Daughter has just bought a diesel Kia Ceed to replace the old petrol Seat Ibiza. Seems a nice car.
One of the many insurances the dealer tried to sell was a mis-fuelling one for £50 a year. I advised against it, but told her I knew a place where someone could give me a first rate recommendation for a tried and tested device which would avoid mis-fuelling.
And I know the obvious answer, but I want belt and braces.
Any suggestions?
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I cannot understand why there isn't a common colour code for fuel pumps and filler caps.
Don't the pumps shout "are you sure you want diesel?" anymore?
I don't know the Ceed, but is there a way of attacking a large reminder onto the fuel filler cap itself - like a big fluffy tail with the word DERV on it?
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>> I cannot understand why there isn't a common colour code for fuel pumps and filler
>> caps.
>> Don't the pumps shout "are you sure you want diesel?" anymore?
>>
>> I don't know the Ceed, but is there a way of attacking a large reminder
>> onto the fuel filler cap itself - like a big fluffy tail with the word
>> DERV on it?
I think there is a universal problem with the idea that you can manage these problems with signs, colours etc. Specifically, that people soon stop processing them, and the moment when they lose concentration they make mistakes even with big signs plastered everywhere.
Put a "mind you head" sticker on a low doorframe and most new people with see it and duck, the person who has walked through that doorway a thousand times, ducks through habit, but the one day that he is distracted he manages to whack his head on the frame of a door that, embarrassingly, has a big yellow "mind your head" sticker on it (because his brain hasn't bothered to process it the last 990 times).
Things should be designed right in the first place. I could not put the battery into my camera the wrong way round if I wanted to, likewise it shouldn't be physically possible for me to put petrol in my diesel car. Don't leave it to incompetent or distracted end users to heed stickers...design it so they have to get it right
Last edited by: SteelSpark on Sat 26 Jun 10 at 18:31
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maybe from ...
www.mis-fuelling.co.uk/?gclid=CMLK3tifvqICFVKZ2AodeSMB6Q
* Fuel Angel -www.misfuellingprevention.co.uk/
* Caparo RightFuel --www.caparorightfuel.com/
* SoloDiesel --www.solodiesel.co.uk/solution.asp
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...And I know the obvious answer, but I want belt and braces...
Very wise.
There are so many instances of misfuels, they cannot all be down to non-thinking idiots.
I know of otherwise intelligent people who have done it, so it is a very easy mistake to make.
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Off on a tangent...
The ideal would be the situation we had when cars ran on leaded or unleaded... the Leaed nozzle wouldn't fit into a UL filler cap.
maybe industry should introduce a square filler for derv?
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I have tried several anti misfuel devices and the best that I have found is the "Fuel Angel".
It is well made, simple, me proof, and it works. On my Ceed it does spit back a little fuel on a complete fill but if you are aware of this it is not a problem, the tank gurgles before it spits. :-)
www.misfuellingprevention.co.uk/
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sat 26 Jun 10 at 18:43
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>> I have tried several anti misfuel devices and the best that I have found is
>> the "Fuel Angel".
>>
>> It is well made, simple, me proof, and it works.
>>
>> www.misfuellingprevention.co.uk/
I had to chuckle at the satisfied customer quotes. Real or not, the first one blames his wife, the second one says "WE misfuelled our car" and the third one is from a woman.
Where is the quote from a satisfied male customer saying, "yeah, hand ups, I misfuelled, but I still feel like a real man..." :)
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The only proper answer to this question is, of course, to buy a Focus:
tinyurl.com/36mukut
Apologies for taking so long to post that, I've been a bit slow today - must be the warm weather.
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>> The only proper answer to this question is, of course, to buy a Focus:
>>
Been there, done that, I prefer the Ceed.
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Due to life's ever fluctuating fortunes, no matter how financially comfortable I may feel on a given day or stage in time, or how diverted I may be by other musings, I still can't conciously spend £60 on fuel without thinking about it, usually somewhat ruefully, at least in the passing. This in itself is something of a reasonably reliable misfueling prevention device. Might be a Scottish thing of course......
:-)
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There used to be a universal colour code for the hoses - Red = Regular leaded, Blue = 4 star leaded, Black = Diesel. Then they introduced Green = unleaded.
Volvos for one had their petrol caps coloured to match. It was all so simple. You just selected the pump with the hose that matched your filler cap.
Then suddenly it all went haywire and they started replacing the hoses with colours at random. Why?
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>> There used to be a universal colour code for the hoses - Red = Regular
>> leaded, Blue = 4 star leaded, Black = Diesel. Then they introduced Green = unleaded.
That addressed the problem of fuel confusion, unfortunately BP jiggered it by using dark blue for 'ultimate' products. Nearest I've ever come to a genuine mistake - I really thought the trigger I'd picked would dispense derv - only the final check saved me.
The other one is where, for whatever reason, the brain suspends normal faculty service, like the low beam example quoted above. Only a 'murphy proof' mechanical device will stop all of these, and even then 'Murphy' will find a way to override it!!
Last edited by: Bromptonaut on Sat 26 Jun 10 at 22:33
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>> Might be a Scottish thing of course......
>>
>> :-)
>>
Nah, unless it is contagious, over 20 years of diesel driving and not even close to a misfuel.
I have had a device fitted for a couple of years, since my Brother in Law put £70 of petrol in his diesel Omega, (having owned it for four years). Stupid must run in that family, my OH has it as well.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sat 26 Jun 10 at 20:52
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everytime i go to my local garage i nearly misfuel
they have a sneaky pump that is extra expensive stuff with 2 hb pencil leads in but you dont realise unless you look at price per litre
the cads
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After SWMBO mis-fuelled her car, I brought a device from Halfords (£6).
I put this on the inside of the fuel flap but deliberately did not tell her.
Nedless to say she had a shock when she went to fill up with a voice announcement of "Caution. diesel. caution".
The device is a small light activated device that operates a repeated message for several seconds when the fuel cap is opened.
What should really be in place is different shaped fuel nozzles (A bit like a babies toy with a circle, triangle and a square shape).
After all you can't make a square peg fit in a round hole.
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>>What should really be in place is different shaped fuel nozzles (A bit like a babies toy with a circle, triangle and a square shape).
Not necessary. Different sized holes are OK, as long as the larger diameter ones have interlock levers that have to be moved to allow the full insertion of the spout.
The wider spout operates the interlock and goes in to the wider filler neck. The narrower spout doesn't. I imagine that this is how the Ford misfuel-inhibitor works but I haven't had the opportunity to look at one.
Conversely the wider spout just won't go into the narrower filler.
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>> >>What should really be in place is different shaped fuel nozzles (A bit like a
>> babies toy with a circle, triangle and a square shape).
>>
This is basically how the Fuel Angel works. It has a metal tube which fits inside the diesel nozzle, but not the smaller petrol one. So the petrol nozzle will not enter the filler.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sun 27 Jun 10 at 16:21
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>> What should really be in place is different shaped fuel nozzles (A bit like a
>> babies toy with a circle, triangle and a square shape).
>>
I saw an engineering company website with fully drawn proposals for such a system but have never been able to find it again. From memory, the diesel nozzle, and its associated filler neck adaptor, was oval, with the narrow part of the oval being too small for a current petrol nozzle to fit in.
Last edited by: Bill Payer on Sun 27 Jun 10 at 18:15
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>>with the narrow part of the oval being too small for a current petrol nozzle to fit in.
...but then neither would the wider diameter diesel nozzle. The problem with the shape-sorter approach is that you have to change the nozzles as well as the fillers, which is a none starter.
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I think you also need some clearance to prevent fouling and to allow for air to escape as the fuel goes in.
So having, say, a square diesel nozzle that was just a few millimetres smaller than a square filler neck would not work.
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Since most people are now well acquainted with "pay at the pump" technology, would it be an idea to make the motorist press a large green (for petrol) or black (for diesel) button before commencing the transaction?
No need for anything more complicated; you could still have all the nozzles, no need for seperate buttons for super unleaded or bio-diesel, just seperate petrol and diesel at the start before its too late.
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If someone can pick up the wrong nozzle they can hit the wrong button. It only takes someone driving a car they are not familiar with.
Last edited by: Old Navy on Sun 27 Jun 10 at 22:49
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>> If someone can pick up the wrong nozzle they can hit the wrong button. It
>> only takes someone driving a car they are not familiar with.
>>
I'd hazard a guess that most mis-fuels are done by people who just don't look at all, like the guy who'd pumped his Honda motorbike full of diesel in Morrisons Carmarthen a couple of weeks back.
My suggestion would involve customer pressing button, pump then lights up sign that says "diesel" or "petrol" then you grab the relevant nozzle. If you grab the wrong nozzle you don't get fuel.
However, as the Americans say, you can't fix stupid!
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Wouldn't it be simpler all round if car manufacturers put the filler cap for their petrol models on one side of the car, and the filler cap for diesel models on the other side.
You could go even further by fuel stations making the delivery pipes shorter (so people couldn't reach around the back of the car) and having one side of the pump for diesel and the other for petrol - that obviously matches up with where car manufacturers have put the filler cap.
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@VxFan
..because that is yet another idea that would leave a large number of existing cars unable to refuel.
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When this discussion happened elsewhere I thought the best idea was a RID solution where each car had a cheap chip stuck around the filler and each pump read the chip and only delivered the right kind of fuel. Certainly for the car that is a very cheap option.
Anyway I have looked at the devices suggested and she will be getting a Fuel Angel - thanks to all for replies and suggestions
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>> ..because that is yet another idea that would leave a large number of existing cars
>> unable to refuel.
In which case the government should be all for it as they're continually trying to force older cars off the road.
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>> I have had a device fitted for a couple of years, since my Brother in
>> Law put £70 of petrol in his diesel Omega, (having owned it for four years).
>> Stupid must run in that family, my OH has it as well.
>>
Oh Dear, My Son in Law filled their diesel Honda FRV with petrol last night. He usually drives a petrol car, my daughter was unimpressed to have "her" car missfuled. I must buy them a Fuel Angel.
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If we didn't have diesel, drivers wouldn't have this problem!
:-D
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Or better still ban petrol! :)
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I've mentioned this before, but when I had my M3 I once ended up at a Shell fuel station, something I tried to avoid as they don't sell "normal" 98 Octane petrol, only the ridiculously expensive snake oil "V-Power". However I was very low on fuel so I stopped next to the snake oil pump, put the nozzle in and started to fill up. To my horror I then noticed a large label on the pump handle saying "Diesel" so I pulled the nozzle out. It was then I realised that it was actually an advert for the V-Power snake oil diesel product that Shell, in their wisdom, had put on the handle of a petrol pump exactly in the place where the fuel type would normally be. Thank you Shell.
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>> And I know the obvious answer, but I want belt and braces.
>>
>> Any suggestions?
>>
Give her a belt and/or braces to wrap around the pump nozzle before she tries to insert it into the fuel filler neck. When she finds the nozzle won't enter the filler neck it'll prompt her to think about whether she's got the right pump.
:-D
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Oh the shame of it. I "may" have misfuelled a diesel at the weekend.
Was sure I'd lifted a black nozzle , but a sneaky return peek at the garage reveals there was a navy blue one next to the diesel, dispensing petrol. And all the hoses are black as well.
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Avoiding mis-fuelling - Ian (Cape Town)
