Seemingly simple question. Is the clutch release bearing a bearing within the manual transmission?
If not, why not?
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No, because it is part of the clutch. Which is a wear and tear component. Having said that I suppose the clutch is part of the transmission. The definition depends on who is paying for the repair.
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I sense an insurance or warranty claim lurking here :)
If a car has a manual gearbox then it can be described as having a manual transmission. So in that sense any bearing in the transmission train is "part" of the manual transmission. And it can with more justification be so-claimed than say a wheel bearing, because only manual transmission cars have clutch release bearings.
But it is not part of the specific component, the gearbox, properly being part of the clutch bell housing. I suppose if the car has an integral gearbox and bellhousing cast as one unit, instead of being detachable, it could begin to be argued that it forms part of the gearbox.
The commonsense argument would follow the sales catalogue - clutches are normally sold as sets of three items, pressure plate, plate, and release bearing, quite distinct from the gearbox.
Which brings us full circle to my point above - does use of the word "manual" limit the meaning to the gearbox alone?
What answer do you want, and I'll suit the argument:)
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>> What answer do you want, ...........
I think we need to know why the question was asked.
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My common sense, layman's answer would be No, it's not. My reasoning is that it can be (indeed, should be) changed whilst the clutch is being replaced, rather than it being an integral component requiring a full gearbox strip-down to get at. Hope that makes sense?
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Oh dear, MM. Not having a tussle with our mutual (now erstwhile on my part because of them being squirming blaggards) warranty company are you?
I hope you're not trying to force them to pay out a disputed claim, which would only serve to bump up other customers' premiums?
Do hope I'm wrong, though and all is well with your wheels.
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I'd say it is a part of the transmission, but not "within the manual transmission", whatever that means.
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>> Seemingly simple question. Is the clutch release bearing a bearing within the manual transmission?
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>> If not, why not?
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Are you asking whether the clutch release bearing is considered to be part of the gearbox?
Last edited by: L'escargot on Tue 1 Jun 10 at 13:42
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>>If not, why not?>>
The gearbox is kind of a self contained unit, the release bearing is part of the clutch actuation mechanism and is generally seen as a wear and tear item like the clutch it'self.
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>> My reasoning is that it can be (indeed, should be) changed whilst the clutch is being replaced,
That I did not know.
It's funny how warranty companies don't ever cover the bits that actually DO go wrong...
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Changing the clutch but not the thrust bearing is rather like changing the oil, but not the filter.
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>> It's funny how warranty companies don't ever cover the bits that actually DO go wrong...
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Sometimes they do. Except you'll usually find that the covered part has gone wrong at the wrong time, or under other extenuating circumstances. Or there was an "R" in the month.
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clutch release bearing wear is relative to how one drives though so even a new car will probably not have this covered
i like to watch how people drive when im sat next to them and many many of them ride the clutch unknowingly, bacause basically they are bad insecure drivers who are expecting a large behemoth jump out at them any second and they must put the clutch down at any cost irrespective that they are going to die in a ball of flames that would put the beginnings of the world to shame............
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>> must put the clutch down at any cost irrespective that they are going to die in a ball of flames >> that would put the beginnings of the world to shame............
Hear him, hear him... radical car dealer's insight into mimser psychology now wall to wall....
Heh heh....
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>> ... bacause basically they are bad insecure drivers who
>> are expecting a large behemoth jump out at them any second ...
No no no. They think it's a foot rest and they can't manoeuvre their rigid chunky trainers onto the carpet beneath.
Like the behemoth mental picture though.
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The Americans call the gearbox the transmission. Here in Blighty I always understood that transmission comprises all the oily bits between the engine and the road wheels including clutch, gearbox, diff and prop or drive shaft(s).
If it's an insurance claim, time to check the tiny print I fear.
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The clutch, including the clutch plate, friction material, and release bearing has always been part of "the clutch" and the clutch has always been a wear and tear item. Like brakes and tyres.
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No one disputes that the clutch release bearing is operationally part of the clutch, not the gearbox. The crucial question however is whether it forms part of the "transmission".
Is a drive shaft part of the transmission?
Does using the expression "manual transmission" restrict the wider definition to the gearbox alone?
I say "operationally", because of course on a conventional set up the clutch release mechanism is actually attached to the gearbox. When you take the gearbox off the release mechanism comes with it. If you swapped the gearbox you would normally leave the operating mechanism on it, but probably replace the release bearing.
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Its outside the gearbox. The trnasmission is the gear box, not the clutch. Never has been, nor the prop shaft or the diff or any other item outside the gearbox.
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Collins English Dictionary:
Transmission-
(Engineering / Mechanical Engineering) a system of shafts, gears, torque converters, etc., that transmits power, esp the arrangement of such parts that transmits the power of the engine to the driving wheels of a motor vehicle.
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So you include the universal joints in that do you?
dont see many shafts gears or torque converers in a thrust bearing do you?
get real.
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>> So you include the universal joints in that do you?
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>>.
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Yes!
One or two here, for example:
tinyurl.com/32va7fk Link to google images considerably shortened to restore correct page width
Last edited by: VxFan on Wed 2 Jun 10 at 12:42
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well if we had those on our cars, it would never be a problem would it!
Now show me the clutch release bearing and clutch plate that goes with it.
Last edited by: Zero on Wed 2 Jun 10 at 12:50
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nah, that clutch does not go with those UJs you showed me
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>> (Sorry mods - I don't know how to shorten the link)
tinyurl.com
copy and paste your long link into the box and click on the "Make TinyURL!" box. It should then copy the shortened link into your computers clipboard for you to then be able to paste the shortened link here.
We are actually looking at a way of automatically shortening links, but in the short term I might put a link to TinyURL in a sticky post at the top of the forum.
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Zero, the transmission is everything between the engine and the driving wheels that transmits effort from the engine to the road. That includes diff, driveshafts, universals and clutch if the gearbox is manual.
That's what 'transmission' actually means. What the makers of cars or providers of warranties mean by it is another matter.
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>> Zero, the transmission is everything between the engine and the driving wheels that transmits effort
>> from the engine to the road. That's what 'transmission' actually means. What the makers of cars or providers of warranties mean by it is another matter.
Quite. And how does one work this out.
www.warrantydirect.co.uk/pdfs/6727-WD_Policy_BK_SecureCare.pdf
See page 5. Provided one accepts that the "clutch" is not a part of the "transmission" then the answer is quite clear.
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If the clutch failed I think you would notice that there was no transmission of power to the wheels. :)
It's been fun having the argument, but obviously in practice a manufacturer will use a word to mean anything that suits them.
I wonder whether they would similarly misuse the word "differential" to include the crown wheel and pinion, as most people do?
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Is clutch release bearing part of manual transmiss - Old Navy
