Three American engines, one BMW engine, a Ford, a GM.
And an MG TF - an icon? Ohhh pullleeeez.
A bit more 'classic' motoring journalism by the great Phil Space.
Last edited by: Mike Hannon on Mon 9 Aug 10 at 09:06
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How good does that Range Rover still look? :-)
If a colleague's MG-F is anything to go by, the fact it is "relatively simple to fix" is a bonus, as that's what it seems to spend most of its life doing. Being fixed. She reckons she's spent about £2k on it in the last 18 months on top of scheduled servicing.
Also, where is the Triumph Stag? Arguably the best looking car ever to come out of the UK, one of the best sounding, and with modern fluids and lubricants, and a smattering of aftermarket parts, no less reliable than anything else of the era.
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I wouldn't have the MGF and the Elise, same genre and the Elise is superior, if an MG it would be an MGC, 6cyl brit engine rather than the MGB V8's Buick derived unit.
That being said the use of the Buick V8 would not take the Range Rover off the list.
Re Triumph, not Stag rather Dolomite Sprint, the first mass produced 16v engine.
Capri is worthy so so is MkI or MkII Escort, RS1600 or RS1800 also the Lotus Cortina MkI or a perhaps a GT in red - though are they the same genre as a Dolomite hmm ...
Last edited by: Cheddar on Mon 9 Aug 10 at 09:18
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The buick V8 shouldnt be regarded as American, they never used or developed it. Far more were made and used here than over there.
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>> The buick V8 shouldnt be regarded as American, they never used or developed it. Far
>> more were made and used here than over there.
>>
>>>>>>they did use it but they developed a better engine at the time and so sold the rights to the engine
remember it was basically at its furthest stage of power output when it was sold and it was only due to making the cylinder walls paper thin that more power could be developed from it plus adding injection over things holley carbs/su"s
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yup, there is no room there for the MG. The Stag has to be the finest looking sports car made.
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If anyone owns a Lotus Elise and would like me to give them a tour of St. Ives, Pendeen, St. Just, Lands End, Mousehole, Newlyn and Penzance, please contact me via the mods.
:)
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sorry Dog but i would be ashamed to put that link up as best of british
its full of turds with just 2 great cars
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As I sed Bb ~ Just4fun :)
Re: The Lotus Elise, knock that idea on the head, I've just read up on the engine :(
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The Stag? surely no. From first hand family experience it it was the most unreliable and expensive pile of junk of its time; know of 6 examples from new over 8 years that spent as much time in the dealers as on the road.
Might be v. nice now as a classic doing max 250 miles a year but goodness not as a real car..........
imho and experience of course :)
Elise would do for me, and the Dolomite :)
Last edited by: R40 on Mon 9 Aug 10 at 10:16
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>>The Stag? surely no. From first hand family experience it it was the most unreliable and expensive pile of junk <<
Hehe! In my mobile tuning days I used to set up all these ole cars and I must admit I can only but agree with you on that one, I reckon the PAS was even more lacking in feel than these ere modern day electric systems.
One thing I did like about the ole Stag though, was the Bude-iful exhaust note (music!) as it pulled away.
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I'd agree with the Range-Rover and the Rolls, but you can keep the others.
In my private collection of all-time greats I'd want a Stag, Daimler Dart, XK 120, a pre-war Rolls with sporting bodywork, Sunbeam-Talbot, Jensen 541, 1940s Alvis, and that beautiful blue monstrosity owned by Diana Dors (OK, not British).
And I've always hankered after owning an old crawler tractor.
And an Airstream caravan.
And..
And..
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And..
And..
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>nurse.............................nurse.................
......
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Mmm Polyfilla really - but I do like the Stag - it was meant to have its headlamps hidden behind power operated flaps giving a very clean style to the grille.
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>> the Stag - it was meant to have its headlamps hidden behind power operated flaps
>>
'cept that it did'nt produce enough power ;-)
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MG as shown - iconic! Some mistake surely?
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The MGF simply carried on the tradition of British sports cars back in the 60's and 70's, IMHO.
Good to look at, great (arguably class leading) to drive, but full of design faults, engineering shortcomings and build quality woes that should have been sorted out long before a customer ever took delivery.
Compare the reliability record of this car with the similarly priced Mazda MX-5 and Toyota MR2. It's not acceptable.
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It is evident that one of the problems the British motorcar industry had - judging by the rplies above - is a surfeit of customers who would accept absolut junk and call it great and collectable through rose timted glasses..
Pile of tat...
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I hate the cant use of the word icon, but if I am right about its meaning not one of those cars except the mini deserves the word.
The only two I would fancy are the RR and the Lotus Carlton.
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...I hate the cant use of the word icon...
The commonly used meaning for icon doesn't appear in the dictionary:
It simply means a symbol, image or a picture, so a picture of any car could be said to be an icon - an image - of motoring.
dictionary.reference.com/browse/icon?db=dictionary
I agree with AC that most people take iconic to mean something more than that, so an original mini or VW Beetle is a motoring icon, but a Kia C'eed is not.
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>>The only two I would fancy are the RR and the Lotus Carlton. <<
I suppose this motor would lower the tone of The Coussine Estate Lud :)
www.classiccarsforsale.co.uk/classic-car-page.php/carno/101797
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>> I suppose this motor would lower the tone
It's grossly overpriced and that car was a bit of a handful to drive quickly. The (preferable) FF is flawed too and probably even more expensive. I'd take a nice CV8 for 20 grand if I had the necessary. But I'd rather have a Bristol.
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>> It's grossly overpriced and that car was a bit of a handful to drive quickly.
Yes, lovely looking car and one I always dreamed about as a child. Live rear axle with cart springs though so I don't want to drive one and have my illusions shattered.
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>> so I don't want to drive one and have my illusions shattered.
Anyone know what the Capri (although in mk3 guise rather than the article) is like to live with? What were the downsides to them?
Last edited by: CraigP on Mon 9 Aug 10 at 17:12
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>> Anyone know what the Capri (although in mk3 guise rather than the article) is like
>> to live with? What were the downsides to them?
My Dad bought himself a late Mk 3 Crapi as a retirement present to himself in the late 90s. It was a 1.6 in red and in excellent condition. I took it out for a spin and frightened the living daylights out of myself with my first (late) braking manoeuvre. Modern cars stop a hell of a lot better than relics like this.
On the positive side you sit very low in front of loads of dials and a bonnet that stretches out forever in front of you, complete with power bulge so you can fantasise that there is something rather more exotic under it than Ford's asthmatic 70hp pinto. The unassisted steering was very direct and the gearbox excellent if not as rifle bolt precise as my rose tinted memory had led me to believe was the case with rwd Fords.
On the road it was predictably set up for squealy understeer with the ability to drift the back end at very low speeds on damp roundabouts which was fun. The suspension, of course, made a Ford Cortina look sophisticated and reminded me again of those long lost expressions "axle tramp" and "bump steer". My Dad didn't care though, it was the car he'd always promised himself. He had it waxoyled, fiddled about under the bonnet with it, and drove my Mum to Southport at weekends in it. He'd probably have kept it as it was actually quite practical day to day, but Mum's advancing arthritis made it impossible for her to get in and out and he sold it for a profit after a couple of years and bought an Astra which he still has.
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>>Anyone know what the Capri (although in mk3 guise rather than the article) is like to live with? What were the downsides to them?<<
I had a 1969 1600 GTXLR Capri in Metallic Jade and thought it was a great car compared to my previously owned cars, a Triumph Herald convertible, A Zephyr 4 mrk 3 and a Cortina 1600 'Super',
I also owned a 3 ltr Ghia in later years + got to tune and road test many a 2.8 inj. through my work, I quite liked the cars really, sure they were too lightweight @ the stern, like many RWD's,
I used to look forward to road testing the 2.8 inj. models,
The Supreme Being in its infinite wisdom gave us adrenaline for reasons thus :)
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Capris are best left to memories because i know if i revisited my old ground i would find them too low too twitchy and outgunned by modern stuff in the twisty bits, even though my one long term capri i had sorted properly.
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>>Capris are best left to memories<<
But that goes for a lot of 'classic' cars innit, not that I'm saying the Capri is a 'classic'
THIS is a Classic ~
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ford_Classic_four_door_registered_May_1962_1498_cc.JPG
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I had a string of capris mk1s.
Difficult to pull out in restricted vsibility areas, due to the long bonnet, Mostly reliable, the bigger the engine the twitchier the tail became, and it could be very twitchy indeed.
Live with it? I could marry one. Great cars to drive and own.
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Haha thanks for this :-)
I don't feel too committed to a "pure" capri (i'm not convinced it's a classic, just very desirable). Modernised brakes would probably be on the "things to do" list.
I like the idea of running a pre-inj model though.
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>>The (preferable) FF is flawed too and probably even more expensive<<
You certainly know your motors Sire, I wouldn't know the difference between an S and an FF,
but then I only tuned the critters.
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Wasn't the Jensen FF four wheel drive with early (Dunlop Maxaret) ABS or am I wrong again??
M
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>> Wasn't the Jensen FF four wheel drive with early (Dunlop Maxaret) ABS or am I
>> wrong again??
Spot on MD!
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>> But I'd rather have a Bristol.
>>
or a nice pair of Bristol's!
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>> Also, where is the Triumph Stag? Arguably the best looking car ever to come out
>> of the UK, one of the best sounding, and with modern fluids and lubricants, and
>> a smattering of aftermarket parts, no less reliable than anything else of the era.
A friend of mine was a classic car enthusiast, and had a Triumph Stag. I remember many happy nights with the top down driving down the streets to the sound of that gorgeous V8 engine. It does need the modern fluids as you describe to keep it reliable, also a larger radiator. And the simplex chain can wear prematurely. Another case of British under development.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triumph_Stag
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CP might have to race me to that Daimler Dart. I'm not one to get over-excited about old cars, or convertibles, but there's a dark blue one a couple of streets from my house and I think it looks fabulous. By comparison, the Stag - any Stag - looks like the brown Crimplene flares it once conveyed.
I have, of course, no idea what a Dart would cost to buy, own and run - or whether it has dynamics to match the looks. But it's a truly beautiful thing.
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And now try naming 10 British cars that were icons of reliability. Not many on that first list, are there?
Pre-Leyland Austins
Triumph 1300 and 2000, but not the Dolomite
Rolls-Royces and Bentleys
Bristols (probably)
Morgans
Recent Fords (but they weren't all built here)
I'm stuck.
Anyone help us get to 10?
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>>And now try naming 10 British cars that were icons of reliability Anyone help us get to 10<<
Triumph Acclaim.
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"Top 10 iconic British cars YOU could own."
#10: McLaren F1 £1.5M to £2.5M
Yes - must rush out and buy one now....
Still, my old Citroën CX does have the same door mirrors found on (early) F1s :-)
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I don't want an "icon" of yesteryear. I want a modern car. I live in the present, not the past.
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Snail is right..
An icon is no fun when you drive it.. And they rust.. And don't stop. And leak...
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There are only two places for an icon of yesteryear ~ either in a museum or in a private collection whch never gets driven on public roads.
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>> I don't want an "icon" of yesteryear. I want a modern car. I live
>> in the present, not the past.
>>
So let's just bulldoze those draughty, old-fashioned 'listed' buildings and replace with eco-friendly glass-and-aluminium sheds, eh?
As for 'classical' music? Pah! It's Lady GaGa all the way, I suppose?
Or maybe not.
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Agree with you - buy a modern MINI, lots of things the old rustbuckety thing wasn't e.g. well made, reliable etc...
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No one has mentioned the Vauxhall Viscount
Seriously! I would love one of these
www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C158639/
I dont know what it is, but there is something about it that I love.
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>>Seriously! I would love one of these<<
Yeah, I've tuned a few of these in my time, the inlet manifold could become porous which affected the fuel mixture so the owners would stick a new carb on it b4 calling me in :(
Nice engines though, I've tuned a fair few Bedford lorries that used that petrol engine.
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Rented an automatic Cresta in that body once to do some work in Sheffield or somewhere. Came back to London down M1 pedal to metal all the way, without once reaching a speedometer 100. It drank plenty though.
Pile of excrement if you ask me.
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The 1st time I ever saw one, was at the Vauxhall Open Day last year
Auto Gear Box, Electric Windows - Very Modern for its day
- I fell in love with it then and wanted one ever since - i think they look fabulous in the Silver.
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"So let's just bulldoze those draughty, old-fashioned 'listed' buildings"
Anyone who has lived through last winter in a house over 100 years old would happily swap it - and its heating bills - for a modern one..#
Listed buildings are like old cars: good to LOOK at..
#
we live in a 180 year old house.. Last winter was COLD.. At least our central heating did not freeze like some modern ones did due to incorrect installation...
ALas I remember Vauxhall Viscounst when they were new. They were carp then,, so now they will have matured to real rubbish. Wallowing thirsty pigs...with all the allure of a sumo wrestler in tights.
Last edited by: madf on Tue 10 Aug 10 at 14:02
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"We live in a 180 year old house....."
Which will no doubt be described as a 'desirable', characterful period property' in an estate agents' particulars :-)
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My previous house was the best part of 300 years old - it was the warmest house I've ever lived in. It was a mid terrace miner's cottage, stone built, with walls two feet thick, small windows, and a big open fireplace in the lounge.
By way of contrast a friend lived in a converted Methodist chapel - I slept on his sofa a few times and endured some of the coldest nights I've experienced. Motoring link - his closest neighbours were the Button family.
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>> My previous house was the best part of 300 years old - it was the
>> warmest house I've ever lived in. It was a mid terrace miner's cottage, stone built,
>> with walls two feet thick, small windows, and a big open fireplace in the lounge.
In the real world we call them "caves"
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A characterful cave though Zero :)
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Zero omitted to add the miner's tin bath and copper jug were part of the bathroom furnishings...:-)
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>Zero omitted to add the miner's tin bath and copper jug were part of the bathroom furnishings...:-)
Part of?? The only furnishings - who needs hot running water ;)
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Getting back to Vauxhalls (VxFan will approve!) I didn't see the Viscount as anything more than a deluxe Cresta - but the later 3-litre Royale / Senator was a good car. There was a 2.5 version quite cleverly called the Viceroy.
I wonder - does this (really an Opel) and the Triumph Acclaim (Honda) truly count as British? If it does, then the tally of reliable British cars leaps up with British-built Hondas, Nissans and Toyotas.
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>>I wonder - does this (really an Opel) and the Triumph Acclaim (Honda) truly count as British?<<
The Rover V8's are reworked American designed engines,
Saab reworked a British designed engine,
(I could go on and on and on etc.,)
The Triumph Acclaim is not 'British' in the true meaning of the word,
but then its not, not British if you see what I mean:)
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Triumph 2000 auto please or Vitesse.
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Top 10 iconic British cars YOU could own. - Mike Hannon
