"A police spokesman said: “Incidents such as these are rare but we are reminding the public to only stop for police vehicles displaying flashing blue lights.
“Motorists can also ask any officer for ID and their shoulder number which is unique to them. Please call 999 if you believe you have been stopped by a person who is impersonating a police officer."
That really doesn't hang together too well from a logic perspective does it?
How the hell am I supposed to know it's a police vehicle?
Is it OK to not stop for unmarked police vehicles now then?
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I think I am right in saying that to perform a stop an unmarked police vehicle must contain an officer in uniform.
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>> I think I am right in saying that to perform a stop an unmarked police
>> vehicle must contain an officer in uniform.
>>
That must surely be the case, otherwise any Tom, Dick or Harriet might try to stop you.
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How can you tell an Officer is in uniform in the dark ? It's a myth - a variation of which is that an Officer must be wearing their helmet/hat/cap when they report you for a traffic offence....not a defence to be depending on.
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>> I think I am right in saying that to perform a stop an unmarked police
>> vehicle must contain an officer in uniform.
>>
I'm often intrigued to know when the definition of "officer" became widened to include all ranks.
Originally the expression was "Officers and men of the Blankshire Constabulary", which is the equivalent to useage in the armed services.
Not that I'm going to try that line of argument when stopped by Police Constable Plod :)
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I believe that some PCSOs use Panda cars, do they have stop authority?
Last edited by: Old Navy on Tue 2 Feb 16 at 11:50
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>>Is it OK to not stop for unmarked police vehicles now then?
Being as we live in 'interesting times', the only way I would stop for an unmarked car would be if it had blues & twos a'going.
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Two seconds on Amazon will get you a set of blues for under a tenner, an ID badge for a bit less and even a complete "uniform" for a few pounds. All sold for "parties" or whatever and wouldn't bear very close scrutiny, but a flash of blues in the mirror, a hatted man in a dark shirt waving what looks like a badge, a positive manner on his part, and who is going to argue the "£60 FPN" or whatever, especially if you're not that acquainted with the police or being stopped. I bet I'd fall for that if it were done right.
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That's a lot of effort to collect a few £60 fines especially when you are looking at five years in jail for impersonating a police officer.
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Well ok, carjacking perhaps, or a colleague "searching" the car. Once you have someone stopped and are in control, I bet you can get away with lots.
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All the more reason to follow the police guidelines above.
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>> All the more reason to follow the police guidelines above.
>>
The completely impractical ones.....
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>>Well ok, carjacking perhaps
Indeedy - the OP was referring to a suspected car-jacking attempt.
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A close female friend got the blue light treatment a couple of years ago very early in the morning (3AM). She was in a company car and it wasn't shown as being insured (but was under the group policy).
She refused to pull over in a dark unlit country road and called 999 from her mobile. The call centre was happy for her to drive to the local police station and identified the patrol car and let them know.
Of course the police station she drove to was closed - but they had arranged for a fully marked car to be there.
Apparently the officers were totally understanding.
Every time I have pulled over officers have been very polite and I would be suspicious if they were not (never got a ticket touch wood - but a good telling off when I was 21 for speeding up a hill - I told the officer that if I hadn't put my foot down the car would never have got up the hill! :-)
Last edited by: zippy on Tue 2 Feb 16 at 00:10
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>>She refused to pull over in a dark unlit country road and called 999 from her mobile. The call centre was happy for her to drive to the local police station and identified the patrol car and let them know.
That's what my wife says she would do, so she's not as *dumb as I thought.
*She's from Essex!!
Last edited by: Dog on Tue 2 Feb 16 at 08:18
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I can only once remember being pulled over by the police in the UK. It was a very helpful policeman warning me that something was awry with my rear suspension. No ticket - just (genuinely) helpful advice. I got it booked into a garage the next day - the rear void bushes on my cortina had gone.
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My missus was pulled over last year by a plod in a black unmarked 5 series bmw, he was on his own and wearing a black polo shirt and plain black trousers.
He stood in front of her car with his hand raised to stop her, and then told her she was speeding (35 in a 30 that used to be a 40) and sent her on her way.
As far as I can see this plod did just about everything wrong, the way he did it, the way he was dressed (no id provided) and the vehicle used, and how he managed to judge her speed is a mystery. I rang our local plod to report a possible fake copper on the loose but they didn't show any interest apart from telling me they 'had an unmarked car in that area'
I went back after my wife told me to see if he was still there but he'd since disappeared. Probably run over by someone for doing the same stupid stunt.
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>> My missus was pulled over last year by a plod in a black unmarked 5
>> series bmw, he was on his own and wearing a black polo shirt and plain
>> black trousers.
>>
>> He stood in front of her car with his hand raised to stop her, and
>> then told her she was speeding (35 in a 30 that used to be a
>> 40) and sent her on her way.
A Dashcam might have proved useful.
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Drift alert !
I am white. One of my best friends is black. We are about the same age. I've hardly ever been randomly stopped by the police. It has happened to him regularly all his adult life. He is, for a bit more background, an excellent and safe driver of a series of quality company cars.
Wrong isn't it? At all manner of levels. Deeply wrong.
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>> I am white. One of my best friends is black. We are about the same
>> age. I've hardly ever been randomly stopped by the police. It has happened to him
>> regularly all his adult life.
Miss B had a lecturer at Uni who was black. He had a similar experience.
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Difficult though.
If statistics show that 75% of drink drivers are 50 year old business men returning from lunch, wouldn't you expect the police to target such a profile? I think I would.
In fact, if the police randomly stopped 50% businessmen and 50% housewives, then wouldn't you think the housewives were being unfairly targetted, since they were receiving far more police attention then could seemingly be justified?
Would forcing the profile of 50% Businessmen and 50% housewives not be akin to positive and artificial discrimination rather than simply targetting the person most likely to offend?
However, at the same time targetting someone by a physical characteristic that they have no control over is most certainly discrimination.
Like I said, difficult.
I had a Jamaican girlfriend and shopping with her in country towns and villages her was frequently a miserable experience because of the type of attention from the older shop assistants.
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Difficult or not, I have zero tolerance for it. If someone ( anyone ) is driving badly, or their vehicle gives cause for concern, then fine, pull them over and deal with it appropriately. But random stops on the basis of "profile" should be unacceptable in a "civilised" society.
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>But random stops on the basis of "profile" should be unacceptable in a "civilised" society.
If only we lived in one.
I do agree though. I may have mentioned my dislike of discrimination before.
Personally I'd favour upping the police budget, and the taxes to support it, so that they had the resources to stop everyone they wanted to rather than having to worry about how to "target".
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>> I do agree though. I may have mentioned my dislike of discrimination before.
>>
Do you find similar where you are Mark ie stop the gringo let locals go untouched or is Chile discrimination free?
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>>Do you find similar where you are Mark ie stop the gringo let locals go untouched or is Chile discrimination free?
There's a big question......
The situation is generally advantageous towards Gringos, although you are far more likely to be cheated. The Police and Establishment will behave fairly according to the law with you, but they will give no leeway which they might to a local, but neither will they abuse you, which they might to a local.
The Gringo is regarded as better educated, more aware, more reliable and more likely to cause official trouble if things go wrong.
The local is more disrespectful towards authority but more likely to understand the rules he must obey.
Its really, really complicated. The way people think is quite different although on major moral issues we are similar. Many gringos struggle here, equally many go native. There are fewer who manage to relate to the local without going native themselves.
Sometimes Gringos do the whole "we're better" thing and expect preferential treatment.
It also depends on age. We get travellers here who typically irritate everybody, locals and gringos alike. They get conned, defrauded, stolen from, abused etc. etc. Which either annoys me or i think serve them right depending on how recently I have had contact with them myself.
Petty crime is rife and almost entirely the territory of the poorer local. Exploitation is much more the purview of the rich businessman or the incoming gringo.
I will *not* be stopped driving because there is *any* suspicion that I am stealing or up to theft-oriented "no good". Whereas a local may be stopped simply because of the area of town or time of night he is about it.
However, they would never stop a local to see if his expensive SUV is legal and all his papers are in order.
The injustices are many. Overall it is probably very slightly in the gringos' favour.
Morally it is troublesome. But you just have to live with it, it is deeply embedded from those who are in awe of foreigners, those who revile them and the vast majority who simply don't care.
They class such things as "First World Problems" and mock the people who worry about them. Sometimes appropriately.
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Let me just be very clear;
The statements I made above are the perceptions that exist here. They are NOT statements that I would profess or hold to be true.
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>> Wrong isn't it? At all manner of levels. Deeply wrong.
>>
Well I'm white but drive older and slightly interesting cars and wear scruffy clothes. I've been pulled over quite a few times for "random" checks, but sense that the nice policeman realises his mistake the moment I open my mouth.
We then have a polite conversation on the lines of "not many of these about now", and part on good terms after a lot of "so sorry to have bothered you Sir", and I resist the temptation to impersonate Lord Peter Wimsey.
Wrong, isn't it? At all manner of levels. Deeply wrong. :)
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>>Well I'm white but drive older and slightly interesting cars and wear scruffy clothes
You'd get on well with Lud
And me!!
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The only phoney copper I can remember is from long before I had a car, in Bamburgh, Northumberland. As night had fallen and we had no money, with another man I was looking for a place to sleep. A geezer in civvies turned up and claimed to be a special constable. I told him to sod off and he did.
Eventually slept on the floor of the cricket pavilion which wasn't locked. Damn cold and uncomfortable it was too.
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>> A geezer in civvies turned up and claimed to be a special constable.
I forgot to mention that he said he was arresting us and tried to take us to the fuzz shop. That was when I told him to sod off.
A lot of people think that if you are younger than them you must be easily intimidated and biddable. An occasional kick will put them in their place usually.
Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Tue 2 Feb 16 at 19:34
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Look at the statistics for crime committed by ethnic minorities. Stopping a car driven by a certain sort of person can be an easy way of detecting crime.
What's the highest percentage by religion of population of our prisons? It certainly ain't Christian! Then compare that with the breakdown of our population by religion compared to prison population.
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>> Look at the statistics for crime committed by ethnic minorities.
>> What's the highest percentage by religion of population of our prisons?
Ahem. Maybe the justice system is not colourblind. David Cameron thinks that's a possibility
too.
www.theguardian.com/law/2016/jan/30/race-bias-court-system
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Tue 2 Feb 16 at 20:14
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Phoney coppers - spamcan61
