Well, the new Merc has 2,000 miles under the bonnet, and I have a surprising issue.
Getting comfortable.
It's crazy really. Plush and seemingly supportive seats which for short runs are fine, but go much over 150 miles and I am squirming a bit, making constant small adjustments to alleviate the pains in the back of my thighs and legs.
The seats are fully electric with infinite adjustment of everything each way, but the problem I have is that I start to make the adjustments when the discomfort starts, and by that point, it the discomfort won't get cancelled out, so I have to trust that any changes I make will make the next long drive better, but after the next long drive I am in the same situation.
I guess after three years of this I will finally have optimised it 100% - just as I hand the car back :(
Now I remember reading an article somewhere (Telegraph?) about starting off in getting a seating position 'just right', and to make it a good starting point that makes it most likely for the body to be in a good anatomical position for a long drive.
I know not to have the seat back too vertical, but what basic starting point would the forum advise (amount of knee bend, etc), or am I just being stupid here, and am the only person that has had this???
The S60 I had took me about 40,000 miles until I got things perfect comfort-wise, and the 5 series I had took less, and both after this time were perfect and I could drive from the UK to Zurich or Munich in one hit and get out without any pain at all, but I am just wondering if there is a short-cut methods to at least get my body positioned correctly to reduce the risk of this , and then make any small tweaks in time.
All constructive (and / or amusing) thoughts / comments welcome!
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I too am incredibly fussy about the minutest details of seat adjustment. The best thing on that front with my current car are the memory seats. On previous models it could take a week to get it all back as I like it after someone else had driven it.
I suppose everyone sits differently, but as a rule of thumb, I adjust the height so that my eyes are in line with the middle of the windscreen, I have the rake so that my outstretched arms are still comfortable and have a tiny bit more reach when gripping the top of the wheel, and have the squab as near to level as I can, neither tipping backwards or forwards.
I drove my E from Milan to Cheshire via the tunnel a couple of months ago in one day, on my own and without any discomfort at all. In fact I felt like I could have gone further. Left Milan about 07.00 and parked on my drive before midnight having punctuated the journey with suitable meal/rest breaks of course.
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The most comfortable car I ever had for long journeys was an Austin Maxi. You sat on the seat squab, not in it and there was absolutely no side support from the squab or the backrest. I can't explain it, it just was.
I've learnt to sit upright to avoid backache, but that can often be uncomfortable with modern cars due to the position of the head restraint pushing the head forward. I also need a little thigh support.
I've found that what may feel comfortable - like an old armchair - is often not the best driving position.
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Cant say I ever bother over much about the seat position. A quick adjustment is all it takes if someone ese has been driving ( why do garage mechanics seem to have such long legs) . I usually dont drive for more than two hours without getting out of the car for a quick break and stretching my legs which I guess is more important than minute adjustments of the seat. I rather think the more you think about these things the more they concern you.
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>> Cant say I ever bother over much about the seat position. A quick adjustment is
>> all it takes if someone ese has been driving ( why do garage mechanics seem
>> to have such long legs) .
I've always found the seat to be much too close to the steering wheel after a service!
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>> I've always found the seat to be much too close to the steering wheel after a service!
+1
And raised too high, and mirror angled right down.
Your garage must also employ short grease monkeys.
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 5 Sep 19 at 10:43
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>> why do garage mechanics seem
>> to have such long legs
>>
Never mind about that.
Why do they always put on the foot operated parking brake?
The thing is in park, it aint going anywhere!
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> Never mind about that.
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>> Why do they always put on the foot operated parking brake?
>>
>> The thing is in park, it aint going anywhere!
>>
Belt and braces I would imagine.
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Dont you have an electronic parking brake which is applied and released automatically?
How quaint :-)
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>> Why do they always put on the foot operated parking brake?
And people complained the electronic parking brake was a solution looking for a problem. We all of course know it was to replace the agricultural MB foot operated parking brake, a throwback to the time when Stuttgart taxi drivers used to drive a horse and cart.
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>> Why do they always put on the foot operated parking brake?
>>
>> The thing is in park, it aint going anywhere!
Yes, but it puts unnecessary strain on the parking pawl in the autobox just relying on that to stop your tin box from rolling off all by itself.
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>> Yes, but it puts unnecessary strain on the parking pawl in the autobox just relying
>> on that to stop your tin box from rolling off all by itself.
Isn't that what it's designed to do, or are you saying it's not fit for purpose?
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>> Isn't that what it's designed to do, or are you saying it's not fit for purpose?
The latter. Whilst generally fine if parked on level ground, but puts a lot of strain on it parking on steep hills.
The handbrake is supposed to be the main holding device, with the transmission being the backup plan.
www.yourmechanic.com/article/why-you-should-always-set-the-parking-brake
A parking pawl is a metal pin that engages into a notch ring that is attached to the transmission's output shaft. When engaged, the pawl restricts the transmission's output shaft from turning.
Unfortunately, parking pawls can break or possibly become dislodged. While this is not a common occurrence it can happen, and if it does your car may end up rolling down the street.
A parking brake on the other hand will hold the vehicle in place even if the parking pawl breaks or dislodges.
See also en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parking_pawl
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The Beemer goes into park (physically flips the gear lever over if its in sport) and puts on the handbrake when you stop the start button.
Just discovered it also has an uncannily good way of making you put the seat belt on, it disables the seat heater till you clunk click.
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The V90 would have driven you mad, it won't let you drive at all without the seat belt ob.
Think Eurotunnel moving up in a queue to board, in a car park when you've just stopped short to get something out of the boot, before reversing up to a wall.
Pat
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The Beemer wont let you pull away with a door open, forget any attempt to crack open the door to check the kerb while reversing.
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>> forget any attempt to crack open the door to check the kerb while reversing.
Good call BMW. Extraordinarily dangerous habit IMO.
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> Good call BMW. Extraordinarily dangerous habit IMO.
>>
Why's that? Slow walking pace have a quick look. I'm not sure I'd call it 'extraordinarily dangerous'?
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>> Why's that? Slow walking pace have a quick look. I'm not sure I'd call it
>> 'extraordinarily dangerous'?
Likewise. I occasionally park against some horribly unforgiving kerbstones, so
being able to use this method for a distance of just a few feet at less than slow walking pace, is useful.
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>> Likewise. I occasionally park against some horribly unforgiving kerbstones, so being able to use this method for a distance of just a few feet at less than slow walking pace, is useful.
My car puts itself into "P" if you open the door, but if you keep the door open and re-select "R" or "D" it'll let you, albeit with a rather po faced safety message on the dash while you do it.
I suppose it presumes that if you've chosen a Merc you're probably reasonably intelligent, whereas with a BMW, the only sensible assumption is, well, a bit different eh?
;-))
Last edited by: Runfer D'Hills on Tue 27 Nov 18 at 16:01
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I'll not hear a bad word about Z...
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>> I suppose it presumes that if you've chosen a Merc you're probably reasonably intelligent, whereas
>> with a BMW, the only sensible assumption is, well, a bit different eh?
Well I guess Mercedes know that their drivers have a habit of kerbing alloys, so they probably need to crank the door open, a lot.
Last edited by: Zero on Tue 27 Nov 18 at 16:15
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>> Good call BMW. Extraordinarily dangerous habit IMO.
Brian Harvey would agree with you.
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/4597607.stm
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Pat,
Surely that can be altered for people who are seatbelt exempt for medical reasons? Pacemaker wearers, etc. I suspect it would have to be done via a dealer though.
I can remember the Ford Transit connect we had at work. We had to do a lot of short start stop journeys on a private site. It wasn't practical to keep putting on and taking off the seat belts, and the seat belt reminder alarm drove us up the wall. A quick google found there was a DIY solution.
Alternately, just buy these www.ebay.co.uk/i/172979062920
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 23 Nov 18 at 11:05
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I suspect it can be altered somewhere in the menu, but we're used to it now so it doesn't bother us unduly.
Pat
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>> It's crazy really. Plush and seemingly supportive seats which for short runs are fine, but
>> go much over 150 miles and I am squirming a bit, making constant small adjustments
>> to alleviate the pains in the back of my thighs and legs.
Hate to tell you but I've had my Merc for 14 years and it's the same , but perhaps earlier - anything more than 90 mins in seat. Indeed I had one for a few days on extended test drive and that was the same but I've never been uncomfortable in a car before so I dismissed it. If I fold a small towel into a pad and put it at the base of my back it's better.
As for setting it up. we were given this guide at work some years ago: drivingergonomics.lboro.ac.uk/downloads/initial%20driving%20position%20and%20posture%20guide.pdf
I do recall being told that the correct position might feel awkward at first, but to persist with it.
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Drivers seat in my car has an electric lumbar support adjustment. Takes me forever to get it just right if it's been touched.
Annoying when it goes in for servicing and some grease monkey presses the buttons thinking it's for all the other adjustments.
I've subsequently found a small black cap that fits over it perfectly and doesn't look out of place. A small amount of evostick impact adhesive holds it in place and stops others from meddling with it.
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I've got lumbar support on mine but I'm never quite sure what to do with it. I've adjustable all the way one way and all the way the other back and in the middle, none seemed to make a difference to anything.
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Try using one of the accessory backrests on the market. I have one I got for £1 from a charity shop but our current i10 doesn't need it and I use it for my computer chair instead. Another device is a typist's wedge-shaped seat cushion with a spinal cutout, which pushes the body to a more upright stance. Some more hints here from Amazon:
www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&keywords=car+seat+back+supports
edited to provide a shorter link
Last edited by: VxFan on Thu 22 Nov 18 at 11:18
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Thanks for the link BP. That was exactly what I was looking for, and I will have a play.
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>>>>>>As for setting it up. we were given this guide at work some years ago: drivingergonomics.lboro.ac.uk/downloads/initial%20driving%20position%20and%20posture%20guide.pdf
Thanks for this Bill Payer. Just what I was looking for.
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Now if you'd had that Skoda Superb that wasn't on your shortlist, SFD, you wouldn't have had to start this thread....
But I'm glad you did because of that excellent link - many thanks Bill P. Starting with it all wrong and step-by-step making yourself more comfortable makes a lot of sense.
But ultimately we're all different, and one person's comfy chair is another's bed of nails. Runfer probably does more miles a year than most of us (with the possible exception of Pat) and he's supremely comfy in his Mercedes - so the chances are that you'll get there in the end.
For me, all seven VAG cars that I've had (2 VWs, 3 Skodas and 2 Audis) have never given me a single twinge or ache over highish mileages. The recent Volvo V60 was OK - mostly comfortable but never quite enough lumbar support, so not the superlative seating experience that I was led to believe about Volvos.
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Fair point. I would have needed a 150+ mile test drive to have learnt this though, and as you say, we would have missed out on Bill P's excellent response.
Consider my car purchase 'error' to be a public service for the greater good :) :)
Yes, I thought Volvo seats were legendarily good, and to an extent they can be, but again only when you get them 'just right' Once I had this on my old S60 I could do epic miles without discomfort.
The V70 was OK, but an old car design when I got mine.
Can't speak for big miles in the more modern ones, but I guess that people like Pat could comment further.
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I've had a couple of Volvos. Long time ago though. The first was a 940 estate and the second an 850. Never could quite get comfortable in either of them, despite rumours to the contrary.
Without question the most comfortable cars I've ever had were the Mondeos. The Mercs have been fine for me too but the Fords were outstandingly good.
I'm about as average sized as it gets at 6' tall and 13st so I must be one of those Mondeo men Tony Blair referred to !
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The V90 is comfortable on long journeys and it has so many adjustments it would be hard not to get it right eventually.
However, I agree with sfd, the V70 was always comfy and didn't need that fine-tuning of the seat to get there.
It also had that lovely bark of the 5 pots when on a mission and I really miss that car....it will always have a little piece of my heart:)
Pat
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Every old Volvo I have driven , including my XC70 was average at best.
The BMW is generally superb, (and having shelled out 1700 quid extra for comfort seats it ruddy well should be). Every conceivable part of the seat is adjustable, means a comfortable position is quickly achievable, to be stored in seat memory and driver key. I have two positions set, one urban and one for galumphing along the motorway. The biggest bonus tho is the electric steering column adjustment. Quick to change with a huge range of movement in and out and up and down, I often tweak that when driving long distances.
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All hail the inventor of memory seats !
The driver's seat in my car can be adjusted to sort of hug you with its side bolster thingies. Sometimes I do that for no reason at all, just because I can.
Yes I know that's a bit sad, but it's something to do if there's nothing on the radio.
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>> All hail the inventor of memory seats !
>>
>> The driver's seat in my car can be adjusted to sort of hug you with
>> its side bolster thingies. Sometimes I do that for no reason at all, just because
>> I can.
>>
>> Yes I know that's a bit sad, but it's something to do if there's nothing
>> on the radio.
When you select sports Plus mode on the Beemer, the seat bolsters extend out and grab you and the seat belts tighten a notch, its a kind of OH SHEET gesture I think.
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Most comfortable I've ever has was probably my Pug 104ZS (82-86) but I was young and flexible then. Both BX's were pretty good but for some reason the second slightly less so than first. Xantia was a PITA as squab too short; lack of thigh support.
Both Berlingos are fine as is Skoda though my left thigh can develop a dull ache on very long trips. That's side I broke my hip on but cannot remember if I suffered before.
In spite of being quite different size/build Mrs B and I can both drive either car without moving the seat but she does faff with the mirrors.
Daughter quite often gets hire cars from work one of which was an Astra. She's got her Mum's legs (short) and squab was far too long. Needed a cushion behind her - she might have missed an adjustment though.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 27 Nov 18 at 16:07
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I can live with someone changing the position of the seats or mirrors I suppose, safety and all that, but I really don't like it if they move my air vents. I get unreasonably angry about that, although I'd never let it show... ;-)
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I get annoyed when I get in and find it on Radio 4 instead of Planet Rock.
I have yet to master the voice control, it doesn't understand swearing.
Pat
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>> I get annoyed when I get in and find it on Radio 4 instead of
>> Planet Rock.
I have the opposite frustration. Less so since my son left home.
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Planet Rock? Exactly where on the wireless dial do I find it. Is it somewhere between the Home Service and Hilversum?
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Is it somewhere between the Home Service and Hilversum?
All you'll get there is Planet Rockall
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Highly embarrassed is I. Found a station on DAB yesterday while scanning in the car, "The Wireless",, Seemed to be playing my kind of music.
Just found out its the Age Uk station!!!!!!!!!!
However, in my defence, I just tuned in and they are playing Thats Entertainment" by The Jam
Phew!
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>> Just found out its the Age Uk station!!!!!!!!!!
You're over 60 - well in their population segment........
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>> Is it somewhere between the Home Service and Hilversum?
>>
>>
>> All you'll get there is Planet Rockall
www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBIDOzB8AEs
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Went to see a recording of I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue last night Bromp. Two recordings back to back at Llandudno. Great night out ( 7 quid for a ticket)/
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Yes, I get quite cross ( with myself ) if I've left it on Radio 2 the day before and get in the car in a morning only to hear Vannessa blinking Feltz on there instead of Radio 4.
Favourite is the last bit of the World Service before R4 kicks in. Sometimes some really interesting stuff you'd not hear about otherwise.
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>> I have yet to master the voice control, it doesn't understand swearing.
Mine does what its told. Alexa on the other hand got a good kicking the other day.
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Getting comfy - Runfer D'Hills
