Things have changed from dialling local tyre places found in the yellow pages. I tried one of these online places and they came up trumps, although I still rang a few local fitters who couldn't match the prices offered online, including the place I went to.
They still seem to be staffed by the ignorant. I was told today that remoulds are illegal!
They couldn't understand why I wanted the Uniroyal rainmasters I'd ordered, as they could provide better tyres for much less! The racks appeared to be full of what I presume were Chinese ditchfinders, as I didn't recognise any names.
I'll find out in the next few days if they were competent at balancing.
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>>I'll find out in the next few days if they were competent at balancing.
That's why some years ago I gave up shopping around for tyres and just use a good local place that can balance wheels properly. They are a bit more expensive but they do it right first time. There are about three tyre places local to me I stopped using because they couldn't balance wheels.
Years ago I used a place that could balance the wheels on the car but that's a bit excessive for most situations.
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>> I'll find out in the next few days if they were competent at balancing.
Hopefully they've put the painted coloured dot in the correct place so as to use minimal weights?
Some places are unware of what the dots are for. Surely that should be part of their basic training.
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>> Hopefully they've put the painted coloured dot in the correct place so as to use
>> minimal weights?
>>
>> Some places are unware of what the dots are for. Surely that should be part
>> of their basic training.
Tell me, pray, what are these coloured dots, of which you speak?
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For years now I've put Michelins on, whatever I drive. They seem to last a very long time, and they are quiet. I get about 25 to 35k from a set as a rule.
Over the last few times I've shopped around, so over a good few years, and suppliers have been able to come within a whisker of each other on price, at about £100 ish each tyre. All were always prepared to negotiate a bit.
This time (two weeks ago) I had enormous trouble getting anyone to shift on their initial advertised price at all. And the price had shot up, ranging from £575 to £675 (for four, fully fitted). That includes everything from online mobile tyre fitters, a couple of indies, Blackcircles and their ilk, through to the Ford main dealer.
Eventually I went with ATS, who had a "special discount" if you bought four x Michelin Primacy 4, bringing their price to a more pleasing, and as I had expected, £420 all fitted. They balanced them fine.
However, I was told by a couple of other places that the reason ATS were so much cheaper for Michelins is that "Michelin own ATS now sir" (or perhaps it was the other way round, I forget). Anyway, ATS it had to be, as without their deal they've turned into really expensive tyres now.
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..Michelin have been ATS Euromasters parent company for a long time (ISTR it may have been from Day1)..........
.......but interestingly, in light of your experience, they also own Blackcircles.........
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>> ..Michelin have been ATS Euromasters parent company for a long time (ISTR it may have
>> been from Day1)..........
Indeed, created by Michelin as contract service provider for large commercials, they expanded into the LGV and then consumer markets.
>> .......but interestingly, in light of your experience, they also own Blackcircles.........
Didnt know that.
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>> Tell me, pray, what are these coloured dots, of which you speak?
>>
Sometimes tyres come with a yellow dot on the sidewall to indicate the "light" spot in balance terms. The idea is that if it is aligned with the valve stem, the total mass of balance weights required is reduced.
I've bought six tyres in the last few months (4 Michelin and 2 Falken), and none have dots at all.
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>> Some places are unware of what the dots are for. Surely that should be part
>> of their basic training.
>>
The Costco guys all have their Michelin training certificates on the wall but they seemed baffled by the dots and also told me the coloured bands don't mean anything either.
Their rigid policy of best tyres on the back annoys me too. I know it's a basic safety thing, but it's not always appropriate and they don't have the leeway or common sense to adapt. I wonder how many of their customers have injured themselves swapping them around when they get home!
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I have generally found that local tyre fitters tend to source their staff from the Neanderthal community who have little or no respect for your car or its expensive alloys.
I once had a basic algnement check done on a Satirday morning and the clown fell asleep under the car no doubt due to excesses the previous Friday night. He then went on to leave the gaiters peeled back.
Buying tyres on line from the main players in the first instance looks like a good bet. Tyres delivered cheaply to your fitter of choice and then you tip up and have them fitted. All good. But the fitting station are on a reduced margin as they are making nothing on the tyre itself. Its my belief that this reflects in your customer experience with them. The other issue can be that if there is a manufacturing defect with the tyre it is not the fitters responsibility but the suppliers which starts a load of pain in an attempt to resolve.
I wrote this on another site I visit (KIA Sportage site) during a discussion about tyre choice:
I have run Barum, Hankooks, Kumho and recently Nexen tyres for a number of years now on Kias. I have not noticed any issues with any of the brands. Mostly commuting with the occasional motorway journey.
The Barums were replacements on the first generation Ceed SW which had factory fit Michelin Primacy 3s on. Vastly over tyred for the type and performance of the vehicle. Style over substance and a top end tyre to boot (excuse the pun).
Days of aggressive cornering and braking long gone and I can get my adrenaline rush on a motorbike. I've been an Advanced emergency services driver and also done some rally driving in the 80s and 90's. So I have some experience exploring tyre limits.
I'm looking for value for money and safety out of my tyres. Looking at a cross section of 245 45 19s I can pay anything from just over £50 for unknown brands to over £200 for a 'premium' brand. Even £257.90 for a Nokian Hakka Black 2. All before fitting.
Now is the most expensive really 5 times better than the cheapest????? Yes you get what you pay for but not 5 times more.
A few years ago Hankooks and Kumho were in the cheap 'ditch finder' category (as reviewed by Gary your expert chav boy racer) but no real evidence to corroborate the accolade. They are now factory fit on a number of models. The prices have marginally increased with their acceptance in the 'premium brand' category. Nexen have also joined this list.
We should now be looking at their replacements in the market that offer performance and value for money. Nankang? Maxxis? Brands that have been around a while which would suggest credibility in the market and amongst customers. I do feel a sense of sidewall badge snobbery amongst some tyre customers.
My Sportage AWD is comming up 17K and is not far off a replacement set.
I will not be fitting a set of Bridgestone Weather Control A005 245/45 R19 102 V XL all weather tyres at nearly a £1000 fitted
Nope. I'm going to dip into the mid range Nexen, Nankang and Maxxis brands and hopefully be fully sorted for less than half the above.
A good recommendation has als been made regarding Farroad tyres and Id never heard of them.
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>> Tell me, pray, what are these coloured dots, of which you speak?
www.oponeo.co.uk/tyre-article/tyre-stripes
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>> >> Tell me, pray, what are these coloured dots, of which you speak?
>>
>> www.oponeo.co.uk/tyre-article/tyre-stripes
>>
They are stripes, not dots. The text refers to 'red dots' on Bridgestone tyres, but no pics.
So, can anyone give me chapter and verse, with photos of these fabled dots?
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>>They are stripes, not dots. The text refers to 'red dots'
If you scroll down a little way to: What is the meaning of dots marked on tyres?
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So the dots are basically meaningless as far as the consumer is concerned and VXfan’s comment on the ignorance of tyre fitters is unfounded.
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If a tyre fitter has to use a lot of weights to balance the wheel, then either the tyre is faulty, wheel buckled, or he hasn't paid attention to the coloured dot and just thrown the tyre on the wheel willy nilly.
From consumers point of view, the wheel may well be balanced and the consumer doesn't get any vibration. However, having all those extra weights fitted does pose the risk of one or more possibly falling off at some point in the future (or blown off by using a jet wash), and you then get a vibration. Some may ignore it, others will return to a tyre garage for rebalancing, at the consumers expense.
However, if only a minimal amount of weights were fitted because the tyre was fitted correctly, the consumer may not even notice if a weight falls off, or the vibration will be less noticeable.
Now I'm not 100% sure of this next bit, but I'm sure I read somewhere having unnecessary weights fitted can result in heavier steering. Probably less noticeable with cars that have PAS.
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I'm sure that is all true but you originally.said "Some places are unware of what the dots are for. Surely that should be part of their basic training." but it would seem that the dots that some manufacturers use are basically for their own purposes and vary in use from company to company and therefore are irrelevant to a Tyre fitter.
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You're just nit picking. Something some of the members of this forum are renowned for (including me ;) ). Why bother putting the dots on at all if only for in-house purposes? Might as well just put a peelable sticker on instead.
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I noticed when browsing in a Honda showroom, all of the new cars had their tyres' red dots perfectly aligned with the valves.
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OK so what do they mean then? You seem to be an expert.
Last edited by: CGNorwich on Fri 8 Mar 19 at 15:55
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Why is anyone outside the tyre trade in the least bit bothered by dots on the tyre.
I buy a tyre, its gets fitted, it gets balanced, if its not right they do it again till they get it right.
Funnily enough, I was forced into a urgent distress tyre purchase yesterday afternoon. Mrs Zee is off for the weekend, I checks tyre pressures for her longish journey, and get to front nearside to be faced with a bulge and a cut, she has kerbed it, with a 200 mile motorway run to do over the weekend
So I leaps into the fester, runs it down to my local National Tyres, explain need this done urgently, please pretty please nice man, buy two mid price Avons for the front (135 quid total for the two) back home 90 minutes later with perfectly fitted and balanced tyres.
Its not complicated folks.
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>> Why is anyone outside the tyre trade in the least bit bothered by dots on
>> the tyre.
Because this is a geeky car forum :-)
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Pretty much how I buy most services. Not really concerned with the esoteric details. Just want the job done properly. Some people like to over complicate their lives.
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>> Why is anyone outside the tyre trade in the least bit bothered by dots on
>> the tyre.
>>
I asked a tyre fitter this. He said it doesn't matter because the balancer takes care of it. That he might be sticking on weights un-neccessarily seemed lost on him.
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Whilst this is a bit of a moving target it is worth knowing 'who owns who.'
Whilst company ownership may not guarantee quality of the minor brands, it can be an indicator. What reputable manufacturer would wish to dilute their brand image by the release of a ditchfinder which features in an adverse press review.
The following link, whilst not exhaustive, comes from a reputable source and claims to be updated regularly.
www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/who-owns-what-tyre-brands.htm
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Missed the edit!
A longer list, but not necessarily from as good a source :)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tire_companies
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I had to replace the 335's beginning of the year. BMW were competitive with other dealers - the premium I paid meant I got them star marked(BMW approved) - read somewhere that BMW back away from warranty claims on the X Drive system if you fit non "approved" ones. I think I could have got them for around a tenner a corner cheaper if I'd have gone none OE with a driveway fitter. Mine have white paint dots on them !
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I bought a pair of "Torque" tyres a fortnight ago on Ebay, dated 2017, no dots or other marks on them.
since I've had the car I've put 2 pairs on the front, both sets averaged about 15000 miles, not too good really, the backs were 12 months old when I got the car and still have about 4mm tread left!
These "Torque" tyres are the quietest I think I've had, now to see how they last! but at the moment I will definitely get them again, good thing is they only cost £70 for the pair!
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Our new Dacia has Kumho tyres. They all have an orange dot.
No idea what it signifies, as there is no apparent relationship to the tyre's valve.
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When I got the Zoe new, I assumed in my two years PCP I wouldn't need new tyres. Crikey, the darn things were looking bad at 10k. It went back with 15k on it, and it was really touch and go whether the nice man was going to complain at inspection. Luckily, he didn't.
He did complain about some other tiny thing that was known to be a warranty fault, and they tried to charge me £200 for it.
I argued telephonically with the finance people and they changed it to £80 and said they would reinvoice for that amount.
Reader, they never did.
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>>I bought a pair of "Torque" tyres
Never heard of them. I see they're Chinese with a rolling resistance of 'E'. Not the best for fuel economy, but reasonable for wet grip and noise. My they're cheap!
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When I worked with KIA Hyundai as a contractor until a year ago. I noticed these coloured dots on the tyre sidewalls. Mostly Korean tyres such as Hankook, NEXEN, Kumho but also some European brands. None of them were aligned with the valve, unless it was a coincidence. It always grated me that a carmaker didn't know what these were for, but having read this thread and the links, maybe it really is just an internet myth?
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On reading the Ebay listing I too wasn't over-impressed with the "E" rating either, but after looking at a few reviews from actual users I decided that for £70 a pair I han't too much to lose by giving them a try, so far I have no regrets! (but time will tell).
www.tirestest.com/web/pages/summer-tires/torque/tq021
seem ok going by this site!
Last edited by: devonite on Mon 11 Mar 19 at 13:11
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Im not sure one review is of much use. They seem to be pretty rare.
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>> Im not sure one review is of much use. They seem to be pretty rare.
Particularly when the review refers to "Breaking properties".
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Well hopefully I'll have more than 15000mls to find out! - I like mi steaks rare, but mi(stakes) even rarer!
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Tyre buying - The Melting Snowman
