Mrs H and I visited one of the daughters in Wilmslow at the weekend. She asked me to listen to her petrol Astra as it started up. Apparently her colleagues had been acting strangely in the car park; some with hands over ears, some pointing at her car as she started it. One of her more helpful workmates had suggested the exhaust was loose. So I bravely turned it over after it had been stood for 40 hours or so. The racket was indescribable; think loose tools being emptied into a dustbin. After a few seconds everything went quiet except for a gentle buzzing as it ticked over.
Tried to check the oil level but the bonnet would only open when daughter pulled the lever and I bounced the bonnet. The old chestnut; the dipstick wasn't long enough. Nearly a litre and a half later, there was some oil visible. A squirt of WD40 had the bonnet working again. She wasn't sure when she last checked the oil but she was adamant that the oil light wasn't on as she drove; why would she need to check the oil unless the light was on?
Starting the car again sounded normal. Clearly I haven't managed to pass on the rudiments of car care to her. Has she been lucky or are these 1.2 petrol engines indestructible? Anyone else with children who give you a head-in-hands moment over car maintenance?
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My step-son thinks the oil light should come on if the oil is low which of course is wrong. It's a low pressure light. I suppose when it's REALLY low it will also show low pressure.
So if this noise really was the engine because of a lack of oil.... surely there's some damage. And how didn't she think it was not sounding okay and yet ignoring it?
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I don't know the car, but a car with hydraulic tappets often has a slight rattle for a second when starting until the oil pressure has built up and the valve clearances close.
Dirty oil can exacerbate this and delay the build-up time. It can cause a tappet to stick, with an horrendous noise until it frees.
She might be lucky - flush the engine and give it an oil and filter change.
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Every 6 months or so someone has their car towed in to y local Indie - siezed engine - they have never checked the oil level in many months/year or longer.
Bangers often BUT some 2/3 or 4 year old cars - fill with petrol but not even 5 minutes attention to oil, radiator level, washer bottle or tyre pressures.
Mind you after paying for a "new engine" they might have learned their lesson - however another fool will along shortly.
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I know a couple of people who run their cars for three years without opening the bonnet or getting the car serviced. I stopped buying used cars long ago.
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>> My step-son thinks the oil light should come on if the oil is low which
>> of course is wrong. It's a low pressure light. I suppose when it's REALLY low
>> it will also show low pressure.
>>
True, though my 1988 BMW had a low oil level as well as pressure light, and that was an E30 model launched in, what, 1983? So I assume posher BMWs had them in the '70s. Almost 50 years ago! Renaults, AFAIK, have had oil level checks since the 90s too, so a simple oil level warning light would seem like a good idea. I have to confess I never check oil levels as all recent cars have had an oil level check function; entertainingly my latest car also lets me check tyre temperatures - a more pointless feature on a road car it's hard to imagine!
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An oil level check would be easy to implement - maybe they prefer to fix and replace engines.... at good profit levels.
It always amazes me how much more Mercedes charge for an AMG hand-built engine over say an exotic 4.0l turbo petrol that's partly machine made.
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Probably lucky if it's no knocking now.
Tom Jones though. It's not unusual for people to assume the light always works that way.
Poor design in this age. Perhaps people accepted that one had to be more or less mechanically minded, or at least read the instructions, 30 years ago. Now, it's possible to treat them like consumer electronics and get away with it most of the time.
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I think nearly all new cars have got them now haven't they? Even in the new vans at work they've all got some warning or monitoring device on them for oil. Either an electronic gauge or simple message system. Although I wonder if it will reduce the amount of damaged engines, people still might ignore it until the engine stops.
I remember a situation like the OP's. I went to go see a friend who asked me to look at his car as the engine was making a noise. Anyway had a look at the dipstick, just a sliver of oil at the bottom on it. Took him down to halfords to get some cheap oil, filled it up and the noise reduced by a fair amount. He looked at me like I just walked on water. No idea how long it had been like that, it didn't seem to do any great damage it lasted another two year before selling it and it was still working.
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>> I think nearly all new cars have got them now haven't they? Even in the new vans at work
>> they've all got some warning or monitoring device on them for oil.
These are usually oil pressure warning lights. They are not oil level warning lights.
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> These are usually oil pressure warning lights. They are not oil level warning lights.
>>
Nope, they are oil level warnings. On all the new vans at work anyway. I'd be surprised if vans have got them and new cars haven't.
Last edited by: sooty123 on Mon 31 Oct 16 at 23:28
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About time if this is the case. I'll check my car manual.
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I haven't actually checked the e-tron, but the previous shape (8P?) A3 had a low oil level warning in the DIS, as did the B7 A4. Both need a litre of oil adding just before the first service but appeared not to consume any after that!
Last edited by: PeterS on Tue 1 Nov 16 at 06:01
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Well my Audi A3 says the oil light is for oil pressure. The manual therefore has a warning that oil level should be checked regularly.
Bearing in mind the current A3 is using the VW MQB platform, the same is likely to apply to the current Golf, Passat, Leon, Octavia, Superb, Tiguan, Ateca, etc.
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>> Well my Audi A3 says the oil light is for oil pressure. The manual therefore
>> has a warning that oil level should be checked regularly.
Yes I found that... try about 3 pages further on, there's probably a heading "Engine Oil Level (Min)".
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Yes you're right - page 24. I'd looked at the red warning lamps but didn't look at the yellow indicator lamps. It would be a yellow lamp for oil level rather than pressure.
There's also a warning for the engine oil sensor itself.
But ignoring my first car which did use oil, no other car has used oil between services at all. Not measurable anyway. The worrying one was the Mazda6 because the oil level went up - and when it got too high it could result in a destroyed turbo and engine (worst case scenario).
Last edited by: rtj70 on Tue 1 Nov 16 at 18:29
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>> Nope, they are oil level warnings. On all the new vans at work anyway. I'd
>> be surprised if vans have got them and new cars haven't.
My old 53 reg Vectra had a low level oil warning light. Came on every now and again, and when I checked the level it was still mid way between min and max on the dipstick. It would only go off and stay off when topped back up to the max.
It was under warranty and the garage discovered the dipstick was the wrong length. I kid you not. Replacement dipstick fitted and never an issue again.
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Doesn't the oil level sensor reside in the engine's sump?
The dip stick is now really a secondary check. I believe there are quite a few cars now that don't have one.
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>> These are usually oil pressure warning lights. They are not oil level warning lights.
Agree with others that some form of oil level indication showing on start up is pretty much universal.
Both my BXs (86/D petrol and 91/H diesel) had gauges that showed a level when key turned. Xantia and Berlingo 1 had a row of lights marking full to low which flashed and activated a default attention getter 'bong' from the dash if detecting a critical level. None were 100% free of spurious warnings, particularly if parked on a slope, but they were a prompt to check.
Current Berlingo shows message 'Oil OK' over odometer and I've never seen a warning. Judging by courtesy cars that function is PSA standard.
Roomie has a dipstick shaped orange warning light which extinguishes along with those for airbags, oil pressure etc. No doubt it stays on and probably sounds an alert if level is low.
Since I check levels at least fortnightly I've never seen a real low oil problem in any of them.
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 1 Nov 16 at 07:23
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>> Roomie has a dipstick shaped orange warning light which extinguishes along with those for airbags,
>> oil pressure etc. No doubt it stays on and probably sounds an alert if level
>> is low.
A red oilcan picture is oil pressure; the same picture in yellow is "oil quantity too low".
The dipstick thing may be coolant - blue for below operating temperature, red for too hot and/or too low. The blue one is in the speedo on ours, and is usually on for the first couple of miles, the red one is in the other big dial and appears briefly at switch on. I can't see anything else resembling a stick!
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The car I had that I watched oil levels carefully was the Mazda6 diesel. Because the oil level would go up. And if it went past Full and got to X that could lead to serious engine damage.
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>> The car I had that I watched oil levels carefully was the Mazda6 diesel. Because
>> the oil level would go up. And if it went past Full and got to
>> X that could lead to serious engine damage.
>>
My diesel Yaris had high and low level oil sensors, ominous.
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I just looked at the Outlander manual and remembered why I hadn't read it all. There must be 50 pages on instruments, so it's much easier to wait until a light comes on and then look it up, as I did when the fuel filter light came on.
It does indeed have an oil level warning, for when it gets too high! It never has.
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>> It does indeed have an oil level warning, for when it gets too high! It
>> never has.
>>
The Yaris high oil level warning was for diesel dilution. Mine was slightly overfilled at a service and a steep MSCP ramp triggered the alarm.
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Many a time I've gorn to tune car and found it required a longer dipstick. I've seen spark plugs which would make you wince, contact breakers so badly worn tis a miracle the car ran at all.
Air filters completely clogged or saturated in oil (think Hillman Imp!!) All part of the joys - at least it kept me in work.
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In the 1970s my next door neighbor had an Austin Maxi. He knew that I was a car geek and asked my advice as his oil light was coming on shortly after engine start. I had an oil pressure gauge which I connected to his engine. The oil pressure would go up to normal then drop to zero, the oil pump drive shaft had snapped but would still drive until the oil pressure built up.
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Like most folk on here I check my fluid levels weekly. And top up the beer levels at least four times a week. Mon, Weds, Fri, Sat, Sun
That's 5.
Up to Lakes for a day on t'tops tomorrow, and despite checking fluid levels last Sunday am shall check again before I leave early. After all, it takes less than a minute. Literally.
I'm probably a bit anal or summat
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>> I'm probably a bit anal or summat
>>
I've just got an anorak.
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Won't need it tomorrow. Cracking forecast next two days. Dry. Good viz. excellent flying conditions for light aircraft, and I declined the offer to go flying with a friend. I'm too scared! Yet I love flying in modern jets. Or even old KLM 747s.
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I can understand vans being prioritised for oil level sensors. Many must be driven by drivers with a "I don't care its not my van" attitude. It also shows in much of their driving!
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I can recall back in the late 80's my mate's Mk3 Escort Ghia having an oil level sensor. It was incorporated into the dipstick. Had to be careful pulling it out so not to break the wires coming from it.
So it's not only modern cars that have an oil level sensor. Some of the high end models from a few years ago also had them too.
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I was most concerned when I got my first car as it had just the normal ( 5 psi ?) low oil pressure sensor/ switch.
I inserted a T piece and added a higher ( 15 psi ? ) sensor/switch so I had a warning when things started to worsen rather than " OOOPs -too late."
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>> I can understand vans being prioritised for oil level sensors. Many must be driven by
>> drivers with a "I don't care its not my van" attitude. It also shows in
>> much of their driving!
>>
I don't think that vans get priority for anything! If you're so minded a few beeps and a light isn't going to bother you!
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I had a Maxi, over perhaps 5 years of ownership, the oil pressure switch failed twice. The first event caused some heartache, but as there were no funny noises, I just replaced the switch.
The concept of no weekly checks though would never happen here. No lights on vintage car though, just a quick check on the level in the oil tank.
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Dry sump?
Sort of, or an ancestor of the dry sump. Accurately called 'total loss' lubrication. 20 to 30 drops a minute fed in, used and then spat out. I feed it straight 50 low detergent oil, and what comes out of the catch tank is perhaps 30 or 20 weight. Certainly had the stuffing knocked out of it for sure. Catch-tank is an addition, as built the oil outlet just vents to the road, but one would not endear oneself to present day motor cyclists if left as standard, so I added a catch-tank, and invented a condenser for the oil as well.
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Must have missed a prior description of the engine! Hadn't realised it was that vintage... Good point having a catch tank. UOA would be interesting to the people at "Bob is the oil guy" who are slightly OTT on this score but v. informative.
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>>I had a Maxi, over perhaps 5 years of ownership, the oil pressure switch failed twice.
My Maxi often flashed the low oil pressure light, but then I was bouncing it around fields. I contacted the BMC competition department, thinking they must have experienced the same in the Maxis they used on the London - Mexico run, they hadn't, but advised me to overfill the sump. It leaked into the clutch!
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>> , but then I was bouncing it
>> around fields.
>>
Off-road vehicles often have baffles in the sump to stop oil from surging to one end and starving the oil pick-up.
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Oil pressure switch on those cars is very rudimentary, just a diaphragm and a spring against a switch. Spring gets weak, and thus the light comes on over bumps. Exactly what mine did.
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>>Off-road vehicles often have baffles in the sump to stop oil from surging to one end and starving the oil pick-up.
Difficult to put baffles in a sump full of gearbox!
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Back in '84 my Citroen CX, and contemporary BXs had an oil pressure gauge which served as a level gauge for a few seconds after switch on. For those of us that like an analogue display, it was just the job. Now my ancient Citroen C8 shows me a few blobs of pixels on an LCD display; it's just not the same.
Having been paid a bonus last month of around £4K, daughter was aghast when I suggested that her car (the very thing that takes her to work so she can be paid so handsomely) be serviced at a a guessed cost of £200. Where did I go wrong?
:-)
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>> Having been paid a bonus last month of around £4K, daughter was aghast when I
>> suggested that her car (the very thing that takes her to work so she can
>> be paid so handsomely) be serviced at a a guessed cost of £200. Where did
>> I go wrong?
>>
>> :-)
>>
Shoes, handbags, or car service. It would be no contest with my girls. That's their husbands problem now. :-)
Last edited by: Old Navy on Wed 2 Nov 16 at 17:37
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>> Shoes, handbags, or car service. It would be no contest with my girls. That's their
>> husbands problem now. :-)
Miss B and her beau are disturbingly organised on this stuff. Currently contemplating replacing their 07 107 with something more suited to their dinghy hauling/long distance visiting lfestyle.
He's an engineer and has it all on a spreadsheet :-P
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Vauxhall Astra G Petrol - Audible warning of low oil pressure - rtj70
