Motoring Discussion > The dash for diesel Legal Questions
Thread Author: henry k Replies: 19
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New Thu 16 Nov 17 18:09 
 The dash for diesel - henry k
Why officials in Labour government pushed 'dash for diesel'

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41985715


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New Thu 16 Nov 17 19:34 
 The dash for diesel - Focal Point
The most objectionable aspect of this story is the way politicians knew decades ago of the health risks associated with diesel, but pressed ahead anyway, dressing it all up in Orwellian double-speak.

And the information had to be prised out of the Treasury under freedom of information protocols.
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New Thu 16 Nov 17 22:12 
 The dash for diesel - Old Navy
How many teabags used in the Treasury is probably a state secret covered by the official secrets act.

Does anyone believe or trust a politician?
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 06:37 
 The dash for diesel - madf
>> Does anyone believe or trust a politician?

About 25% of the population will vote for a politician based on their rosette colour irrespective of their ability...So yes,.. they must .

"You can fool some people all of the time" They WANT to believe. They NEED to believe.
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 17 Nov 17 at 17:05
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 06:49 
 The dash for diesel - Duncan

>> About 25% of the population will vote for a politician based on their rosette colour
>> irrespective of their ability.
>>

Are you suggesting the other 75% are floating voters? I don't think so.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 13:07 
 The dash for diesel - madf
>> Are you suggesting the other 75% are floating voters? I don't think so.


As only 70% vote, the other 45% are floating..

The two main political parties poll - over the years - between 30-40 % of voters each (not both low/high at the same time of course) so about 20% to 28% - hence my "25%" (of registered voters)
Last edited by: VxFan on Fri 17 Nov 17 at 17:05
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 14:13 
 The dash for diesel - Duncan

>> As only 70% vote, the other 45% are floating..
>>
>> The two main political parties poll - over the years - between 30-40 % of
>> voters each (not both low/high at the same time of course) so about 20% to
>> 28% - hence my "25%" (of registered voters)

Unconvinced.

When you wrote "About 25% of the population", I assumed you meant 25% of the voting population.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 14:30 
 The dash for diesel - No FM2R
Unless you know that the 25% you refer to is the same 25% every time, then your comment is baseless.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 10:45 
 The dash for diesel - Cliff Pope
>> The most objectionable aspect of this story is the way politicians knew decades ago of
>> the health risks associated with diesel,
>>

Not only that, it was obvious to everybody else too.

Anyone can guess that when a diesel vehicle clears its DPC or whatever it's called and belches out a cloud of black smoke it probable isn't very healthy.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 13:10 
 The dash for diesel - madf
Any chance of suing the then Government for lack of Duty of Care?

After all, politicians first duty should be the well being of their citizens. To deliberately and knowingly choose a course of action which will endanger everyone's health is a gross dereliction of duty. 20 years jail should suffice pour encourager les autres.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 14:30 
 The dash for diesel - Bromptonaut
>> Any chance of suing the then Government for lack of Duty of Care?

It wasn't just UK that favoured or continued to favour diesel. Same throughout EU and probably other places too.

I've read another account that says governments focused on CO2 as they were advised that PM and NoX were covered with (a) DPF and (b) selective catlyzation coming down the road. Those requirements were eased at German instigation as part of the inter governmental horse trading after the banking crisis and further weakened by VW, and almost certainly others, monkeying around with the tests.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Fri 17 Nov 17 at 14:33
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 16:02 
 The dash for diesel - Rudedog
And yet this week all I've heard about is the environment damage caused by the continued increase in sea temps linked to CO2 levels in the atmosphere.

Obviously both gases cause issues but which one is worse?

Diesels produce lower CO2 levels without much effort.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 16:47 
 The dash for diesel - Boxsterboy
Petrols are worse for CO2 which is a greenhouse gas causing global warming issues (allegedly!)

Diesels are worse for NOX which is a local environmental issue. Even just off busy roads the levels of NOX falls quite rapdily and NOX is soon dissipated. Unlike CO2.

Petrols were out of favour during the dash for diesels. Diesels are out of favour now because of local pollution. I am sure petrols will fall out of favour again when the spotlight falls back onto global warming and CO2 output.
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New Fri 17 Nov 17 19:36 
 The dash for diesel - Dog
>>Obviously both gases cause issues but which one is worse?

NOx kills peops. CO2 just kills the planet, they say.
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New Sun 19 Nov 17 08:44 
 The dash for diesel - misar
>> It wasn't just UK that favoured or continued to favour diesel. Same throughout EU and
>> probably other places too.
>>
>> I've read another account that says governments focused on CO2 as they were advised that
>> PM and NoX were covered with (a) DPF and (b) selective catlyzation coming down the
>> road. Those requirements were eased at German instigation as part of the inter governmental horse
>> trading after the banking crisis and further weakened by VW, and almost certainly others, monkeying
>> around with the tests.
>>
Up to now yours is the only accurate comment in this thread.

Governments did not cynically set out to kill people, they believed claims from the European motor industry that it could control toxic emissions. We now know that even if the industry promises had been kept the current technology adds substantial costs and maintenance problems to diesel engines in cars.
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New Mon 20 Nov 17 12:51 
 The dash for diesel - TheManWithNoName
If Google is to be believed, the original diesel engine was designed to run on peanut oil and similar bio fuels.

Does anyone know if burning bio fuels creates the same toxic chemicals as fossil fuels?
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New Mon 20 Nov 17 13:08 
 The dash for diesel - Dog
"Biodiesel packs nearly the same energy content as regular diesel, but burns much, much cleaner. Pure biodiesel (aka B100) produces 75 percent fewer emissions than regular diesel"

auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-efficiency/biofuels/biofuel-fossil-fuel1.htm
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New Mon 20 Nov 17 13:26 
 The dash for diesel - Focal Point
"Up to now yours is the only accurate comment in this thread."

Pretty sweeping. You can demonstrate that not a single previous comment including anything accurate?

"Governments did not cynically set out to kill people..."

Did anyone actually say that?

Your comment, agreeing with another, is fair enough, but weakened by your wish to discredit wholesale what other people have put.

If the diesel policy we're discussing does not show the Government's wilful blindness to the noxious effects of diesel exhaust, then it does show an extraordinary naivety.
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New Mon 20 Nov 17 14:08 
 The dash for diesel - Duncan

>> Up to now yours is the only accurate comment in this thread.

Leaving aside the accuracy of that comment.

Welcome back! You don't like posting too frequently, do you?
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New Mon 20 Nov 17 23:07 
 The dash for diesel - Roger.
Shake, rattle and roll!
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