Someone wants more restrictions
www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-45627115
"We do not blame Skye whatsoever for what happened," says Aidan.
"There was nothing she could have done I believe on that night. It was all down to inexperience."
Last edited by: Duncan on Thu 27 Sep 18 at 11:02
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They seem to be saying;
She didn't have the sense to be careful with her inexperience and not to drive like that
He friends didn't have the sense not to do it with her
Various parents didn't have the sense to tell caution and advise her not to do it
And it's the law's fault for failing to force her not to do it.
In a nutshell, today's society.
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>> In a nutshell, today's society.
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No chance of anyone being responsible for their actions then.
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>> No chance of anyone being responsible for their actions then.
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Certainly not !
Its the Trump effect, blame everyone.
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Most of us here being interested and car savvy understand that wet surfaces lack grip and that spilled fuel, mud or cow poo, as well as perturbations in the surface can throw you off line or worse. Judging my number of people I see driving absurdly fast on roads with standing water or even slush the concept of grip v Newtonian Physics is not well understood.
I wonder if Skye's instruction covered this?
Graduated licences are not answer though.
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>>Most of us here being interested and car savvy understand...…
True.
But not understanding is not a justification for doing it without a care. If nothing else one is aware that this activity is new to you. As someone said years ago, would she have been more careful if there had been a sharp spike sticking out of the middle of the steering wheel? Obviously yes. The interesting point is why that would be.
I know little about explosives, I probably still wouldn't run carrying them.
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It might take experience to know just what the margins are, but just thinking should be enough to understand that conditions affect safety, that tailgating is a bad idea, et cetera.
It's probably more about risk management than skill. Appropriate testing and training would achieve more than just making people gain experience by driving alone for a while. In any case, experience seems to give some people more confidence, not competence - especially in the early years. My observation of some young drivers is that as they gain experience, they drive faster.
Just this morning there was a screech of skidding tyre and a bang outside. All I could see from the front door was a trainer (footwear) in the middle of the road, so I rushed out expecting the worst.
The young motorcyclist was lying in the road with his bike, on which he had just rear-ended an SUV. Fortunately he wasn't seriously injured and eventually picked himself up. His account of the cause of the collision was that one of my neighbours had signalled and braked late to turn into her driveway, causing the SUV driver behind her to brake suddenly and him (the motorcyclist) to run into the SUV. In other words, he did at that point not see his own driving as a problem. That probably isn't unusual. I hope his experience will make him follow more cautiously when he reflects later - probably unfair to judge in the immediate aftermath.
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>> causing the SUV driver behind her to
>> brake suddenly and him (the motorcyclist) to run into the SUV. In other words, he
>> did at that point not see his own driving as a problem. That probably isn't
>> unusual. I hope his experience will make him follow more cautiously when he reflects later
>> - probably unfair to judge in the immediate aftermath.
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Did you point out to him the error of his ways?
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>> Did you point out to him the error of his ways?
No. I hope he'll work it out and he'll be far more likely to take it on board that way than from some boring old twit.
I helped him get the bike off the road and put the left over bits in my dustbin.
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>>The young motorcyclist was lying in the road with his bike, on which he had just rear-ended an SUV. Fortunately he wasn't seriously injured and eventually picked himself up. His account of the cause of the collision was that one of my neighbours had signalled and braked late to turn into her driveway, causing the SUV driver behind her to brake suddenly and him (the motorcyclist) to run into the SUV. In other words, he did at that point not see his own driving as a problem.
Decades ago, I was driving a works JU250 van, it was peeing down, in a line of traffic that all suddenly slowed. When I braked I heard a loud clang at the back and turning my head saw a helmeted head in one the back windows that sunk below sight. A scooter rider had ridden into the back of me, his scooter was then driven over by a truck coming the other way.
He blamed me for 'stopping too quickly'. I put him in the back of the van (in the dry, he didn't appear to be injured)) and someone called the BIBs from a nearby 'phone box as he insisted.
The BIB that turned up asked the scooter rider what happened. the scooterist replied he'd been following about six foot behind me, 'to keep dry'. The BIB then asked if he'd been followed by a big lorry, would he expect it to run into him if he braked!
The scooterists insurance had to pay for the damage to the van I was driving and the truck that ran over his scooter. I never heard any more about the sodden, wet rider I left at the side of the road after I drove away.
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I would agree that graduated licences are not THE answer but I think they would help.
Re inexperience.
I had thirteen hours of driving lessons, absolutely no other driving, no other driver in the family to advise me and passed my test in an urban area.
12 months later having done no more driving I was able to hire a car and drive off ( well sort of)
A real baptism for me. The driving school car was a HA Viva and I hired a Victor 101 estate.
I collected it from T2 at LHR and tried to stay cool when shown a column change.
Fast forward and I did a deal with my children re driving lessons. Concentrate on your A level examines and then I will spend unlimited funds on you both getting through the test.
Then I bought a knackered Fiat UNO so little chance of them breaking almost any speed limits.
At the first snow fall it was off to a very large and deserted car park to experience braking etc in snow.
How things have changed.
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Many of us on here are probably of an age where we first drove in cars with a lot more feel than the modern computer programmed white goods that pass for your average motor today. Driving on wet cobbles with crossply tyres in a rear engined Renault soon taught me how easy it was to slide without warning.
Jump forward thirty odd years and our (then) 18 year old son was desperate to take his car out the first night it snowed. I persuaded him not to but he went out next day in daylight. He went down a country road and stopped because a van was coming the other way. It was going too fast and skidded into him. Luckily noone was injured but his car was a write off. The other party paid up but it was a lesson thats stuck with him and ten years later he's still very cautious in poor conditions.
His lesson was a cheap one and its a heart-breaking that others are not so lucky.
Last edited by: martin aston on Thu 27 Sep 18 at 18:13
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When I first started driving it was a case of " he was an idiot and it killed him"
I don't see why evolution should be messed around with
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Had a friend at school that shortly after passing their test lost control of a car with friends and there were fatalities. He just avoided prison. One of the passengers was decapitated.
If your parents are wealthy then the car you can borrow tends to be a bit too powerful for a newly qualified driver.
Last edited by: rtj70 on Thu 27 Sep 18 at 18:51
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"...lost control of a car with friends and there were fatalities. One of the passengers was decapitated."
Shocking. I imagine heads rolled.
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I gave you a red raspberry for that.
Not because I am offended, it was quite funny, but because I always like to be first in the queue
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>> At the first snow fall it was off to a very large and deserted car
>> park to experience braking etc in snow.
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Empty car parks are invaluable for getting that kind of experience.
I always try to say to myself:
On a wet road anything more than half your normal speed is courting danger, especially on a bend. If you must chance it, then you need to be ultra alert.
On a wet road double your stopping distance.
On a snowy road stopping distance X 10.
On ice there is probably no stopping distance.
Whatever speed you think is safe to take a sharp corner, imagine there is someone approaching doing the same speed. Would you want to hit a stationary object at that combined speed?
Now imagine there is someone approaching going faster than you. Doesn't that thought make you want to go more slowly?
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Do you drive at 35mph on a motorway when it's raining then?
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I was going to say, or 15mph in a 30?
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>> Do you drive at 35mph on a motorway when it's raining then?
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No - you haven't read my post.
a) on a bend
b) potentially a hazard, so you need to take more care and be aware.
c) (implied) - on ordinary 2-way roads, obviously not motorways because there is no oncoming traffic, and no sharp bends.
It's surely non-contentious that it is sensible to drive more carefully in the wet?
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"On a wet road anything more than half your normal speed is courting danger, especially on a bend"
"especially" is not "only".
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"Stationary object...combined speed"..um..what? Not sure I follow that, or am I being as dense as usual?
Point taken about extra care taken of course.
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It is sensible to drive carefully all of the time.
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I was driving back from the North East a few months back on the M1. I experienced the heaviest rain I've seen in the UK. The motorway was soon treacherous with deep standing water (hard to see white lines) and wipers going at max speed not great.
I slowed to what I thought was a safe pace and HGVs seemed to be doing similar/same speed. The number of vehicles overtaking including coaches was a surprise. They had poor visibility, braking totally compromised but they tail gated past me.
30 minutes and through it and I could make good progress again.
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Graduated Licences? - No FM2R
