Motoring Discussion > The little car, drive in France without a licence	Miscellaneous
Thread Author: henry k	Replies: 54

New Mon 4 Jan 16 10:12   The little car, drive in France without a licence - henry k

www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35210572 ....But in France, no licence? No problem. You can simply go shopping for a VSP a voiture sans permis - a small two-seater car that anyone aged 14 or over can take out on the road with as little as four hours' experience behind the wheel, sometimes not even that. A good idea ? Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 10:30   The little car, drive in France without a licence - CGNorwich

It's one of those anachronisms that sort of works for the French. Nobody can really justify it but banning VSP's would be politically difficult in rural communities. The French authorities are more pragmatic that the British. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 10:35   The little car, drive in France without a licence - movilogo

I have seen few of these cars in Rome last month! On other news, 80% of all cars in Rome has dents/scapes. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 10:41   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Harleyman

They do have a more basic version in the UK, which can even be driven on pavements. It's called a mobility scooter. Reply to this message | Report message       1

New Mon 4 Jan 16 11:44   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sherlock47

Presumably it can also be driven when you have an alcohol suspended licence? (in France). not sure I would like drive one in a competitive urban enviroment, the BP (Boulevard Periferique, paris) would be challenging :) Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 11:51   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sherlock47

Should have read the article first! Surprised that one of my French friends did not acquire one for his 12 months. Better than using a moped! Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 17:30   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Armel Coussine

I like the current Fiat 500. A slightly tweaked one would suit me down to the ground and save me money. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 17:33   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

Go for a Panda AC. Same car, more room, less money. Good fun too. I want one but couldn't live with the size on a purely practical level. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 17:42   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Armel Coussine

Panda's a good motor by accounts although ungainly looking. It's not the size that prevents me from having one, it's the cost since I still haven't won the lottery. But I like the style of the 500. Proper Italian Fiat designed to squeal its tyres on the marble slabs in Rome. Rear engine and rwd too. It's got everything. Last edited by: Armel Coussine on Mon 4 Jan 16 at 17:44 Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 17:46   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

>> Rear engine and rwd too. It's got everything. Eh? Not the new ones I'm pretty sure. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 17:54   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Armel Coussine

>> Not the new ones I'm pretty sure. I haven't checked, so perhaps not the latest. But a recent one anyway, has an aircooled vertical twin in the tail and a sort of flattened tailpipe. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 18:05   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Armel Coussine

>> has an aircooled vertical twin in the tail No it hasn't... has the aircooled twin but in the nose and is fwd. Wrong again... but I liked rear-engined Fiats, hired a sky-blue 600 in Italy back in the day. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 17:37   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Armel Coussine

I tried to add: France overall has much lower traffic density than this country. Small very low-powered cars have always been usable by children with indulgent, progressive parents there. Dunno how legally, but the French are cavalier with that stuff. I was terribly envious of the French when small. Why was my country so humourless and po-faced about cars of all things? It just wasn't fair! Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 21:13   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Tigger

>> Presumably it can also be driven when you have an alcohol suspended licence? (in France). Yes, where my father lives in rural France, the main customers are people who have lost their licences. Reply to this message | Report message

New Mon 4 Jan 16 22:10   The little car, drive in France without a licence - T junction

A friend of mine had one here in the UK for a while before he moved to France. I think he was looking for the cheapest method to commute between here and Carlisle (about 30 miles each way!). When he moved to France he took it with him in the back of a Transit van. I had a short drive in it over there when I visited, it was an open topped one and I felt very vulnerable even on quiet backroads. Had a diesel engine, can't remember if one or two pot or how many gears, but shook like mad when idling and just forward and reverse on the gear selector. Very basic transport but has its place. Reply to this message | Report message

New Tue 5 Jan 16 19:46   The little car, drive in France without a licence - mikeyb

Our head office is France. Apparently its not unusual to see a few of the senior managers driving them after driving bans Reply to this message | Report message

New Wed 6 Jan 16 22:45   The little car, drive in France without a licence - John Boy

This topic reminded me of this little one-seater, which I saw at a local music festival in '03. I haven't seen it since, can't decipher the badge and can't find one on Google. Anyone know what it is? farm2.staticflickr.com/1561/24135656911_d2f00e598d_c.jpg[/img] Reply to this message | Report message

New Wed 6 Jan 16 22:57   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

......Qpod City? Reply to this message | Report message

New Wed 6 Jan 16 23:14   The little car, drive in France without a licence - John Boy

Looks like the one! Thankyou. www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3ReqySokVw Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 10:05   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

..hadn't seen the "three wheel" version before, but 4-wheel Qpods have been much discussed as potential for towing behind a motorcaravan, and your picture just looked the same (but not quite), so Google was my friend. Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 10:45   The little car, drive in France without a licence - John Boy

They look like a whole lot of fun: www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YqAIGhKywo The "three wheel" version doesn't appear to be made any more. There are 5 in the range. This one looks the most appealing to me: www.qpod.co.uk/qpod-sport.php Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 19:46   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

I do innocently wonder why those with motor caravans tow small cars behind them. Presumably they also have a 'normal' car at home so could have just bought a caravan and towed it with the family car. Or am I missing something? It also occurs to me that those who have motor caravans and don't tow a little car or have bikes or whatever must at least occasionally get the whole thing set up, awning out, ( see I know about awnings ) dinner on, wine open and realise " oh crap we've no milk ! " Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:06   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

...I'm sure you're right. Never fancied towing a caravan or a trailer, never mind a car. TBH, one of the attractions of motorcaravanning for us is that it supports our outdoor pursuits, and encourages (much) cycling and walking on our travels. So, walking gear is permanently stored in the 'van, and bikes are the matter of minutes to put on the back. It doesn't take us long to pack up and drive off (maybe 20 minutes) - if it's wet we'll probably move on and sight-see in the 'van, if it isn't, stay put and walk or cycle. I don't think that it is a lifestyle that will appeal to all, but it suits us. (and in Europe, towing a car behind a motorhome is generally a no-no (illegal), which is being increasingly enforced. In the UK, it is currently neither legal nor illegal (one of the vagaries of our legal system), a situation that will change only if there is a test case). Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:13   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Bromptonaut

We started with idea of a motorhome or motorcaravan and then remembered all the occasions I'd gone off in car with one kid for bread leaving Mrs B and other kid in tent getting coffee etc. OTOH towing more than 1200kg (a modest three/four berth) needs a pretty big car. Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:18   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sooty123

>> We started with idea of a motorhome or motorcaravan What's the difference? Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:21   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Bromptonaut

>> What's the difference? AIUI a motorcaravan is adapted/converted from a panel van and retains its basic dimensions. A motor-caravan is coachbuilt onto a chassis/cab unit. Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:52   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sooty123

>> AIUI a motorcaravan is adapted/converted from a panel van and retains its basic dimensions. A >> motor-caravan is coachbuilt onto a chassis/cab unit. >> Right, I think I'd call the first a campervan, never heard the word 'motorcaravan' before. Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:57   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

Ah, in that case maybe you've never got into conversation about house prices with anyone who tarmacs drives or sells clothes pegs and heather for a living then Sooty... ( and favours fleeces and bobble hats) :-) Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 21:02   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sooty123

>> Ah, in that case maybe you've never got into conversation about house prices with anyone >> who tarmacs drives or sells clothes pegs and heather for a living then Sooty... >> >> ( and favours fleeces and bobble hats) >> >> >> :-) >> >> Nope, can't say I ever have! Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 22:28   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Harleyman

>> Right, I think I'd call the first a campervan, never heard the word 'motorcaravan' before. >> >> If you're young and have a family, or you're in any way trendy, you have a campervan. If you're an old fossil you have a motor caravan. Reply to this message | Report message       1

New Fri 8 Jan 16 06:25   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sooty123

> If you're young and have a family, or you're in any way trendy, you have a campervan. >> >> If you're an old fossil you have a motor caravan. Ah right it's an old fashioned word, cheers. Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 09:37   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

......note to self: I must use campervan, not motorcaravan..... I must use campervan, not motorcaravan..... .... (in reality, all of the terminology is interchangeable, though campervan is more associated with the conversion of a commercial panel van than the other types). Whatever type, mine have always been "the 'van", though I quite like the French "camping-car", which seems to cover all the ground for them. Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 11:14   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Dog

>>I must use campervan, not motorcaravan..... >>I must use campervan, not motorcaravan..... I had a motorhome, which is distinct from a camper van, but could possibly be called a motor caravan? Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:56   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Bromptonaut

Read before hitting Post.... >> AIUI a motorcaravan is adapted/converted from a panel van and retains its basic dimensions. A >> motor-caravan motorhome is coachbuilt onto a chassis/cab unit. . Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:21   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

Dunno but the first sounds like something you'd end up in if life hasn't gone quite as well as you'd hoped and the second sounds like something you'd have if it has but you like wearing fleeces. Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:26   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

...have you had access to my CV.....? Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:30   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

What, you've actually listed fleece wearing as a hobby or interest? Not, erm, matching ones please? Where are you on bobble hats as a matter of interest? ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:35   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

>> What, you've actually listed fleece wearing as a hobby or interest? ...occupation.... (Oh, and I must have about 50 bobble-hats) ;-) Last edited by: tyrednemotional on Thu 7 Jan 16 at 20:37 Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:37   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

Fab! :-) Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 21:08   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

Here's one for the environmentally conscious - tinyurl.com/hl4nz8a Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 21:47   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

...but with my knees, it would have to be an e-Bike Caravan....... Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 22:21   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

>> ...but with my knees... Side effect of all that praying for forgiveness for causing all those tailbacks? ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 22:25   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

...no, lack of exercise using the clutch and accelerator..... ;-) Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:17   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sooty123

In the UK, it is currently neither legal nor illegal (one >> of the vagaries of our legal system), a situation that will change only if there >> is a test case). >> I thought it was illegal here too. If you want to tow a car it has to be on a trailer, the only people allowed to use those dollies were breakdown companies? Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:27   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Bromptonaut

>> I thought it was illegal here too. If you want to tow a car it >> has to be on a trailer, the only people allowed to use those dollies were >> breakdown companies? I think we've done this before. The law about towing weights etc is complex. IF you can sort the towed car so it's braked, within the towing limit on the hauling vehicle's V5 and signalling lights work then you may be OK. Whether all those things can be dealt with at once is another matter. Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:34   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

...but a dolly isn't used. As far as the authorities are concerned, whilst being towed the towed vehicle ceases to be a car, and becomes "a trailer" (and subject to the braking and other regulations thereof) Whilst this is the current official stance, none of it is covered in statute, and it is thus neither illegal or legal, simply officially ignored until/unless there is (need for) a test case. The UK stance is, however, imminently at threat from EU harmonisation, and in the majority of EU countries, the practice is already legislated against (and, as I stated, increasingly enforced). Reply to this message | Report message

New Thu 7 Jan 16 20:58   The little car, drive in France without a licence - sooty123

Right, the only cars I remember had a dolly IIRC, although it's been a while since I've seen one so I might have been wrong. Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 11:43   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Mike Hannon

Some time ago I stood on a street corner in Oradour-sur-Glane and saw an enormous six-wheeled motor caravan towing a trailer with a BMW 5-series Touring on it. That must have been around the time I gave up on the rest of the human race. Incidentally, you may not need a licence to drive some types of voiturette or sans-permis in France but the compulsory insurance is eye-wateringly expensive, for obvious reasons. Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 14:20   The little car, drive in France without a licence - John Boy

>> ... That must have been around the time I gave up on the rest of the human race. >> That sounds a bit radical. Would you care to explain or point me to a relevant topic? Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 15:50   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Mike Hannon

It's just me. When I passed the 65 mark it had a remarkably ageing effect, which the monthly return from the government of money I lent them years ago hasn't really made up for. Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 16:14   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Runfer D'Hills

Take heart Mike, it's not just you, I'm considerably younger than you but I'm not all that keen on humans either! Some of them are alright I suppose, but most of them are ultimately disappointing. :-) Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 16:32   The little car, drive in France without a licence - John Boy

I'm 72 and still don't feel like that, so I'm obviously more positive and optimistic than I thought. Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 17:14   The little car, drive in France without a licence - Dog

>>When I passed the 65 mark it had a remarkably ageing effect I'm 65 next year. I feel 45 (when I visit her) 65 sounds 'king very old - perhaps I'll shuffle before then. :} Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 17:25   The little car, drive in France without a licence - WillDeBeest

Oradour is hardly the place you'd choose for a reminder of the better side of human nature, is it? Reply to this message | Report message

New Fri 8 Jan 16 17:33   The little car, drive in France without a licence - tyrednemotional

....indeed not, but it is a popular destination for motorcaravan motorhome campervan owners...... Reply to this message | Report message