looks normal but has a very smooth thick resin surface so the scooter was very very quiet and IMO was a menace to folks.
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>>Our road surface looks normal but has a very smooth thick resin surface so the scooter was very very quiet and IMO was a menace to folks.
? Really? If they're walking in the middle of the road without looking I guess. Perhaps we should adopt the US approach of making jaywalking illegal - problem solved.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Sun 21 Jun 20 at 07:48
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Gosh maybe you guys haven't yet experienced the escooters that are now on the main roads?
Couple of staff at work have escooters but use them on the pavements.. quite fast and when we had a try it was the instant acceleration that caught us out.
But I now see slightly bigger ones mixing it with the traffic, they can easily keep up with cars going 20 to 30, darting between them or draughting close behind to gain a few extra mph, not sure of their stopping power at that speed.
The guys at work are convinced they are now legal due to the fact that they've been stopped by the police but just told to go on their but be a bit more careful!
I think it's going to be the silent high speed that catches other pavement users out in the end.
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Unfortunately there is a sizeable minority who claim they “have” to break laws. “There were no parking spaces so I had to double park“, “ The road was too busy so I had to ride on the pavement “. And so it goes.
Being severely deaf in one ear I can’t hear bikes or scooters coming at me from behind. A blooming menace.
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>>>not sure of their stopping power at that speed.<<<
All to do with the coefficient of friction between skin and tarmac?
Or rider mass vs granite/concrete kerbstones?
A pedestrian can be regarded as an air bag replacement.
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>>not sure of their stopping power at that speed.
Their stopping ability in a 'planned' stop is pretty good. A combination of a disc brake on the back and a hub brake on the front means you can really stop quite fast.
However, in an emergency stop when you just slam on the anchors without thinking it's much less so. Alright if you're trying to avoid slamming into to something, it'll have minimised the impact sufficiently.
But if you're after stopping before you run off a cliff or into the path of a truck, then you're probably SOOL.
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There are two opposing schools....
The Extinction Rebellion group who do not understand that if we want a society without carbon fuel we need to create electric energy by other means which also can harm or at best change the environment; e.g. the Severn barrage. They oppose that as well, but fail to understand how they are going to power their phones to organise their riots without them. They really are turkeys who vote for Christmas.
The traditionalists who do not understand that a simple one person electric transport device (like an e-scooter or Segway) are very efficient, quick and simple and remove another car off the road. Yes one could use a bicycle but they are more cumbersome unless you need to carry something in panniers.
So permit all transport devices as long as they are clean and efficient. Having used a Segway in Dublin, I was amazed at its handling and the feeling that within a few minutes of first use, I felt at one with it and very safe.
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>>Segway..
Almost as prone to sending you ass over tit as a scooter.
Was using an off - road version of the Segway and hit a small root at about 15mph.
The Segway stopped dead. I didn't.
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>>I think mine does about 15mph
The Xiaomi M365 does about 15mph out the box but can be software unlocked (how-to is on youtube et al) to do 22-23mph
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Mine is the M365 Pro which I think is a couple of miles faster, I've watched the Youtube videos and similar about derestricting it.
You can change its top speed, you can also change the speed at which the engine cuts in. There was something else as well, but I forget what.
A couple of things put me off;
Firstly, I don't really want to go any faster. When it's smooth and flat it seems like going faster would be a good move. Then the next time you hit a bump you realise that 16mph or thereabouts is quite fast enough.
Secondly I do enjoy the battery life, and there are warnings that derestricting crucifies the range. Which kind of makes sense.
So I didn't.
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How far do you get on a charge?
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It's 4ish miles to the bar I like, reasonably flat, tarmac. I can get there and back three times without worry. I don't think I could make it 4 times, but perhaps not far off.
So I'd say 28 miles ish, something like that.
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Hmmm 15 miles an hour for 4 miles on the way back from the bar? I know, at some stage, this is going to be an interesting tale.
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That a more than I thought, although it's a fair speed post drinks!
Can you be over the limit in Chile on an e scooter?
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>> That a more than I thought, although it's a fair speed post drinks!
>>
>> Can you be over the limit in Chile on an e scooter?
Dunno, but currently you can get points on your driving license for using one in the UK.
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>> Dunno, but currently you can get points on your driving license for using one in
>> the UK.
If anybody in the UK had a driving license, of course?
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Just read in the Daily Telegraph that Segway have stopped production. Apparently only 140,000 were ever made. One of the issues seems to be high reliability so people don’t need to buy another.
Also scooters are way cheaper.
Last edited by: martin aston on Wed 24 Jun 20 at 06:11
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>> Just read in the Daily Telegraph that Segway have stopped production. Apparently only 140,000 were
>> ever made. One of the issues seems to be high reliability so people don’t need
>> to buy another.
The Guardian provides the real reason, people dont want them, and never really did.
www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/jun/23/segway-transporter-production-ends
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Perhaps the biggest reason why they didnt catch on here was just how silly you look riding one. The same goes for adults on skatebooards or scooters. The English are very conscious of image!
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>> Perhaps the biggest reason why they didnt catch on here was just how silly you
>> look riding one. The same goes for adults on skatebooards or scooters. The English are
>> very conscious of image!
Outside of some police forces, and tourist attractions, they caught on nowhere.
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I guess they look so stupid that even the Americans felt self conscious.
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>> Can you be over the limit in Chile on an e scooter?
Yes, And on a bicycle. But your chances of getting caught are just ridiculously small. As they are in a car.
They love checking the rules; paperwork, helmet, lights, brakes etc. etc.
But behaviour? Not a chance. Not red lights, one way signs, no entry signs, which side of the road, drunk as a skunk etc. etc.
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You’ll feel right at home driving in Bradford then. You haven’t mentioned quad bikes racing up and down in small convoys.
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The more you write about Chile the less I understand it.
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 25 Jun 20 at 02:49
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You should try living in it. It's a basket case.
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Last night I was caught and undertaken by an e-scooter who was doing around 40MPH, it then went through a red traffic light.
I've emailed my chief constable.
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Lots of people "upgrade" their bikes and scooters using readily available kits. On bikes the motor is limited to 250w and speed to ~15mph.
Stick a 1000w motor on and it goes somewhat faster!
In theory if a bike goes faster it then becomes a moped in the eyes of the law and needs insurance, tax, mot, helmet and a licence (or L plates).
In practice I don't expect the police to be remotely bothered unless (a) someone is seriously injured, or (b) it's a very quiet night etc
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>> Last night I was caught and undertaken by an e-scooter who was doing around 40MPH,
Organ donor - it can only be matter of time unfortunately. Effectively no brakes and no protection.
I'm not actually aware of having seen one yet.
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>> Last night I was caught and undertaken by an e-scooter who was doing around 40MPH,
I ride one a lot. 40mph is simply stupid.
>> Effectively no brakes and no protection.
Pretty much. Actually brakes are just fine in the 15mph range. But at 40, there would be nothing.
One also has to keep a lookout for holes and most particularly grooves in the road, both of which have a dramatically bad effect on a scooter. And I'm not sure how one could do that at 40mph.
However, be aware there is another breed of scooter which has much larger, fatter wheels. They're quite a different prospect.
e.g. www.gooscooter.com/en/electric-scooter/19-harley-electric-scooter-1000w-12ah-big-wheel-motorcycle-removable-battery-electric-scooter.html
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Going to get one. just trying to decide which one. There's quite a choice.
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I love e-scooters. They, like garlic bread, are the future.
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I'm sure I heard that the trials started in one of the towns was halted this week due to injuries...
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>>I'm sure I heard that the trials started in one of the towns was halted this week due to injuries..
Whilst there are many ridiculous things here, their reaction to people falling of scooters and killing/injuring themselves is that the solution is not to ride them and therefore nobody's fault but the rider. There is no nanny state.
Legislation, such as it is, is only focussed on stopping scooters hurting anybody else.
But they don't put much effort into that on the roads either.
They do separate scooters and pedestrians though enforcement is sporadic. They have civilian enforcers, a bit like traffic wardens, who can issue on the spot fines with pretty much no comeback if you think it unjust. That tends to keep it all calmed down.
Last edited by: No FM2R on Thu 17 Sep 20 at 16:44
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>> Legislation, such as it is, is only focussed on stopping scooters hurting anybody else.
My kind of legislation. The risks you take with your own body are your business as long as you don't endanger anyone else.
It all started going down the pan when they made helmets on motorcycles compulsory.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 18 Sep 20 at 02:30
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>> I'm sure I heard that the trials started in one of the towns was halted
>> this week due to injuries...
Local reports say Coventry. Testing in Northampton goes on but I've yet to try one.
Or even see one.
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>> However, be aware there is another breed of scooter which has much larger, fatter wheels.
>> They're quite a different prospect.
No, this was a typical small wheeled, stand up job. I was amazed it could go at that speed and to undertake me showed the intelligence of the rider.
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Has the Chief Constable replied?
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>>Has the Chief Constable replied?
Unlikely - too busy chasing up Snitchi Patel's neighbours, and working out of Chris Failing's £100k/yr for 7 hours/wk for a port is criminal.
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>> Has the Chief Constable replied?
Nah, not even deigned to acknowledge. Think I'll forward it to my MP, unless anyone can suggest another way to concentrate their mind?
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You could try the Police and Crime Commissioner (the relevant elected politician).
Mention the 'racing' vans on the A421 while you're at it. They are limited to 60 but I keep having to get out of their way at an indicated 75 when I'm trying to do the crossword.
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Yeah, I don't like my car being shoogled by passing white vans while I'm try to dunk a custard cream... ;-)
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Exactly, you can't start the crossword without a cup of char and a biscuit.
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>>Mention the 'racing' vans
I experienced some of them on the A11 t'other day, didn't know they went so fast. I don't know if it was speed or open doors that caused one to shed its load on a roundabout. The driver decided to stop and completely block the dual carriageway while he picked up everything. One HGV decided 'sod this' and was picking stuff up to throw onto the verge to clear a path
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E10 petrol and e-scooters - Crankcase
