A mother claims Kwik Fit mechanics tried to charge her £360 for an £11.65 puncture repair 'because she is a woman'
The mother-of-one claims the mechanics rang half an hour later to say that the puncture couldn't be fixed and that all four tyres would also have to be replaced - at a cost of £360.
But rejecting their offer, Mrs Henderson took the car she shares with her husband Ross to an independent garage that charged her just £11.65 to repair the slow puncture.
tinyurl.com/gtq994x - Daily Wail
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Toyota do free puncture repairs, but our local dealer had no facilities, so contracted the repair out.
We had a nail in an almost new winter tyre, but they suddenly turned into tyre experts and said it couldn't be repaired. The nail was in the tread, maybe half an inch in from the edge.
The local tyre fitters said no problem. The tyre has done three more winters without incident.
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Had to take the A3 to a local Kwikfit at the weekend with a nailed tyre - KF are Lex's tyre fitters of choice apparently. Despite it being a lease car and Lex picking up the bill (didn't even have to sign anything), they only repaired it.
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I see she believes an all weather tyre can be mixed with standard tyres. Is that true? I would avoid this even if it's not actually forbidden
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They "have a few thousand miles left"?
Let her crash and kill the kids I say, she can argue sex discrimination at the inquest.
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.....but surely, there is a point at which tyres "have a few thousand miles left".........
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yes but which point? a few thousand miles left to 1.6mm, or a few thousand miles left at 1.8 mm?
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....or a few thousand miles left to manufacturers recommended replacement tread depth....?
That's the point, we don't (and probably never will) know.
Slow news day at the Mail (plus ça change)
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Here is another angle on it
You as a tyre fitter deemed the tyre is unsafe to fix*. The car has all-weather tyres all round with a "few thousand miles left" do you
1/replace 1 tyre? (leaving you with one tyre with 8mm on and 3 with 2mm on)
2/ Recommend you replace two tyres, on the same axle I hope (leaving you with two 8mm tyres and two 2mm tyres) If they were on the front, do you swop them round? Allweather tyres? a mix of ordinary and all weather?
3/ Do you, knowing that all 4 tyres are going to need replacing in "a couple of thousand miles" (thats two months?) suggest she avoid all the hassle and get them changed now while he has the car.
As the driver, being told 3/
A:" do you accept that as good advice?
B: accept that as good advice and act upon it
C: Accept it as good advice and Ignore it
D: Start wailing about sex discrimination, rip of Britain, and go straight to the daily mail.
* is the only arguing point, but that is not "daily mail" material is it.
Last edited by: Zero on Thu 7 Apr 16 at 10:04
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>>
>> A:" do you accept that as good advice?
>> B: accept that as good advice and act upon it
>> C: Accept it as good advice and Ignore it
>> D: Start wailing about sex discrimination, rip of Britain, and go straight to the daily
>> mail.
Aaah, but now what will happen is that KwikFit will instruct all of their chaps to now do a technical report on every repair job that comes in, and ensure that it is explained to every customer in simple words, and a great big does of "In our opinion...".
That way they cover their backsides... because as has been pointed out, if they had done the 12 quid repair, and the tyre had failed a hundred miles later, it would have been 'glaswegian teacher blames KwiKfit for dodgy repair job which cost her kid's life...'
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....but, I think that is another angle on something, not necessarily "it".
Whilst there might be room for debate, there is simply not enough data at all to merit the response
They "have a few thousand miles left"?
Let her crash and kill the kids I say, she can argue sex discrimination at the inquest.
I do agree that none of it is national newspaper fodder (is the mail a national "newspaper"?)
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It's an international professional trolling organisation.
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.....well, they do have to find some "news" stories to pad out the "sidebar of shame" on the website ;-)
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>> It's an international professional trolling organisation.
>>
In some way like every other UK national newspaper
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>>I do agree that none of it is national newspaper fodder (is the mail a national "newspaper"?)>>
You seem to have some doubt......
www.dailymail.co.uk/home/article-3525479/Your-winning-Mail-named-Daily-Newspaper-Year-prestigious-London-Press-Club-Awards.html
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....don't believe everything you read in The Mail ;-)
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>> ....don't believe everything you read in The Mail ;-)>>
...nor indeed what's written by Polly Toynbee and anything in the Mirror or Morning Star..:-)
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>> Whilst there might be room for debate, there is simply not enough data at all
>> to merit the response
>>
>> They "have a few thousand miles left"?
>>
>> Let her crash and kill the kids I say, she can argue sex discrimination at
>> the inquest.
I contend that is a perfectly valid response as for some time she then went on to drive knowing she had a slow puncture and possibly worn tyres
Now that, to me, indicates a somewhat careless approach to road safety.
Last edited by: Zero on Thu 7 Apr 16 at 10:21
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....you never driven on a slow puncture?
The tread depth and condition of the other tyres would have been easily checked
(possibly by her husband - or am I showing sex discrimination? :-) )
The end result is that she seems to have a driveable car, with tyres another garage deem at least adequate for a few thousand miles, for £11.67 rather than £360.
The truth is in there somewhere, but, as I say, insufficient data, and not a national news story.
(God, I can't believe I'm responding repeatedly to a thread based on a Mail story - Genug ist genug!)
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He's a dentist and she is a teacher. Of course I'm sure he will never have suggested an alternative "premium" solution to a patient's dental requirements will he? Course not.
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>> Winter teeth?
Fillings top or bottom?
Last edited by: Zero on Thu 7 Apr 16 at 11:01
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Do fillings in the bottom require a special chair?
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Ask Roger, he has just been shafted by the plumber.
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round the bend if you ask me.
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>> Do fillings in the bottom require a special chair?
>>
....according to some "artistic" films of the 60s, standard dentists' chairs could be used for filling cavities in a variety of locations.........
(allegedly ;-) )
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Reminds me of the story about the two Scottish, erm, dentists...
Ben Doune and Phil McCavity
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I had a friend whilst at college called Ben Dover.
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>> ... she then went on to drive knowing she had a slow puncture and possibly worn tyres
>>
>> Now that, to me, indicates a somewhat careless approach to road safety.
>>
I have a tyre which loses about 1 psi every two weeks. Its too slow for the tyre fitters to trace it. I just top it up every month.
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>> I have a tyre which loses about 1 psi every two weeks. Its too slow
>> for the tyre fitters to trace it.
Have you tried taking the wheel off the car, laying it on the ground and pouring soapy water around the edge of the tyre and wheel to see if it's leaking between the tyre and rim? Turn over and repeat on the other side of the wheel.
That's where a leak on one of my tyres turned out to be. A corroded edge of the wheel not allowing the tyre to seat properly.
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>> I have a tyre which loses about 1 psi every two weeks. Its too slow
>> for the tyre fitters to trace it. I just top it up every month.
>>
Porous alloy wheel?
This one of many internet forums talking about it:
tinyurl.com/h7o2fdf
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Or it could be a leaky valve.
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Best Kwik Fit story I heard was the one where the woman gave permission to have new pads and discs fitted to all wheels and when given the invoice, promptly handed over the year's guarantee that she had been given 6 months previously when another branch had done the same!
My indie mechanic used to be a branch manager at KF and left because he refused to do all the dodgy sales and advice stuff that they were pressured into doing to deliver profitable branches.
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Someone tried it one with me once - getting a rear trailing arm bearing replaced on a BX. Garage (a Cit Indie near Reading IIRC) phones up and says rear pads could do with replacing, would you like us to do it while it's on the lift. I declined - on the grounds that I had replaced them only a few months earlier!! Suppose I could have made something of it, but didn't seem worth the effort at the time.
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Similar experience to Richard also with a BX (my first a 16RS hatch). Took it to Charlie Browns in Northampton for two front tyres. Tech told me front pads were badly worn. Asked him to show me and wanted estimate of how long the several mm still showing above the wear indicator groove would last. Cheeky so* tried to tell me about a fortnight(!).
Said I'd leave them for now and monitor. Another 18 months before they were replaced at regular service.
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On the other hand, I had two tyres fitted to the Merc at a local Kwik Fit yesterday. The branch manager did a quick "health check" of the car, including the other two tyres, shocks and exhaust. Told me everything was fine and that the wear on the fronts indicated that the tracking was fine too.
In and out in about 25 minutes including a free coffee. Two 245/18/40 97Y Contis, fitted, balanced and nitrogen filled for £245.
Not crazy money really given that they should last about 50,000 miles.
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KF were on Watchdog last year for selling nitrogen but filling the cars with air. I think air is 78% nitrogen so they weren't exactly lying!
;-)
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Isn't it a criminal offence to charge people for wholly unnecessary replacements?
It should be.
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Lease car.
Screw in the middle of the back tyre. Car had about 5k on the clock at the time and the tyre was in very good nick.
KF insisted on a new tyre at £150. Of course the lease company gets a substantial discount and rebate at year end.
I have had similar punctures fixed for about £10.
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I had a puncture in a very rural part of Ireland a couple of years ago. Only place I could see to get any help was a tractor repair workshop in the middle of the quietest part of nowhere.
They fixed my tyre while I waited, gave me a mug of tea and refused to take any payment.
I drove to the nearest village, found a bakers, bought a large bag of doughnuts and went back to the tractor place and left them on the counter.
They seemed quite taken with that tiny gesture, I was certainly taken with their service.
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"I drove to the nearest village, found a bakers, bought a large bag of doughnuts and went back to the tractor place and left them on the counter.
They seemed quite taken with that tiny gesture, I was certainly taken with their service."
What a lovely gesture, both from them and you. Seeing something like that warms the heart.
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>> "I drove to the nearest village, found a bakers, bought a large bag of doughnuts
>> and went back to the tractor place and left them on the counter.
>>
>> They seemed quite taken with that tiny gesture, I was certainly taken with their
>> service."
>>
>> What a lovely gesture, both from them and you. Seeing something like that warms the
>> heart.
Well its like this you see. The baker is owned by his brother, and there is more profit margin in doughnuts. Plus you can take them back to resell.
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Since 2013 I've had two punctures and four new tyres on the Berlingo and two new tyres on the Roomster. The latter as a result of wrecking one in a pothole and deciding to replace well over half worn unknown brand on same 'axle' while at it.
The punctures were both in mid tread of n/s rear and both were repaired by Citroen dealer, Perrys in MK. Cost about £15 each I think.
Others were at Kwik Fit (Stoke for 'lingo rears, Northampton for Roomie - front). National did 'lingo fronts. Choice determined by what was in stock when I wanted it. My usual local go to, Formula One, didn't have what we wanted at time.
On each occasion I was given a summary of wear state of tyres and brakes. Each offered opportunity to look at car on ramp and have anything pointed out. Other than KF, when replacing rears rightly pointing out that fronts were around 3mm no issues and no hard sell. Now whether being a bloke who probably looks/sounds as though he knows how a car works made any difference I cannot tell.
I suspect this case only made Mail 'cos news is slow and the lady is photogenic and has a cute baby. If she looked like the back end of a bus and came from the rough end of her town I doubt the local paper or national's stringers would have picked it up.
Do any of our current/ex journo's have a view on how stories like this catch a national?
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Although I don't personally like KF I feel sorry for companies in this kind of situation as these days there is such a groundswell of support and sympathy for the "cheated" generated on social media and elsewhere, and such cynicism, that all they can really do is apologise, say we cocked up and offer some "re-training".
What they won't do is inspect the car and say Here is a report which justifies our original position.
There are countless incidents like this where they simply could not afford to tell their side. There was that breastfeeding issue, a checkout lady who refused to serve someone who was on their phone and numerous other incidents. They usually end up with an apology, and a bunch of flowers or a voucher but rarely with "the customer was a plank and got what they deserved". (which I'm not saying is the case here, but as already highlighted there could be an element of it for all we know)
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Zero has already got it right.
I wouldn't have a different make of tyre on any of my cars, let alone a different type... and i'd never leave tyres until they were near the limit.
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Over centuries of time and through a million or so jalopies I have learned to adapt unconsciously to any combination of wheels and tyres however random and outlandish. Any change alters the game and keeps things amusing. Cars should assume attitudes, which then have to be kept in some sort of check. I always know when I am pushing too hard. It's a grown-up thing.
Got a deflating rear at the moment though, very damn tiresome when the others are all at a firm, impeccable 35psi. Have to go to the tyre place, damn.
Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Thu 7 Apr 16 at 17:30
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>> I wouldn't have a different make of tyre on any of my cars, let alone
>> a different type...
I'm guessing the previous owner of my Astra had a puncture at some point of ownership. Hence why there are 3 Bridgestones and one Michelin tyre fitted.
Normally I'm the same as you, same make of tyres all round. But as the Michelin is on the rear, still has 7 or 8 mm of tread on it, and makes sod all difference to the handling, it's staying put until it wears out or gets damaged.
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>> I feel sorry for companies in this kind of
>> situation as these days there is such a groundswell of support and sympathy for the
>> "cheated" generated on social media and elsewhere, and such cynicism, that all they can really
>> do is apologise,
Twitter made a huge difference to customer service in retail. Companies can no longer play the numbers game and shrug off awkward customers. The other side of the coin is that they can in effect be blackmailed.
If you are getting nowhere with what you consider a legitimate complaint, twitter is the way to go.
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I moaned at First Great Western on Twitter about some delays to my wife's train, which ruined our weekend plans once.
They sent me 4 complimentary First Class Anytime tickets to any destination of my choosing on their network.
Jolly D of them, and totally unexpected. In reciprocation I broadcast my gratitude from my Twitter account.
That's how it works.
Last edited by: Alanović on Fri 8 Apr 16 at 09:39
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.....I suspect they thought you were related to royalty.............
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Then they should have delivered a private train for me.
I are disappoint.
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>> Then they should have delivered a private train for me.
>>
>> I are disappoint.
They did, it was waiting at Windsor for you
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.....was dis a points failure...?
I'll get my coat.......
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>> Lease car.
>>
>> Screw in the middle of the back tyre. Car had about 5k on the clock
>> at the time and the tyre was in very good nick.
>>
>> KF insisted on a new tyre at £150. Of course the lease company gets a
>> substantial discount and rebate at year end.
>>
>> I have had similar punctures fixed for about £10.
>>
There are countless tales of lease car drivers playing merry heck about how dangerous it is to repair punctures and demanding a new tyre.
My experience of how reluctant Kwik-Fit were to change tyres that were worn out was a significant factor in me choosing to opt out of having a company car.
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I used to do mega miles in my job. The lease car had to go to Kwikfit for tyres.
I saw some major differences between branches. One was very, very good. I saw another one send wheels out without even balancing them. I always tried to go to the good one - but that was hard when the lease company insisted on only replacing tyres when they had reached 1.6mm.
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>> I always tried to go to the good one - but that was hard when the lease company insisted on only replacing tyres when they had reached 1.6mm.
It's your motor in your hands Tigger. Surely it isn't beyond you to do some creative expenses chits and so on? In my day we just named a figure and they paid it.
Can't help missing the old days a bit. No doubt it's all gone po-faced and stingy now. What's the word I'm looking for? Efficiency, something like that. Bad cess to it.
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>> It's your motor in your hands Tigger. Surely it isn't beyond you to do some
>> creative expenses chits and so on? In my day we just named a figure and
>> they paid it.
>>
You can't do that - KF calls the lease company for authorisation and they won't change the tyres unless they're at 2mm or lower.
You'd think the KF guys would say the right thing to get a sale but in my experience they erred the other way - I had a huge row when I took a car in with tyre worn flush to the tread wear indicators an KF to the main controller they were at 3mm. Once they’d said that there was no way he was going to authorise replacement.
Another time they put Continental eco tyres on the front to replace worn out sticky Dunlop’s. Continenetal tell you not to mix eco and non-eco. I was told if I didn’t like it I could buy my own tyres.
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It's possible that KF take the risk on some fleets' tyres.
Not my area, but I can see how simply allowing users to go and get a check at KF and have new tyres creates two moral hazards. One is that the users will put in for new tyres that they don't really need, and KF will go with the flow/massage the measurements as it benefits them; the other that KF will manufacture their own sales e.g. fitting a new tyre of set of tyres instead of just mending a puncture, or fitting the tyres with the biggest margin.
One way round that is for fleets to do a "fixed price" or "pence per mile" deal with KF to replace tyres as needed. The paying party then removes risk, and KF is incentivised to not fit unnecessary replacements. Maybe it doesn't happen, but it would certainly be on my ideas list as a fleet operator.
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It is to KF's advantage *not* to replace tyres. They win / retain the business based on the costs to maintain the fleet over a period of time, *not* on the prices of individual tyres.
If KF want to be the primary supplier they have to show that they will be the lowest cost over the period.
And replacing tyres unnecessarily would harm that.
However, the time I faced this issue then asking PHH to confirm in writing that *they* had made the decision not to replace the tyre, rather than the supplier (which I think was National, but it was a long time ago) caused them to authorise replacements.
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Motability also use KF and won't authorise tyre replacement unless it's almost absolutely on the limit according to a friend.
Even make, he says, Motability owners arrange and pay the cost of an MOT at the end of the three years of use.....
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To those company car drivers, if you went well past legal on the tyres, would there be any comebacks? Does anyone check them, would the company changing them bother?
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I haven't had a leased company car for donkeys years, but I do remember the reluctance to change tyres until they were absolutely on the legal limit.
Now, quite often, not always of course, but a fair percentage of company car drivers do huge mileages and a thousand miles in a week is not uncommon.
So, you get the crazy scenario where the lease co refuses to change the tyres on a Monday because "there's life left" but they are actually illegal by the end of that working week.
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I take it yours is purchased so the company decides?
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Fortunately, I get to decide thank goodness. I am at one level lucky in so far as my immediate boss owns the company and he couldn't care less about relatively "minor" expenses claims provided they are valid. I've always taken the view that I'll spend whatever I would if it was my own money. Seems to work for all concerned. Never had anything questioned anyway.
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Sounds good, i guess that's the difference between big and small organisations.
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KF appear to have different rules for the mobile fitters than the garages. Apparently they don't sort the tyres changed by the mobile guys so can't check up on them later.
I always used the mobile crews and never had a problem getting them changed.
Only once managed to get the brand I wanted.
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Charged £360 for an £11.65 puncture repair - Tigger
